Or by someone who was trying to talk themselves out of taking their own lifeterry smith rules wrote:then explain to me why young kids are committing suicide after getting bullied.stinger wrote: ....when i was growing up i was told that sticks and stones will break my bones but words will never hurt.....
I suspect that saying was made up by someone trying to justify their actions/words
Milne and OBrien investigation
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Re: Milne and OBrien investigation
- Dr Spaceman
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Re: Milne and OBrien investigation
Footballers are employees and the football ground is their workplace. That of course is technically correct.
The reality is that these are sportsmen playing sport on a sporting ground.
These are men who have to endure enormous physical and mental pressures just to be able to stay on a list and compete in the game. These are men who once a week, while most of us are still lying under the doona, have to wade into a frozen sea in their jocks.
Yes workplace bullying is a terrible thing and should not be tolerated.
But to apply the usual standards of workplace bullying to these pumped up, high profile athletes is laughable.
The first year apprentice may well be upset at being called a “Homo”. But if an AFL player is destroyed by such a remark then he’s obviously pursuing the wrong career.
So keep calling it a workplace. I’ll keep thinking of it as a sport.
The reality is that these are sportsmen playing sport on a sporting ground.
These are men who have to endure enormous physical and mental pressures just to be able to stay on a list and compete in the game. These are men who once a week, while most of us are still lying under the doona, have to wade into a frozen sea in their jocks.
Yes workplace bullying is a terrible thing and should not be tolerated.
But to apply the usual standards of workplace bullying to these pumped up, high profile athletes is laughable.
The first year apprentice may well be upset at being called a “Homo”. But if an AFL player is destroyed by such a remark then he’s obviously pursuing the wrong career.
So keep calling it a workplace. I’ll keep thinking of it as a sport.
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Re: Milne and OBrien investigation
tsr. You have no idea.
Well said Joffaboy. Not all workplaces are exactly the same. How can they be? They're DIFFERENT workplaces. Probably in DIFFERENT buildings or grounds as well.
Well said Joffaboy. Not all workplaces are exactly the same. How can they be? They're DIFFERENT workplaces. Probably in DIFFERENT buildings or grounds as well.
As ex-president Peter Summers said:
“If we are going to be a contender, we may as well plan to win the bloody thing.”
St Kilda - At least we have a Crest!
“If we are going to be a contender, we may as well plan to win the bloody thing.”
St Kilda - At least we have a Crest!
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Re: Milne and OBrien investigation
My problem is that when you sit on the boundary line as I often do, especially against interstate sides you can get a pretty clear idea of what is said during a footy match. This incident was not any different to heaps of others on field but this was taken out the match and played out in a public arena. The AFL chose to promote it as an issue. If it had not been publicised it would not have been different to the several sledges that will go over the line this week. He shouldn't say it but he did. It isn't an easy thing to get sympathetic towards the AFL on because they have chosen to take one incident out of hundreds to cover themselves not because anybody truly felt any sense of persecution.
This is a case of an official using the media to justify stepping over the rule book and into a role of moral guardian for society.Talking of moral guardians here is one of the best of all time enjoy...
This is a case of an official using the media to justify stepping over the rule book and into a role of moral guardian for society.Talking of moral guardians here is one of the best of all time enjoy...
Re: Milne and OBrien investigation
terry smith rules wrote:then explain to me why young kids are committing suicide after getting bullied.stinger wrote: ....when i was growing up i was told that sticks and stones will break my bones but words will never hurt.....
I suspect that saying was made up by someone trying to justify their actions/words
that's after sustained bullying i believe......i get bullied and called names on here...to me it's water off a ducks back.....but then i accept some are more fagile than others......
for the record, you seriously don't believe what milne said to o'brien would end up in o'brien taking his life ffs....
.everybody still loves lenny....and we always will
"Freedom of expression is the cornerstone of a free society,"
However, freedom of expression is not encouraged in certain forums.
