Baker cops 3rd striking charge & found guilty on 4th

[Sainterman]

To the St Kilda admin, bloody awful handling of this whole saga. The fact Bakes will walk away with 9 is a disgrace. You NEVER support our players at the tribunal, and NEVER take on the AFL. How these little hits are classified as any form of impact, low or whatever, is a joke.



How is this the clubs fault. They appealed. To say you never support the players is a joke, remember the whole Farmer incident was under a different administration. Get of your high horses, it doesn't change anything. The fact is they have it in for Bakes and thats not St kildas fault.

We took one charge to appeal. Wow! Brilliant effort. We did not make one statement other than we would contest 2 charges...one once it got to the tribunal. Was the force sufficient compared to all the others that are let go??? Great effort! Take it to court if you need to, the system that produces this result is clearly wrong.

Open your eyes...this is all political and we don't want to step on the AFL toes. I guess Andy D's "precedent" set when GT commented on umpires and we got whispers in the sky is enough to put us off.

We had options here and took the least of them...bent over.

[BackFromUSA]

That is so true Wal.

Let sleeping dogs lie.

[Bernard Shakey]

He won't play finals :cry:

Yes he will. You mark my words Steven baker will play all finals and get a premiership medallion.

[3rd generation saint]

Maybe the supporters should take it to court!
Class action

[realdeal]

To the St Kilda admin, bloody awful handling of this whole saga. The fact Bakes will walk away with 9 is a disgrace. You NEVER support our players at the tribunal, and NEVER take on the AFL. How these little hits are classified as any form of impact, low or whatever, is a joke.



How is this the clubs fault. They appealed. To say you never support the players is a joke, remember the whole Farmer incident was under a different administration. Get of your high horses, it doesn't change anything. The fact is they have it in for Bakes and thats not St kildas fault.

We took one charge to appeal. Wow! Brilliant effort. We did not make one statement other than we would contest 2 charges...one once it got to the tribunal. Was the force sufficient compared to all the others that are let go??? Great effort! Take it to court if you need to, the system that produces this result is clearly wrong.

Open your eyes...this is all political and we don't want to step on the AFL toes. I guess Andy D's "precedent" set when GT commented on umpires and we got whispers in the sky is enough to put us off.

We had options here and took the least of them...bent over.

+1
took the words out of my mouth!

[Saint Bev]

To the St Kilda admin, bloody awful handling of this whole saga. The fact Bakes will walk away with 9 is a disgrace. You NEVER support our players at the tribunal, and NEVER take on the AFL. How these little hits are classified as any form of impact, low or whatever, is a joke.



How is this the clubs fault. They appealed. To say you never support the players is a joke, remember the whole Farmer incident was under a different administration. Get of your high horses, it doesn't change anything. The fact is they have it in for Bakes and thats not St kildas fault.

We took one charge to appeal. Wow! Brilliant effort. We did not make one statement other than we would contest 2 charges...one once it got to the tribunal. Was the force sufficient compared to all the others that are let go??? Great effort! Take it to court if you need to, the system that produces this result is clearly wrong.

Open your eyes...this is all political and we don't want to step on the AFL toes. I guess Andy D's "precedent" set when GT commented on umpires and we got whispers in the sky is enough to put us off.

We had options here and took the least of them...bent over.

They withdrew it because there was video evidence he wacked him. No point appealing and risking getting more weeks, that would be stupidity. The fact is he wacked him, yep it was soft, but he still did it and we can't change that, we also have to consider the bigger picture.

[Saint Bev]

To those of you bagging the club, you need to calm down and stop acting so petulantly. As a general rule, nobody gets off at the tribunal. Even Sir Judd was unable to beat his gouging charge late last year. Many have tried and failed. Very, very few are successful. If they were that keen to make an example of Baker, there was not a great deal that we can do.

Now before we all go mouthing off about Supreme Court action, have a long hard think about it. If you don't think we suffer enough now, can you imagine how hard it will be made for us if we were to pursue this? We have bigger fish to fry. Bakes will be back for the finals. We will be able to cover him until then. We will then see all our boys holding the cup high in September. That will be the big 'up yours' to the footy public, the media and the AFL. Actions not words people, actions not words.

