On Replacing Roo....some thoughts

[saintsRrising]

We can't. There is only one Roo. He plays the game quite differently to any other key forward and certainly to anyone we have on our list.

What the Saints will focus on is what can be done.
"Saints Footy" and workrate was the key to our 2009 success and will be the key also to having success in 2010 (hopefully greater success!!).
So even though Roo is a major loss there is no need to radically change most of our gameplan, but neither will it be a matter of just slotting in another player for Roo.

Our midfield and backline are both intact and if we play well here we can still control games.

What will be different on some occasions is how we enter the forward line. Roo will not be there and so it is important that others present. We still need marking targets up forward and our three small forwards in Milne, Schneider and Mini need a marking target to feed off. Gardi demonstrated that all too well in the last quarter against the Pies.

Now after next week the task will be eased somewhat as Kosi will return, and while Kosi is no Roo I am quite sure his game suffers due to:

* Being the second banana team-mates tend to look fair Roo more
* AND also being the second banana Kosi is conscious of trying to keep out of Roo's way.

Kosi will get more ball sent his way...and this is important in providing opportunities to Milne and Schneider from what is spilt....and to Mini's role of locking the ball in. Kosi will IMO be allowed to roam a bit further, and while no Roo this will assist him in staying engaged in the game as like many IMO when he plays as a pure FF his concentration seems to lapse easily.

So no Roo..to me means that we will get more out of Kosi. But will not generate the same number of leads, nor will he present as far and as wide.

Roo's constant presenting is important to how we often try and go forward as we switch the ball around till an opportunity presents, and Roo presented many opportunities.

Now any replacement for Roo will try and present..but no one in the AFL does it better than Roo and so his "replacement" will not be able to do so quarter in quarter out like Roo.

Stanley is currently our most likely option. BUT he is still a kid with zero games and an immature body. Expecting him to play CHF, the hardest position, in the AFL is a huge ask for many reasons including that he will have tough opponent as well as playing in a position that demands great attention to reading the play which comes from experience). His ability to deliver "Saints Footy" will weigh on the coaches minds....as will be expecting him to do this for a dozen games straight.

Now if it was me I would bring in Stanley this week....and would play him as a tall marking target...but would ensure that Gwilt and Goddard are currently rotating through CHF as well. So the role I would assign him would not be that of a true CHF, but rather more "Richo" or "Buddy"-Like (or rather as Buddy should be playing for at present he is being sucked into body contests and is a lesser player as a result) as a big half forward.

Apart from Stanley, Cahill is another kid who has been impressing well at Sandi. That would mean Kosi playing more as a CHF though.

"Saints Footy" is required and the younger players may struggle to deliver this for 4 quarters week in week out. For this reason Lyon may favour a more mature player and body. Do not look for Roo's output, but a player that can contest and contest again. Players rotating through CHF would not surprise. That may give Patto the edge, but he is also perhaps too similar to Kosi and not mobile enough. Ben?. I just do not see him as mobile enough to play CHF and especially with Kosi back. Maybe a one week "fix' againts Freo though.

For this week as well Gardi will have to push forward as well. But Gardi standing at FF for 4 quarters is not a good option due to his lack of mobility. From the week after Kosi will be back and so that problem is eased. Gardi will still push forward, but not as much as he will try to against Freo.

Now some are agitating for Sam Fisher or Gilbert to move forward.
I view our ability to restrict opposition teams to low scores as a cornerstone of our path to success. I would therefore seek to keep our backline as rock-solid as possible. In addition the two Sam's provide great drive out of our defence.

Goddard has now been freed up to play a utility midfielder role. He can and will play during games in a variety of roles and where the need is. A better BJ will go a long way to bridging the loss of Roo. Not by playing CHF, or even as a permanent forward, but by being the very damaging player that he is. I do however expect BJ to kick more goals in 2010 than he did in 2009.

Indeed looking at BJ's career his past year totals have been only 15, 11, 3, 10 6, 4, 6. I was actually quite surprised at these totals even allowing for him playing back so much.

He already has 7 in 2010.

The blossoming of Gwilt this year has been important in freeing up BJ.
Tweaking of our 2009 gameplan in 2010 has already in part set us up to deal with not having Roo. We have been making space better and have had more options running forward into space to kick goals...BJ, Peake, Gram. Goals from our mids is up and it is important that this be maintained.

Zac. Another option would be to move Zac forward. However he is sadly out of form. But the coaches might "eye-ball" him and set him the challenge.

Looking at the fixture..we don't play any teams that play two "big" forwards till the Cats in round13 and the Lions in Round 15. PA do have Westhoff and Tredera..but Westhoff can be handled by a smaller (to him) opponent.