"Freedom of expression is the cornerstone of a free society,"
However, freedom of expression is not encouraged in certain forums.
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Re: Milne and OBrien investigation
Exactly. Its a sport not an office job or construction job.markp wrote:If OH&S get onto this idea all the players will have to wear hardhats, orange vest, and protective goggles.
It's political correctness gone mad.
I'm pretty sick of this nanny state they call Australia. It's gone to the dogs.
Last edited by Jacks Back on Fri 10 Aug 2012 5:08pm, edited 1 time in total.
As ex-president Peter Summers said:
“If we are going to be a contender, we may as well plan to win the bloody thing.”
St Kilda - At least we have a Crest!
“If we are going to be a contender, we may as well plan to win the bloody thing.”
St Kilda - At least we have a Crest!
Re: Milne and OBrien investigation
gringo wrote:My problem is that when you sit on the boundary line as I often do, especially against interstate sides you can get a pretty clear idea of what is said during a footy match. This incident was not any different to heaps of others on field but this was taken out the match and played out in a public arena. The AFL chose to promote it as an issue. If it had not been publicised it would not have been different to the several sledges that will go over the line this week. He shouldn't say it but he did. It isn't an easy thing to get sympathetic towards the AFL on because they have chosen to take one incident out of hundreds to cover themselves not because anybody truly felt any sense of persecution.
This is a case of an official using the media to justify stepping over the rule book and into a role of moral guardian for society.Talking of moral guardians here is one of the best of all time enjoy...
well said....
.everybody still loves lenny....and we always will
"Freedom of expression is the cornerstone of a free society,"
However, freedom of expression is not encouraged in certain forums.
"Freedom of expression is the cornerstone of a free society,"
However, freedom of expression is not encouraged in certain forums.
Re: Milne and OBrien investigation
made me laugh...gold mate...pure unadulterated gold....gringo wrote:My problem is that when you sit on the boundary line as I often do, especially against interstate sides you can get a pretty clear idea of what is said during a footy match. This incident was not any different to heaps of others on field but this was taken out the match and played out in a public arena. The AFL chose to promote it as an issue. If it had not been publicised it would not have been different to the several sledges that will go over the line this week. He shouldn't say it but he did. It isn't an easy thing to get sympathetic towards the AFL on because they have chosen to take one incident out of hundreds to cover themselves not because anybody truly felt any sense of persecution.
This is a case of an official using the media to justify stepping over the rule book and into a role of moral guardian for society.Talking of moral guardians here is one of the best of all time enjoy...
.everybody still loves lenny....and we always will
"Freedom of expression is the cornerstone of a free society,"
However, freedom of expression is not encouraged in certain forums.
"Freedom of expression is the cornerstone of a free society,"
However, freedom of expression is not encouraged in certain forums.
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Re: Milne and OBrien investigation
stinger wrote:gringo wrote:My problem is that when you sit on the boundary line as I often do, especially against interstate sides you can get a pretty clear idea of what is said during a footy match. This incident was not any different to heaps of others on field but this was taken out the match and played out in a public arena. The AFL chose to promote it as an issue. If it had not been publicised it would not have been different to the several sledges that will go over the line this week. He shouldn't say it but he did. It isn't an easy thing to get sympathetic towards the AFL on because they have chosen to take one incident out of hundreds to cover themselves not because anybody truly felt any sense of persecution.
This is a case of an official using the media to justify stepping over the rule book and into a role of moral guardian for society.Talking of moral guardians here is one of the best of all time enjoy...
well said....
Who me or Alan Jones?
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Re: Milne and OBrien investigation
prwilkinson wrote:Alan Jones... Hilarious...
Lucky he doesn't work for the Saints he'd need to work for a year to pay the fines.
