What do you want from this review?

[Teflon]

As a pass mark for a genuine attempt to get this club back on some sort of track - what do you want to see this review deliver??

For me a few things:

1. A genuine, experienced Head of Football appointed who has clear autonomy to question the direction in field. No not to coach but raise questions/concerns when things are obviously not working (see second half year, ball transition, forward line, skill level , list goes on). Mark Williams type sounded out would be my ideal. He’s a bit mad a bit mongrel but we need done if it.

2. Keep Boris and Lenny obviously- rest of assistants cleaned out.

3. GENUINE list appraisal- no more of this “we are in the window BS” how far off are we, what’s the missing pieces and the plan to get the pieces in place ? 2-3? Might need to bolster recruiting/list management resources

4. VFL - how is this alignment really affecting player development??

5. AFL team game plan - reviewed and updated with significant focus on fitness and skill execution

6. Recruiting - strategy if you can’t kick you don’t get a game

[Vortex]

As a pass mark for a genuine attempt to get this club back on some sort of track - what do you want to see this review deliver??

For me a few things:

1. A genuine, experienced Head of Football appointed who has clear autonomy to question the direction in field. No not to coach but raise questions/concerns when things are obviously not working (see second half year, ball transition, forward line, skill level , list goes on). Mark Williams type sounded out would be my ideal. He’s a bit mad a bit mongrel but we need done if it.

2. Keep Boris and Lenny obviously- rest of assistants cleaned out.

3. GENUINE list appraisal- no more of this “we are in the window BS” how far off are we, what’s the missing pieces and the plan to get the pieces in place ? 2-3? Might need to bolster recruiting/list management resources

4. VFL - how is this alignment really affecting player development??

5. AFL team game plan - reviewed and updated with significant focus on fitness and skill execution

6. Recruiting - strategy if you can’t kick you don’t get a game

Brother Teffers, surely you understand reviews at football clubs are like Royal Commissions and magic shows, it's all an illusion to keep the seaguls distracted.

Just hope the club can recruit a crap load of players capable of becoming finals four types.

It's not rocket surgery.

[Teflon]

As a pass mark for a genuine attempt to get this club back on some sort of track - what do you want to see this review deliver??

For me a few things:

1. A genuine, experienced Head of Football appointed who has clear autonomy to question the direction in field. No not to coach but raise questions/concerns when things are obviously not working (see second half year, ball transition, forward line, skill level , list goes on). Mark Williams type sounded out would be my ideal. He’s a bit mad a bit mongrel but we need done if it.

2. Keep Boris and Lenny obviously- rest of assistants cleaned out.

3. GENUINE list appraisal- no more of this “we are in the window BS” how far off are we, what’s the missing pieces and the plan to get the pieces in place ? 2-3? Might need to bolster recruiting/list management resources

4. VFL - how is this alignment really affecting player development??

5. AFL team game plan - reviewed and updated with significant focus on fitness and skill execution

6. Recruiting - strategy if you can’t kick you don’t get a game

Brother Teffers, surely you understand reviews at football clubs are like Royal Commissions and magic shows, it's all an illusion to keep the seaguls distracted.

Just hope the club can recruit a crap load of players capable of becoming finals four types.

It's not rocket surgery.

Well that’s the point brother Vort..
How serious is this review?
If it’s ass covering then imo serious questions about Bassatt should rightly be asked
IF they make some genuine attempts to bolster our shoddy structured football Dept and address some of the other off field areas (development) then happy days.
You can’t just “recruit a crapload of players” without some genuine semblance of a footy plan/strategy….to do that you first need to be realistic on where you are now…imo
I think you mean it’s not rocket science btw…
And I’d agree
Time will tell.

[Impatient Sainter]

Transparency in all facets covered - a warts and all release that highlights the deficiencies a how they are going to correct them.

[Vortex]

As a pass mark for a genuine attempt to get this club back on some sort of track - what do you want to see this review deliver??

