FRANKSTON DEAL NOT DONE YET

[casey scorp]

I hear, but haven't seen, that a local paper in Frankston is leading with the headline this week - Deal Not Done Yet.

Not surprising given a few issues which seem a little problematic.

The Frankston deal is a great deal financially for the short term (asset on the balance sheet etc) but is strategically shortsighted from a financial, membership and football perspective, and besides it's a crappy little ground.

It will have all sorts of parking problems.

Now I understand that the players would prefer Frankston to Casey Fields because its less windy and there's some cafes nearby. However I recall a few years ago that another team was looking at Casey Fields as a venue (North Melbourne), and the strategic thinking was that although the players might be unhappy (most lived north of Melbourne - not in Brighton/Hampton) an AFL club turns its list over every few years and in less than a decade very few players would have known any different.

Besides Casey Fields might look like it's in a rural area now, but in 10 years it will be in a developed urban area.

Remember this is an arrangement for 50 years - not for 5 years.

[saint66au]

heheheh..you are really are obsessed with gettin the boys out there aren'tt ya

[casey scorp]

It's just a minor distraction for me, but I think it would be the best outcome for sure.

[riccardo]

Best outcome for the club, or the people that live in Casey?

There is little difference between the two areas as far as I'm concerned, as long as the facilities are top notch, we could train on Pluto for all I care.

[casey scorp]

I wear a few hats - Saints supporter, Casey resident, Scorpions supporter and a few others as well probably.

I agree with you that Frankston or Casey is 6 of one and half a dozen of the other from a simple locational point of view for the club and supporters who live further afield.

There are benefits of each location, and those benefits favouring Frankston (asset on the balance sheet, close to cafes) are immediate benefits.

The club should be making a decision for the long term and, in my view, the benefits of Casey Fields outweigh those of Frankston. Those benefits include access to a very large and expanding population base (which will identify with a Casey location but not a Frankston location) and access to a top quality ground which will be maintained by Casey Council to the necessary standard and which is the size of the MCG.

The reality is that when the financial contributions of the two Councils and the relative costs of development are taken into account, the development is more acheivable at Casey Fields.

Sure it mightn't be near the bay, or cafes (yet), but it also won't have access and parking issues which willundoubtedly be problematic at Frankston.

Finally I agree that the training facilities have to be the best possible regardless of location. I think that both the best facilities and the best location can be delivered at Casey (and as I have always maintained, it can be acheived fastest at Casey as well).

[RBnW]

I wear a few hats - Saints supporter, Casey resident, Scorpions supporter and a few others as well probably.

I agree with you that Frankston or Casey is 6 of one and half a dozen of the other from a simple locational point of view for the club and supporters who live further afield.

There are benefits of each location, and those benefits favouring Frankston (asset on the balance sheet, close to cafes) are immediate benefits.

The club should be making a decision for the long term and, in my view, the benefits of Casey Fields outweigh those of Frankston. Those benefits include access to a very large and expanding population base (which will identify with a Casey location but not a Frankston location) and access to a top quality ground which will be maintained by Casey Council to the necessary standard and which is the size of the MCG.

The reality is that when the financial contributions of the two Councils and the relative costs of development are taken into account, the development is more acheivable at Casey Fields.

Sure it mightn't be near the bay, or cafes (yet), but it also won't have access and parking issues which willundoubtedly be problematic at Frankston.

Finally I agree that the training facilities have to be the best possible regardless of location. I think that both the best facilities and the best location can be delivered at Casey (and as I have always maintained, it can be acheived fastest at Casey as well).

The deal is done, did you not see the papers and news last week, let it go brother the Saints are not coming to Casey....move on and pick someone else to get out there, its not about how many Cafes are in Casey or Frankston its a better fit for the club, we are a Bayside club not a farmland club, Casey might be bigger in a few years than Canberra but it don't have a beach which is why canberra is stuffed too, well there are a few other reasons for Canberra being stuffed....maybe you could create a lake at Casey, just like Canberra...Lake Ugg Boot...or Lake Field of dreams, problem is that you have built it but still they don't come....
Change tact and make it the windsurfing capital of the world.....
We are still not coming...