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Re: Milne and OBrien investigation
Lame analogy. Those things were a positive change to society and removed barricades for equality. Stopping someone from calling his opponent a name on the football field - or trying to completely eradicate the use of such vaguely pejorative terms in wider society - is inane and symptomatic of a society pandering too far to sensitivities in some ludicrous attempt to ensure that no one is ever offended by anyone ever again. A noble aspiration perhaps, but still ridiculous... People need to toughen up and accept that the world is never going to be a perfect place, and worry more about their own actions and the things that they can control rather than getting upset over the most trivial of matters such as this. In the overall scheme of things this incident literally means nothing. The nanny state has well and truly arrived if calling someone a name during a football match is front page news...Austinnn wrote: * Yes, the world has changed/gone mad/whatever. People said exactly the same thing hundreds of years ago when society let women vote, or when they stopped slavery. Its called progression. And they reacted the same way to what I just said as you probably just have. Hopefully your kids will be a bit more with it. Yes, it comes close to an Orwellian scenario, but I think that society is trying to redress the crimes of the past a bit and I think eventually we'll find a balance. Please be patient.
The future's so bright I've got to wear shades...
Re: Milne and OBrien investigation
you......jones was really funny....made me smile......i've know a few members of the bench who carried on like that too.....gringo wrote:stinger wrote:gringo wrote:My problem is that when you sit on the boundary line as I often do, especially against interstate sides you can get a pretty clear idea of what is said during a footy match. This incident was not any different to heaps of others on field but this was taken out the match and played out in a public arena. The AFL chose to promote it as an issue. If it had not been publicised it would not have been different to the several sledges that will go over the line this week. He shouldn't say it but he did. It isn't an easy thing to get sympathetic towards the AFL on because they have chosen to take one incident out of hundreds to cover themselves not because anybody truly felt any sense of persecution.
This is a case of an official using the media to justify stepping over the rule book and into a role of moral guardian for society.Talking of moral guardians here is one of the best of all time enjoy...
well said....
Who me or Alan Jones?
.everybody still loves lenny....and we always will
"Freedom of expression is the cornerstone of a free society,"
However, freedom of expression is not encouraged in certain forums.
"Freedom of expression is the cornerstone of a free society,"
However, freedom of expression is not encouraged in certain forums.
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Re: Milne and OBrien investigation
Extraordinarily well expressed....well said sir.....(or ma'am)Harvey To Hayes wrote:
Lame analogy. Those things were a positive change to society and removed barricades for equality. Stopping someone from calling his opponent a name on the football field - or trying to completely eradicate the use of such vaguely pejorative terms in wider society - is inane and symptomatic of a society pandering too far to sensitivities in some ludicrous attempt to ensure that no one is ever offended by anyone ever again. A noble aspiration perhaps, but still ridiculous... People need to toughen up and accept that the world is never going to be a perfect place, and worry more about their own actions and the things that they can control rather than getting upset over the most trivial of matters such as this. In the overall scheme of things this incident literally means nothing. The nanny state has well and truly arrived if calling someone a name during a football match is front page news...
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Re: Milne and OBrien investigation
Wise wordsHarvey To Hayes wrote:Lame analogy. Those things were a positive change to society and removed barricades for equality. Stopping someone from calling his opponent a name on the football field - or trying to completely eradicate the use of such vaguely pejorative terms in wider society - is inane and symptomatic of a society pandering too far to sensitivities in some ludicrous attempt to ensure that no one is ever offended by anyone ever again. A noble aspiration perhaps, but still ridiculous... People need to toughen up and accept that the world is never going to be a perfect place, and worry more about their own actions and the things that they can control rather than getting upset over the most trivial of matters such as this. In the overall scheme of things this incident literally means nothing. The nanny state has well and truly arrived if calling someone a name during a football match is front page news...Austinnn wrote: * Yes, the world has changed/gone mad/whatever. People said exactly the same thing hundreds of years ago when society let women vote, or when they stopped slavery. Its called progression. And they reacted the same way to what I just said as you probably just have. Hopefully your kids will be a bit more with it. Yes, it comes close to an Orwellian scenario, but I think that society is trying to redress the crimes of the past a bit and I think eventually we'll find a balance. Please be patient.