For me a few things:

1. A genuine, experienced Head of Football appointed who has clear autonomy to question the direction in field. No not to coach but raise questions/concerns when things are obviously not working (see second half year, ball transition, forward line, skill level , list goes on). Mark Williams type sounded out would be my ideal. He’s a bit mad a bit mongrel but we need done if it.

2. Keep Boris and Lenny obviously- rest of assistants cleaned out.

3. GENUINE list appraisal- no more of this “we are in the window BS” how far off are we, what’s the missing pieces and the plan to get the pieces in place ? 2-3? Might need to bolster recruiting/list management resources

4. VFL - how is this alignment really affecting player development??

5. AFL team game plan - reviewed and updated with significant focus on fitness and skill execution

6. Recruiting - strategy if you can’t kick you don’t get a game

Brother Teffers, surely you understand reviews at football clubs are like Royal Commissions and magic shows, it's all an illusion to keep the seaguls distracted.

Just hope the club can recruit a crap load of players capable of becoming finals four types.

It's not rocket surgery.

Well that’s the point brother Vort..
How serious is this review?
If it’s ass covering then imo serious questions about Bassatt should rightly be asked
IF they make some genuine attempts to bolster our shoddy structured football Dept and address some of the other off field areas (development) then happy days.
You can’t just “recruit a crapload of players” without some genuine semblance of a footy plan/strategy….to do that you first need to be realistic on where you are now…imo
I think you mean it’s not rocket science btw…
And I’d agree
Time will tell.

Well Brother Teffers it depends how much you understand principles in good management, becaue any good management system has a review process so the review process happens whether desired outcomes are reached or not. So there's that. Now where simple folk like yourself get lost is in the misunderstanding a review is a lynching designed to sack everyone and throw the baby out with the bathwater so people feel good about themselves.

The review may or may not conclude that personnel changes are needed but it's about a lot more than that.

Keep asking questions Brother Teffers...it's how we will grow together.

[Vortex]

Transparency in all facets covered - a warts and all release that highlights the deficiencies a how they are going to correct them.

I don't need transparency in anything so deep, transparency will be in how our list improves and how the Ws versus Ls works out.

We need more Windhagers and NWMs and Hayes.

[Teflon]

As a pass mark for a genuine attempt to get this club back on some sort of track - what do you want to see this review deliver??

For me a few things:

1. A genuine, experienced Head of Football appointed who has clear autonomy to question the direction in field. No not to coach but raise questions/concerns when things are obviously not working (see second half year, ball transition, forward line, skill level , list goes on). Mark Williams type sounded out would be my ideal. He’s a bit mad a bit mongrel but we need done if it.

2. Keep Boris and Lenny obviously- rest of assistants cleaned out.

3. GENUINE list appraisal- no more of this “we are in the window BS” how far off are we, what’s the missing pieces and the plan to get the pieces in place ? 2-3? Might need to bolster recruiting/list management resources

4. VFL - how is this alignment really affecting player development??

5. AFL team game plan - reviewed and updated with significant focus on fitness and skill execution

6. Recruiting - strategy if you can’t kick you don’t get a game

Brother Teffers, surely you understand reviews at football clubs are like Royal Commissions and magic shows, it's all an illusion to keep the seaguls distracted.

Just hope the club can recruit a crap load of players capable of becoming finals four types.

It's not rocket surgery.

Well that’s the point brother Vort..
How serious is this review?
If it’s ass covering then imo serious questions about Bassatt should rightly be asked
IF they make some genuine attempts to bolster our shoddy structured football Dept and address some of the other off field areas (development) then happy days.
You can’t just “recruit a crapload of players” without some genuine semblance of a footy plan/strategy….to do that you first need to be realistic on where you are now…imo
I think you mean it’s not rocket science btw…
And I’d agree
Time will tell.

Well Brother Teffers it depends how much you understand principles in good management, becaue any good management system has a review process so the review process happens whether desired outcomes are reached or not. So there's that. Now where simple folk like yourself get lost is in the misunderstanding a review is a lynching designed to sack everyone and throw the baby out with the bathwater so people feel good about themselves.

