burgoyne to saints, according to...

[desertsaint]

Sorry, I must be living in a different universe but just how many game sof AFL has Stanley played????

I really rate him, and he has done extremely well for a first year player at the club......But I would trade both him and our first draft pick in a heart beat for Burgoyne....

And I still think Port would be a little hard done by by that.

agree.
if such a thing really exists our premiership window is open right now and for the next two to three years - burgoyne could even be looked at as that missing forward option we've tried gwilt in. twice bagged 39 goals in a season mainly used as a mid, 185 cm, speedy, very good tackler.

[plugger66]

Well if people want him then we would have to let Bally go to fit him in the salary cap. Remember there is a salary cap and finally how does a side who may win the flag get him. It aint going to be to easy. He will not be at the saints next year.

[meher baba]

Burgoyne is a top rate player. The AFL trading market is a very efficient one, so we'd have to give up a lot to get him. Something like Ball and Maguire and a pick in a complex trade involving the Hawks and another club so we end up with a top 3 pick to trade to Port.

I can't believe they'd let him go for much less. And there will be a dozen clubs better placed than us in terms of trade. And Raph is probably 75% as good as Burgoyne (as are others) and younger. So why do it?

In fact, why trade for anyone this year? We can't fit all our AFL quality players in our top 22 now. If I were in charge, I'd trade for draft picks. But, for some reason I don't get (and it could just be coincidence) Ross seems to favour recycled players over young draftees......

[InkerSaint]

Hahaha. Another 26-year old. You lot crack me up.

Trade Stanley... unbelievable...

[Hurricane]

Herald Sun reported that Burgoyne requested a trade to Hawthorn and if they couldnt get it done he would walk out.

Id have him at the Saints if the Hawks cant or wont do a deal

BANG BANG

[bendigo bob]

He is reportedly looking for $500k per year. How the hell do we fit that into the salary cap unless we lose someone like Ball. Can't see him in our colours but he would be a handy pick up. Better value than Tarrant, Peake and all the others who have been mentioned so far and light years ahead of McMahon from the Tigers

[SainterK]

Off topic, but still about trades....

Last night Caro was saying that Josh Gibson walking out on North has left Matt Maguire in a bad position, given that the saints don't want him and he had good currency as a defender to go somewhere like Hawthorn.

Is this shoot from the hip, or is there any truth in it?

[Spinner]

Off topic, but still about trades....

Last night Caro was saying that Josh Gibson walking out on North has left Matt Maguire in a bad position, given that the saints don't want him and he had good currency as a defender to go somewhere like Hawthorn.

Is this shoot from the hip, or is there any truth in it?

I think you'll find its common sense....

I would believe that the saints do want him, but she said otherwise based on him not playing senior games this year.

Strategically, Maguire was a good fit to go to Hawthorn.

[Spinner]

Hahaha. Another 26-year old. You lot crack me up.

Trade Stanley... unbelievable...

Another 26 year old?

Or is this a sarcastic post?


How is trading Stanley 'unbelievable'.....It seems most consider our list untouchable, even players that have only been at the club one year, and played zero games.

[Spinner]

Well if people want him then we would have to let Bally go to fit him in the salary cap. Remember there is a salary cap and finally how does a side who may win the flag get him. It aint going to be to easy. He will not be at the saints next year.

Yep....Easily the biggest road block. Pushing 500k a year I would assume.

[JABBER]

Questions should be asked about his injuries the last couple of years.Maybe worth a gamble with a late pick and would he make our best 22

[matrix]

dead wood
500 K a year pfft

no thanks

[Spinner]

Questions should be asked about his injuries the last couple of years.Maybe worth a gamble with a late pick and would he make our best 22

Mmmm Just outside our best 22 when fit.

Id say about 23 or 24ish.

[SideshowMilne]

Is it too late to trade back to Port Fergus Watts. Mark Williams sure did seem real reluctant to let him go last time.

