The Basics
Moderators: Saintsational Administrators, Saintsational Moderators
- rodgerfox
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 9059
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 9:10am
- Has thanked: 425 times
- Been thanked: 327 times
The Basics
We fail badly at the basics of football.
This is the problem we have. And I don't see any choice but to lay the blame solely with the coach.
These are some very basic observations of our team. This isn't technical stuff, this is simple stuff. This is the type of stuff any dude in the grandstand or sitting at home watching on TV can identify:
Tackling technique
We are a terrible tackling team. It seems we either give away free kicks, or we allow the player to dispose of the ball.
Contested ball technique
Again, we give away too many free kicks. This, and we seem to get ourselves hurt too much. Really good pressure in a contest is about doing the basics right. Get the basics right first, then speed it up. Without the basics, it's undisciplined, chaotic and ineffective.
Basic field kicking
We miss too many easy targets around the ground. Our feet are not a weapon around the ground. They are a liability.
Goal kicking
Terrible technique, and mentally weak.
Standing the mark
Such a simple thing, but so effective. Delaying the movement of the ball, even by a split second is huge factor in getting the game on your terms. Hawthorn actually train this. We clearly don't. We don't even seem to care about it. We often don't even know where the mark is - and give the opposition an extra meter or two when they have a shot for goal! Just inexcusable and so, so simple to address and improve. But it hasn't improved in 5 years.
Getting back off the mark when take a mark or win a free kick
As per the above, being delayed by a second gives the opposition time to set up. We so often get the pill with a mark or a free kick, can't move it on immediately, then get caught out because we haven't charged back quickly enough off the mark. We either kick into the man on the mark as a result, or or forced into a poor kick because we haven't given ourselves the required space to execute. Or, when we get called to play on - we're rushed and cough it up.
Basic decision making
Obviously the 'bomb it in' method is laughable. But our movement through the midfield and out of defence lacks logic at times. We kicked long down the line to Lonie in a marking contest three times on Saturday night. Jack freakin' Lonie. If someone can explain the logic in that to me, I'm all ears. Jack Billings handballed sideways after we'd already handballed twice whilst Gresham was standing on his own in the goal square. His teammate even yelled to him and pointed to Gresham - but he handballed anyway. Why? Poor, poor decision making. Even our centre clearances were poor - we'd handball it around 4 or 5 times to find someone clear or coming off the back of the square, and by the time we did Collingwood were already set up in defence.
My opinion, is that the players are so mentally screwed by the woeful game plan that the coaches have drilled into them - that they simply don't know what they're meant to do, and they certainly don't know what each other is doing.
Now, the above are not ground breaking discoveries. They are the types of things little kids practice at Auskick. These are the first things that a junior coach wants his players doing. All the other s*** will come, if you get the basics right. Without the basics, you have no foundation.
If you're out of form, or having a bad day - you can still do the basics. Stand the mark with technique and intent. Get back off the mark quickly. The little things.
We are so poor at the 'big things' like goal kicking and field kicking, but we are also utterly terrible and amateurish at the basics.
This is the problem we have. And I don't see any choice but to lay the blame solely with the coach.
These are some very basic observations of our team. This isn't technical stuff, this is simple stuff. This is the type of stuff any dude in the grandstand or sitting at home watching on TV can identify:
Tackling technique
We are a terrible tackling team. It seems we either give away free kicks, or we allow the player to dispose of the ball.
Contested ball technique
Again, we give away too many free kicks. This, and we seem to get ourselves hurt too much. Really good pressure in a contest is about doing the basics right. Get the basics right first, then speed it up. Without the basics, it's undisciplined, chaotic and ineffective.
Basic field kicking
We miss too many easy targets around the ground. Our feet are not a weapon around the ground. They are a liability.
Goal kicking
Terrible technique, and mentally weak.
Standing the mark
Such a simple thing, but so effective. Delaying the movement of the ball, even by a split second is huge factor in getting the game on your terms. Hawthorn actually train this. We clearly don't. We don't even seem to care about it. We often don't even know where the mark is - and give the opposition an extra meter or two when they have a shot for goal! Just inexcusable and so, so simple to address and improve. But it hasn't improved in 5 years.
Getting back off the mark when take a mark or win a free kick
As per the above, being delayed by a second gives the opposition time to set up. We so often get the pill with a mark or a free kick, can't move it on immediately, then get caught out because we haven't charged back quickly enough off the mark. We either kick into the man on the mark as a result, or or forced into a poor kick because we haven't given ourselves the required space to execute. Or, when we get called to play on - we're rushed and cough it up.
Basic decision making
Obviously the 'bomb it in' method is laughable. But our movement through the midfield and out of defence lacks logic at times. We kicked long down the line to Lonie in a marking contest three times on Saturday night. Jack freakin' Lonie. If someone can explain the logic in that to me, I'm all ears. Jack Billings handballed sideways after we'd already handballed twice whilst Gresham was standing on his own in the goal square. His teammate even yelled to him and pointed to Gresham - but he handballed anyway. Why? Poor, poor decision making. Even our centre clearances were poor - we'd handball it around 4 or 5 times to find someone clear or coming off the back of the square, and by the time we did Collingwood were already set up in defence.
My opinion, is that the players are so mentally screwed by the woeful game plan that the coaches have drilled into them - that they simply don't know what they're meant to do, and they certainly don't know what each other is doing.
Now, the above are not ground breaking discoveries. They are the types of things little kids practice at Auskick. These are the first things that a junior coach wants his players doing. All the other s*** will come, if you get the basics right. Without the basics, you have no foundation.