[casey scorp]

Sure I saw it all last week (or the week before). Just as I saw all only 18 months ago in respect to Linton Street:

http://www.legislation.vic.gov.au/domin ... enDocument

[stinger]

[ Casey might be bigger in a few years than Canberra but it don't have a beach which is why canberra is stuffed too, well there are a few other reasons for Canberra being stuffed....maybe you could create a lake at Casey, just like Canberra...Lake Ugg Boot...or Lake Field of dreams, problem is that you have built it but still they don't come....

the biggest problem with canberra is that it is filled with flowering politicians.,......but then they are not locals are they......?????

[RBnW]

Sure I saw it all last week (or the week before). Just as I saw all only 18 months ago in respect to Linton Street:

http://www.legislation.vic.gov.au/domin ... enDocument

dear Scorp...you know that the Moorabbin deal was a bit different, pokies and a land sale/buy from the local council and a council that didn't want the club....
If you would like to compare the two there are significant differences which I know you know are there, frankston no pokies and no sale of parkland to the club....these were the two main issues........
The funding is all in place and Frankston want the club to move there....
It will happen and you know it's not the same....but if it keeps you happy to keep the flame burning them go ahead.....if it was me i would be diging that lake because you have more chance of holding the World Championships for wind surfing at Casey than getting the Saints there now....http://www.internationalwindsurfing.com/

The Quest for 50 Knots at Casey
Posted On: 22/11/2007
Lake Ugg Boot delivered two solid days of Southeast wind that was an excellent start to the 5-month period in the chase for the 50-knot barrier, national records and individual personal bests. Ideal for football....

Tuesday, November 20th

The wind was strongest during the early afternoon with a range between 35/40-knots with the occasional bigger gust. Patrik Diethelm set a new production board record with an excellent time of 44.71-knots on his F2 XS Missile and Antoine Albeau set a new Casey windsurfing record with a speed of 46.55-knots.

Unfortunately the wind on Lake Ugg Boot was too square for a chance at the world record with a constant orientation of 105-110 degrees, which made the apparent wind in the face feel like the wind was much stronger. The speeds from Antoine and Finian were impressive considering that the conditions were far from perfect with exceptionally gusty winds that were very unusual for this wind direction. Some competitors like Finian had flown from Maui for two-days. Others had driven from Frankston to compete on Lake Ugg Boot just to the South of Casey fields.

Wednesday, November 21st

The field survived the onslaught of Lake Ugg Boot during the night and the Lake was opened early at 8:30am as the first light comes at 7:30. The access road was blocked with a bulldozer clearing the locals from the night before, so many competitors were forced to wait for the road to open. There were small windows of opportunity during the day until 1pm for decent runs but the wind started to die quickly at 2pm and the session was called off at 3pm and adjouned to the pub, after all it was pension day at Casey. Finian found his tuning after 2-years of training on Lake Ugg Boot to post a decent speed considering the light wind conditions of just 50 knots.


Next week there is a long-term forecast for Mistral wind that we are closely monitoring. If world record conditions arrive we expect our media partner windsurfjournal.com to begin our live coverage straight from the Canal and we will put our live ticker online for immediate information.

[casey scorp]

Of course there are differences between the two proposals. My point was that there was a lot of publicity around the Linton Street announcement, just as there was around the Frankston announcement. I'm sure everyone was dead certain 2 weeks after the Linton Street announcement that it was all systems go.

Go back to my OP - it was a media report that said the deal wasn't done yet.

It may be of course that Casey is no longer prepared to be accommodating, so there may be no possibility of Casey Fields. Think about the options then.

[saintsRrising]

With the players....it is not just that for players commuting there that it is more attractive with closer and nicer cafes, beaches etc.....BUT that for cashed up players it is a very realistic option that they may then also choose to live near the ground.


With their salaries there are ample attractive properties that they can rent or buy nearby...witha bayside lifestyle.....which is also good fora fitness lifestyle.