[InkerSaint]

Hahaha. Another 26-year old. You lot crack me up.

Trade Stanley... unbelievable...

Another 26 year old?

Or is this a sarcastic post?


How is trading Stanley 'unbelievable'.....It seems most consider our list untouchable, even players that have only been at the club one year, and played zero games.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and spell it out for you.

We already have about a dozen 25-to-26-year old players. Why is that a problem? Well - it's not at the moment but will be a massive one in about 6 years when the team hits the wall because all of these players retire within two years of each other. It's called continuity, or "succession planning". Bergholt did a great job in arguing the point here:
http://www.saintsational.com/forum/view ... p?p=816993

Number two. Tell me what position Rhys Stanley plays, and then tell me the age of the players who are currently playing this position in the ones, and I'll tell you why getting rid of him is completely loopy.

[Spinner]

Hahaha. Another 26-year old. You lot crack me up.

Trade Stanley... unbelievable...

Another 26 year old?

Or is this a sarcastic post?


How is trading Stanley 'unbelievable'.....It seems most consider our list untouchable, even players that have only been at the club one year, and played zero games.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and spell it out for you.

We already have about a dozen 25-to-26-year old players. Why is that a problem? Well - it's not at the moment but will be a massive one in about 6 years when the team hits the wall because all of these players retire within two years of each other. It's called continuity, or "succession planning". Bergholt did a great job in arguing the point here:
http://www.saintsational.com/forum/view ... p?p=816993

Number two. Tell me what position Rhys Stanley plays, and then tell me the age of the players who are currently playing this position in the ones, and I'll tell you why getting rid of him is completely loopy.

In six years time..... Come on, you cant be serious.

Players reach their peak at about 25/26....To think that you wouldn't want a star player who has six years in front of him, and think a player that is 19 years old to be untouchable is bordering on stupid.

This viewpoint reeks of arrogance, and is extremely precious. Imagine if we plucked a couple of flags by the start of your '6-year' downfall..... I would be fairly happy to cop that on the chin.


And for the other point. I rate Rhys but im am not completely disillusion to think he is 'untouchable' but I will answer your questions.

Ruck, 29/30. Now answer a few of mine..... How many games has he played? How many years does it take a ruckman to develop to the point he is effectively influencing matches and then tell me how old he is..... Answer these and it will be pretty clear how 'loopy' it is to think he is 'untouchable'.

BTW - Ruckman dont start influencing games until 24/25 years old. Unless they are freaks ala Kruzer.

[Hurricane]

Is it too late to trade back to Port Fergus Watts. Mark Williams sure did seem real reluctant to let him go last time.

Fergus Watts came to us from Adelaide not Port

BANG BANG

[InkerSaint]

In six years time..... Come on, you cant be serious.

Players reach their peak at about 25/26....To think that you wouldn't want a star player who has six years in front of him, and think a player that is 19 years old to be untouchable is bordering on stupid.

This viewpoint reeks of arrogance, and is extremely precious. Imagine if we plucked a couple of flags by the start of your '6-year' downfall..... I would be fairly happy to cop that on the chin.


And for the other point. I rate Rhys but im am not completely disillusion to think he is 'untouchable' but I will answer your questions.

Ruck, 29/30. Now answer a few of mine..... How many games has he played? How many years does it take a ruckman to develop to the point he is effectively influencing matches and then tell me how old he is..... Answer these and it will be pretty clear how 'loopy' it is to think he is 'untouchable'.

BTW - Ruckman dont start influencing games until 24/25 years old. Unless they are freaks ala Kruzer.

Stupid... ? Arrogance? Precious?

Aww... somebody doesn't wike being disagweed wif...

So let's say we pick Burgoyne. Who goes out for him? A 22- or 23-year old who goes back to the VFL?

Gee... great experience.

So you'd love a couple of flags. And you'd wear the cost of bottoming out a la Melbourne, or us circa 1999-2001... bully for you.

