Stephen Milne's lawyers to decide on rape trial abandonment

[Linton Lodger]

I haven't got a problem with Lenny and Roo being there. Even if a mate HAS done the wrong thing that doesn't mean he's no longer a mate. Surely in a mature world even potential sponsors can understand that. Especially as this happened 10 years ago and Milne no longer plays at the club.

From what I hear I reckon it's a good outcome for Milney....

Considering the longevity of time that has passed since the alleged offence, the sordy circumstances of the whole thing, and Milnes good character, I'd be surprised if he gets any jail time

A very good friend of mine went to court as a victim of an indecent assault charge among others. 38 years after the event. Perpetrator had lots of character witnesses saying what a great church going, old people helping, loving husband type of guy he was. Still went to jail for 4 years. So did Rolf Harris.

As I understand Indecent assault is often used as an alternative for statutory rape prior to 1986 I think as that offence wasn't legalised (not sure the correct term for this) until then. Which is why jail time is often given to those historical rape cases in certain circumstances, even though the charge is indecent assault. Rolf Harris was guilty of statutory rape and rape. Not sure about British law but in Victoria he would have had his stat rape charged amended to indecent assault and he was also guilty of rape. He got the right penalty (imo)

A good example being the Gavin Hopper case about 10 years ago. Was charged with rape as it was a 14yr old school girl he was having consensual sex with. I think in the end the charge was amended to indecent assault for the reasons outlined above. He pleaded not guilty and was found guilty at trial. Received 3mths gaol time as a result.

Under certain circumstances Milney may have been in a bit of trouble. Considering what we know of the circumstances, ie the victim involved was an adult, victim was known to Milne, etc etc the fact he has pleaded guilty, and the passage of time I stand by the fact that he won't receive gaol time. Before you jump up and down and say that these factors make no difference I am NOT defending Milney or his conduct. Some where along the way he did the wrong thing and responsibility has been accepted (finally) Each case is different and certain factors mitigate the sentencing, which is why we have an Act for sentencing alone. ie Milney standing in the bushes, dragging some unsuspecting jogger in and indecently assaulting her would be considered worse (from what we know) as to what he has allegedly done.

Also depends on what the indecent assault was, for example an uninvited pinch on the bum is indecent assault. So I guess that's a factor. I doubt someone would be sent to gaol for pinching someone on the bum, but would for a more severe act or repeated and remorseless brazen acts (see Rolf Harris).

[Bunk_Moreland]

I still don't have any idea as to what allegedly happened?

Allegedly - girl said 'no' (friend heard her say it, Montagna heard her say it). Milne went ahead anyway. Girl didn't resist because she thought it was Montagna. When she realised all hell broke loose.

and milne stopped.....said that's cool....you don't actually believe that milnes voice could be mistaken for joey's do you???.

...look it all comes down to mony.....a ten day trial would have cost milne tens of thousands of dollars.......

The only people getting the money were those blood sucking lawyers.

Don't know about that, may be a civil case looming.

done and dusted.....many moons ago....

Oh OK...

[The Redeemer]

I have no issue with our blokes supporting Yapper in an official capacity via the Courts. They are free to do as they please and if they feel strongly, so be it.

Yapper better have saved money throughout his AFL career though. Not many people have such a great opportunity to make amazing money so early in life...

[Moods]

This is the line that really drew my attention

But she had performed consensual sexual acts with Milne both before and after the assault

So she continued to have sex with Milne after she was allegedly attacked? I can see why they were agreeable to a deal. Try convincing a jury that you were raped but that you continued straight after to CONSENUALLY engage in sex with your attacker?? It appears she was aware that it was Milne she was with after she claimed she was attacked and engaged in sex acts with him anyway - consensually. No wonder the cops didn't want to proceed in the first instance. Are the police a disgrace, or the persons who bowed to political pressure.

I agree Moods. I just don't understand how this can happen AFTER. Surely it must be typo.

Either I have drawn the wrong conclusion - and the victim consented to sex after the attack, but believed all along she was with Joey still, and once she realised that it was Milney afterwards she was further horrified and decided to report it OR she knew it was Milney once she had been assaulted, BUT felt compelled to go along with certain acts due to being intimidated by him. Although if that was the case, then it's still rape. I can only assume I've misread or miscomprehended the article and it was the former of my beliefs.

In any event, if a person believes that they have been raped - regardless of who committed the act (due to darkness) You would think that if they are genuinely aggrieved, they wouldn't continue to have consensual sex with the attacker. You would think that they would stop there and then.

