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SAINT-LEE wrote: ↑Mon 06 Sep 2021 6:06pm
Yes yes....I'm sure Ben is drooling over the idea of going backwards.
He can't wait to come to St Kilda into his brothers shadow like the 19 years previous. Always second best, relegated to fullback.
He is chomping to get back under Max and lose himself in being the "twin".
Wake up!
He will never and I repeat, NEVER come to St Kilda.
He could also come to the saints, help win that elusive second flag and bask in all the glory and fan fare
Preach it mate!!! I hope so.
But being an identical twin myself and having my younger bro tell me how hard it was for him in my
" shadow"....which I never realised or even thought was true....I don't reckon it will happen.
We both went to a family therapist in 1989 ( our parents passed in a auto accident, we were 15 and it fudged us 6 kids up) and it shocked me how he felt and the freedom he found by joining the army and being "out" from under both the "twin" and my stranglehold.
I was and am book smarter but I never thought that mattered. He was behind me athletically but he had all the ladies and I spent many a lonely night at the servo magazine rack....
I don't know if these twins feel the same unspoken struggle to find their unique self...I know that pain behind the laugh after hearing 78,000 times...."now which one are you?"
Hopefully they're healthier emotionally and we see a family reunion!!!!
SAINT-LEE wrote: ↑Mon 06 Sep 2021 6:06pm
Yes yes....I'm sure Ben is drooling over the idea of going backwards.
He can't wait to come to St Kilda into his brothers shadow like the 19 years previous. Always second best, relegated to fullback.
He is chomping to get back under Max and lose himself in being the "twin".
Wake up!
He will never and I repeat, NEVER come to St Kilda.
He could also come to the saints, help win that elusive second flag and bask in all the glory and fan fare
Preach it mate!!! I hope so.
But being an identical twin myself and having my younger bro tell me how hard it was for him in my
" shadow"....which I never realised or even thought was true....I don't reckon it will happen.
We both went to a family therapist in 1989 ( our parents passed in a auto accident, we were 15 and it fudged us 6 kids up) and it shocked me how he felt and the freedom he found by joining the army and being "out" from under both the "twin" and my stranglehold.
I was and am book smarter but I never thought that mattered. He was behind me athletically but he had all the ladies and I spent many a lonely night at the servo magazine rack....
I don't know if these twins feel the same unspoken struggle to find their unique self...I know that pain behind the laugh after hearing 78,000 times...."now which one are you?"
Hopefully they're healthier emotionally and we see a family reunion!!!!
SAINT-LEE wrote: ↑Mon 06 Sep 2021 6:06pm
Yes yes....I'm sure Ben is drooling over the idea of going backwards.
He can't wait to come to St Kilda into his brothers shadow like the 19 years previous. Always second best, relegated to fullback.
He is chomping to get back under Max and lose himself in being the "twin".
Wake up!
He will never and I repeat, NEVER come to St Kilda.
I hope he thinks a little bit more of himself than that & has a resolve in him that wants to do something unique. To me that would be, in partnership with his brother, to create the most formidable forward duo in the AFL.
Not to mention a legacy for a Club their family follow, or the money / brand that would also materialise.
Mate I'm 156% with you!! I pray to the footy gods he comes home!
But I'm not getting that vibe....he's going to be a damn legend...it'll be hard to lure him.
You are spot on, it's going to be bloody hard. This has made me think about who our hardest to get player has been, who has been our coup?
Hill & Hannebery were lay downs because of the amount of money we were offering plus picks & players. I doubt anyone could call those shrewd, savvy deals.
Ben may actually be those most crucial trade target in our history. If we can land him without selling Linton Street, including the playground, our List Manager may become just as immortal.
B.M wrote: ↑Tue 07 Sep 2021 8:22pm
Loewe and Lockett
Brereton and Dunstall
Carey and Longmire
Brown and Lynch
Roughead and Franklin
Lucas and Lloyd
Reiwoldt and Gehrig
Could go on further
Two big dogs up front are hard to stop.
How many premierships did Loewe-Lockett and Riewoldt-Gehrig win?
They might win you games, but not premierships.
