TRAINING REPORTS - JAN to MAR

[Saintmike65]

I really don't like bigfooty. Same nasty arseholes who continually baited posters on this forum appears to be still doing the same over there.

However they do have some excellent training reports.

Take this latest one from a guy called palantine.

"
Coffield participated in some early non contact drills looking powerful and quick and explosive. I was actually surprised at how strong overall he looked, big man.
Enright is brilliant the way he plays and coaches. Still moves so well.
Liked the look of Peris. Kicked a goal and was generally involved and useful. Was up front in the conditioning drills at the end just behind Windy (of course).
Early on Hayes limped off. Couldn't guess what the injury was. Didn't see him again but others have seen him in a moon boot. Kept waiting for him to come back out but knew he wouldn't. His body language looked down walking slowly into the building after he did whatever he did. Was pretty disappointing.
Owens just breaks through tackles using his power. Very strong in the air playing forward in the drills. He might be hard to match up on, just so impressive. No doubt he'll be in the forward line round one.
Others who impressed; Marshall, Mattaes, Higgins, Wood, Wilkie - everyone was looking pretty good to be honest. Love watching Wanga-Milly and quite like him in the backline.
I thought Cordy was ok in the running sessions at the end. My guess is he's improving. Walsh really puts them through their paces with running drills back and forth with intervals, and then two third lap of the oval - all on repeat. Quite brutal. They look incredibly fit. Cordy has a funny Jack Steven running wiggle about him. But I didn't notice him much in the simulation work.
To me Howard trained well and looks bigger than last year. Van Es managed some nice things and is plenty big, runs good. Heath getting a bit of muscle on him now, will be interesting to see if he gets used this year. I would think next year.
I still find it hard to rate Allison, looked a little uncouth to me in marking contests. Just can't see it. Hope I'm wrong. Watched a bit of him in VFL.
Good to see Jones out there, looks in good shape. Maxxy running loose laps, not many. No Clark.

The 4 youngsters NWM, Owens, Windhager & Phillipou terrific today.

[Devilhead]

Great to hear

[D.B.Cooper]

I really don't like bigfooty. Same nasty arseholes who continually baited posters on this forum appears to be still doing the same over there.

However they do have some excellent training reports.

Take this latest one from a guy called palantine.

"
Coffield participated in some early non contact drills looking powerful and quick and explosive. I was actually surprised at how strong overall he looked, big man.
Enright is brilliant the way he plays and coaches. Still moves so well.
Liked the look of Peris. Kicked a goal and was generally involved and useful. Was up front in the conditioning drills at the end just behind Windy (of course).
Early on Hayes limped off. Couldn't guess what the injury was. Didn't see him again but others have seen him in a moon boot. Kept waiting for him to come back out but knew he wouldn't. His body language looked down walking slowly into the building after he did whatever he did. Was pretty disappointing.
Owens just breaks through tackles using his power. Very strong in the air playing forward in the drills. He might be hard to match up on, just so impressive. No doubt he'll be in the forward line round one.
Others who impressed; Marshall, Mattaes, Higgins, Wood, Wilkie - everyone was looking pretty good to be honest. Love watching Wanga-Milly and quite like him in the backline.
I thought Cordy was ok in the running sessions at the end. My guess is he's improving. Walsh really puts them through their paces with running drills back and forth with intervals, and then two third lap of the oval - all on repeat. Quite brutal. They look incredibly fit. Cordy has a funny Jack Steven running wiggle about him. But I didn't notice him much in the simulation work.
To me Howard trained well and looks bigger than last year. Van Es managed some nice things and is plenty big, runs good. Heath getting a bit of muscle on him now, will be interesting to see if he gets used this year. I would think next year.
I still find it hard to rate Allison, looked a little uncouth to me in marking contests. Just can't see it. Hope I'm wrong. Watched a bit of him in VFL.
Good to see Jones out there, looks in good shape. Maxxy running loose laps, not many. No Clark.

The 4 youngsters NWM, Owens, Windhager & Phillipou terrific today.

Hey mike, at what stage does Clark appear to be at with his fitness and training?

[Saintmike65]

I really don't like bigfooty. Same nasty arseholes who continually baited posters on this forum appears to be still doing the same over there.

However they do have some excellent training reports.

Take this latest one from a guy called palantine.