If you're out of form, or having a bad day - you can still do the basics. Stand the mark with technique and intent. Get back off the mark quickly. The little things.
We are so poor at the 'big things' like goal kicking and field kicking, but we are also utterly terrible and amateurish at the basics.
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 23157
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 3:53pm
- Has thanked: 9106 times
- Been thanked: 3948 times
- perfectionist
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 9054
- Joined: Mon 30 Jul 2007 3:06pm
- Has thanked: 60 times
- Been thanked: 353 times
Re: The Basics
We did have good pressure at the opposition when they had the ball, which kept us in the game - at least until we got tired in the 3rd quarter. However, the points from rodgerfox are generally well made. Every centimetre matters in ball games and should be fought for. Chasing by a few of our players, once an opposition player as a break, is another problem. Even if a player has a break of 10 metres, a chase is still important. They might fumble a bounce - something our worst chaser has done on a number of occasions.
As far as the coaches are concerned, there are two possibilities. First, they don't consider these 1%er things have any value. Alternatively, these have trained for them but the players are incapable of responding. Either way, the coaches must take responsibility - especially after 4 years.
As far as the coaches are concerned, there are two possibilities. First, they don't consider these 1%er things have any value. Alternatively, these have trained for them but the players are incapable of responding. Either way, the coaches must take responsibility - especially after 4 years.
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 681
- Joined: Tue 07 Feb 2012 1:03pm
- Has thanked: 1 time
- Been thanked: 4 times
Re: The Basics
But Steele did that chase and tackle Freo last year which
Was the game changer
What has changed this year because that desire to make everything a contest is well and truly gone.
Was the game changer
What has changed this year because that desire to make everything a contest is well and truly gone.
- rodgerfox
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 9059
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 9:10am
- Has thanked: 425 times
- Been thanked: 327 times
Re: The Basics
I think it's because there is no technique or method to our pressure. It's just 'manic'. This will put some panic into the opposition, but if they settle they can work through it. The other factor is that manic pressure with no real method to to it, is exhausting. It's wasted energy.perfectionist wrote: ↑Mon 21 May 2018 12:13pm We did have good pressure at the opposition when they had the ball, which kept us in the game - at least until we got tired in the 3rd quarter. However, the points from rodgerfox are generally well made. Every centimetre matters in ball games and should be fought for. Chasing by a few of our players, once an opposition player as a break, is another problem. Even if a player has a break of 10 metres, a chase is still important. They might fumble a bounce - something our worst chaser has done on a number of occasions.
The key to pressuring the ball carrier, is not necessarily to win it off them. It's to force them to turn it over with the next possession. So how you set up down the ground is the key. We seem hell bent on going all kamikaze at the ball carrier, but don't seem to think too much about the next possession. If they do get a clearing kick, and we haven't set up well for it - the pressure on the ball carrier was a waste of energy. And what's worse, when we do win it off the ball carrier - we actually haven't though about what the hell we are going to do with the ball once we get it!
Agreed. It has to be one or the other - and either way it is a coaching failure.perfectionist wrote: ↑Mon 21 May 2018 12:13pm As far as the coaches are concerned, there are two possibilities. First, they don't consider these 1%er things have any value. Alternatively, these have trained for them but the players are incapable of responding. Either way, the coaches must take responsibility - especially after 4 years.
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 681
- Joined: Tue 07 Feb 2012 1:03pm
- Has thanked: 1 time
- Been thanked: 4 times
Re: The Basics
But Steele did that chase and tackle Freo last year which
Was the game changer
What has changed this year because that desire to make everything a contest is well and truly gone.
Was the game changer
What has changed this year because that desire to make everything a contest is well and truly gone.
- Munga
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 5287
- Joined: Tue 09 Mar 2004 12:00am
- Has thanked: 525 times
- Been thanked: 98 times
Re: The Basics
Bravo rodger, said everything I've been trying to say all year.
Simple and easy things like standing right on the mark and make the opposition kick higher over your arms! Many of our guys actually BACK OFF a few metres, WTF for?
And taking a step off the mark, especially in defence, the umps are red hot on this and call play on immediately... instantly putting our guys under pressure for no reason, and looping high balls out of the backline.
And bombing long to one of our smaller players, who usually has two against him anyway... but why aren't our big fellas there?
There are structual issues, tactical, technical, mental... but yes the basics can be sorted out quickly and easily, why aren't they?
Simple and easy things like standing right on the mark and make the opposition kick higher over your arms! Many of our guys actually BACK OFF a few metres, WTF for?
And taking a step off the mark, especially in defence, the umps are red hot on this and call play on immediately... instantly putting our guys under pressure for no reason, and looping high balls out of the backline.
And bombing long to one of our smaller players, who usually has two against him anyway... but why aren't our big fellas there?
There are structual issues, tactical, technical, mental... but yes the basics can be sorted out quickly and easily, why aren't they?
Gehrig emerged from scans yesterday saying he was "as sweet as a bun"
- rodgerfox
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 9059
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 9:10am
- Has thanked: 425 times
- Been thanked: 327 times
Re: The Basics
Interesting point...oh when the wrote: ↑Mon 21 May 2018 12:47pm But Steele did that chase and tackle Freo last year which
Was the game changer
What has changed this year because that desire to make everything a contest is well and truly gone.
See, in my opinion, that Steele chase wasn't manic 'pressure' - there was method to it. He wanted to win, was prepared to put in the effort, and executed it correctly. Made the right decision when to run, and to keep running. And when he caught him, he executed the contest perfectly.
To be honest, it was a pretty instinctive thing. These days, that instinct is coached out of them.