The review may or may not conclude that personnel changes are needed but it's about a lot more than that.

Keep asking questions Brother Teffers...it's how we will grow together.

Come now bros Vort - surely you can conjure a better cliche than “principles in good management” LMAO
You’ve read a text book somewhere…impressive!
Anyone whose ever managed (or managed a review) knows there are 3 types:

1. Ass covering, delay, smokescreen (Dan Andrew’s special these…,something looks bad on his watch…let’s have a review and suddenly he can’t discuss it while the review is underway).
2. Pre-determined outcome reviews - CEO usually wants someone /something gone….a beautiful “independent” review provides just the licence
3. A genuine “let’s understand what’s happening” review… cause they have no idea why Shyte has hit the fan…

Good management principles..,that’s serious delusion there
I prefer the old Marx bro line …
“These are my principles……if you don’t like them ….I have others!!”

[Teflon]

Transparency in all facets covered - a warts and all release that highlights the deficiencies a how they are going to correct them.

Agree
Those who lack “good management principles”
Don’t get the importance of transparency..
It’s about providing confidence in the process
A lot will be learned by what is and isn’t shared
Ultimately though, review actions/outcomes will tell you if it’s a toothless tiger show

[Yorkeys]

I want a conspiracy theory.
Noble from North on the review. Hill and Long go to North. Join the jumping roos.
Ratts gets 2 years in exchange for giving new CEO low base to start from.
Needed to lose 8 in second half of season to get exactly right draft pick. Took all of Lade and Ratts combined skills to stop our finals ready group from kicking winning scores.
Any of those fly?

[IluvHarvey]

I want it to be the “moment” people talk about for years after we dominate the competition in the next 5-7 years!

[Vortex]

As a pass mark for a genuine attempt to get this club back on some sort of track - what do you want to see this review deliver??

For me a few things:

1. A genuine, experienced Head of Football appointed who has clear autonomy to question the direction in field. No not to coach but raise questions/concerns when things are obviously not working (see second half year, ball transition, forward line, skill level , list goes on). Mark Williams type sounded out would be my ideal. He’s a bit mad a bit mongrel but we need done if it.

2. Keep Boris and Lenny obviously- rest of assistants cleaned out.

3. GENUINE list appraisal- no more of this “we are in the window BS” how far off are we, what’s the missing pieces and the plan to get the pieces in place ? 2-3? Might need to bolster recruiting/list management resources

4. VFL - how is this alignment really affecting player development??

5. AFL team game plan - reviewed and updated with significant focus on fitness and skill execution

6. Recruiting - strategy if you can’t kick you don’t get a game

Brother Teffers, surely you understand reviews at football clubs are like Royal Commissions and magic shows, it's all an illusion to keep the seaguls distracted.

Just hope the club can recruit a crap load of players capable of becoming finals four types.

It's not rocket surgery.

Well that’s the point brother Vort..
How serious is this review?
If it’s ass covering then imo serious questions about Bassatt should rightly be asked
IF they make some genuine attempts to bolster our shoddy structured football Dept and address some of the other off field areas (development) then happy days.
You can’t just “recruit a crapload of players” without some genuine semblance of a footy plan/strategy….to do that you first need to be realistic on where you are now…imo
I think you mean it’s not rocket science btw…
And I’d agree
Time will tell.

Well Brother Teffers it depends how much you understand principles in good management, becaue any good management system has a review process so the review process happens whether desired outcomes are reached or not. So there's that. Now where simple folk like yourself get lost is in the misunderstanding a review is a lynching designed to sack everyone and throw the baby out with the bathwater so people feel good about themselves.

The review may or may not conclude that personnel changes are needed but it's about a lot more than that.

Keep asking questions Brother Teffers...it's how we will grow together.

