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markp wrote:Goddard is being greedy, and the bummers are mad to be offering him that much (however much that actually is), let's run with that.
I know you dont want him to leave but surely you dont want us to pay around 3 million over 4 years to keep him?
Nup, the horse has bolted.
But it shouldn't have got to this stage.
I trust a source that said we made good offer very early in the year that BJ didnt like. It was based on the this year and last years form. To me that makes sense. 2010 is a fair while ago. We drew a GF that year and finished 9th this year so many things can happen in 2 years.
We need to be very clear that St Kilda is now a place where you come to be part of the culture and success, and to be part of that, you have to give up something.
Those intent on making extraordinary money can look elsewhere.
We have to be a club that seeks the success of many over satisfying the demands of few.
This can only be gained by what you are prepared to give up for the benefit of St Kilda.
If you cannot adhere to this ethos, that's fine. The St Kilda Way isn't for everybody.
But if you are prepared to exhaust yourself for the benefit of those around you, you will find more joy and meaning in establishing the bonds of lifelong friendship and a place to call 'home' that come with being a one-club legend.
Or you can take the money and maybe get a faster car.
Like I said, being a part of making St Kilda great isn't for everybody.
Trying to take the emotion out of it I just can't agree with paying Goddard 700k over 4 years.
I realise his peak is elite but IMO the true test of champions comes via consistently producing your best - he simply hasn't in 2 years and we can't pay because of that mark forever.
I've watched Goddard a lot in games , clearly frustrated and not getting any faster (he gets caught/pressured quickly now which impacts his use IMO). That aside ask yourself - is it just a coincidence that Brendon Goddards best footy was equally at a time when we as a team were at our best ??
Put another way, how many games this season have you seen Goddard really impact/dominate?
The flip side to this for me is I think he can dominate again - but it will largely be determined by the team around him. Left to float in a side with enough talent to feed him he'll be a gun. But if it's not going well and that sides playmakers are shut down don't expect the catalyst (especially in the midfield) to be Goddard.
I have no malice - wish him all the best and should he get a flag good luck to him.. I'm realistic enough to know he wouldn't have in the best 4 years with us.
Dr Spaceman wrote:Who's to say it could've been prevented?
Bombers offer could have been put to him early in the year.
No one has reported that.
But I'm saying my opinion is that it seems he wanted to stay, and the big issue was the fourth year.
This debate is entirely based on which stories and rumours people choose to believe.
I don't believe he wanted silly money, I don't think we should've let him 'test the market', and I also don't like the sound of the reduced offer story.
If the end result is him leaving then somewhere along the line that's a big fail from us.
If he was worth his salt, then I am pretty sure the club would have re-contracted him after his 3 years. He is the one being stubborn if it is purely because of wanting a fourth year… He was probably going to be captain FFS, of course he would have got an extension.
Not many players go much into their 30's these days, I totally back the club in not writing extensions more 3 years into the future for 30 year olds, same goes for Roo, Lenny and everyone… makes absolute sense.
I trust a source that said we made good offer very early in the year that BJ didnt like. It was based on the this year and last years form. To me that makes sense. 2010 is a fair while ago. We drew a GF that year and finished 9th this year so many things can happen in 2 years.
I will repeat what i have heard form someone I trust on the BJ issue. The club made BJ an offer earlier in the season. BJ didnt accept the offer because the offer matched his form at the time. It wasnt a great deal but was still significant. He wanted to do a contract when his form improved and it did later in the season. By that time the Saints were dealing with other contracts and said the first offer stands
That's what you said.
Not a great deal but matched his form at the time, came back when it improved and was told bad luck.
He wanted to do a deal.
I've heard and believe $475 x 3 was the offer.
Also reports that the offer was reduced. A winning strategy that one... along with suggesting he test the market.
I reckon $500 - $550k x 4 would not be unreasonable, and could've got it done.
evertonfc wrote:I've got no qualms with letting him walk.
We need to be very clear that St Kilda is now a place where you come to be part of the culture and success, and to be part of that, you have to give up something.
Those intent on making extraordinary money can look elsewhere.
We have to be a club that seeks the success of many over satisfying the demands of few.
This can only be gained by what you are prepared to give up for the benefit of St Kilda.
If you cannot adhere to this ethos, that's fine. The St Kilda Way isn't for everybody.
But if you are prepared to exhaust yourself for the benefit of those around you, you will find more joy and meaning in establishing the bonds of lifelong friendship and a place to call 'home' that come with being a one-club legend.
Or you can take the money and maybe get a faster car.
Like I said, being a part of making St Kilda great isn't for everybody.
Who's it going to be for Ev?
Who is going to be the kind of players we target and bring in for peanuts?
Not convinced even the Geelongs and Hawks of the comp will be able to maintain this 'everyone is equal' stance anymore
A ruckman, KPP or decent mid comes on the FA market moving forward....what makes us think they'll come to us?
