Saints to affiliate with Sandringham

[Mr Magic]

Mr Magic, if the previous results are anything to go by, we don't need Ilzy anyway.

Them's fighting words!, Keep polishing the trophy so it's in great condition for us when we bring it back to it's rightful place - with us.

Oh and next game we're bringing an extension ladder so that we can look your 'Andre the Giant' in the eye!

[yipper]

Mr Magic, if the previous results are anything to go by, we don't need Ilzy anyway.

Them's fighting words!, Keep polishing the trophy so it's in great condition for us when we bring it back to it's rightful place - with us.

Oh and next game we're bringing an extension ladder so that we can look your 'Andre the Giant' in the eye!

And the umpire will be a year older and even more crankier!!!

[zebgrowler]

We had a guy who called himself zebgrowler, a very traditional Sandy supporter who seemed to resent the alliance and did everything he could to piss on it.

Well Im on here now and glad to be shot of the whingeing Melbourne fans.
The kid Newton that caused all their angst against Sandy is a gutless dud so why would Sandy play him ahead of Nick Suantner who is a proven VFL champion.
I certain if the Saints respect the fact that the SFC is not the St Kilda reserves and will try to win as many games as possible and develope the younger players then the relationship will be fruitfull for both clubs.
Dont forget before the Mebourne alliance the Zebras won 3 flags in the 1990s.

[Otiman]

Well Im on here now and glad to be shot of the whingeing Melbourne fans.
The kid Newton that caused all their angst against Sandy is a gutless dud so why would Sandy play him ahead of Nick Suantner who is a proven VFL champion.
I certain if the Saints respect the fact that the SFC is not the St Kilda reserves and will try to win as many games as possible and develope the younger players then the relationship will be fruitfull for both clubs.
Dont forget before the Mebourne alliance the Zebras won 3 flags in the 1990s.

Welcome.

It's clear that the Melbourne-Sandringham relationship was not an ideal one. However I am not too sure that Sandy fans will be happy with the saints relationship either.

With Casey, there was quite a bit of dissent from the Scorpions, as well as quite a bit of resentment of the St. Kilda officials and players. It lead to quite a few club stalwarts leaving for Collingwood.

Now, in 2008, Casey are top 4 on the ladder, and I believe that this success is due to the synergy between the Saints and Scorpions.

A number of St. Kilda appointed officials are involved with the running of Casey, the head coach Greg Hutchison and St. Kilda development coach Danny Sexton are heavily involved down at Casey.

Essentially the current lineup of the Scorpions is quite reliant on the St. Kilda listed players, and this contributes to the success of the club.

The club is the jumper, the song, and whichever players and staff happen to be at the club at the time.

From a St. Kilda point of view, Sandringham is a club where we can develop our kids (in positions and roles that we want), and bring back players from injury. From a Sandringham point of view, the alignment offers up valuable resources (players, coaches, facilities) that wouldn't otherwise be available.

[Otiman]

The issues lied with flexibility. We basically had no say at all in which of our players played in the seniors or reserves, and where they played if they did. For example, it's damn near impossible to develop a full forward when Nick Sautner is planted there, ditto a full back when Chris Lamb has the top spot. Sandy's primary concern was Sandy premierships, not developing Melbourne players. That's fine, it's their club and their perogative, but if St. Kilda expect anything different they're going to be disappointed.

We have had the same issues with Casey in the 2004-2006 era. Barry Brooks playing forward instead of ruck, and such. It should be a two way street.

Did you have any MFC appointed officials down at the club in the ear of the Sandy coaches?

[Mr Magic]

Does anybody know (or remember) why Sandy affiliated with MFC rather than us in the first place?

[Otiman]

Interview with John Mennie on ABC now.


Melbourne told Sandy that they were moving to Casey, basically ditched them.

St. Kilda talks started about 2 weeks ago.

Unanimous decision from the Sandy board to sign with St. Kilda.

[esaint66]

I'm the happiest peron on earth, i'm a Sandy fan from way back and still am and all i can say is why werent we originally linked with the zebs

Great stuff !!!

[Otiman]

Guess who Casey plays in round 10 of the VFL? (next week)

[zebraman]

Re Michael Newton....a lot of Melbourne supporters kept bitching that Sautner was holding him back....Newton played quite a few games for sandy at Full Forward...took some real speccies...then got promoted to Melbourne...he was NEVER held back by Sautner....Melbourne drafted Stefan Martin who played as a ruckman for Sandy...Melbourne wanted him to play in defence...guess where Martin now plays....in defence!!...and in the pre season game at Casey Fields where Melbourne played North Melbourne and got flogged...they played Michael Newton in defence!...so much for holding him back from playing as full forward...

Most Melbourne fans were supportive of the alliance with Sandy but this year a few of them have tried using Sandy as a scapegoat for their pathetic year on the field...

What Sandy gave Melbourne players was the opportunity to play in a winning environment...

Most Melbourne players who played in our premiership teams...that will be the only senior premiership that they wiil get to play in...ask players like Guy Rigoni and Chris Lamb how much playing in a premiership team meant to them..Shannon Motlop rated the 2 flags he won with Sandy as a highlight of his career..obviously the one he won with North Melbourne rated highest

Sandy won't play a guy like McEvoy on the wing...he's a ruckman....