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Re: Milne and OBrien investigation
Harvey To Hayes wrote:Lame analogy. Those things were a positive change to society and removed barricades for equality. Stopping someone from calling his opponent a name on the football field - or trying to completely eradicate the use of such vaguely pejorative terms in wider society - is inane and symptomatic of a society pandering too far to sensitivities in some ludicrous attempt to ensure that no one is ever offended by anyone ever again. A noble aspiration perhaps, but still ridiculous... People need to toughen up and accept that the world is never going to be a perfect place, and worry more about their own actions and the things that they can control rather than getting upset over the most trivial of matters such as this. In the overall scheme of things this incident literally means nothing. The nanny state has well and truly arrived if calling someone a name during a football match is front page news...Austinnn wrote: * Yes, the world has changed/gone mad/whatever. People said exactly the same thing hundreds of years ago when society let women vote, or when they stopped slavery. Its called progression. And they reacted the same way to what I just said as you probably just have. Hopefully your kids will be a bit more with it. Yes, it comes close to an Orwellian scenario, but I think that society is trying to redress the crimes of the past a bit and I think eventually we'll find a balance. Please be patient.
If you want to talk seriously, we allow guys like Jones to send people to the Maroubra riots to reclaim the beaches while making grand sweeping statements that are designed to inflame and incite hatred but we pull out an off the cuff remark from a footballer who's only life experience was as a shelf packer at Coles and expect them to behave better than carping pollies and powerful broadcasters.
There are bigger issues in our society than Milney's naive comments that show an ignorance rather than any genuine attempt to harm, upset or persecute.
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Re: Milne and OBrien investigation
Is it possible Milne accidently left the umpire feeling like he had been outed?Leo.J wrote:Did the umpire take offense to what Milne said?
Is the umpire gay?
Did this slur insult the umpire enough to blur his judgement?
If we ever get Margetts as an umpire, I suggest we offer the walkover, otherwise it will be similar to every match including former umpire Michael Vozzo. He'd umpire our game, we'd lose.
I'll say it again I was left sensing Margetts turned himself into judge and jury and now we know why.
Re: Milne and OBrien investigation
'Sheila' - IMO not acceptable. I hate that in playgrounds the standard insult from boys to each other is to call the other 'a girl'... women have until recently been disenfranchised... domestic violence used to be sanctioned and in many parts of the world women really are second class citizens.markp wrote:Can they call someone a 'shiella', or 'mental', or 'short-arse', or 'baldy'?... all are technically vilification.
Homo?
What a joke.
And Harry O was going out with that Fuzzy chick for a long time, so while context may be relevant I don't think it comes into play here.
'Mental' - the perjorative use of this term ought to stop... again, the stereotyping and stigmatisation of people with mental illnesses really has gone on too long in our society
Racist and homophobic insults similarly are not acceptable.
'Short-arse', 'baldy', 'beardy'... whatever... I hardly think that people with those characteristics have been ritually and systematically subjected to denigration and an abrogation of their rights as human beings as those in the other groups have. Some of society's prevailing attitudes are clearly evident in this thread.
In case people were not aware, in Nazi Germany and their occupied countries gay people were sent to the gas chambers too.
Up until 30 years ago homosexuality was categorised as a mental disorder in the DSM (psychiatric diagnostic classification).
In most of the world, including Australia, gay people are not allowed to marry (which IMO is an absolute disgrace).
----------------
If the above views make some people think I am 'overly-PC' then sobeit... for my part this thread makes me acutely aware of just how conservative mainstream Australia remains. I attended a talk this week that was given by a former Chief Justice in Victoira when he made this very point (with regards to Human Rights). When people with whose political views I usually am sympathy with on this forum are joining in the reactionary throng then I realise just how right Alistair Nicholson is.
Hird... The unflushable one is now... just a turd...