"
Coffield participated in some early non contact drills looking powerful and quick and explosive. I was actually surprised at how strong overall he looked, big man.
Enright is brilliant the way he plays and coaches. Still moves so well.
Liked the look of Peris. Kicked a goal and was generally involved and useful. Was up front in the conditioning drills at the end just behind Windy (of course).
Early on Hayes limped off. Couldn't guess what the injury was. Didn't see him again but others have seen him in a moon boot. Kept waiting for him to come back out but knew he wouldn't. His body language looked down walking slowly into the building after he did whatever he did. Was pretty disappointing.
Owens just breaks through tackles using his power. Very strong in the air playing forward in the drills. He might be hard to match up on, just so impressive. No doubt he'll be in the forward line round one.
Others who impressed; Marshall, Mattaes, Higgins, Wood, Wilkie - everyone was looking pretty good to be honest. Love watching Wanga-Milly and quite like him in the backline.
I thought Cordy was ok in the running sessions at the end. My guess is he's improving. Walsh really puts them through their paces with running drills back and forth with intervals, and then two third lap of the oval - all on repeat. Quite brutal. They look incredibly fit. Cordy has a funny Jack Steven running wiggle about him. But I didn't notice him much in the simulation work.
To me Howard trained well and looks bigger than last year. Van Es managed some nice things and is plenty big, runs good. Heath getting a bit of muscle on him now, will be interesting to see if he gets used this year. I would think next year.
I still find it hard to rate Allison, looked a little uncouth to me in marking contests. Just can't see it. Hope I'm wrong. Watched a bit of him in VFL.
Good to see Jones out there, looks in good shape. Maxxy running loose laps, not many. No Clark.

The 4 youngsters NWM, Owens, Windhager & Phillipou terrific today.

Hey mike, at what stage does Clark appear to be at with his fitness and training?

To be honest there’s nothing special to report about Hunter Clark.
He didn’t train today but I’ve seen him a few times in training sessions.
I believe he’d make a good wingman but just doesn’t have the tank.
He looks a bit heavier but not in muscle, so not sure where he’s at fitness wise.
He’s at the crossroads of his career but we’re all hopeful he gets a good run at it injury wise.

[Saintmike65]

Overall the training has been very good but something that does bother me still is the foot skills.
With faster ball movement requires an ability to hit targets properly..yesterday there were far too many sloppy kicks, something of a bugbare of mine for many years.
We only seem to have a handful of players on our list that are above average to elite in foot skills.
Hill, NWM, Sinclair (Hill is occasionally prone to butchering it) are ones that spring to mind.
Windhager, Owens, Steele, Wood, Clark, Coffield,McKenzie, Connelly, Marshall, Sharman, Billings & Phillipou are ok but we do need more good ball users on our list.
Highmore, Paton, Jones, Byrnes, Bytel, Webster, Crouch, Peris etc. are often culprits at not hitting targets by foot.

[The Fireman]

stop training now... we cant afford to lose anymore ......

[Vortex]

Dear oh dear, there is nothing like dealing with someone who seeks to re-write history to show themself in a better light. Name calling? You accuse me of name calling yet you refer to me as undeveloped, insecure and a wanker. Do you see anything slightly hypocritical in your behaviour?

Let’s return to the main point of your kick them out after 2 years if they are not a consistent AFL standard performance. I see a couple of others have pointed out the error of your position on this. Maybe the ‘system’ needs a change but not to what you want, casting talented athletes out after only 2 years in the AFL system. This would be a disaster. It would result in no young recruits wanting to be sent to the Saints. And for the ones who are, would put unsustainable pressure on young men when they need to be developed and guided.

I await your next round of name calling.

Let tbe record show you have initiated every attack.

If we are a consistently successful club the kids would be lining up to play for the club.

2 years is more than enough if you have been selected as a first rounder. How many first rounders do you know who have a premiership medal and took more than 2 years?

Billings is exhibit A.

Clarke and Coffield are exhibit B and C, if these two aren't both in the top 5 of our best this year then time to cut the losses.

The goal is to win silverware, not be a holiday destination.

The record will show that I have responded to your fatuous statements and questioned them when they are just purely ridiculous, impractical and Ill-informed. The record will show that it’s you who then gets nasty, name calling, labelling and trying to belittle anyone who disagrees with you. Your view of player’s performance is simplistic and fails to take into account other factors. With your criteria we would have cut Plugger.

Anyhow, you can go and please yourself. You are not worth the effort of wasting time on.

Thank farg for that...mabye consider changing your nic to AngryFeet

Sounds like he’s got angry bunions.

Comparing Plugger’s early years to Matthew Allison’s first two year. Lol.

I thought I had heard it all.

Did Plugger bag the club in his early years on a podcast.

For sure, it's real head scratcher.

[Sanctorum]

These training reports are great for us ex-Melburnians in Qld, if I lived nearby I'd go and watch them regularly, so thanks everyone for keeping the forum informed. Especially good to read all the positive reports about the young guns!

