an impression.....

[Dr Spaceman]

It is funny how after what has been our most sustained period of success ever we are becoming more frustrated by our list. The guys that have carried us for the last 5 or 6 years don't seem to have any credit for past achievements. Guys like Gram that were one of the reasons for our finals success are now thrown out by forumites. Gram was a Saints supporter growing up and as such I like him more than players that didn't, a bit like Peckett. Our players are victims of their success, because they nearly got there they have left a frustrated fan base wanting blood. A couple of pieces of luck and they would be eternal heroes. Tough gig football.

And with an ounce of luck, Gram would have been a Norm Smith medalist in the club's second only Premiership side!

[dragit]

The reality is that Saints fans, like all football fans are made up of all walks of life, with contrasting values, different experiences and intelligence.
Whilst I really do appreciate the sentiment - stick fat. For me, this really is the place for people to share their ideas including the ridiculous & unloyal.
I do agree on the denegration point, these players are real people and don't deserve personal attacks, however I don't feel that suggesting a player is finished or should be traded does fit this criteria…

Do you think Geelong fans still feel bad about Brent Maloney?
They needed a good ruckmen, so gave up one of their many on-ballers to do so…

Collingwood didn't exactly give away Fraser, but by trading hard for Jolly, Fraser's papers were effectively stamped… He was a no1 pick, 200 game veteran, very comitted, but not the answer to their next premiership.

I have posted before that we should consider trading a player…
IF
We decide that our next real tilt will be after our current stars have retired
AND
The trade is a genuinely postive step towards our next flag

Make no mistake, although it breaks my heart whenever a Saints player leaves us, occasionally it really is the right thing to do for both parties…
> Maguire & Clarke, both seemingly great blokes & top footballers at times, I was so dissapointed to see them go, but really, it is now looking like a sensible move by the club.

Our search for speed/skill cost us Ball and we never really got Lovett, this whole phase is heart-break city, but the sole aim was to deliver us a flag, the execution was abysmal, but you can't question the motivation behind it…

While it would hurt to lose a favourite player (aren't they all), if it landed us some missing jigsaw piece we would all forgive the treason.

we all want the same thing

[BAM! (shhhh)]

Seems to me a lot of people are making a lot of assumptions about what motivates, and free agency's coming impact.

While personally I believe that handing over free agency in the way the AFL is creates unnecessary chaos, having observed MLB (no salary cap), NHL (hard salary cap), and to some extent NFL (hard salary cap plus ability to walk away from bad contracts) and NBA (soft cap... every time I think I've got it figured, it goes crazy on me again), there's only one thing I'm sure of.

The capologists for every AFL team are about to get big raises.

For the players... AFL players are probably more loyal beasts than financial wisdom would recommend, excepting superstars like Trent Knobel and Cain Ackland who follow the money. What a hard cap with free agency does is dissalow a draft dynasty. That's teams withouts an established pecking order and lots of talent - Melbourne, Gold Coast, even Collingwood. For teams like the Saints who know who their leaders are...

We wait and see what the AFL comes up with.

[gringo]

For me while a guy is in red black and white they are our players. We have to back them in. Saying someone should be looked at for trade is fine, it is the people that say Raph Clarke, Kosi, Eddy etc. are liabilities and should never play again because they are crap etc. that i have a problem with. There are a number of times family of players have let the forum know they are reading the posts. I would suggest there are more silent ones. We expect players to remain loyal to the club until they are judged by forum as worthless. I my kid was getting bagged constantly I would say f$#@ them take the money and go after reading this crap. You have to say the list management have more idea on the things that matter when it comes to a players future. People seem to get frustrated and personally attack certain players. Zac has come out this year and silenced some critics but he was gone on this forum last year. The players are retained because some one with inside knowledge judges them to have some worth. It is fine to put up ideas but I would suggest the personal attacks calling players crap etc. are a little low and should be considered before being posted. If you had your work scrutinised constantly and were always trying to second guess and remedy peoples attitudes, you would perform worse than you would otherwise wouldn't you?

[georgie girl]

For me while a guy is in red black and white they are our players. We have to back them in. Saying someone should be looked at for trade is fine, it is the people that say Raph Clarke, Kosi, Eddy etc. are liabilities and should never play again because they are crap etc. that i have a problem with. There are a number of times family of players have let the forum know they are reading the posts. I would suggest there are more silent ones. We expect players to remain loyal to the club until they are judged by forum as worthless. I my kid was getting bagged constantly I would say f$#@ them take the money and go after reading this crap. You have to say the list management have more idea on the things that matter when it comes to a players future. People seem to get frustrated and personally attack certain players. Zac has come out this year and silenced some critics but he was gone on this forum last year. The players are retained because some one with inside knowledge judges them to have some worth. It is fine to put up ideas but I would suggest the personal attacks calling players crap etc. are a little low and should be considered before being posted. If you had your work scrutinised constantly and were always trying to second guess and remedy peoples attitudes, you would perform worse than you would otherwise wouldn't you?

WELL SAID!!
Also hate those supporters at games who are just waiting for a player to make an error so they can bag them some more. I am talking about the ones who spend more time berating the team, the club the players than supporting them in anyway. Why do they bother 'supporting' a team? The opposition supporters bagging our players is enough we don't need to join in.