For this reason I personally would be tempted to drop Zac to find some form and bring in Raph to play as a backman. This frees up BJ and Gwilt to rotate forward, but not play as permanent forwards.

A backline of:

Raph Fisher Gilbert (Geary)
Baker Blake Gwilt

looks to me to have the versatility to deal with most situations we will face and in setting up the same structures that we already employ, while still providing plenty of rebound and attack (remember that BJ the utility will rotate through).

Zac once he finds form can return by pushing someone out.

[iwantmeseats]

Good read. I think Kosi is probably the best/worst example of anyone in the game who is called a "confidence player". With him becoming the main target, I think this will help him alot.

[StNoodles]

Kosi always seems to step up in Roo's absence.

I'd back him to do it again.

[SainterK]

Had Roo gone down last year, I think I would of been worried. I honestly think it would of had the capacity to derail our season.

However given the lessons that I personally believe Ross has learned from the finals, I have already seen signs in 2010 of a team building towards not being so reliant Roo and improving both accuracy and the goal spread.

We have already seen more of a contribution of midfielders goals, accuracy has improved, Kosi has talked about improving his aerobic capacity, BJ and others have rotated through the forward line.

[St. Luke]

I like how Gilbert is shaping up. Great engine, mobile...but I'm not entirely familiar with his goal kicking accuracy. Could we afford to free him up?

[Dr Spaceman]

Had Roo gone down last year, I think I would of been worried. I honestly think it would of had the capacity to derail our season.

However given the lessons that I personally believe Ross has learned from the finals, I have already seen signs in 2010 of a team building towards not being so reliant Roo and improving both accuracy and the goal spread.

We have already seen more of a contribution of midfielders goals, accuracy has improved, Kosi has talked about improving his aerobic capacity, BJ and others have rotated through the forward line.

Agree, it's not so much that our game plan revolves around Roo, it's just that he's so bloody good he'd be an integral part of any game plan.

We're better with him of course but I reckon now we are still a team to be reckoned with even if he's not there.

We can't rely on one player to win us games or get us a flag. If we could we'd have heaps of Premierships in the bag from Lockett or from Harvey etc.

As good as Roo is, we are less reliant on one superstar now than at any other time in recent memory.

[Thinline]

I like how Gilbert is shaping up. Great engine, mobile...but I'm not entirely familiar with his goal kicking accuracy. Could we afford to free him up?

Nup. He's pretty much the best defender going around.

[saint75]

Had Roo gone down last year, I think I would of been worried. I honestly think it would of had the capacity to derail our season.

However given the lessons that I personally believe Ross has learned from the finals, I have already seen signs in 2010 of a team building towards not being so reliant Roo and improving both accuracy and the goal spread.

We have already seen more of a contribution of midfielders goals, accuracy has improved, Kosi has talked about improving his aerobic capacity, BJ and others have rotated through the forward line.

Agree, it's not so much that our game plan revolves around Roo, it's just that he's so bloody good he'd be an integral part of any game plan.

We're better with him of course but I reckon now we are still a team to be reckoned with even if he's not there.

We can't rely on one player to win us games or get us a flag. If we could we'd have heaps of Premierships in the bag from Lockett or from Harvey etc.

As good as Roo is, we are less reliant on one superstar now than at any other time in recent memory.

+1

Do we not remember those now infamous words from Ross Lyon to our players at the end of the 2008 season when we elected not to select Cousins?

"If you have to rely on 30+ player to win you a premiership, we have far more serious problems than I thought!"

Same applies to Roo going down. If we have to rely on Roo to win us a flag, this team will never win won. No one is irreplaceable. Hard to replace, but not irreplaceable.

Kosi will step up, so much so that Roo may have to fight to get his position back......

[St. Luke]

I like how Gilbert is shaping up. Great engine, mobile...but I'm not entirely familiar with his goal kicking accuracy. Could we afford to free him up?

Nup. He's pretty much the best defender going around.

Yeah yeah I know

[3:16]

As we all know, we won't replace Rooey, full-stop, however, you may find that our saints-footy may include going back to a more defensive mindset for this week especially this week until Kosi is back at least.

It could be a 8goal to 6goal game, like a few of our previous encounters with the Swans, if you get my drift. As long as it is in our favour, whilst it may be hard to watch and play in, if we take home the 4pts, that's all that we care about.

I will change again the following week with the big Kosi back!!!!!

[aussiejones]

Long term injury to Roo has brought into focus what had to happen after last year.....alternate strategies to Roo. Yes it was happening , but now it is vital. There have been good signs so far this year and greater contributions from Half forward and better accuracy.