I trust a source that said we made good offer very early in the year that BJ didnt like. It was based on the this year and last years form. To me that makes sense. 2010 is a fair while ago. We drew a GF that year and finished 9th this year so many things can happen in 2 years.
I will repeat what i have heard form someone I trust on the BJ issue. The club made BJ an offer earlier in the season. BJ didnt accept the offer because the offer matched his form at the time. It wasnt a great deal but was still significant. He wanted to do a contract when his form improved and it did later in the season. By that time the Saints were dealing with other contracts and said the first offer stands
That's what you said.
Not a great deal but matched his form at the time, came back when it improved and was told bad luck.
He wanted to do a deal.
I've heard and believe $475 x 3 was the offer.
Also reports that the offer was reduced. A winning strategy that one... along with suggesting he test the market.
I reckon $500 - $550k x 4 would not be unreasonable, and could've got it done.
One more year and maybe 5% more.
Robbo just said BJ and his camp asked to sit down only recently with the club to see if they would be open to a fourth year with conditions met in the third, and they said no to even talking about it. All the way along it has been 'it is what it is'
For the record, I think Robbo has been in communication with BJ the entire time, and would know.
Good points evertonfc (both here and at Goodison last satdee!!!) Time to move away from cow-towing to "superstars" and continuing in the task of building a TEAM based culture at St Kilda!
I still think it is a foolish decision.
It will cause us to drop down the ladder and this will mean fewer members.
Admin obviously think we have no chance of a successful finals campaign in 5 years.
I think it is pathetic! Makes me sick that we would not negotiate a "possible fourth year" - this will bite us on the arse AGAIN!
This is a team game and there is no room for individuals who think they are above walking through the fire.
For a bloke that has been with the club for so long and obviously had passion for us and mates here to leave over 1 measly year on a contract and a bit of extra cash makes me sick.
I honestly hope he does nothing in his time at Essenscum. I wont wish injury upon him just shitty form.
BANG BANG
Mitsuharu Misawa 1962 - 2009.
I am vengeance....I am the night...I....AM.....BATMAN
I have come here to chew bubblegum and kick ass and im all out of bubblegum
SainterK wrote:Robbo just said BJ and his camp asked to sit down only recently with the club to see if they would be open to a fourth year with conditions met in the third, and they said no to even talking about it. All the way along it has been 'it is what it is'
For the record, I think Robbo has been in communication with BJ the entire time, and would know.
Depressing if accurate.
But no, apparently BJ is just being stubborn and greedy.... wants $750k x 4 and wont budge....
Maybe the original offer but x 4 would've even done it?
Now there are other eager suitors, and he's likely and understandably got his nose out of joint....
SainterK wrote:Robbo just said BJ and his camp asked to sit down only recently with the club to see if they would be open to a fourth year with conditions met in the third, and they said no to even talking about it. All the way along it has been 'it is what it is'
For the record, I think Robbo has been in communication with BJ the entire time, and would know.
Depressing if accurate.
But no, apparently BJ is just being stubborn and greedy.... wants $750k x 4 and wont budge....
Maybe the original offer but x 4 would've even done it?
Now there are other eager suitors, and he's likely and understandably got his nose out of joint....
=Bye-bye BJ.
Do you think Rooy has earnt his money in the last 3 years?
mbogo wrote:I still think it is a foolish decision.
It will cause us to drop down the ladder and this will mean fewer members.
Admin obviously think we have no chance of a successful finals campaign in 5 years.
I think it is pathetic! Makes me sick that we would not negotiate a "possible fourth year" - this will bite us on the arse AGAIN!
I don't think it's a case of what we can or can't win next year, I think it's a case of will we sell our future for it. There are numerous whispers stating that he is chasing $$. It's his last big contract, so good luck, but we shouldn't mortgage our club's future on him. Can't believe the angst about this. TEAM ABOVE INDIVIDUAL. Good lord, how many of you haven't realised that this messiah worship is what has been holding us back as a club. Plugger went and we ended up in a GF within two seasons, and trust me, as good as he is, BJ is no Plugger.
The heavy metal artist formerly known as True Believer!
IF you look around the room and can't identify who the sucker is, then it's probably you!
evertonfc wrote:I've got no qualms with letting him walk.
We need to be very clear that St Kilda is now a place where you come to be part of the culture and success, and to be part of that, you have to give up something.
Those intent on making extraordinary money can look elsewhere.
We have to be a club that seeks the success of many over satisfying the demands of few.
This can only be gained by what you are prepared to give up for the benefit of St Kilda.
If you cannot adhere to this ethos, that's fine. The St Kilda Way isn't for everybody.
But if you are prepared to exhaust yourself for the benefit of those around you, you will find more joy and meaning in establishing the bonds of lifelong friendship and a place to call 'home' that come with being a one-club legend.
Or you can take the money and maybe get a faster car.
Like I said, being a part of making St Kilda great isn't for everybody.
mbogo wrote:I still think it is a foolish decision.