A gun midfield is the most important aspect of an AFL team, we need to invest in that.
All posters are equal, but some posters are more equal than others.
The_Dud wrote: ↑Tue 07 Sep 2021 9:43pm
Any of those teams have average midfields?
Geelong won 3 premierships with a mixture of Mooney, N Ablett, Podsiadly and young (ordinary) Hawkins up forward.
The Dogs won with Zaine Cordy and Tom Boyd (who was more ruck)
Richmond won their first with just Riewoldt.
Sydney won with Sam Reid.
Collingwood won with Cloke and Dawes…
You can win premierships with average key forwards and gun mids, but you can’t do it the other way around.
And before you say it, yes we need more than Steele and a bunch of Bs / Cs
Ports midfield has only 2 stars Boak and Wines rest is ok
Our misfiled could do with 1 or 2 more class outside runners to assist but that’s doable even if we draft Bing and certainly our current midfield ain’t the worst in the league
Point is getting Bing and improving our midfield ain’t mutually exclusive- we can do both and that doesn’t take into account players on the list now we’d like to run through there that could in time include Clarke, Bytel, Byrnes - even Coffield played mid as a junior and eventually I think Connolly could roll through if we keep his development up.
A talented roaming lead up CHF /Forward plus another contested marking FF beast at the same time for St Kilda is unique.
You don’t let that pass IF it’s possible.
My take in it. If you have two teams with equally good midfields, the one with the edge will be the one that consistently converts opportunities into goals under pressure. That’s why good forwards - and particularly key forwards - are important. The finishing part of the game is so often the difference.
But it’s no good having gun key forwards that you cannot supply. Obviously.
Exactly my point. A star studded midfield / smalls could even make Mooney look AA.
And Hawkins kicked 27 goals in 18 games in 2011 (and kicked 3 goals in a 40 point GF win)…
Hayes, Dal Santo, Goddard, Montagna and Ball (x1) were 2 bounces of a ball away from being dual premiership players.
Yes, all 3 zones are equally important, so investing 15% of your salary cap in 2 tall forwards isn’t the smartest plan. Especially when your next highest paid player after that will probably be a ruck/forward. Doesn’t leave much to go around in the midfield and defence.
A gun midfield will make an average forward/backline look better, while an average midfield will make a gun forward/backline look worse. The ball always starts and is won in the midfield.
Having 2x King’s would sell a whole lot of tickets and merch, and would probably have many exciting performances a season, but would leave too many holes over the field to win premierships, considering the cap space and draft capital it would cost.
If you could lock them both in at $750k a season for 10 years and get Ben for Battle and a 2nd rounder, great! I would love it! But that ain’t gonna happen.
All posters are equal, but some posters are more equal than others.
The_Dud wrote: ↑Tue 07 Sep 2021 11:59pm
St Kilda’s problem has always been having superstar players, some of the greatest of all time, but poor depth.
We’ve got to learn from this.
Don’t disagree but no ones suggesting sell the farm or over pay Bing - he’ll get more from Essendon but if he comes to us he gets what his brother gets and that’s unders IMO
I’m not convinced he’ll come but if he nominated us you just do it
You won’t get a star forward on the rise who just kicked 50 goals in a poor side for fringe in Battle and a second rounder ...go look at what Cats gave up for Cameron
Bing would be 2 firsts and possibly a player with a late something back
However that price changes if he’s OOC and we get him end next year ...my worry there is Dew will be sacked....Clarkson appointed and it might be hard to get him then
SAINT-LEE wrote: ↑Mon 06 Sep 2021 6:06pm
Yes yes....I'm sure Ben is drooling over the idea of going backwards.
He can't wait to come to St Kilda into his brothers shadow like the 19 years previous. Always second best, relegated to fullback.
He is chomping to get back under Max and lose himself in being the "twin".
Wake up!
He will never and I repeat, NEVER come to St Kilda.
I hope he thinks a little bit more of himself than that & has a resolve in him that wants to do something unique. To me that would be, in partnership with his brother, to create the most formidable forward duo in the AFL.
Not to mention a legacy for a Club their family follow, or the money / brand that would also materialise.