I'd like to think we can achieve the former without the latter.

Now back to Rhys. By your logic we should have culled Kosi years ago, how long did he take to get anything near a consistent output? Oh yeah... should have scrapped Riewoldt at the end of '01 seeing as he did sweet F.A. that year.

So he's 19, and won't be in his prime for awhile yet... my bet is he will be playing in the ones by 2011 when one or both of King and Gardiner have either retired or miss games due to injury. This club has already been through the debacle of no decent ruck stocks and got very lucky in picking up two AA discards. But no... you'd roll the dice again.

Greedy. Nearsighted. Reckless.

[Spinner]

In six years time..... Come on, you cant be serious.

Players reach their peak at about 25/26....To think that you wouldn't want a star player who has six years in front of him, and think a player that is 19 years old to be untouchable is bordering on stupid.

This viewpoint reeks of arrogance, and is extremely precious. Imagine if we plucked a couple of flags by the start of your '6-year' downfall..... I would be fairly happy to cop that on the chin.


And for the other point. I rate Rhys but im am not completely disillusion to think he is 'untouchable' but I will answer your questions.

Ruck, 29/30. Now answer a few of mine..... How many games has he played? How many years does it take a ruckman to develop to the point he is effectively influencing matches and then tell me how old he is..... Answer these and it will be pretty clear how 'loopy' it is to think he is 'untouchable'.

BTW - Ruckman dont start influencing games until 24/25 years old. Unless they are freaks ala Kruzer.

Stupid... ? Arrogance? Precious?

Aww... somebody doesn't wike being disagweed wif...

So let's say we pick Burgoyne. Who goes out for him? A 22- or 23-year old who goes back to the VFL?

Gee... great experience.

So you'd love a couple of flags. And you'd wear the cost of bottoming out a la Melbourne, or us circa 1999-2001... bully for you.

I'd like to think we can achieve the former without the latter.

Now back to Rhys. By your logic we should have culled Kosi years ago, how long did he take to get anything near a consistent output? Oh yeah... should have scrapped Riewoldt at the end of '01 seeing as he did sweet F.A. that year.

So he's 19, and won't be in his prime for awhile yet... my bet is he will be playing in the ones by 2011 when one or both of King and Gardiner have either retired or miss games due to injury. This club has already been through the debacle of no decent ruck stocks and got very lucky in picking up two AA discards. But no... you'd roll the dice again.

Greedy. Nearsighted. Reckless.

This is one of the most illogical responses I have come across for sometime. Especially the bolded part.

Let me put it simply for you.

Ask a St Kilda supporter if they would be happy to trade stanley. And 60% would respond with "Who".

Ask a PA support if they would accept a trade involving Stanley. 99% of responses would be, "Who the f*** are you talking about?"


In fact, Stanley probably has little to no trade value what-so-ever. So the argument would never exist anyways.

Burgoyne is a gun - But you wouldn't want him in your team. Laughable. Do you actually watch any football played by non-Stkilda teams?

[Winmarvellous]

If we could get Burgoyne it'd be the recruiting coup of the off-season no doubt. I just don't see who wqe could possibly trade for him. Unlike most on this forum, I don't see Ball as untouchable, and if it betters our list, so be it. Winmar was traded at the end of his career. Lockett was traded. Stewart was traded. I just coouldn't see Port accepting Ball for Burgoyne. Two completely different types of players. We've got Armo to cover for Ball, don't know who Port has to cover for Burgoyne. Imagine him, Gram and Joey streaming towards goal

[saintly]

In six years time..... Come on, you cant be serious.

Players reach their peak at about 25/26....To think that you wouldn't want a star player who has six years in front of him, and think a player that is 19 years old to be untouchable is bordering on stupid.

This viewpoint reeks of arrogance, and is extremely precious. Imagine if we plucked a couple of flags by the start of your '6-year' downfall..... I would be fairly happy to cop that on the chin.


