Gram

VietNam_Saint · Mon 01 Jun 2009 4:20pm

How did he go this week ?

Any opinions ?

Solar · Post: # 749640Post **Solar** » Mon 01 Jun 2009 4:23pm

was pretty good as a outside half forward receiver. Still tried to belt the ball a little too much but a big improvement from what I saw on the TV

BringBackMadDog · Mon 01 Jun 2009 4:38pm

he is an out and out receiver I am getting a bit sick of the small step shuffles he does to avoid being first to the ball or to lay a tackle, it stands out like dogs bollocks when the rest of the side are having a red hot dip....that aside his pace is still something that we crave, especially on big grounds

Duggie · Post: # 749652Post **Duggie** » Mon 01 Jun 2009 4:49pm

Just. Judge him after the Kangas

SydneySainter · Mon 01 Jun 2009 4:59pm

He did his bit. His pace and penetration are well-needed, though his kicking was still dicey, but it might be due to lack of confidence since he was dropped.

sunsaint · Post: # 749663Post **sunsaint** » Mon 01 Jun 2009 5:24pm

SydneySainter wrote:He did his bit. His pace and penetration are well-needed, though his kicking was still dicey, but it might be due to lack of confidence since he was dropped.

I would have thought one of the reasons he was dropped was his kicking
... his accuracy has plummeted

OhMyGoddard · Mon 01 Jun 2009 5:32pm

BringBackMadDog wrote:he is an out and out receiver I am getting a bit sick of the small step shuffles he does to avoid being first to the ball or to lay a tackle, it stands out like dogs bollocks when the rest of the side are having a red hot dip....that aside his pace is still something that we crave, especially on big grounds

Absolutely SPOT ON!!!

Ok... Every team needs these players, but when it is your turn to go you have to go. Loves to hang out the back of packs.
Bring Max back and move Zac to the back flank.

OMG.

hotdish · Post: # 749669Post **hotdish** » Mon 01 Jun 2009 5:34pm

SydneySainter wrote:He did his bit. His pace and penetration are well-needed, though his kicking was still dicey, but it might be due to lack of confidence since he was dropped.

Gram's disposal accuracy was 74%, well above his average of 66% this season. Efficiency wise, this was his equal 2nd best game of the season.

http://superstats.heraldsun.com.au/profile/220034.html

savatage · Post: # 749674Post **savatage** » Mon 01 Jun 2009 5:46pm

His pace disappears when he has to chase.

GrumpyOne · Post: # 749687Post **GrumpyOne** » Mon 01 Jun 2009 5:54pm

savatage wrote:His pace disappears when he has to chase.

And the rest of him seems to disappear when he has to tackle.

Saints43 · Post: # 749688Post **Saints43** » Mon 01 Jun 2009 5:57pm

savatage wrote:His pace disappears when he has to chase.

Austinn Jones Syndrome - Cannot be caught. Cannot catch.

Saints43 · Post: # 749693Post **Saints43** » Mon 01 Jun 2009 6:01pm

I am going to preface this by saying that I am no Gram fan generally so...

The quote below is so true. He is a one trick pony and so far this year hasn't been much good at the one trick.

BringBackMadDog wrote:I am getting a bit sick of the small step shuffles he does to avoid being first to the ball or to lay a tackle, it stands out like dogs bollocks when the rest of the side are having a red hot dip

bigcarl · Post: # 749694Post **bigcarl** » Mon 01 Jun 2009 6:01pm

good player who, like everyone else on our list, has his strengths and weaknesses.

kicking lets him down at times and probably not our best shutdown artist, but we need his run and carry and ability to move it quickly to our big forwards.

we missed his direct, simple approach to the game against brisbane.

like everyone else, he should play to his strengths and work on his weaknesses.

Saint Bev · Post: # 749753Post **Saint Bev** » Mon 01 Jun 2009 6:57pm

I thought he had a shocking game. Just seemed to stand back and not get in the game at all. Looked disinterested.

St Fidelius · Mon 01 Jun 2009 7:04pm

Saint Bev wrote:I thought he had a shocking game. Just seemed to stand back and not get in the game at all. Looked disinterested.

That's because he doesn't know what a contested possession is, he can't kick and his tackle effectiveness is poor.

Yes he did improve on his disposal effectiveness but the match prior it was at 54% effectiveness.

I would suggest that most of the disposal effectiveness is by hand and not by foot.

SainterK · Post: # 749776Post **SainterK** » Mon 01 Jun 2009 7:21pm

Saint Bev wrote:I thought he had a shocking game. Just seemed to stand back and not get in the game at all. Looked disinterested.