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Re: Milne and OBrien investigation
This from the AFL webiste
http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/ ... fault.aspx
and Scott Watters's thoughts from a different article on the same website:
http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/ ... fault.aspx
Yah, sure.
Regardless, I think it was probably wise of the club to fine the player and take care of it in-house rather than it becoming a wider AFL issue. Of course, it's all over the papers, but Milney was a villain before, he'll be a villain after. We still love him.
I'm glad that the club is handling it more maturely than some of the posters on this thread. I don't know where a lot of you have been for the last 20 years, but this is not a new idea. If you question why we need to be so sensitive about gay discrimination, then take a look at this ''nostalgic' post from howlinwolf, from page 8 of this thread, dated this year 2012:
Maybe if Margetts was just watching in the crowd, or it was just a suburban league game, he wouldn't have been moved to make this complaint. He may have considered that as the appointed officiator of a high profile game of great interest to the general public (at least AFL fans), he needed to be visibly strict on behaviour.
This may have even been a directive of the AFL; stamp out all unseemly behaviour that casts a negative or 'unenlightened' shadow over our 'brand', if you like. Even if it didn't come from AFL directly, with all the fines and bans for vilification and such, you can see what the AFL wants to do. I'd imagine that Dean Margetts will be getting a pat on his head from the Dear Leader at AFL House about now.
Scott Watters is bang on, again. Milney needed to be more disciplined, full stop. Whatever it's fair or not, there is sadly only one way to do his job and that is the AFL way. I'm sure he'll be happier mouthing off to his hearts content in whatever suburban league he falls back into after retirement, but for now he has to control himself.
As for Margetts, he has made a rod for his back now, appointing himself as manners coach for the 18 clubs of the AFL and all their players, having to report anyone who he feels might have used excessively bad language. I'd imagine that each of his future games would now garner at least one similar report... or perhaps he'll just decide that he's made his point, and feel no further need to reprimand anyone based on displaced aggression; yeah, I've got a feeling it will be the latter.
Harry O won't lose any sleep, won't worry about what Milney said, is thankfully oblivious to the dozens of idiots on this site and thousands more around Australia who don't like him because "he thinks he's so good" and he's from Brazil and his girlfriend's called Fuzzy, etc. He isn't at fault for the report, he can absolve himself of blame. He never has any problem containing Milney, but now he knows exactly how to stop him. Our players have done the same to excessively wound up opposition players in the past (Boomer Harvey, Scott Camporeale, etc).
The world's homosexual community will be fine too, I'm sure they take any homophobic comments by footballers as read anyway. Progress continues but there are some limits to what can be achieved in 30 years. Maybe Aker was right after all. Football just isn't ready. The fans and players that is, not the administrators.
That leaves people like some of us, people who see the damage done by homophobic discrimination (type teen gay suicide into google and check out some of the results) but also can see that this was neither vilification or really homophobia, (i.e. Milne used the word HOMO because he's grown up believing that that is an appropriate insult for a sensitive man, not because he hates gays). What the hell do we do? Keep pretending these two situations are unrelated?
http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/ ... fault.aspx
"Milne and O'Brien clashed verbally after the St Kilda forward gave away a free kick for sliding feet-first into Darren Jolly during the third quarter of the game.
The offending taunt by Milne to O'Brien was not picked up on TV microphones, but events before and after the exchange were.
As O'Brien came in to take Jolly's kick, with the ruckman on the ground winded, he and Milne argued.
Officiating umpire Dean Margetts could be heard through a TV microphone saying, "OK, OK, enough of the language."
Milne was then heard saying to O'Brien, "What are you going to do, f**khead? What are you going to do?"