I'm looking forward to this alignment with St Kilda.....there's a bit of history with the 2 clubs....Bob Murray,John Beveridge,Trevor Barker...Jack Barker will be as happy as a pig in poo now!...he loves both clubsof course there will be ups and downs with any partnership...but we both want that one prize...the big one in September

[Otiman]

To the Zebra fans, how would the players in bold fit in with the Sandringham listed players? Excuse the extended bench, Casey and St. Kilda are both playing on sunday arvo.

B R.Clarke Silvagni Taylor
HB Garrubba Wall Baker
C X Clarke Gwilt Matthews
HF Howard Rix Dunne
F C Gardiner Allen McDonald
R McEvoy Eddy McQualter
INT Steven Parker Campbell L Fisher O'Bryan Fiora Panozza Miles

Keep in mind that Rix, Gwilt and Fiora probably won't be Saints listed players next year. Possibly Leigh Fisher and McQualter too, if he can't crack a gig this year after being elevated.

For those you might not be familiar with, i'll give a brief overview.

Howard: Running flanker/mid, extremely quick and has great endurance. Good skills by foot and hand, but struggles to read the play well, and his vision isn't great.

Allen: Traditional FF/CHF type of player, Strong overhead, knows how to find space, but may not have the speed or endurance.

McQualter: Inside mid, a ball magnet but disposal is questionable. Not effective at any distance more than 30m.

Steven: Nuggety midfielder/forward pocket, courageous and extremely smart. Will push for AFL selection early in '09.

Miles: Full Back (or more probably 3rd tall, he's 185cm), extremely fast closing speed, and can provide really good run from defense.

Eddy: Prolific midfielder, a fantastic athlete who was tearing up the time trials and endurance runs preseason. Can get the ball but his disposal needs work. Used primarily as a run with player.

Here is this week's Sandy lineup, for comparison.

B Biddlecombe Carroll Whelan
HB Lamb Martin Valenti
C Yze Summers T. Johnston
HF Tregear Crowe C. Johnson
F Meesen Holland Maric
R Jamar Poyas Buckley

Int C. Liddell Bell McConnell Plymin Rivers Gilchrist Waller M. Johnston Martyn

[Enrico_Misso]

Does anybody know (or remember) why Sandy affiliated with MFC rather than us in the first place?

Originally when this VFA becoming the VFL thing happened back in the 90s we, along with a number of of other Melbourne-based AFL clubs tried to go it alone with our own team in the VFL.

But the costs were quite prohibitive.
So a number of clubs looked to align with existing VFA clubs.
And that also made sense for the VFA club as it gave them access to AFL players and exchanging of personnel, facilities, expertise etc.
And it also made sense from a financial point of view, as the AFL affiliate would want a strong VFL side.

So Melb approached Sandy.
At the time StKilda made it clear they weren't seeking an affiliation.
So Sandy agreed to jump in with Melbourne.

A couple of years later we realised that running our own VFL team was becoming a huge financial drain.
But by that time Sandy was taken and quite happy.

Hence we wound up where we did.

But I have no doubt that if you could wind back the clock, the logical pairing from day 1 would have been a Sandy-Saints alliance.
Logical for both parties.

Everything happens eventually - just takes time !

[Mr Magic]

Thanks for the info EM

[saintbrat]

http://insidefootballonline.com/cleary.html

Phil's take on alignements

The VFA/VFL would be a much better compe­tition and derive more support from the local community, including local councils, if part-alignments were the rule, or failing that, the AFL partnership was geographically based.
Does anyone think St Kilda – which will re-locate to Frankston when the redevelopment is complete – won’t consider an alignment with Frankston or part-alignments with Sandringham and Frankston?
And let’s be blunt about it. Does anyone believe the AFL won’t move heaven and earth to see Melbourne – and possibly another club – go north?
Just as the old VFA was on borrowed time when football went national, so is the Melbourne Football Club a victim of the national game. If Melbourne does go north, who’ll take on Casey Fields? Why wouldn’t the Richmond Football Club dump the Craigieburn option for an alignment with the Scorpions?
Although I have no concrete evidence as to what Essendon has planned in Bendigo, the strategy in trouble. Resignations at the Bendigo Bombers, coupled with onerous travel times and lack of interest locally, are taking their toll.
The Bombers will surely either go it alone in the VFL or look for a Melbourne-based alignment. As we have seen with Melbourne’s decision to abandon Sandringham, nothing is certain in modern football.
Melbourne to the Gold Coast. Essendon with Coburg. Richmond with Casey Scorpions, at Casey Fields. St Kilda aligned with Frankston (if the Dolphins decide to go this way) and Sandringham. That should be a starting point. And, if the Kangaroos go north? Well, that’s another story. And Tasmania? I’m unconvinced!

[Otiman]

Always respect Phil Cleary's point of view, even if I disagree with it most of the time. And in this case, I do.

VFL/AFL alignments are just that. They are a temporary pooling of resources which allow VFL clubs to operate at a lower budget, and have (potentially) AFL quality players and resources at their disposal.

They do have to sacrifice some of their pride, which is the biggest cost. Any premiership won by an AFL aligned side in the VFL will be blighted, until all clubs are aligned.

I'd love for Frankston to win the flag this year, or next. They won't.

Geelong and now Collingwood are a farce in the VFL system. They don't have VFL reserves, and consist of developing AFL players and some cheap kids from the local Geelong league, and some poached VFL experience players (Carmody and co at Collingwood).

Before this year I had next to zero interest in the VFL, but it's clear that there's some great footy to be seen, and the integrity of the competition is being bought out by the AFL.