Disinterested, or petulant? Remember he only got called up because Milne was injured, the guy needs to swallow his pride and be prepared to prove everyone wrong.

St Fidelius · Mon 01 Jun 2009 7:28pm

Only an average of 66% disposal effectiveness is poor IMO

CJ is on 75% disposal effectiveness...

http://superstats.heraldsun.com.au/profile/261743.html

Gram really needs to improve in that area

perfectionist · Mon 01 Jun 2009 8:13pm

ohwhenthesaints! wrote:
Saint Bev wrote:I thought he had a shocking game. Just seemed to stand back and not get in the game at all. Looked disinterested.
Disinterested, or petulant? Remember he only got called up because Milne was injured, the guy needs to swallow his pride and be prepared to prove everyone wrong.

No, I don't think that's it. If fact, as much as it counts for anything, he would bleed for a St Kilda win as much as any Saints player because, like us, and unlike almost all of his team mates, he was a mad passionate Saints supporter when he was a child and teenager. After a brief interlude in Brisbane, he got his boyhood wish, to play for the Saints.

But barracking is not playing - as we all know too well!

Just where genes end and desire starts is going to be one of those imponderables forever and a day. My view is that desire allows you to improve some percentage points on nature, but not much. If all of our players were blessed with the skills and desire of Robert Harvey, well we would have won flags aplenty over the years. It appears to me that the best "lifter" for any player is his team mates, but it's never forever, rather short periods. Timing can be everything in this regard, especially as the players who need to lift have to do it at roughly the same time.

He is definitely hard to catch once he has the ball (like Aussie). We are probably just going to have to accept that he'll be an average chaser and tackler at best. He has done it a couple of times this year, so we (and he) knows it can be done. To be truthful, it doesn't seem at all natural to him and I always fear some injury is imminent to him with any over exertion in this regard. Perhaps he does too.

plugger66 · Post: # 749824Post **plugger66** » Mon 01 Jun 2009 8:21pm

Drop him. We do not require players who run and carry, have pace and kick it long. Those types must go for us to succeed.

The Fireman · Mon 01 Jun 2009 8:28pm

I get the feeling we will see an improvement right across the board when we come against a real challenging side.
Atm , going through the motions , picking up the 4 points with out over stretching ourselves. Not a bad way to go in my opinion.
Save ourselves for the big ones.

Leo.J · Post: # 749832Post **Leo.J** » Mon 01 Jun 2009 8:29pm

Gram is a line breaker, he's a required player.

Sainter_Dad · Tue 02 Jun 2009 10:02am

The Fireman wrote:I get the feeling we will see an improvement right across the board when we come against a real challenging side.
Atm , going through the motions , picking up the 4 points with out over stretching ourselves. Not a bad way to go in my opinion.
Save ourselves for the big ones.

So what you are saying is that we are lazy in front of goal - because when we bashed Fremantle - and everyone was thrilled - we kicked 17.9 against Melbourne we kicked 11.17 - more scoring shots. Do we need to be playing better opponents to kick accurately. We are playing the same football - it is just that we are not finishing as well.

Saints43 · Post: # 750006Post **Saints43** » Tue 02 Jun 2009 10:11am

plugger66 wrote:Drop him. We do not require players who run and carry, have pace and kick it long. Those types must go for us to succeed.

Only a fool would have that opinion.

And you're the only one expressing it.

Or is this more of the absolutely hilariously witty 'take the most extreme view and post as sarcasm to invalidate all but the most positive views' style of posting that has become the flavour of the month on SS? If so, you forgot to add the rolly eyes.

spert · Post: # 750008Post **spert** » Tue 02 Jun 2009 10:15am

Gram is required if we are going to win a flag -a team wins matches, not the individual and not every player is going to give 10 out of 10 in a game -as long as all players do their bit and we win.

The Fireman · Tue 02 Jun 2009 10:28am

Sainter_Dad wrote:
The Fireman wrote:I get the feeling we will see an improvement right across the board when we come against a real challenging side.
Atm , going through the motions , picking up the 4 points with out over stretching ourselves. Not a bad way to go in my opinion.
Save ourselves for the big ones.
So what you are saying is that we are lazy in front of goal - because when we bashed Fremantle - and everyone was thrilled - we kicked 17.9 against Melbourne we kicked 11.17 - more scoring shots. Do we need to be playing better opponents to kick accurately. We are playing the same football - it is just that we are not finishing as well.

As I said I think the majority of the players are just going through the motions including our goal kickers, when we come up against some quality and real pressure I'm sure the accuracy will improve. We smashed teams earlier to see if we could, now it's time to save ourselves for the big ones, just picking up the 4 points will do me as I am confident they will respond positively to pressure.