It is time to calm down, put this behind us and move forward.

Agree.

[SainterK]

He won't play finals

Yes he will. You mark my words Steven baker will play all finals and get a premiership medallion.

I truly hope so

[Sainterman]

To the St Kilda admin, bloody awful handling of this whole saga. The fact Bakes will walk away with 9 is a disgrace. You NEVER support our players at the tribunal, and NEVER take on the AFL. How these little hits are classified as any form of impact, low or whatever, is a joke.



How is this the clubs fault. They appealed. To say you never support the players is a joke, remember the whole Farmer incident was under a different administration. Get of your high horses, it doesn't change anything. The fact is they have it in for Bakes and thats not St kildas fault.

We took one charge to appeal. Wow! Brilliant effort. We did not make one statement other than we would contest 2 charges...one once it got to the tribunal. Was the force sufficient compared to all the others that are let go??? Great effort! Take it to court if you need to, the system that produces this result is clearly wrong.

Open your eyes...this is all political and we don't want to step on the AFL toes. I guess Andy D's "precedent" set when GT commented on umpires and we got whispers in the sky is enough to put us off.

We had options here and took the least of them...bent over.

They withdrew it because there was video evidence he wacked him. No point appealing and risking getting more weeks, that would be stupidity. The fact is he wacked him, yep it was soft, but he still did it and we can't change that, we also have to consider the bigger picture.

Does it not matter to you that exactly the same type of hits, with the same and more force have incurred no charge or penalty???

Yeah, we should accept our players being treated differently.

Anyway, you have your opinion and I have mine...and mine is we were bent over and we took it.

[saint75]

To the St Kilda admin, bloody awful handling of this whole saga. The fact Bakes will walk away with 9 is a disgrace. You NEVER support our players at the tribunal, and NEVER take on the AFL. How these little hits are classified as any form of impact, low or whatever, is a joke.



How is this the clubs fault. They appealed. To say you never support the players is a joke, remember the whole Farmer incident was under a different administration. Get of your high horses, it doesn't change anything. The fact is they have it in for Bakes and thats not St kildas fault.

We took one charge to appeal. Wow! Brilliant effort. We did not make one statement other than we would contest 2 charges...one once it got to the tribunal. Was the force sufficient compared to all the others that are let go??? Great effort! Take it to court if you need to, the system that produces this result is clearly wrong.

Open your eyes...this is all political and we don't want to step on the AFL toes. I guess Andy D's "precedent" set when GT commented on umpires and we got whispers in the sky is enough to put us off.

We had options here and took the least of them...bent over.

Some people simply have no idea. What in the effin' hell did you want them to do and at what freakin' cost? By cost I don't mean financially. We went through enough hell in the GT years when he opened his mouth. Do you want to return to the days of 'sirengate'? Gotta pick your battles with this mob. Besides, Bakes helping to hold the cup up at the end of the year is satisfaction enough.

We have a fantastic team that is about to welcome back some of it's stars. We need to refocus on the task this Sunday. If you want to vent your spleen, get along to the game and give it to one of the opposition supporters who will have the misfortune around you to open their mouth about that incident or the Milne one.

[saintharvs]

I am very disapointed and feel that the club has not done the right thing by Baker. To only contest one of those charges is ridiculous. What they should have done is appealed three out of the four charges. Obviously StKilda would have lost the appeal but then they can take it straight to the courts. The MRP do not look ar precedence but our courts do. It is pretty difficult to take charges to the court to which you have pleaded guilty.
Not happy!!

[Sainterman]

To the St Kilda admin, bloody awful handling of this whole saga. The fact Bakes will walk away with 9 is a disgrace. You NEVER support our players at the tribunal, and NEVER take on the AFL. How these little hits are classified as any form of impact, low or whatever, is a joke.



How is this the clubs fault. They appealed. To say you never support the players is a joke, remember the whole Farmer incident was under a different administration. Get of your high horses, it doesn't change anything. The fact is they have it in for Bakes and thats not St kildas fault.

