Will Cousins be better than?

[WayneJudson42]

Given that the great 35 has retired, and assuming we get Cousins.

Would a fit BC bring more value (footy wise) than the man he replaces?

And if he regained his form... where would you rate him in our midfield?

For argument's sake, our 09 mids would be:

Joey
Dal
Lenny
Ball
Gram
Bj (?)
Ray (?)

Where woud you rate BC in this... top 3? Top 5?

At his best, I'd rate him in our top 4. The interesting part will be how much Dal will be freed up. If you buy the argument that having BC means less tagging for Dal, then his value increases not only for his footy skills, but also coz it allows Dal to become more dangerous.

Your thoughts...

[fonz_#15]

Hard to say really, and ethically i cannot compare the two.

i think he will definately be of huge value to us if he can be anywhere near his best, but i won't slag off or compare him to the great man.

[JeffDunne]

If Ben Cousins is fit, clean and focused, he will be close to the best player on our list let alone midfielders.

[busso mick]

Harves wasn't tagged a lot in recent years, but was still a very effective contributor every game he played. Benny will attract some attention, whcih will ease the load on other midfielders like Dal. So from that perspective he will be an asset to the team.

I suppose if you look at the capitulation of the Eagles midfield last year you could surmise that he made a huge difference to their team when he was playing. Cousins will be out to prove a point next year and if he is fit he will slot quite nicely into our top 2 or 3 midfielders, behind only Lenny & maybe Ball. I would certainly rate him ahead of Joey, Dal, Gram, BJ & Ray.

[kaos theory]

why are you making such a comparision?

Harvs was playing as a 37-38year old. He was WAY past his best.

Cousins was an elite just 18 months ago. He has just turned 30, had a year off, and his body is in great condition.

He will be our best mid-fielder, if he is focused & stays clean. He has talent, runs very hard, plays inside, outside & kicks goals.

That will be a significnat boost to our mids.

[st_Trav_ofWA]

Benny will bring his running ability and that alone will bring us good fortune he can bust a tag apart and will allow for dal to be freed up more (lets face it you would tag BC befor Dal ) he has big game experiance and he can kick goals... potentially BC could become as valuble to our club as Roo ....... potentially

[quidnunc]

Luke Ball has the potential (injury free) to be consistently a very, very good midfielder.

Lenny Hayes is consistently a very, very good midfielder.

Ben Cousins at this best was consistently a very, very good midfielder who had the added arsenal of being very, very damaging with his use of the ball or goal scoring ability.

The elite to me are Judd and Kerr with in-form Cousins probably with them.

[SainterK]

The only comparison I am interested in, it will Cousins be better than Cousins?

[SAINT JUMP]

after taking drugs for 10 years, there would have to be some effect on your body. he is 30 now not a young guy, and in the last couple of years, really abused his body.

[st_Trav_ofWA]

Luke Ball has the potential (injury free) to be consistently a very, very good midfielder.

Lenny Hayes is consistently a very, very good midfielder.

Ben Cousins at this best was consistently a very, very good midfielder who had the added arsenal of being very, very damaging with his use of the ball or goal scoring ability.

The elite to me are Judd and Kerr with in-form Cousins probably with them.

Kerr is over rated !! its easy to get all the spoils when you have Cox tapping it down your throat and Judd and Cousins taking the best defencive mids week in week out imo Kerr is only slightly better the Fletcher

[WayneJudson42]

Let me clarify...

I'm not comparing him with Harvey. No way.

The question refers to his contribution if 100% firing v what we've lost with Harvey.

In other words... the bottom line re list improvement. Not just in terms of "replacing" 35... but also in terms of overall team performance and the flow on effect on other players.

I suspect that he would not only help give Dal and our midfield a lift, but also, some quick delivery would make it easier for Roo and Kosi... and by default, Milne and Schneider.

In that regard, the upside is massive, and whilst the individual won't win you a flag, his influence will bring us closer.

Seriously, don't get your knicks in a knot.

[Pilgram]

If Ben Cousins is fit, clean and focused, he will be close to the best player on our list let alone midfielders.

agreed.
bens strength is his determination.

[joffaboy]

I agree with the sentiments of JeffDunne and kaos theory.

It is possible he could be the best mid at our club. It is possible he may have past it.

I read with interest the other day one of the big factors in Collingwood decision not to persue Cousins was because Malthouse or McGuire couldn't think of a mid to come back and play good football after a year off at the age of 30.

Didn't Harvs do his knee in 2001 at the age of 30??????

Didn't Buckley come back at 31 or so after about a year out with hammy's?

Short memories and lame ecuses from the filth.

[BAM! (shhhh)]

A lot of people seem to be talking as if Cousins has been gone for a long, long time.

Players miss time due to injury for longer than Cousins and come back effectively. So while we shouldn't imagine he'll be in top form immediately, an expectation he should reach a comparable level to where he left the game by round 5 is not wildly optomistic.

The last time Ben Cousins played was September 2007. He was one of the best midfielders in a good midfield. That's 14 months now, around 20 at the start of the 2009 season. He's missed 1 season.