Poor disposal has been a massive problem for years and arguably cost them games that could have got St Kilda playing finals in 21/22.

The good thing is that there is at least another 6 weeks or more for that to get fixed and I imagine this is top of the agenda for the coaches. You would expect players themselves to make this a big focus because 'if you can't hit your target you're not going to be selected'!

Once the players start intra-club match simulations, disposal will sort out the wheat from the chaff.

[Vortex]

Overall the training has been very good but something that does bother me still is the foot skills.
With faster ball movement requires an ability to hit targets properly..yesterday there were far too many sloppy kicks, something of a bugbare of mine for many years.
We only seem to have a handful of players on our list that are above average to elite in foot skills.
Hill, NWM, Sinclair (Hill is occasionally prone to butchering it) are ones that spring to mind.
Windhager, Owens, Steele, Wood, Clark, Coffield,McKenzie, Connelly, Marshall, Sharman, Billings & Phillipou are ok but we do need more good ball users on our list.
Highmore, Paton, Jones, Byrnes, Bytel, Webster, Crouch, Peris etc. are often culprits at not hitting targets by foot.

Hopefully now the hype over Lyon returning will settle and we can discuss the elephant in the room...the lack of enough skills to move up to flag contention. As soon as I heard of the 3 second rule I was concerned, all good and well to apply the game plan you think can win the silverware, it's another thing to have the skills to execute. As much as I love Lyon, it was hard to get excited because I knew our severe lack of depth in skill was going to always still be our biggest issue as a club.

Hayes going down also proves another point I have made ad nauseum re the fragility of our list quality and depth, meaning we only have to lose a relatively small number of players to injury for our season to be derailed as was the case in 21 and 22.

It also highlights what I think was a major stuff up in recruiting last year and that was the glaringly obvious and desperately urgent need to recruit a tall forward.

[bobmurray]

Is there a training session on this Friday (20th Jan) ?

If so what time does it start ?

Thanks

[longtimesaint]

Training is on Monday, Wednesday and Friday starts about 9 :30 or 10

[longtimesaint]

Training is on Monday, Wednesday and Friday starts about 9 :30 or 10

[Teflon]

The only people suggesting Lyon was the answer to our obvious list/skill shortfalls were those keen to bag the club for making the tough call and moving Bambi on.

Anyone knows Lyon got 4 years upfront for a reason
He will turn this list over
I too for a number of years have battled with a lopsided amount of poor ball users on the list - as others have noted guys like Jones, dare I say Gresham, Ross, Webster, Crouch etc you simply wouldnt trust them GF day to hit a lead up forward lace out to win you the game….the thing could go 20 over their head
It’s been this way for a while - used to drive Roo spare …
We’ve got to put some stock in players who can use the footy well - it’s a turn over game now…you carry too many ball butchers and in big moments they hurt you …
I just hope Peris or Owens can do enough (aka DMac) to mask obvious deficiencies …
Not everyone will be Breust but we need to get a bette balance
I can see why Cats grabbed that left foot guy from Hawks (forget name) whose been a good pick up for them..
And I pray guys like Clark, Connolly can come good…and be regulars

[Vortex]

The only people suggesting Lyon was the answer to our obvious list/skill shortfalls were those keen to bag the club for making the tough call and moving Bambi on.

Anyone knows Lyon got 4 years upfront for a reason
He will turn this list over
I too for a number of years have battled with a lopsided amount of poor ball users on the list - as others have noted guys like Jones, dare I say Gresham, Ross, Webster, Crouch etc you simply wouldnt trust them GF day to hit a lead up forward lace out to win you the game….the thing could go 20 over their head
It’s been this way for a while - used to drive Roo spare …
We’ve got to put some stock in players who can use the footy well - it’s a turn over game now…you carry too many ball butchers and in big moments they hurt you …
I just hope Peris or Owens can do enough (aka DMac) to mask obvious deficiencies …
Not everyone will be Breust but we need to get a bette balance
I can see why Cats grabbed that left foot guy from Hawks (forget name) whose been a good pick up for them..
And I pray guys like Clark, Connolly can come good…and be regulars

My only concern is Lyon is on the record as saying he doesn't coach skills and yet here we are trying to implement a game style where you can't hold onto the ball for more than 3 seca to try and create quick ball movement with a list lacking serious skills. You would have thought skills development would be Lyon's highest priority with this list?

[B.M]

Senior AFL coaches don’t teach people how to kick a footy

It’s not Auskick or u12s

[Vortex]

Senior AFL coaches don’t teach people how to kick a footy

It’s not Auskick or u12s

So where do AFL players with sub standard skills go to learn skills?