In future trades this may well assit in recruiting players....as players we trade for have to want to come to us.

Waterside living is currently booming as people seek the fashionable "seachange"...




Now while there may well be some nice properties near Casey.....it is pretty obvious I would think that cashed up males are in the main going to be atracted to bayside living than "inland living.

For any players wantinga rural retreat with horses and whatever there are also such proprerties withina few minutes drive.


For our younf male draftees...well I think most would be pretty chuffed to live near the new facility with its lifestyle benefits..

[Bernard Shakey]

Lifestyle benefits in Frankston?

You must be kidding.

I know if I were a cashed up young footballer I'd prefer to live in Brighton, Hampton, Sandringham, Black Rock or Beaumaris than Frankston, Seaford, Kananook or Langwarrin. Maybe parts of Mt Eliza would be OK.

[saintsRrising]

Lifestyle benefits in Frankston?

You must be kidding.

I know if I were a cashed up young footballer I'd prefer to live in Brighton, Hampton, Sandringham, Black Rock or Beaumaris than Frankston, Seaford, Kananook or Langwarrin. Maybe parts of Mt Eliza would be OK.

By way of explanation:

Firstly we are comparing ONLY the bases of Casey and Frankston.

Secondly.. I am including all areas that are say within 15/20 minutes (ie a short commuute) of both bases. Players can go back towards the city a bit...or Morninton, Mt Eliza, Mt Martha as well.....or in parts of Franston parts of which do include multi-million dollar properties.


Thirdly I am not comparing it to Brighton etc......as we were talking about Franstaon training Base vs a Casey Training Base.

[St. Luke]

We've just been given the go ahead for getting the plan submissions drawn up for the Frankston project. I can't say anything more....sorry

[casey scorp]

In the meantime they're kicking the squatters out of the Frankston Oval buildings:


http://www.frankstonleader.com.au/artic ... _news.html


Grandstand squatters to be evicted
Geoffrey Edwards
03Dec07

POLICE will campaign to oust squatters and vandals from Frankston Football Oval's grandstand, ticket box and other areas.


They declared their intention just days after St Kilda Football Club announced it would relocate from Moorabbin to the oval in 2010 to use a planned $10 million training facility.
But Sen-Sgt Steve Iddles declared the issues unrelated, citing reports of anti-social behaviour at the oval for the crackdown.
``We are mounting a campaign to move the squatters towards other accommodation,'' he said.
``We'll use support services to try to find suitable accommodation.
``There have been up to six squatters there at a time.
``We've moved them on, they've gone away for a couple of days and then they have returned.''.
Police plan regular patrols 24 hours a day, seven days a week, starting this week.
Sen-Sgt Iddles said he had received four complaints that squatter anti-social behaviour had diminished the enjoyment of walkers to and around the oval, intimidating some to stay away.
He said the grandstand had suffered damage and rubbish was often left behind.
He said squatting was not one of the oval's legitimate uses and police had to ensure the public's safety.
Football club manager Bryan Mace welcomed the police action, saying he had corresponded with them about oval incidents for a few months.
``We've had some very nasty things happening there not assaults which don't suit people who go to the park,'' Mr Mace said.
He said offenders had exhibited anti-social behaviour, broken into the grandstand, sprayed foul words on walls or punched holes in them, and damaged a balustrade.

[Bernard Shakey]

Just the environment the Saints are looking for.

Not that Casey Fields (is he related to Billy Fields?) would be any better.

At least squatters aren't innarested in Linton Street.

[casey scorp]

Although the police were called regularly to separate the forces who were trying to plant trees in the carpark and those who were trying to stop them!!

[saint patrick]

Lifestyle benefits in Frankston?

You must be kidding.

I know if I were a cashed up young footballer I'd prefer to live in Brighton, Hampton, Sandringham, Black Rock or Beaumaris than Frankston, Seaford, Kananook or Langwarrin. Maybe parts of Mt Eliza would be OK.

Don't forget Victoria's coastal crown jewel Mt.Martha.20 minutes from Frankston.30 minutes from Sorento/Portsea and still just and hour and 5 from Telstra dome down the freeway.