Margetts awarded a 50m penalty to Collingwood, saying, "That language is unacceptable""
and Scott Watters's thoughts from a different article on the same website:
http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/ ... fault.aspx
Sounds like Margetts wanted to reproach Milne and teach him a lesson about manners. I hope he's been consistent throughout all his games and zeroing in on anyone who he feels is excessively rude and/or aggressive. How many games has he officiated? How many similar reports has he lodged? Of course there is the chance that Stephen Milne is the only player he has ever encountered who has been so uncouth."The players are under enormous pressures, but you do still have a choice on what you say and how you react," Watters said on Friday morning.
"So Stephen's choice of vocab was poor.
"You need to be disciplined, you need to be controlled, and it's not about laying blame at the doorstep of someone else."
Asked if he felt the AFL had taken political correctness too far, Watters said it was important to maintain perspective.
"I'm not going to enter into that debate, but one thing I check myself on all the time is … trying to put myself in a player's shoes," he said.
"He (Milne) is a player that cops an enormous amount of criticism and taunts from opposition supporters, who probably hadn't received a couple of free kicks to that point that he though he might, all those pressures that players are under.
"Keep a perspective on that, but still ultimately you have a choice on how you respond, and good athletes and good teams … their discipline is outstanding.
"So regardless of whether you think it's political correctness gone made or whatever, you control that as an individual."
Yah, sure.
Regardless, I think it was probably wise of the club to fine the player and take care of it in-house rather than it becoming a wider AFL issue. Of course, it's all over the papers, but Milney was a villain before, he'll be a villain after. We still love him.
I'm glad that the club is handling it more maturely than some of the posters on this thread. I don't know where a lot of you have been for the last 20 years, but this is not a new idea. If you question why we need to be so sensitive about gay discrimination, then take a look at this ''nostalgic' post from howlinwolf, from page 8 of this thread, dated this year 2012:
Yes, it's idiotic and not representing the general sentiment on here, yet still unpleasant to read. Like Margetts with Milne, I found this post distasteful and considered reproaching the poster. Unlike Margetts, I thought again and decided it wasn't worth it. Perhaps the difference in context is the reason why Margetts didn't withdraw his report after reflection: I am not the appointed officiator of this forum, so it's not my place. Even if I was a mod though, I'd think twice because although this is technically a public forum, it is not being read by great numbers of sports fans or televised, and is seldom referred to outside itself, if that makes sense. If it was a newspaper and I was an editor, I wouldn't print it. If howlinwolf had said it on TV, and I was the producer, I might have told him off, or even suspended him. What about you, what would you have done?howlinwolf wrote:Unfortunately it isn't going to stop. It's a juggernaut that doesn't involve sensibilites. The world is obsessed with political correctness to the point we will have gay marriages accepted.
I don't care what they call their union but it isn't marriage.
The Oxford Dictionary defines marriage as between man and woman. Next we'll be calling an apple an orange due to PC.
Maybe if Margetts was just watching in the crowd, or it was just a suburban league game, he wouldn't have been moved to make this complaint. He may have considered that as the appointed officiator of a high profile game of great interest to the general public (at least AFL fans), he needed to be visibly strict on behaviour.
This may have even been a directive of the AFL; stamp out all unseemly behaviour that casts a negative or 'unenlightened' shadow over our 'brand', if you like. Even if it didn't come from AFL directly, with all the fines and bans for vilification and such, you can see what the AFL wants to do. I'd imagine that Dean Margetts will be getting a pat on his head from the Dear Leader at AFL House about now.
Scott Watters is bang on, again. Milney needed to be more disciplined, full stop. Whatever it's fair or not, there is sadly only one way to do his job and that is the AFL way. I'm sure he'll be happier mouthing off to his hearts content in whatever suburban league he falls back into after retirement, but for now he has to control himself.
As for Margetts, he has made a rod for his back now, appointing himself as manners coach for the 18 clubs of the AFL and all their players, having to report anyone who he feels might have used excessively bad language. I'd imagine that each of his future games would now garner at least one similar report... or perhaps he'll just decide that he's made his point, and feel no further need to reprimand anyone based on displaced aggression; yeah, I've got a feeling it will be the latter.