We took one charge to appeal. Wow! Brilliant effort. We did not make one statement other than we would contest 2 charges...one once it got to the tribunal. Was the force sufficient compared to all the others that are let go??? Great effort! Take it to court if you need to, the system that produces this result is clearly wrong.

Open your eyes...this is all political and we don't want to step on the AFL toes. I guess Andy D's "precedent" set when GT commented on umpires and we got whispers in the sky is enough to put us off.

We had options here and took the least of them...bent over.

Some people simply have no idea. What in the effin' hell did you want them to do and at what freakin' cost? By cost I don't mean financially. We went through enough hell in the GT years when he opened his mouth. Do you want to return to the days of 'sirengate'? Gotta pick your battles with this mob. Besides, Bakes helping to hold the cup up at the end of the year is satisfaction enough.

We have a fantastic team that is about to welcome back some of it's stars. We need to refocus on the task this Sunday. If you want to vent your spleen, get along to the game and give it to one of the opposition supporters who will have the misfortune around you to open their mouth about that incident or the Milne one.

I thought it was ok to vent my spleen here. I thought this was a fan forum.

What a great competition it is when you have to accept something unjust because the consequences are going to be even worse if you don't. Amazing some are happy to accept this. When do we get our reward for being a good little club for all the things we have accepted over the years then???

I agree we have a fantastic team, and I don't think losing Bakes will slow us down too much, it is the principle of this.

And fight it all the way is what I wanted them to effing do. all we got was a little statement outlining the charges they would contest. Nothing from our president, nothing at all really.

Anyway, I will move on but it is just another example of a very, very flawed competition.

[saintbrat]

debate failed

suspension Stands at 9 weeks


which would have been his 200th game

Come back strong and fit next year Bakes... after a wonderful Finals series

Reminder those who wish to wish Bakes all the Best he will be honoured with St Kilda Life membership at the Hall Of Fame on July 24th.

[BackFromUSA]

9 it is ...

[saint75]

To the St Kilda admin, bloody awful handling of this whole saga. The fact Bakes will walk away with 9 is a disgrace. You NEVER support our players at the tribunal, and NEVER take on the AFL. How these little hits are classified as any form of impact, low or whatever, is a joke.



How is this the clubs fault. They appealed. To say you never support the players is a joke, remember the whole Farmer incident was under a different administration. Get of your high horses, it doesn't change anything. The fact is they have it in for Bakes and thats not St kildas fault.

We took one charge to appeal. Wow! Brilliant effort. We did not make one statement other than we would contest 2 charges...one once it got to the tribunal. Was the force sufficient compared to all the others that are let go??? Great effort! Take it to court if you need to, the system that produces this result is clearly wrong.

Open your eyes...this is all political and we don't want to step on the AFL toes. I guess Andy D's "precedent" set when GT commented on umpires and we got whispers in the sky is enough to put us off.

We had options here and took the least of them...bent over.

Some people simply have no idea. What in the effin' hell did you want them to do and at what freakin' cost? By cost I don't mean financially. We went through enough hell in the GT years when he opened his mouth. Do you want to return to the days of 'sirengate'? Gotta pick your battles with this mob. Besides, Bakes helping to hold the cup up at the end of the year is satisfaction enough.

We have a fantastic team that is about to welcome back some of it's stars. We need to refocus on the task this Sunday. If you want to vent your spleen, get along to the game and give it to one of the opposition supporters who will have the misfortune around you to open their mouth about that incident or the Milne one.

I thought it was ok to vent my spleen here. I thought this was a fan forum.

What a great competition it is when you have to accept something unjust because the consequences are going to be even worse if you don't. Amazing some are happy to accept this. When do we get our reward for being a good little club for all the things we have accepted over the years then???

I agree we have a fantastic team, and I don't think losing Bakes will slow us down too much, it is the principle of this.

And fight it all the way is what I wanted them to effing do. all we got was a little statement outlining the charges they would contest. Nothing from our president, nothing at all really.

Anyway, I will move on but it is just another example of a very, very flawed competition.

If they had fought every charge and lost and Baker copped 12 weeks, would that have helped YOU sleep better at night? Had they spent thousands of dollars taking it to the supreme court and STILL the verdict stood, would that also have made YOU feel better? What about the team and the rest of this season? How was that going to help them? More unnecessary publicity that is not needed in a year where I believe we WILL take the flag. You can only put so much pressure on this playing group. They need to keep there eye on the ball, so to speak.