[chook23]

Moods

It clearly states that in the HS article

also appears to have been stated by the prosecution

The headlines etc

dont seem to match the content

HS have pushed the boundary with certain aspects.....


But typical of gutter reporting


No wonder the judge is considering a fine given all the circumstances with No CONVICTION

[stinger]

Moods

It clearly states that in the HS article

also appears to have been stated by the prosecution

The headlines etc

dont seem to match the content

HS have pushed the boundary with certain aspects.....


But typical of gutter reporting


No wonder the judge is considering a fine given all the circumstances with No CONVICTION

your post doesn't make sense to me...clearly the judge is considering a fine because of the facts of the matter.....not because of the way the facts are being reported...

[Furphy]

If a 'former St.Kilda player' who never played a game for us was acquitted for what he was alleged to have done, (and I believed he was guilty) there is no way Milney would have been convicted of rape, he should not have pleaded guilty to anything.

[chook23]

Moods

It clearly states that in the HS article

also appears to have been stated by the prosecution

The headlines etc

dont seem to match the content

HS have pushed the boundary with certain aspects.....


But typical of gutter reporting


No wonder the judge is considering a fine given all the circumstances with No CONVICTION

your post doesn't make sense to me...clearly the judge is considering a fine because of the facts of the matter.....not because of the way the facts are being reported...

Sorry Stinger

2 complete discussions

what the judge is considering

AND

the way the HS has reported various parts of the matter

[Moods]

If a 'former St.Kilda player' who never played a game for us was acquitted for what he was alleged to have done, (and I believed he was guilty) there is no way Milney would have been convicted of rape, he should not have pleaded guilty to anything.

That's easy for you to say. You had nothing to lose by saying it. Even if found not guilty (which on that point I agree with you) then Milne would be under huge financial pressure, and I'm not sure he would feel as vindicated as he would like by the public. Let's face it - the whole thing was pretty untidy. Drunk footballers in a dark room playing swapsies. You have to consider that Milney has kids old enough to understand what's going on - which means they have friends/associates/adversary's who are also old enough to understand what's going on. People are pretty nasty - you only have to read the online stuff written to understand that. Even stuff written on here about different individuals can be harsh, and that's just the saints players!

At a guess, I reckon he took the deal for the sake of those closest to him, and actually sacrificed himself a bit. I know that portrays Milne as a bit of a martyr which is offensive to some, but I reckon he would believe that he had put his family through enough, so if there was a way clear for him to avoid gaol time and even a possible conviction, then I reckon he took it - rather than pay another $30-40k to clear his name, but bring up a whole lot of titillating headlines for the press and cause more hardship/stress for himself. I reckon I would have done the same thing in the circumstances. I guess the point is - I would pretty disappointed in myself to even find myself in these circumstances, but you can't undo the past.

[stinger]

Moods

It clearly states that in the HS article

also appears to have been stated by the prosecution

The headlines etc

dont seem to match the content

HS have pushed the boundary with certain aspects.....


But typical of gutter reporting


No wonder the judge is considering a fine given all the circumstances with No CONVICTION

your post doesn't make sense to me...clearly the judge is considering a fine because of the facts of the matter.....not because of the way the facts are being reported...

Sorry Stinger

2 complete discussions

what the judge is considering

AND

the way the HS has reported various parts of the matter

...no worries mate

[matrix]

yeah she didnt know who it was
lol

whatever

oh its not who i thought it was
but i kept going anyway

and all this time she was fighting away, trying to bring milney to justice
i mean this is all we've heard about for ten years
right?
what a crock of shite
im sorry if im offending here but crikey this is not adding up one bit

[tweedaletomanning]

yeah she didnt know who it was
lol

whatever

oh its not who i thought it was
but i kept going anyway

and all this time she was fighting away, trying to bring milney to justice
i mean this is all we've heard about for ten years
right?
what a crock of shite
im sorry if im offending here but crikey this is not adding up one bit

Have to agree,

however lets hope milney's lawyer did a good job and at least investigated the character of the girl.

for all we know she could be a complete and utter s**t, and already slept with half the AFL.

OR

She was a very conservative girl, who had no background of this kind of behaviour and really believed she was doing joey, and that she was going to become the love of his life.

anyway, indecent assault...

can someone tell me what DECENT assault is?