Come now bros Vort - surely you can conjure a better cliche than “principles in good management” LMAO
You’ve read a text book somewhere…impressive!
Anyone whose ever managed (or managed a review) knows there are 3 types:

1. Ass covering, delay, smokescreen (Dan Andrew’s special these…,something looks bad on his watch…let’s have a review and suddenly he can’t discuss it while the review is underway).
2. Pre-determined outcome reviews - CEO usually wants someone /something gone….a beautiful “independent” review provides just the licence
3. A genuine “let’s understand what’s happening” review… cause they have no idea why Shyte has hit the fan…

Good management principles..,that’s serious delusion there
I prefer the old Marx bro line …
“These are my principles……if you don’t like them ….I have others!!”

I'll agree somewhat while I'm sitting up here on a boat in the marina reviewing my life under blues skies and no clouds a zero knots.

What the review hopefully uncovers is a list that has been overrated and not capable of sustained top 4 finishes. The review bit ain't rocket surgery...burp. what to do next will require a thorough understanding of quantum physics.

Keep paying attention Skeppers...

[Rubyjo]

You two are hilarious ....keep it up.

[shanegrambeau]

The Teflon vs Vortex posture here is a great way to look at it.


Remember when GMH (Holden) decided to cease production in Australia? To close down all its manufacturing plants? I think they announced it for 2017, so the decision would have followed reviews in - you'd imagine 2010-2015. Notwithstanding, they may have a had a secret plan to shut it all down decades ago if the government stopped subsidies.

Now when the decision was announced, there was no doubt that Holden would continue as a name and continue to sell Holden branded cars, service those cars and continue dealerships throughout the country.

Cut to a few years later, and then the announcement that the whole thing..the Holden name, dealearships, the lot..get thrown over the side..It's all dead and gone.

In hindsight, did any of us think GM were seriously committed to maintaining the Holden brand beyond a few short years. A stop gap measure, just enough to bull s*** the press, politic and the public for a while?

I suggest no.

BUt here is the question that comes back to our review.

Would those new executives that remained at the new 'Holden' after manufacturing ceased given a ratts? (Pardon the pun) They would fulfill their obligations to the various committees and sub-comittees in a professional manner, ticked the boxes and moved on!

And so our review could be just as legit.

Are we an entity.
Do we have a brand? Are we a car? With its own manufacturing base, or are we just a sticker, we slap on the side of a Toyota ute to call it a Holden?
Who and what is at stake - really - long term,. in such a review?

I am not that cynical. There are people who really DO care about St Kilda, at St Kilda. They are not drones of the AFL. They are real thinking and passionate people. I believe.

But for a review, lets be realistic.

I want...
a) A thorough investigation into the week before Spud's game,
I want it spelled out in micro detail. What led to a club so utterly underprepared. ...Tell me WTF was going on. That will be a start.

[Saints58]

As a pass mark for a genuine attempt to get this club back on some sort of track - what do you want to see this review deliver??

For me a few things:

1. A genuine, experienced Head of Football appointed who has clear autonomy to question the direction in field. No not to coach but raise questions/concerns when things are obviously not working (see second half year, ball transition, forward line, skill level , list goes on). Mark Williams type sounded out would be my ideal. He’s a bit mad a bit mongrel but we need done if it.

2. Keep Boris and Lenny obviously- rest of assistants cleaned out.

3. GENUINE list appraisal- no more of this “we are in the window BS” how far off are we, what’s the missing pieces and the plan to get the pieces in place ? 2-3? Might need to bolster recruiting/list management resources

4. VFL - how is this alignment really affecting player development??

5. AFL team game plan - reviewed and updated with significant focus on fitness and skill execution

6. Recruiting - strategy if you can’t kick you don’t get a game

Brother Teffers, surely you understand reviews at football clubs are like Royal Commissions and magic shows, it's all an illusion to keep the seaguls distracted.

Just hope the club can recruit a crap load of players capable of becoming finals four types.

It's not rocket surgery.