The AFL were determined to make a stance on this and have support from numerous quarters in the community. How did you think this was going to end once the decision was made by the MRP? Did you really think he was going to walk away with nothing? In the real world you are often required to make sacrifices for the greater good. This may just be one of those times.

[Farren's Girl]

The jury believed that Steven Baker knew Steve Johnson was an 'injured player' at the time of incident

Well if he was injured then Geelong should be charged with endangering the safety of a player. This is an absolute disgrace.

This means all players with any taping will have to be treated with kid gloves just in case....

There is still some hope they haven;t ruled out appealing and I hope they do. This sets a very scarey precedent.

Gee I never knew that Bakes was a doctor, see you learn something new everyday. Right now I could cry, I am so dam angry. Just to top it off nine had to also mention about the other matter tonight as well.

As someone who is a registered Coach with the AFL, it is my understanding that when a player takes to the field everyone is fair game. If Johnson had been in hands of trainer absolutely he would be wrong. For God's sake, we watched Johnson do his fitness test at quarter time.

He declared himself fit as did the club. So did the Saints players get their radios out in the quarter time address to listen to SEN to see who was injured....Somehow I think not.

I will still be taking my sign to the game this weekend, as this is a sad day in AFL history. People you have just witnessed our game show that it is turning into a non contact sport.

And again I congratulate Bakes on his medical qualification.

GO SAINTERS

[realdeal]

To the St Kilda admin, bloody awful handling of this whole saga. The fact Bakes will walk away with 9 is a disgrace. You NEVER support our players at the tribunal, and NEVER take on the AFL. How these little hits are classified as any form of impact, low or whatever, is a joke.



How is this the clubs fault. They appealed. To say you never support the players is a joke, remember the whole Farmer incident was under a different administration. Get of your high horses, it doesn't change anything. The fact is they have it in for Bakes and thats not St kildas fault.

We took one charge to appeal. Wow! Brilliant effort. We did not make one statement other than we would contest 2 charges...one once it got to the tribunal. Was the force sufficient compared to all the others that are let go??? Great effort! Take it to court if you need to, the system that produces this result is clearly wrong.

Open your eyes...this is all political and we don't want to step on the AFL toes. I guess Andy D's "precedent" set when GT commented on umpires and we got whispers in the sky is enough to put us off.

We had options here and took the least of them...bent over.

Some people simply have no idea. What in the effin' hell did you want them to do and at what freakin' cost? By cost I don't mean financially. We went through enough hell in the GT years when he opened his mouth. Do you want to return to the days of 'sirengate'? Gotta pick your battles with this mob. Besides, Bakes helping to hold the cup up at the end of the year is satisfaction enough.

We have a fantastic team that is about to welcome back some of it's stars. We need to refocus on the task this Sunday. If you want to vent your spleen, get along to the game and give it to one of the opposition supporters who will have the misfortune around you to open their mouth about that incident or the Milne one.

I thought it was ok to vent my spleen here. I thought this was a fan forum.

What a great competition it is when you have to accept something unjust because the consequences are going to be even worse if you don't. Amazing some are happy to accept this. When do we get our reward for being a good little club for all the things we have accepted over the years then???

I agree we have a fantastic team, and I don't think losing Bakes will slow us down too much, it is the principle of this.

And fight it all the way is what I wanted them to effing do. all we got was a little statement outlining the charges they would contest. Nothing from our president, nothing at all really.

Anyway, I will move on but it is just another example of a very, very flawed competition.

If they had fought every charge and lost and Baker copped 12 weeks, would that have helped YOU sleep better at night? Had they spent thousands of dollars taking it to the supreme court and STILL the verdict stood, would that also have made YOU feel better? What about the team and the rest of this season? How was that going to help them? More unnecessary publicity that is not needed in a year where I believe we WILL take the flag. You can only put so much pressure on this playing group. They need to keep there eye on the ball, so to speak.