Mate I'm 156% with you!! I pray to the footy gods he comes home!
But I'm not getting that vibe....he's going to be a damn legend...it'll be hard to lure him.
You are spot on, it's going to be bloody hard. This has made me think about who our hardest to get player has been, who has been our coup?
Hill & Hannebery were lay downs because of the amount of money we were offering plus picks & players. I doubt anyone could call those shrewd, savvy deals.
Ben may actually be those most crucial trade target in our history. If we can land him without selling Linton Street, including the playground, our List Manager may become just as immortal.
I reckon Howard has been a real coup. Port made him Captain and did NOT want him to go. Gearing up for a flag etc. Yet Gags got it done and we have our FB for the next X years.
SAINT-LEE wrote: ↑Tue 07 Sep 2021 2:38pm
But being an identical twin myself and having my younger bro tell me how hard it was for him in my
" shadow"....which I never realised or even thought was true....I don't reckon it will happen.
We both went to a family therapist in 1989 ( our parents passed in a auto accident, we were 15 and it fudged us 6 kids up) and it shocked me how he felt and the freedom he found by joining the army and being "out" from under both the "twin" and my stranglehold.
I was and am book smarter but I never thought that mattered. He was behind me athletically but he had all the ladies and I spent many a lonely night at the servo magazine rack....
I don't know if these twins feel the same unspoken struggle to find their unique self...I know that pain behind the laugh after hearing 78,000 times...."now which one are you?"
Hopefully they're healthier emotionally and we see a family reunion!!!!
Such an interesting story, Saint-Lee - thanks for posting it. What a tough age to lose your parents. The important question though - does your brother barrack for the saints???!!!
minneapolis wrote: ↑Wed 08 Sep 2021 2:34am.
I reckon Howard has been a real coup. Port made him Captain and did NOT want him to go. Gearing up for a flag etc. Yet Gags got it done and we have our FB for the next X years.
Also I thought Crouch was a very savvy trade.
I don't see them as coups, I do see them as smart trades and good recruiting. By coup I mean prising a club's best player or a gun on the rise from a club. Beating other clubs to that player's signature without offering a ridiculous amount, crippling our club's future.
SAINT-LEE wrote: ↑Tue 07 Sep 2021 2:38pm
But being an identical twin myself and having my younger bro tell me how hard it was for him in my
" shadow"....which I never realised or even thought was true....I don't reckon it will happen.
We both went to a family therapist in 1989 ( our parents passed in a auto accident, we were 15 and it fudged us 6 kids up) and it shocked me how he felt and the freedom he found by joining the army and being "out" from under both the "twin" and my stranglehold.
I was and am book smarter but I never thought that mattered. He was behind me athletically but he had all the ladies and I spent many a lonely night at the servo magazine rack....
I don't know if these twins feel the same unspoken struggle to find their unique self...I know that pain behind the laugh after hearing 78,000 times...."now which one are you?"
Hopefully they're healthier emotionally and we see a family reunion!!!!
Such an interesting story, Saint-Lee - thanks for posting it. What a tough age to lose your parents. The important question though - does your brother barrack for the saints???!!!
The_Dud wrote: ↑Tue 07 Sep 2021 11:59pm
St Kilda’s problem has always been having superstar players, some of the greatest of all time, but poor depth.
We’ve got to learn from this.
Don’t disagree but no ones suggesting sell the farm or over pay Bing - he’ll get more from Essendon but if he comes to us he gets what his brother gets and that’s unders IMO
I’m not convinced he’ll come but if he nominated us you just do it
You won’t get a star forward on the rise who just kicked 50 goals in a poor side for fringe in Battle and a second rounder ...go look at what Cats gave up for Cameron
Bing would be 2 firsts and possibly a player with a late something back
However that price changes if he’s OOC and we get him end next year ...my worry there is Dew will be sacked....Clarkson appointed and it might be hard to get him then
I think some are suggesting selling the farm for him. 2 FRDP + is doing that IMO. We need to use as many FRDP on mids as we can, need to find Steele a couple of A grade mates.
All posters are equal, but some posters are more equal than others.