Well that’s the point brother Vort..
How serious is this review?
If it’s ass covering then imo serious questions about Bassatt should rightly be asked
IF they make some genuine attempts to bolster our shoddy structured football Dept and address some of the other off field areas (development) then happy days.
You can’t just “recruit a crapload of players” without some genuine semblance of a footy plan/strategy….to do that you first need to be realistic on where you are now…imo
I think you mean it’s not rocket science btw…
And I’d agree
Time will tell.

Well Brother Teffers it depends how much you understand principles in good management, becaue any good management system has a review process so the review process happens whether desired outcomes are reached or not. So there's that. Now where simple folk like yourself get lost is in the misunderstanding a review is a lynching designed to sack everyone and throw the baby out with the bathwater so people feel good about themselves.

The review may or may not conclude that personnel changes are needed but it's about a lot more than that.

Keep asking questions Brother Teffers...it's how we will grow together.

Should they get GT in to do the review with Mark Williams there would be no holding back it would hit the fan maybe something we need tough love.

[WellardSaint]

I don't give a Ratts about any review, when the head coach has been renewed already.
His performances and KPIs have to be included in the parameters/terms of reference.
But because he's renewed, the only thing they can do is say 'if he doesn't meet his KPIs from now, then he shouldn't be renewed at the end of this contract'.
But the club may not even comply with that recommendation though.

The 'review' is flawed, and compromised.

[Teflon]

As a pass mark for a genuine attempt to get this club back on some sort of track - what do you want to see this review deliver??

For me a few things:

1. A genuine, experienced Head of Football appointed who has clear autonomy to question the direction in field. No not to coach but raise questions/concerns when things are obviously not working (see second half year, ball transition, forward line, skill level , list goes on). Mark Williams type sounded out would be my ideal. He’s a bit mad a bit mongrel but we need done if it.

2. Keep Boris and Lenny obviously- rest of assistants cleaned out.

3. GENUINE list appraisal- no more of this “we are in the window BS” how far off are we, what’s the missing pieces and the plan to get the pieces in place ? 2-3? Might need to bolster recruiting/list management resources

4. VFL - how is this alignment really affecting player development??

5. AFL team game plan - reviewed and updated with significant focus on fitness and skill execution

6. Recruiting - strategy if you can’t kick you don’t get a game

Brother Teffers, surely you understand reviews at football clubs are like Royal Commissions and magic shows, it's all an illusion to keep the seaguls distracted.

Just hope the club can recruit a crap load of players capable of becoming finals four types.

It's not rocket surgery.

Well that’s the point brother Vort..
How serious is this review?
If it’s ass covering then imo serious questions about Bassatt should rightly be asked
IF they make some genuine attempts to bolster our shoddy structured football Dept and address some of the other off field areas (development) then happy days.
You can’t just “recruit a crapload of players” without some genuine semblance of a footy plan/strategy….to do that you first need to be realistic on where you are now…imo
I think you mean it’s not rocket science btw…
And I’d agree
Time will tell.

Well Brother Teffers it depends how much you understand principles in good management, becaue any good management system has a review process so the review process happens whether desired outcomes are reached or not. So there's that. Now where simple folk like yourself get lost is in the misunderstanding a review is a lynching designed to sack everyone and throw the baby out with the bathwater so people feel good about themselves.

The review may or may not conclude that personnel changes are needed but it's about a lot more than that.

Keep asking questions Brother Teffers...it's how we will grow together.

Come now bros Vort - surely you can conjure a better cliche than “principles in good management” LMAO
You’ve read a text book somewhere…impressive!
Anyone whose ever managed (or managed a review) knows there are 3 types:

1. Ass covering, delay, smokescreen (Dan Andrew’s special these…,something looks bad on his watch…let’s have a review and suddenly he can’t discuss it while the review is underway).
2. Pre-determined outcome reviews - CEO usually wants someone /something gone….a beautiful “independent” review provides just the licence
3. A genuine “let’s understand what’s happening” review… cause they have no idea why Shyte has hit the fan…

Good management principles..,that’s serious delusion there
I prefer the old Marx bro line …
“These are my principles……if you don’t like them ….I have others!!”