[plugger66]

yeah she didnt know who it was
lol

whatever

oh its not who i thought it was
but i kept going anyway

and all this time she was fighting away, trying to bring milney to justice
i mean this is all we've heard about for ten years
right?
what a crock of shite
im sorry if im offending here but crikey this is not adding up one bit

Have to agree,

however lets hope milney's lawyer did a good job and at least investigated the character of the girl.

for all we know she could be a complete and utter s**t, and already slept with half the AFL.

OR

She was a very conservative girl, who had no background of this kind of behaviour and really believed she was doing joey, and that she was going to become the love of his life.

anyway, indecent assault...

can someone tell me what DECENT assault is?

Yep its all funny until you know people involved in this type of stuff. I have no idea if Milney is guilty or not and from what I have heard would have got off but the girl thinks she was raped so I also feel for her. Don't see the need to have a go at her at all.

[White Winmar]

Given the little we know, I'm puzzled that a charge of rape has morphed into an indecent assault charge. I thought it has been alleged that the victim and Milne had sexual intercourse, with the victim consenting by fraud, believing she was having sex with Joey. Rape occurs when intercourse takes place without consent, through force, fear, or fraud. Suddenly after ten years of investigations and a committal hearing, it's been downgraded to indecent assault. Even if penetration was digital, or with an object, it's still rape, as I understand. Does anyone actually know what the offending behaviour the prosecution is now alleging? A squeeze of the breast, a grope on the backside or groin? It seems we've suddenly gone from the most serious of crimes, to something that is on the lesser end of the scale. How?

[plugger66]

Given the little we know, I'm puzzled that a charge of rape has morphed into an indecent assault charge. I thought it has been alleged that the victim and Milne had sexual intercourse, with the victim consenting by fraud, believing she was having sex with Joey. Rape occurs when intercourse takes place without consent, through force, fear, or fraud. Suddenly after ten years of investigations and a committal hearing, it's been downgraded to indecent assault. Even if penetration was digital, or with an object, it's still rape, as I understand. Does anyone actually know what the offending behaviour the prosecution is now alleging? A squeeze of the breast, a grope on the backside or groin? It seems we've suddenly gone from the most serious of crimes, to something that is on the lesser end of the scale. How?

I think its called lack of evidence and this stops all action. Seems to me it would upset both parties but maybe both have just had enough. Makes me wonder about the police though.

[White Winmar]

Exactly, P66. This seems to have been a gigantic c**k up from the start. I know a couple of guys who had a ringside seat to the investigation and they tell me that it was a farce from the start. Milney and the alleged victim should sue Gladman for incompetence. How the whole thing has ended here is unbelievable.

[satchmo]

Didn't gladman have a relationship with the girl as well? Makes you wonder why he spilled his guts to a reporter, then moved to Central America.

[suss]

Does anyone actually know what the offending behaviour the prosecution is now alleging? A squeeze of the breast, a grope on the backside or groin? It seems we've suddenly gone from the most serious of crimes, to something that is on the lesser end of the scale. How?

I'm not a criminal lawyer but I'm sure it's assault with a sexual component. The latter determined according to society's standards. So it will cover minor stuff and also much more serious stuff - hence the large maximum sentence.

The outcome seems reasonably predictable to me - both sides not confident of winning and not willing to risk the consequences of losing. Just a fact of life in the justice system.

[ace]

Seems like a big waste of taxpayers and Milne's money.
Milne walks because whatever he did was not serious enough to get jail time.
The senior police recognised this and told the original investigating officer to pull his head in.

After what happened she was so ashamed she wanted to pretend to herself and anyone who listened - I was not a willing participant.

The original investigating officer went public to settle a score with his seniors.
It became politically too hard to drop the case again so a prosecution had to go ahead
The prosecutors needed to deal there way out of the case by getting Milne to plead to a lesser charge.
The senior police got it right the first time.

[satchmo]

Seems like a big waste of taxpayers and Milne's money.
Milne walks because whatever he did was not serious enough to get jail time.
The senior police recognised this and told the original investigating officer to pull his head in.

After what happened she was so ashamed she wanted to pretend to herself and anyone who listened - I was not a willing participant.

The original investigating officer went public to settle a score with his seniors.
It became politically too hard to drop the case again so a prosecution had to go ahead
The prosecutors needed to deal there way out of the case by getting Milne to plead to a lesser charge.
The senior police got it right the first time.

That was my take on it too.

The timing of the "re-opening of the investigation" was interesting as well, if I recall correctly.

[plugger66]

Seems like a big waste of taxpayers and Milne's money.
Milne walks because whatever he did was not serious enough to get jail time.
The senior police recognised this and told the original investigating officer to pull his head in.