Harry O won't lose any sleep, won't worry about what Milney said, is thankfully oblivious to the dozens of idiots on this site and thousands more around Australia who don't like him because "he thinks he's so good" and he's from Brazil and his girlfriend's called Fuzzy, etc. He isn't at fault for the report, he can absolve himself of blame. He never has any problem containing Milney, but now he knows exactly how to stop him. Our players have done the same to excessively wound up opposition players in the past (Boomer Harvey, Scott Camporeale, etc).
The world's homosexual community will be fine too, I'm sure they take any homophobic comments by footballers as read anyway. Progress continues but there are some limits to what can be achieved in 30 years. Maybe Aker was right after all. Football just isn't ready. The fans and players that is, not the administrators.
That leaves people like some of us, people who see the damage done by homophobic discrimination (type teen gay suicide into google and check out some of the results) but also can see that this was neither vilification or really homophobia, (i.e. Milne used the word HOMO because he's grown up believing that that is an appropriate insult for a sensitive man, not because he hates gays). What the hell do we do? Keep pretending these two situations are unrelated?
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Re: Milne and OBrien investigation
IF it's any comfort at all mate, I'm with you 100%.Richter wrote: If the above views make some people think I am 'overly-PC' then sobeit... for my part this thread makes me acutely aware of just how conservative mainstream Australia remains. I attended a talk this week that was given by a former Chief Justice in Victoira when he made this very point (with regards to Human Rights). When people with whose political views I usually am sympathy with on this forum are joining in the reactionary throng then I realise just how right Alistair Nicholson is.
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Re: Milne and OBrien investigation
OMGAustinnn wrote:This from the AFL webiste
http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/ ... fault.aspx
"Milne and O'Brien clashed verbally after the St Kilda forward gave away a free kick for sliding feet-first into Darren Jolly during the third quarter of the game.
The offending taunt by Milne to O'Brien was not picked up on TV microphones, but events before and after the exchange were.
As O'Brien came in to take Jolly's kick, with the ruckman on the ground winded, he and Milne argued.
Officiating umpire Dean Margetts could be heard through a TV microphone saying, "OK, OK, enough of the language."
Milne was then heard saying to O'Brien, "What are you going to do, f**khead? What are you going to do?"
Margetts awarded a 50m penalty to Collingwood, saying, "That language is unacceptable""
and Scott Watters's thoughts from a different article on the same website:
http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/ ... fault.aspx
Sounds like Margetts wanted to reproach Milne and teach him a lesson about manners. I hope he's been consistent throughout all his games and zeroing in on anyone who he feels is excessively rude and/or aggressive. How many games has he officiated? How many similar reports has he lodged? Of course there is the chance that Stephen Milne is the only player he has ever encountered who has been so uncouth."The players are under enormous pressures, but you do still have a choice on what you say and how you react," Watters said on Friday morning.
"So Stephen's choice of vocab was poor.
"You need to be disciplined, you need to be controlled, and it's not about laying blame at the doorstep of someone else."
Asked if he felt the AFL had taken political correctness too far, Watters said it was important to maintain perspective.
"I'm not going to enter into that debate, but one thing I check myself on all the time is … trying to put myself in a player's shoes," he said.
"He (Milne) is a player that cops an enormous amount of criticism and taunts from opposition supporters, who probably hadn't received a couple of free kicks to that point that he though he might, all those pressures that players are under.
"Keep a perspective on that, but still ultimately you have a choice on how you respond, and good athletes and good teams … their discipline is outstanding.
"So regardless of whether you think it's political correctness gone made or whatever, you control that as an individual."
Yah, sure.
Regardless, I think it was probably wise of the club to fine the player and take care of it in-house rather than it becoming a wider AFL issue. Of course, it's all over the papers, but Milney was a villain before, he'll be a villain after. We still love him.