The AFL were determined to make a stance on this and have support from numerous quarters in the community. How did you think this was going to end once the decision was made by the MRP? Did you really think he was going to walk away with nothing? In the real world you are often required to make sacrifices for the greater good. This may just be one of those times.

the 3rd charge should definatly have been contested, no force what so ever.

lets just be a door mat for the rest of the league like we were for 100 years. its about pride and support for our club

[Sainterman]

To the St Kilda admin, bloody awful handling of this whole saga. The fact Bakes will walk away with 9 is a disgrace. You NEVER support our players at the tribunal, and NEVER take on the AFL. How these little hits are classified as any form of impact, low or whatever, is a joke.



How is this the clubs fault. They appealed. To say you never support the players is a joke, remember the whole Farmer incident was under a different administration. Get of your high horses, it doesn't change anything. The fact is they have it in for Bakes and thats not St kildas fault.

We took one charge to appeal. Wow! Brilliant effort. We did not make one statement other than we would contest 2 charges...one once it got to the tribunal. Was the force sufficient compared to all the others that are let go??? Great effort! Take it to court if you need to, the system that produces this result is clearly wrong.

Open your eyes...this is all political and we don't want to step on the AFL toes. I guess Andy D's "precedent" set when GT commented on umpires and we got whispers in the sky is enough to put us off.

We had options here and took the least of them...bent over.

Some people simply have no idea. What in the effin' hell did you want them to do and at what freakin' cost? By cost I don't mean financially. We went through enough hell in the GT years when he opened his mouth. Do you want to return to the days of 'sirengate'? Gotta pick your battles with this mob. Besides, Bakes helping to hold the cup up at the end of the year is satisfaction enough.

We have a fantastic team that is about to welcome back some of it's stars. We need to refocus on the task this Sunday. If you want to vent your spleen, get along to the game and give it to one of the opposition supporters who will have the misfortune around you to open their mouth about that incident or the Milne one.

I thought it was ok to vent my spleen here. I thought this was a fan forum.

What a great competition it is when you have to accept something unjust because the consequences are going to be even worse if you don't. Amazing some are happy to accept this. When do we get our reward for being a good little club for all the things we have accepted over the years then???

I agree we have a fantastic team, and I don't think losing Bakes will slow us down too much, it is the principle of this.

And fight it all the way is what I wanted them to effing do. all we got was a little statement outlining the charges they would contest. Nothing from our president, nothing at all really.

Anyway, I will move on but it is just another example of a very, very flawed competition.

If they had fought every charge and lost and Baker copped 12 weeks, would that have helped YOU sleep better at night? Had they spent thousands of dollars taking it to the supreme court and STILL the verdict stood, would that also have made YOU feel better? What about the team and the rest of this season? How was that going to help them? More unnecessary publicity that is not needed in a year where I believe we WILL take the flag. You can only put so much pressure on this playing group. They need to keep there eye on the ball, so to speak.

The AFL were determined to make a stance on this and have support from numerous quarters in the community. How did you think this was going to end once the decision was made by the MRP? Did you really think he was going to walk away with nothing? In the real world you are often required to make sacrifices for the greater good. This may just be one of those times.

This is not about me. And I accept what you are saying. If we take on the AFL then we get punished in some other way. We have seen it before. So yup, we just accept it and move on, less disruption. Kinda like someone who didn't quite commit the crime they are accused of accepting a plea bargain, cos if they don't they risk worse. What a sadly run competition is has become.

I have supported the club financially, and with my heart for 30 years, I think I can have an opinion on the way things are done. I think I am entitled to vent before I move on. I am glad you are so quick to move along and let it go...good for you.

I am a member and am there every week yelling my lungs out. I always support the club, but on this occasion I am of the opinion we needed to make a stand...sorry if that does not agree with yours.

I will be watching this weeks round of games very closely, there better be consistency here hey? But there won't be. Next week someone will do the same thing and nothing will happen. You watch.

Anyway...who do we play this week? Melbourne?

Onward and forward.

[To the top]

In regards Baker's alleged knowledge of Johnson having a broken hand the finding on Nikolic today is of real interest.

The summation on Nikolic was that a suspicion that Nikolic was passing information for a purpose was not proof that he was passing information for a purpose.