[bobmurray]

Senior AFL coaches don’t teach people how to kick a footy

It’s not Auskick or u12s

So where do AFL players with sub standard skills go to learn skills?

Isn't that why Mr Carroll gets the big bucks ?

[Vortex]

Senior AFL coaches don’t teach people how to kick a footy

It’s not Auskick or u12s

So where do AFL players with sub standard skills go to learn skills?

Isn't that why Mr Carroll gets the big bucks ?

Supposedly it is so my question is if your skills are poor across the list isn't that the first area of improvement, say well before learning game plans you are incapable of executing?

Can anyone who is going to training report if they are seeing any skills improvement sessions, specifically kicking?

No point being trained to get rid of the ball under 3 seconds if you consistently give it back to the opposition.

[Impatient Sainter]

Senior AFL coaches don’t teach people how to kick a footy

It’s not Auskick or u12s

Everyone can improve their kicking skills if it is highlighted and worked on. During my teenage years I was an ordinary kick, but I worked hard on it over the years and became I reliable consistent kick. Its just a matter of concentration and a skill that can be improved on even under pressure, it just takes a willingness to practice.

Even Clint Jones improved his kicking at the club, his action was still terrible but he learnt to keep his kicks to short sharp no more than 30 metre passes. It was when he tried to kick long he shanked the ball badly.

[Saintmike65]

Training is on Monday, Wednesday and Friday starts about 9 :30 or 10

Suggest you don’t get there any later than 9.30

[Saintmike65]

Senior AFL coaches don’t teach people how to kick a footy

It’s not Auskick or u12s

Everyone can improve their kicking skills if it is highlighted and worked on. During my teenage years I was an ordinary kick, but I worked hard on it over the years and became I reliable consistent kick. Its just a matter of concentration and a skill that can be improved on even under pressure, it just takes a

Even Clint Jones improved his kicking at the club, his action was still terrible but he learnt to keep his kicks to short sharp no more than 30 metre passes. It was when he tried to kick long he shanked the ball badly.

There are very few players on our list that kick with low trajectory & speed through the air.
They have an extra 8 weeks every off season to work on their foot skills but alas, doesn’t seem to happen.
Gresham is the worst offender..his passes are half floaters that travel slowly through the air!

[Killa]

Given the ratio between kicks and handballs it is efficiency by both foot and hand

Added to this is two sided skills - again both by foot and hand

There was a time when two sided was worked on assiduously - and leading to no preference as to side when you had the pill in hand

There were also some, not as proficient by foot and whose DNA was to handball to advantage - so you would position yourself to spread off them including third receiver

The object is to create space - so kicking can be more precise because you were not under such direct pressure

So it is a whole of game exercise

Skills complimenting skills

I also had the view that left footers (one sided!!) looked good kicking, sweeping onto their left foot with low, fast delivery

But, in the cold light of day they were not efficient

Webster is a case in point - one superb kick does not cover for half a dozen or more which miss the mark and which leads to the ball in opposition hands and a counter attack

Ross is another whose disposal by both hand and foot can leave the side exposed

And added to disposal deficiencies, Ross for his 185cm cannot mark overhead - so not dangerous to any opposition (noting the number of times he remains stationary with ball in hand)

No one is going to go at 100% across foot and hand

But the worst outcome should be a contested ball - not gifted to the opposition with us accordingly out of position and vulnerable

In regard Jones, it is interesting that his 30 disposal games see St Kilda winning - because he carries the ball with his pace

Gresham always looks to carry, but can go around in circles looking for the space, then under pressure and disposal hurried

Analysis is always undertaken looking for prime outcomes given player skills - so all part of the chain

[Templar]

Senior AFL coaches don’t teach people how to kick a footy

It’s not Auskick or u12s

So where do AFL players with sub standard skills go to learn skills?

Tackling school and hand pass school. See Jack Daniels and Seb Ross. But a team can only carry a few of these types.

I think it is fairly evident that Ratten lost his job in big part due to the high amount of turnovers in 2022 that cost us game after game and a finals spot. Some of the games we won only because the oppo was turning it over just as bad or worse.

I suspect that it is a hard thing for a coach to address as I imagine good kicking is a lot about confidence. Putting a harsh focus on kicking could make things worse for nervous nellies.

But it certainly was agonising to watch unforced turnover after turnover in 2022 that lost us games. Turnovers convert to opposition goals very quickly in this era of football.

Hopefully RTB will serve a special sauce that will see everyone sure and firing. Winning by large margins would also help instill confidence. Chicken/Egg

[cwrcyn]

Unforced errors are the killers. They're the ones that put everyone out of position and allow the opposition to slingshot forward.

[cwrcyn]

IndecIsion can be a problem, too. A better structured game plan can help with that