And for the other point. I rate Rhys but im am not completely disillusion to think he is 'untouchable' but I will answer your questions.

Ruck, 29/30. Now answer a few of mine..... How many games has he played? How many years does it take a ruckman to develop to the point he is effectively influencing matches and then tell me how old he is..... Answer these and it will be pretty clear how 'loopy' it is to think he is 'untouchable'.

BTW - Ruckman dont start influencing games until 24/25 years old. Unless they are freaks ala Kruzer.

Stupid... ? Arrogance? Precious?

Aww... somebody doesn't wike being disagweed wif...

So let's say we pick Burgoyne. Who goes out for him? A 22- or 23-year old who goes back to the VFL?

Gee... great experience.

So you'd love a couple of flags. And you'd wear the cost of bottoming out a la Melbourne, or us circa 1999-2001... bully for you.

I'd like to think we can achieve the former without the latter.

Now back to Rhys. By your logic we should have culled Kosi years ago, how long did he take to get anything near a consistent output? Oh yeah... should have scrapped Riewoldt at the end of '01 seeing as he did sweet F.A. that year.

So he's 19, and won't be in his prime for awhile yet... my bet is he will be playing in the ones by 2011 when one or both of King and Gardiner have either retired or miss games due to injury. This club has already been through the debacle of no decent ruck stocks and got very lucky in picking up two AA discards. But no... you'd roll the dice again.

Greedy. Nearsighted. Reckless.

This is one of the most illogical responses I have come across for sometime. Especially the bolded part.

Let me put it simply for you.

Ask a St Kilda supporter if they would be happy to trade stanley. And 60% would respond with "Who".Ask a PA support if they would accept a trade involving Stanley. 99% of responses would be, "Who the f*** are you talking about?"


In fact, Stanley probably has little to no trade value what-so-ever. So the argument would never exist anyways.

Burgoyne is a gun - But you wouldn't want him in your team. Laughable. Do you actually watch any football played by non-Stkilda teams?

it would be better to say ask a saints support who is on the internet and reads the reserves information or goes to the vfl games if they want to trade stanley and thmost would say. ask port , they all 100% of them would say who? just the same as if port reserves players were offered for trade, we would not know who they were.

[InkerSaint]

Let me put it simply for you.

Ask a St Kilda supporter if they would be happy to trade stanley. And 60% would respond with "Who".

Ask a PA support if they would accept a trade involving Stanley. 99% of responses would be, "Who the f*** are you talking about?"


In fact, Stanley probably has little to no trade value what-so-ever. So the argument would never exist anyways.

Burgoyne is a gun - But you wouldn't want him in your team. Laughable. Do you actually watch any football played by non-Stkilda teams?

You didn't answer my first question. Who would you push out for Burgoyne?

I'm not knocking Burgoyne - he is a gun - but we have plenty of quality midfielders already to put pressure on the salary cap.

To suggest ruck stocks aren't a premium commodity - with the history of this club - is laughable.

In a year when the likes of Armitage and Steven can barely get a game, and Ball struggles to hold his spot... to talk about players not getting a game is a very convenient argument.

At another club it would be a diffent story.

Tom Bellchambers, who?

[desertsaint]

they can have gwilt, x, matt, and their choice of armo OR eddy - fair trade!

[True Blue Sainter]

I would go:

Ball, 2nd round pick, 3rd round pick

for

Pearce, Burgoyne, 3rd rounder

or Ball and 2nd round pick for either of Pearce & 3rd rounder or Burg & 3rd rounder.

[degruch]

Herald Sun reported that Burgoyne requested a trade to Hawthorn and if they couldnt get it done he would walk out.

Id have him at the Saints if the Hawks cant or wont do a deal

BANG BANG

All the talk over here is the Hawks, where he knows players, coach and support staff. Although why anyone would want to join that rabble of a club, gawd only knows...I can't see them improving much if they get a wobbly start to next season. Essendon v Hawks round 1, I say!