Simply, unless Nikolic admitted he was passing on information for the reasons alleged no one can know what was going on inside his brain - and he can not be found guilty on any suspician of what was going on in his brain.

Unless Baker admits he knew Johnson's hand was broken he has been found guilty on the suspician that he knew Johnson's hand was broken.

So 2 findings on the one day and these findings totally inconsistent with each other.

Victoria Racing's tribunal got it right.

The AFL tribunal got it wrong.

There should be an avenue of appeal to an independent judiciary on this matter alone - and then include the other matters on the basis of precedent and where precedent needs to evidence contact with the head specifically.

The AFL set up this "mickey mouse" system to keep matters from the Courts and they overtly intimidate clubs with retribution if they break ranks and look for a civil resolution.

Simply, the whole AFL MRP and tribunal process is a sham and will not stand up in any Court of Law if and when challenged.

There is also the severity of action(s) which did not result in any need for attention from the training or medical staff, the impact of the penalty(ies) commensurate to the severity of the action(s) and the resultant restraint of trade courtesy of the penalty(ies) handed down.

Interim Orders will allow Baker to play out the season - and throw the AFL's MRP and Tribunal system into chaos forcing the AFL to revert (correctly) to a Court of Law because restraint of trade is an issue.

There is also the matter of "trial by media" which has occurred in this instance including by describing the match as vicious etc. etc., which it was not - in my view at least.

In my view it was simply wet weather, accountable footy.

What Baker did has always been going on.

I well recall a full back by the name of John Abley at Port Adelaide who got up to every distracting trick in the book no matter that the ball was at the other end of the ground.

Pinching, punching, grabbing, treading on your toes in your face type stuff for the whole 100 minutes.

All Australian full back on 3 occasions at 3 succesive Carnivals - and arguably, on that record, the greatest full back of them all.

Put Steven Baker's tactics to shame!

The point I make is that nothing has changed - and nor should it.

If a deliberate act results in injury to a player or puts a player at risk of injury then that is another issue altogether.

I also disagree the "tagger" description.

Johnson played half forward and Baker played on him at half back.

Or don't you expect to have a full on opponent hell bent on minimising your influence on a match these days?

Have we reverted to a "kick it to me" code?

Even my grand-daughter at netball finishes games with pinch marks all over her!

Time for Demitriou to go.

[Farren's Girl]

To the St Kilda admin, bloody awful handling of this whole saga. The fact Bakes will walk away with 9 is a disgrace. You NEVER support our players at the tribunal, and NEVER take on the AFL. How these little hits are classified as any form of impact, low or whatever, is a joke.



How is this the clubs fault. They appealed. To say you never support the players is a joke, remember the whole Farmer incident was under a different administration. Get of your high horses, it doesn't change anything. The fact is they have it in for Bakes and thats not St kildas fault.

We took one charge to appeal. Wow! Brilliant effort. We did not make one statement other than we would contest 2 charges...one once it got to the tribunal. Was the force sufficient compared to all the others that are let go??? Great effort! Take it to court if you need to, the system that produces this result is clearly wrong.

Open your eyes...this is all political and we don't want to step on the AFL toes. I guess Andy D's "precedent" set when GT commented on umpires and we got whispers in the sky is enough to put us off.

We had options here and took the least of them...bent over.

Some people simply have no idea. What in the effin' hell did you want them to do and at what freakin' cost? By cost I don't mean financially. We went through enough hell in the GT years when he opened his mouth. Do you want to return to the days of 'sirengate'? Gotta pick your battles with this mob. Besides, Bakes helping to hold the cup up at the end of the year is satisfaction enough.

We have a fantastic team that is about to welcome back some of it's stars. We need to refocus on the task this Sunday. If you want to vent your spleen, get along to the game and give it to one of the opposition supporters who will have the misfortune around you to open their mouth about that incident or the Milne one.

I thought it was ok to vent my spleen here. I thought this was a fan forum.

What a great competition it is when you have to accept something unjust because the consequences are going to be even worse if you don't. Amazing some are happy to accept this. When do we get our reward for being a good little club for all the things we have accepted over the years then???