I'll agree somewhat while I'm sitting up here on a boat in the marina reviewing my life under blues skies and no clouds a zero knots.

What the review hopefully uncovers is a list that has been overrated and not capable of sustained top 4 finishes. The review bit ain't rocket surgery...burp. what to do next will require a thorough understanding of quantum physics.

Keep paying attention Skeppers...

It’s like having a discussion with the skipper off Gilligans Island….or maybe the blonde one..

[shanegrambeau]

Listen to Ross from 12:48 to 17:48 maybe more..



Honest conversations...
have them over summer bit...

then ask about review..

[B.M]

We are on a slippery slope, and will go backwards in a hurry

Our list management is a mess

We are losing talent - and getting none in

Right now we are a carcass ripe for the picking, and clubs now this and will feast on any of our talented players

In 4 years we will be a basket case

[spert]

A detailed outline of why the club fell away last season and then this one, and that should include the playing list, all coaching and recruitment. If it's on paper rather than PR weasel words, then the onus is on the club to rectify identified issues.

[Banger9798]

A game plan - number one
A development program, - close second
A recruitment strategy - third

[Gershwin]

A new coach.
Or an explanation of how the current coach was re-appointed.

[Zed]

When is the review?

[Vortex]

As a pass mark for a genuine attempt to get this club back on some sort of track - what do you want to see this review deliver??

For me a few things:

1. A genuine, experienced Head of Football appointed who has clear autonomy to question the direction in field. No not to coach but raise questions/concerns when things are obviously not working (see second half year, ball transition, forward line, skill level , list goes on). Mark Williams type sounded out would be my ideal. He’s a bit mad a bit mongrel but we need done if it.

2. Keep Boris and Lenny obviously- rest of assistants cleaned out.

3. GENUINE list appraisal- no more of this “we are in the window BS” how far off are we, what’s the missing pieces and the plan to get the pieces in place ? 2-3? Might need to bolster recruiting/list management resources

4. VFL - how is this alignment really affecting player development??

5. AFL team game plan - reviewed and updated with significant focus on fitness and skill execution

6. Recruiting - strategy if you can’t kick you don’t get a game

Brother Teffers, surely you understand reviews at football clubs are like Royal Commissions and magic shows, it's all an illusion to keep the seaguls distracted.

Just hope the club can recruit a crap load of players capable of becoming finals four types.

It's not rocket surgery.

Well that’s the point brother Vort..
How serious is this review?
If it’s ass covering then imo serious questions about Bassatt should rightly be asked
IF they make some genuine attempts to bolster our shoddy structured football Dept and address some of the other off field areas (development) then happy days.
You can’t just “recruit a crapload of players” without some genuine semblance of a footy plan/strategy….to do that you first need to be realistic on where you are now…imo
I think you mean it’s not rocket science btw…
And I’d agree
Time will tell.

Well Brother Teffers it depends how much you understand principles in good management, becaue any good management system has a review process so the review process happens whether desired outcomes are reached or not. So there's that. Now where simple folk like yourself get lost is in the misunderstanding a review is a lynching designed to sack everyone and throw the baby out with the bathwater so people feel good about themselves.

The review may or may not conclude that personnel changes are needed but it's about a lot more than that.

Keep asking questions Brother Teffers...it's how we will grow together.

Should they get GT in to do the review with Mark Williams there would be no holding back it would hit the fan maybe something we need tough love.

You'd want to be a fly on the wall in meetings between those two for sure.

[SaintPav]

Times Roman 12 point font and 1.5 line spacing.

[Teflon]

We are on a slippery slope, and will go backwards in a hurry

Our list management is a mess

We are losing talent - and getting none in

Right now we are a carcass ripe for the picking, and clubs now this and will feast on any of our talented players

In 4 years we will be a basket case

So other than that we should be OK then?