It will cause us to drop down the ladder and this will mean fewer members.
Admin obviously think we have no chance of a successful finals campaign in 5 years.
I think it is pathetic! Makes me sick that we would not negotiate a "possible fourth year" - this will bite us on the arse AGAIN!
I don't think it's a case of what we can or can't win next year, I think it's a case of will we sell our future for it. There are numerous whispers stating that he is chasing $$. It's his last big contract, so good luck, but we shouldn't mortgage our club's future on him. Can't believe the angst about this. TEAM ABOVE INDIVIDUAL. Good lord, how many of you haven't realised that this messiah worship is what has been holding us back as a club. Plugger went and we ended up in a GF within two seasons, and trust me, as good as he is, BJ is no Plugger.
SainterK wrote:Robbo just said BJ and his camp asked to sit down only recently with the club to see if they would be open to a fourth year with conditions met in the third, and they said no to even talking about it. All the way along it has been 'it is what it is'
For the record, I think Robbo has been in communication with BJ the entire time, and would know.
Depressing if accurate.
But no, apparently BJ is just being stubborn and greedy.... wants $750k x 4 and wont budge....
Maybe the original offer but x 4 would've even done it?
Now there are other eager suitors, and he's likely and understandably got his nose out of joint....
=Bye-bye BJ.
Do you think Rooy has earnt his money in the last 3 years?
mbogo wrote:I still think it is a foolish decision.
It will cause us to drop down the ladder and this will mean fewer members.
Admin obviously think we have no chance of a successful finals campaign in 5 years.
I think it is pathetic! Makes me sick that we would not negotiate a "possible fourth year" - this will bite us on the arse AGAIN!
I don't think it's a case of what we can or can't win next year, I think it's a case of will we sell our future for it. There are numerous whispers stating that he is chasing $$. It's his last big contract, so good luck, but we shouldn't mortgage our club's future on him. Can't believe the angst about this. TEAM ABOVE INDIVIDUAL. Good lord, how many of you haven't realised that this messiah worship is what has been holding us back as a club. Plugger went and we ended up in a GF within two seasons, and trust me, as good as he is, BJ is no Plugger.
Well said.
+1
Ablett leaves cats retain stars and continue to build not only on field but a professional culture off field plus they can still afford to attract new talent, Boak, Caddy, Dangerfield aaaaand win a GF.
Last edited by andrewg on Mon 01 Oct 2012 3:50pm, edited 1 time in total.
mbogo wrote:I still think it is a foolish decision.
It will cause us to drop down the ladder and this will mean fewer members.
Admin obviously think we have no chance of a successful finals campaign in 5 years.
I think it is pathetic! Makes me sick that we would not negotiate a "possible fourth year" - this will bite us on the arse AGAIN!
I don't think it's a case of what we can or can't win next year, I think it's a case of will we sell our future for it. There are numerous whispers stating that he is chasing $$. It's his last big contract, so good luck, but we shouldn't mortgage our club's future on him. Can't believe the angst about this. TEAM ABOVE INDIVIDUAL. Good lord, how many of you haven't realised that this messiah worship is what has been holding us back as a club. Plugger went and we ended up in a GF within two seasons, and trust me, as good as he is, BJ is no Plugger.
Well said.
I hear what you say - I just have never ever seen us give up a great player and gained from it unequivocally!
This is just another case of St Kilda not valueing key players - who almost inevitably go on to be successful elsewhere. The more successful clubs lost players rarely and keep them until the end. For us to "get Lovetted" by Essendon and then give them Goddard is laughable.
This is a team game and there is no room for individuals who think they are above walking through the fire.
evertonfc wrote:I've got no qualms with letting him walk.
We need to be very clear that St Kilda is now a place where you come to be part of the culture and success, and to be part of that, you have to give up something.
If you are a player - be it in the draft or under free agency - why would you want to come to St Kilda right now? We have to actually have a successful culture before this strategy works...
At the moment the message being sent suggests that even if you are an elite player, don't expect to get compensated accordingly.
SainterK wrote:Robbo just said BJ and his camp asked to sit down only recently with the club to see if they would be open to a fourth year with conditions met in the third, and they said no to even talking about it. All the way along it has been 'it is what it is'
For the record, I think Robbo has been in communication with BJ the entire time, and would know.
Robbo wouldn't happen to be a bombers fan would he?
At any rate if that is true, then I would suggest that Pelchen is pretty confident of nabbing Caddy with pick 13… taking emotion out of it, we get 200 games from another gun midfielder and enough salary space to fit another excellent player in the cap…
Of course they couldn't publicly say that they would prefer pick 13 to keeping Goddard, but maybe Pelchen is more interested in building a premiership list than keeping a great 'saints' man on big coin.
Let's try a different approach to a premiership team… if an even money approach fails, then we could always go back to overpaying 10 "champions" again…
( God help me)