While expectations should be tempered because we just don't know what effect a year of rehab has had on his fitness and athleticism, and he's histting the age range where we'd be expecting him to lose a step soon, I agree with JeffDunne above - if Cousins joins the Saints clean and focused, he has the potential to be the best player on the list. Performing at the level of Dal or Hayes (the 2 mids we have with any sort of comparable ability) would be a step down for Cousins from when last sighted. Only Nick Reiwoldt is a no-brainer better player than Cousins at this stage. Much as I love Robert Harvey (and career wise, Cousins isn't in the same stratosphere), it should be an on field upgrade.

[st_Trav_ofWA]

I agree with the sentiments of JeffDunne and kaos theory.

It is possible he could be the best mid at our club. It is possible he may have past it.

I read with interest the other day one of the big factors in Collingwood decision not to persue Cousins was because Malthouse or McGuire couldn't think of a mid to come back and play good football after a year off at the age of 30.

Didn't Harvs do his knee in 2001 at the age of 30??????

Didn't Buckley come back at 31 or so after about a year out with hammy's?

Short memories and lame ecuses from the filth.

make no mistake there is more to the story on why collingwood didnt chase Benny it may never come out the real reason but somthing is stinky down the lexus centre

[markp]

I think he will turn out to be the bargain of the century...

There are a lot of people he'll want to either repay or stick it up, and there's only one way he can do that.

[evertonfc]

I think he'll give us:

- 2 years of elite level football.
- 1 year of really good football.
- A final year of handy football, ala Crawf, possibly on a HFF.

If we're getting that for no outlay, that is an absolute bargain. Most AFL players don't last more than three seasons, let alone contribute at the level Cousins will bring.

I honestly feel his freak natural capacity could extend his career until he's 35-36 - and that he's had 18 months out of the game will have given athletic prowess tremendous recovery.

What I like best is that in between his time out of the game, he came back, and was still a freak. That proves he can get back into the fold - and that was with hardly ANY true preparation.

I love the fact that he'll take a tagger, too. He'll ease the pressure on Ball and Dal Santo - meaning they'll grow in confidence and have a much greater chance of lifting their output. And he'll show them how to beat taggers.

It's a massive coup for the club. There are similarities with the Carey comeback of course, but we must remember that Adelaide sold the house to recruit a player who was already well past his best.

We're getting a player for free who, when he last played, was scintilating.

Quite simply, we've got to take him. And if we do, he'll give us some great service over the next five years, and he'll show our midfielders what it takes to become a world class athlete.

[WayneJudson42]

I think he'll give us:

- 2 years of elite level football.
- 1 year of really good football.
- A final year of handy football, ala Crawf, possibly on a HFF.

If we're getting that for no outlay, that is an absolute bargain. Most AFL players don't last more than three seasons, let alone contribute at the level Cousins will bring.

I honestly feel his freak natural capacity could extend his career until he's 35-36 - and that he's had 18 months out of the game will have given athletic prowess tremendous recovery.

What I like best is that in between his time out of the game, he came back, and was still a freak. That proves he can get back into the fold - and that was with hardly ANY true preparation.

I love the fact that he'll take a tagger, too. He'll ease the pressure on Ball and Dal Santo - meaning they'll grow in confidence and have a much greater chance of lifting their output. And he'll show them how to beat taggers.

It's a massive coup for the club. There are similarities with the Carey comeback of course, but we must remember that Adelaide sold the house to recruit a player who was already well past his best.

We're getting a player for free who, when he last played, was scintilating.

Quite simply, we've got to take him. And if we do, he'll give us some great service over the next five years, and he'll show our midfielders what it takes to become a world class athlete.

I agree.... but what makes you think he'll teach our mids how to beat taggers if 35 couldn't? That's what worries me.

[evertonfc]

I agree.... but what makes you think he'll teach our mids how to beat taggers if 35 couldn't? That's what worries me.

Harvey hasn't been properly tagged since 1999. Hayes saw a bit of it - none of the others did.

Harvey's best year since his first knee reco was 2003, where he polled very well in the Brownlow (18 votes), but it was clear he wasn't being tagged with the same intensity as his best years.

He pulled in 756 touches in 1997 and 735 in 1998 - compared with 580 n 2003. And it was in those two years that he was tagged so much that he often was double-teamed, which makes those figures even more meretorious.

[HarveysDeciple]

I think he'll give us:

- 2 years of elite level football.
- 1 year of really good football.
- A final year of handy football, ala Crawf, possibly on a HFF.

If we're getting that for no outlay, that is an absolute bargain. Most AFL players don't last more than three seasons, let alone contribute at the level Cousins will bring.

I honestly feel his freak natural capacity could extend his career until he's 35-36 - and that he's had 18 months out of the game will have given athletic prowess tremendous recovery.

What I like best is that in between his time out of the game, he came back, and was still a freak. That proves he can get back into the fold - and that was with hardly ANY true preparation.

I love the fact that he'll take a tagger, too. He'll ease the pressure on Ball and Dal Santo - meaning they'll grow in confidence and have a much greater chance of lifting their output. And he'll show them how to beat taggers.

It's a massive coup for the club. There are similarities with the Carey comeback of course, but we must remember that Adelaide sold the house to recruit a player who was already well past his best.

We're getting a player for free who, when he last played, was scintilating.

Quite simply, we've got to take him. And if we do, he'll give us some great service over the next five years, and he'll show our midfielders what it takes to become a world class athlete.

absolutely 100%.

[brown-coat]

If Ben Cousins is fit, clean and focused, he will be close to the best player on our list let alone midfielders.

Agreed.