Wouldn'tl ive anywhere else for quids

[barneyboyz]

I wear a few hats - Saints supporter, Casey resident, Scorpions supporter and a few others as well probably.

I agree with you that Frankston or Casey is 6 of one and half a dozen of the other from a simple locational point of view for the club and supporters who live further afield.

There are benefits of each location, and those benefits favouring Frankston (asset on the balance sheet, close to cafes) are immediate benefits.

The club should be making a decision for the long term and, in my view, the benefits of Casey Fields outweigh those of Frankston. Those benefits include access to a very large and expanding population base (which will identify with a Casey location but not a Frankston location) and access to a top quality ground which will be maintained by Casey Council to the necessary standard and which is the size of the MCG.

The reality is that when the financial contributions of the two Councils and the relative costs of development are taken into account, the development is more acheivable at Casey Fields.

Sure it mightn't be near the bay, or cafes (yet), but it also won't have access and parking issues which willundoubtedly be problematic at Frankston.

Finally I agree that the training facilities have to be the best possible regardless of location. I think that both the best facilities and the best location can be delivered at Casey (and as I have always maintained, it can be acheived fastest at Casey as well).

Is that you Mike?

[casey scorp]

I've got a mate called Mike who told me last week he reads the threads on Saintsational (G'day Mike!).

We sometimes reveal ourselves at Saintsational events. Come along some time.

[Seaford_Saint]

BERNARD SHAKEY...... you arrogant flowering TOOL!!!

Where do you fit into the food chain to go bagging Frankston, Kananook and Seafod????

When did you last check out the developments happening in all 3 suburbs??

Where do you think Bonbeach, Chelsea, Edithvale, Aspendale, Moordialloc and Parkdale were at 5 years ago? - it was scorned

Where wer Sandringham, Highett and Hampton at 15 years ago?? - no one wanted to live there.

Slag off Frankston and surrounds now.... see where they are in 5 years!

You are an ignorant twat of the highest order - with zero foresight.

[casey scorp]

We've just been given the go ahead for getting the plan submissions drawn up for the Frankston project. I can't say anything more....sorry

St Luke, how is the design work going for the new project?

I was down near Frankston Park today for a meeting in the vicinity, and struggled to find a carpark. Eventually, after 2 laps of the block, I had to park in the public carpark located on the actual allotment of land which the Council proposes to give to St Kilda. There are about 20 carspaces on this block serving a very congested area with woefully inadequate parking.

While the designers won’t have to deal with replacing the parking for the lost carspaces on this allotment, it will have to be addressed in the town planning approvals process. You may need to help the Council out with some thoughts on that one.

There are some interesting design conundrums which you will have no doubt got your teeth into by now:

• how to preserve the western views to the bay, while at the same time fitting on the training facility, while at the same time allowing for the widening of the pockets
• where to put the parking on the actual reserve for all the players and coaches (40 to 50 spaces)
• how to fit the admin building on the ¼ acre allotment the Council is providing, along with all the carparking for the employees (will it be one level or 2 levels of underground parking?)
• how to keep the construction of 2 buildings (instead of a single integrated structure), with underground parking, within the budget of $9.25 million (all that’s left of the original $10.25 million after the $1 million value of the land has been deducted from the Council contribution).

It sounds like a lot of money when you say it slowly, $9.25 million, but you will know by now that it doesn’t go far enough for this project.

[saintspremiers]

The Vic minister for Sport was on SEN today around lunctime expecting to make an announcement re govt funding very soon, sounded very positive and very, very likely to happen.

Some rehab opportunities for patients at Frangga Hospital to use the Saints new facilities, part of that community involvment bizzo politcally correct stuff from what he said.

Bad luck casey scorp!!!

[St Fidelius]

The local labor MP Alistiar Harkness is a mad Saints fan and has said he will do his utmost to secure the deal

[casey scorp]

The local labour MP Alistiar Harkness is a mad Saints fan and has said he will do his utmost to secure the deal

Good; he might need to ensure additional State Government money to fund the project.