I agree we have a fantastic team, and I don't think losing Bakes will slow us down too much, it is the principle of this.

And fight it all the way is what I wanted them to effing do. all we got was a little statement outlining the charges they would contest. Nothing from our president, nothing at all really.

Anyway, I will move on but it is just another example of a very, very flawed competition.

I totally 100% agree with you. I said earlier today that we need to start acting like a top club and this means not taking this absolute disgrace of a result.

We would never see the likes of Collingwood take this and accept it.

I think it was bad advice to plead guilty as you are limited in your ability to appeal.

It is same as confessing to murder and then appealing you cant do it.

I would hope that someone at the club will grow a set, and at least appeal the length of the sentence, as deduct the carry over points he was hit high to begin with.

ALL SAINTERS FANS WE HAVE TAKEN THIS NONSENSE FOR TOO LONG, STAND UP AND REACT GET ANGRY AND DO SOMETHING...PLEASE DONT SIT THERE AND TAKE THIS.

GO SAINTERS!

[Sainterman]

In regards Baker's alleged knowledge of Johnson having a broken hand the finding on Nikolic today is of real interest.

The summation on Nikolic was that a suspicion that Nikolic was passing information for a purpose was not proof that he was passing information for a purpose.

Simply, unless Nikolic admitted he was passing on information for the reasons alleged no one can know what was going on inside his brain - and he can not be found guilty on any suspician of what was going on in his brain.

Unless Baker admits he knew Johnson's hand was broken he has been found guilty on the suspician that he knew Johnson's hand was broken.

So 2 findings on the one day and these findings totally inconsistent with each other.

Victoria Racing's tribunal got it right.

The AFL tribunal got it wrong.

There should be an avenue of appeal to an independent judiciary on this matter alone - and then include the other matters on the basis of precedent and where precedent needs to evidence contact with the head specifically.

The AFL set up this "mickey mouse" system to keep matters from the Courts and they overtly intimidate clubs with retribution if they break ranks and look for a civil resolution.

Simply, the whole AFL MRP and tribunal process is a sham and will not stand up in any Court of Law if and when challenged.

There is also the severity of action(s) which did not result in any need for attention from the training or medical staff, the impact of the penalty(ies) commensurate to the severity of the action(s) and the resultant restraint of trade courtesy of the penalty(ies) handed down.

Interim Orders will allow Baker to play out the season - and throw the AFL's MRP and Tribunal system into chaos forcing the AFL to revert (correctly) to a Court of Law because restraint of trade is an issue.

There is also the matter of "trial by media" which has occurred in this instance including by describing the match as vicious etc. etc., which it was not - in my view at least.

In my view it was simply wet weather, accountable footy.

What Baker did has always been going on.

I well recall a full back by the name of John Abley at Port Adelaide who got up to every distracting trick in the book no matter that the ball was at the other end of the ground.

Pinching, punching, grabbing, treading on your toes in your face type stuff for the whole 100 minutes.

All Australian full back on 3 occasions at 3 succesive Carnivals - and arguably, on that record, the greatest full back of them all.

Put Steven Baker's tactics to shame!

The point I make is that nothing has changed - and nor should it.

If a deliberate act results in injury to a player or puts a player at risk of injury then that is another issue altogether.

I also disagree the "tagger" description.

Johnson played half forward and Baker played on him at half back.

Or don't you expect to have a full on opponent hell bent on minimising your influence on a match these days?

Have we reverted to a "kick it to me" code?

Even my grand-daughter at netball finishes games with pinch marks all over her!

Time for Demitriou to go.

Nicely put, but careful, we are better off accepting it all and moving on according to some.

[oneteam]

How is this the clubs fault. They appealed. To say you never support the players is a joke, remember the whole Farmer incident was under a different administration. Get of your high horses, it doesn't change anything. The fact is they have it in for Bakes and thats not St kildas fault.

If they had fought every charge and lost and Baker copped 12 weeks, would that have helped YOU sleep better at night? Had they spent thousands of dollars taking it to the supreme court and STILL the verdict stood, would that also have made YOU feel better? What about the team and the rest of this season? How was that going to help them? More unnecessary publicity that is not needed in a year where I believe we WILL take the flag. You can only put so much pressure on this playing group. They need to keep there eye on the ball, so to speak.