I'm glad that the club is handling it more maturely than some of the posters on this thread. I don't know where a lot of you have been for the last 20 years, but this is not a new idea. If you question why we need to be so sensitive about gay discrimination, then take a look at this ''nostalgic' post from howlinwolf, from page 8 of this thread, dated this year 2012:Yes, it's idiotic and not representing the general sentiment on here, yet still unpleasant to read. Like Margetts with Milne, I found this post distasteful and considered reproaching the poster. Unlike Margetts, I thought again and decided it wasn't worth it. Perhaps the difference in context is the reason why Margetts didn't withdraw his report after reflection: I am not the appointed officiator of this forum, so it's not my place. Even if I was a mod though, I'd think twice because although this is technically a public forum, it is not being read by great numbers of sports fans or televised, and is seldom referred to outside itself, if that makes sense. If it was a newspaper and I was an editor, I wouldn't print it. If howlinwolf had said it on TV, and I was the producer, I might have told him off, or even suspended him. What about you, what would you have done?howlinwolf wrote:Unfortunately it isn't going to stop. It's a juggernaut that doesn't involve sensibilites. The world is obsessed with political correctness to the point we will have gay marriages accepted.
I don't care what they call their union but it isn't marriage.
The Oxford Dictionary defines marriage as between man and woman. Next we'll be calling an apple an orange due to PC.
Maybe if Margetts was just watching in the crowd, or it was just a suburban league game, he wouldn't have been moved to make this complaint. He may have considered that as the appointed officiator of a high profile game of great interest to the general public (at least AFL fans), he needed to be visibly strict on behaviour.
This may have even been a directive of the AFL; stamp out all unseemly behaviour that casts a negative or 'unenlightened' shadow over our 'brand', if you like. Even if it didn't come from AFL directly, with all the fines and bans for vilification and such, you can see what the AFL wants to do. I'd imagine that Dean Margetts will be getting a pat on his head from the Dear Leader at AFL House about now.
Scott Watters is bang on, again. Milney needed to be more disciplined, full stop. Whatever it's fair or not, there is sadly only one way to do his job and that is the AFL way. I'm sure he'll be happier mouthing off to his hearts content in whatever suburban league he falls back into after retirement, but for now he has to control himself.
As for Margetts, he has made a rod for his back now, appointing himself as manners coach for the 18 clubs of the AFL and all their players, having to report anyone who he feels might have used excessively bad language. I'd imagine that each of his future games would now garner at least one similar report... or perhaps he'll just decide that he's made his point, and feel no further need to reprimand anyone based on displaced aggression; yeah, I've got a feeling it will be the latter.
Harry O won't lose any sleep, won't worry about what Milney said, is thankfully oblivious to the dozens of idiots on this site and thousands more around Australia who don't like him because "he thinks he's so good" and he's from Brazil and his girlfriend's called Fuzzy, etc. He isn't at fault for the report, he can absolve himself of blame. He never has any problem containing Milney, but now he knows exactly how to stop him. Our players have done the same to excessively wound up opposition players in the past (Boomer Harvey, Scott Camporeale, etc).
The world's homosexual community will be fine too, I'm sure they take any homophobic comments by footballers as read anyway. Progress continues but there are some limits to what can be achieved in 30 years. Maybe Aker was right after all. Football just isn't ready. The fans and players that is, not the administrators.
That leaves people like some of us, people who see the damage done by homophobic discrimination (type teen gay suicide into google and check out some of the results) but also can see that this was neither vilification or really homophobia, (i.e. Milne used the word HOMO because he's grown up believing that that is an appropriate insult for a sensitive man, not because he hates gays). What the hell do we do? Keep pretending these two situations are unrelated?
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Re: Milne and OBrien investigation
Munga wrote:So he called him a homo??
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Homo erectus...
Hehe.
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Re: Milne and OBrien investigation
Mildly amused at Chris Johnson , given his history
http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/ ... fault.aspx
http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/ ... fault.aspx
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Rejoicing in hope, patient in tribulation, continuing steadfastly..!!
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