After what happened she was so ashamed she wanted to pretend to herself and anyone who listened - I was not a willing participant.

The original investigating officer went public to settle a score with his seniors.
It became politically too hard to drop the case again so a prosecution had to go ahead
The prosecutors needed to deal there way out of the case by getting Milne to plead to a lesser charge.
The senior police got it right the first time.

How do you know that was the reason the girl wanted the case to proceed? Sounds like made up crap to me and a pretty poor response.

[CURLY]

Seems like a big waste of taxpayers and Milne's money.
Milne walks because whatever he did was not serious enough to get jail time.
The senior police recognised this and told the original investigating officer to pull his head in.

After what happened she was so ashamed she wanted to pretend to herself and anyone who listened - I was not a willing participant.

The original investigating officer went public to settle a score with his seniors.
It became politically too hard to drop the case again so a prosecution had to go ahead
The prosecutors needed to deal there way out of the case by getting Milne to plead to a lesser charge.
The senior police got it right the first time.

That was my take on it too.

The timing of the "re-opening of the investigation" was interesting as well, if I recall correctly.

Amazing that Tony Jones broke the story that evidence may have been tampered with the week following Mick Malthouse and Eddie's disgusting attack on Milne. On Channel 9 just to add to the crap.

[satchmo]

Seems like a big waste of taxpayers and Milne's money.
Milne walks because whatever he did was not serious enough to get jail time.
The senior police recognised this and told the original investigating officer to pull his head in.

After what happened she was so ashamed she wanted to pretend to herself and anyone who listened - I was not a willing participant.

The original investigating officer went public to settle a score with his seniors.
It became politically too hard to drop the case again so a prosecution had to go ahead
The prosecutors needed to deal there way out of the case by getting Milne to plead to a lesser charge.
The senior police got it right the first time.

That was my take on it too.

The timing of the "re-opening of the investigation" was interesting as well, if I recall correctly.

Amazing that Tony Jones broke the story that evidence may have been tampered with the week following Mick Malthouse and Eddie's disgusting attack on Milne. On Channel 9 just to add to the crap.

Come on CURLY, it's not as if Jones is a colonwood supporter.....oh wait,sorry

[CURLY]

Seems like a big waste of taxpayers and Milne's money.
Milne walks because whatever he did was not serious enough to get jail time.
The senior police recognised this and told the original investigating officer to pull his head in.

After what happened she was so ashamed she wanted to pretend to herself and anyone who listened - I was not a willing participant.

The original investigating officer went public to settle a score with his seniors.
It became politically too hard to drop the case again so a prosecution had to go ahead
The prosecutors needed to deal there way out of the case by getting Milne to plead to a lesser charge.
The senior police got it right the first time.

That was my take on it too.

The timing of the "re-opening of the investigation" was interesting as well, if I recall correctly.

Amazing that Tony Jones broke the story that evidence may have been tampered with the week following Mick Malthouse and Eddie's disgusting attack on Milne. On Channel 9 just to add to the crap.

Come on CURLY, it's not as if Jones is a colonwood supporter.....oh wait,sorry

Yeah what are the chances hey.

[Selhurst Saint]

Seems like a big waste of taxpayers and Milne's money.
Milne walks because whatever he did was not serious enough to get jail time.
The senior police recognised this and told the original investigating officer to pull his head in.

After what happened she was so ashamed she wanted to pretend to herself and anyone who listened - I was not a willing participant.

The original investigating officer went public to settle a score with his seniors.
It became politically too hard to drop the case again so a prosecution had to go ahead
The prosecutors needed to deal there way out of the case by getting Milne to plead to a lesser charge.
The senior police got it right the first time.

That was my take on it too.

The timing of the "re-opening of the investigation" was interesting as well, if I recall correctly.

Amazing that Tony Jones broke the story that evidence may have been tampered with the week following Mick Malthouse and Eddie's disgusting attack on Milne. On Channel 9 just to add to the crap.

Come on CURLY, it's not as if Jones is a colonwood supporter.....oh wait,sorry

Yeah what are the chances hey.

Every time Milney was receiving some positive attention from the media in relation to a milestone game Keith Moor would publish a rehashed version of the same old story in the Herald Sun.

This is the same Keith Moor who wrote another story about how outraged he was that a drunk girl dared to accuse Eddie Maguire, Steve Quartermain, and Steve Millichip of Rape in the 1990's. Connect the dots.

The third man Millichip, a B grade actor and a relative unknown took the rap and did jail time.