The AFL were determined to make a stance on this and have support from numerous quarters in the community. How did you think this was going to end once the decision was made by the MRP? Did you really think he was going to walk away with nothing? In the real world you are often required to make sacrifices for the greater good. This may just be one of those times.[/quote]

Exactly right.

Some dills on here get so worked up , and forget there are actual rules the tribunal follows.

Once the MRP made its decision, no point risking him for the finals. Crazy to not have him available if we need him in the finals.

He kills steve J when he is on him , and against other clubs, Steve j is the match winner often.


Sure, appeal! fight! just fight. Ignore whether challenging is the right decision. ignore the downside.

Thank god those people are not on the board. Or we would have players out for much longer.

It is now so rare for the mrp to be over turned in a challenge. But crazy saint supporters want to stick it right up em. No matter if it hurts the playing group and the club.

ridiculous to say we should have fought the 3 head high hits, and risk him not being there for the first final if needed.

[Thinline]

In regards Baker's alleged knowledge of Johnson having a broken hand the finding on Nikolic today is of real interest.

The summation on Nikolic was that a suspicion that Nikolic was passing information for a purpose was not proof that he was passing information for a purpose.

Simply, unless Nikolic admitted he was passing on information for the reasons alleged no one can know what was going on inside his brain - and he can not be found guilty on any suspician of what was going on in his brain.

Unless Baker admits he knew Johnson's hand was broken he has been found guilty on the suspician that he knew Johnson's hand was broken.

So 2 findings on the one day and these findings totally inconsistent with each other.

Victoria Racing's tribunal got it right.

The AFL tribunal got it wrong.

There should be an avenue of appeal to an independent judiciary on this matter alone - and then include the other matters on the basis of precedent and where precedent needs to evidence contact with the head specifically.

The AFL set up this "mickey mouse" system to keep matters from the Courts and they overtly intimidate clubs with retribution if they break ranks and look for a civil resolution.

Simply, the whole AFL MRP and tribunal process is a sham and will not stand up in any Court of Law if and when challenged.

There is also the severity of action(s) which did not result in any need for attention from the training or medical staff, the impact of the penalty(ies) commensurate to the severity of the action(s) and the resultant restraint of trade courtesy of the penalty(ies) handed down.

Interim Orders will allow Baker to play out the season - and throw the AFL's MRP and Tribunal system into chaos forcing the AFL to revert (correctly) to a Court of Law because restraint of trade is an issue.

There is also the matter of "trial by media" which has occurred in this instance including by describing the match as vicious etc. etc., which it was not - in my view at least.

In my view it was simply wet weather, accountable footy.

What Baker did has always been going on.

I well recall a full back by the name of John Abley at Port Adelaide who got up to every distracting trick in the book no matter that the ball was at the other end of the ground.

Pinching, punching, grabbing, treading on your toes in your face type stuff for the whole 100 minutes.

All Australian full back on 3 occasions at 3 succesive Carnivals - and arguably, on that record, the greatest full back of them all.

Put Steven Baker's tactics to shame!

The point I make is that nothing has changed - and nor should it.

If a deliberate act results in injury to a player or puts a player at risk of injury then that is another issue altogether.

I also disagree the "tagger" description.

Johnson played half forward and Baker played on him at half back.

Or don't you expect to have a full on opponent hell bent on minimising your influence on a match these days?

Have we reverted to a "kick it to me" code?

Even my grand-daughter at netball finishes games with pinch marks all over her!

Time for Demitriou to go.

Interesting stuff.

[St Michele]

Just heard Brad Hardy on 6Pr 'Charged with 4 parking fines and jailed for murder.'

Described it pretty well I think

[Verdun66]

I look forward to the Karma bus stopping right outside our door. The precedent is now there. Any excessive tagging of our stars I would expect the tribunal to come down like a ton of bricks.

Incidents like the attack on our players by Collingwood and North players before the bounce will be properly scrutinised, and appropraite penalties handed out.

(Of course I don't expect any of this to happen. We'll be hung out to dry as normal)