[3:16]

Long term injury to Roo has brought into focus what had to happen after last year.....alternate strategies to Roo. Yes it was happening , but now it is vital. There have been good signs so far this year and greater contributions from Half forward and better accuracy.

And mid-field goals!!!!!

[busso mick]

Long term injury to Roo has brought into focus what had to happen after last year.....alternate strategies to Roo. Yes it was happening , but now it is vital. There have been good signs so far this year and greater contributions from Half forward and better accuracy.

And mid-field goals!!!!!

I agree. If you look at the Bulldogs all they really have is Hall as a key target and their midfield and crumbers make up most of the remainder of their score. So in that sense we are on level terms with them and will overtake them when Roos returns!

[saintsRrising]

As we all know, we won't replace Rooey, full-stop, however, you may find that our saints-footy may include going back to a more defensive mindset for this week especially this week until Kosi is back at least.

It could be a 8goal to 6goal game, like a few of our previous encounters with the Swans, if you get my drift. As long as it is in our favour, whilst it may be hard to watch and play in, if we take home the 4pts, that's all that we care about.

I will change again the following week with the big Kosi back!!!!!

Yes.

That is one of my points. We should not compromise our backline. It along with our midfield is one of our major strengths.

It is also where we often set up play from.


The game is not to kick a high score..the game is to score more than our opposition.

[TazzieSaintGirl83]

As we all know, we won't replace Rooey, full-stop, however, you may find that our saints-footy may include going back to a more defensive mindset for this week especially this week until Kosi is back at least.

It could be a 8goal to 6goal game, like a few of our previous encounters with the Swans, if you get my drift. As long as it is in our favour, whilst it may be hard to watch and play in, if we take home the 4pts, that's all that we care about.

I will change again the following week with the big Kosi back!!!!!

Yes.

That is one of my points. We should not compromise our backline. It along with our midfield is one of our major strengths.

It is also where we often set up play from.


The game is not to kick a high score..the game is to score more than our opposition.

+1 for the above posts.
I am prepared to sit through close games and heart stoppers. As long as we have the higher score at the last siren thats all I care about.

[meher baba]

Having both Kosi and Riewoldt absent this week makes it a special situation. It might be that the club chooses to give Stanley a go, but in place of Kosi rather than Riewoldt.

If he turns out to be an absolute sensation on AFL debut, then he can possibly stay in for the next game when Kosi comes back. However, I do not see him as a likely fill-in for Riewoldt over an extended period. Indeed, they might not even select him for Sunday.

I reckon that the initial fix for Riewoldt at CHF (such as the position is nowadays) is going to boil down to a choice between Gwilt and BJ.

By dint of his mobility, fitness and strength, Riewoldt creates many goal-scoring chances that nobody else could create. So, by definition, whoever replaces him will get far fewer opportunities and will therefore need to be a pretty eliable kick for goal. On that basis, I don't see Sams Fisher or Gilbert, Blake, Dawson or Raph as good options. None of them are proven, reliable kicks on goal at AFL level. BJ and Gwilt are.

Whoever replaces Riewoldt will also need to have a strong, hard body which can deal with the sort of treatment that AFL backlines dish out. BJ and Gwilt have this. I do not believe that any of Lynch, Stanley or Cahill have proven that they do yet.

I know Gwilt has never set the world on fire playing as a third forward, but I reckon that he might do a fair bit better as a designated CHF with no Riewoldt to compete against. So he'd be my first choice.

So, for Sunday, I would suggest

IN Stanley OUT Riewoldt.

And, for the following week (unless Stanley has an absolute blinder), I'd go

IN Kosi, OUT Stanley.

Raph is clearly in good form ATM, but - unless Peake has a couple of shockers in a row - he will probably have to wait for another spot to open up through injury.

[saintsRrising]

If he turns out to be an absolute sensation on AFL debut, then he can possibly stay in for the next game when Kosi comes back. However, I do not see him as a likely fill-in for Riewoldt over an extended period. Indeed, they might not even select him for Sunday.

.

If Stanley comes in, and that is certainly an if, I don't think the coaches will be looking for a "sensation", but rather if he is performing and achieving the role asigned.

Constant leading, even if not rewarded with passes, would be better reagrded than a couple of sensational "speccies".

As you say they could promote him as a one game look-see...

[Saintsfan]

Kosi always seems to step up in Roo's absence.

I'd back him to do it again.

Personally I would back the house, the cars and my life that he will do well.

[plugger66]

Kosi always seems to step up in Roo's absence.

I'd back him to do it again.

Personally I would back the house, the cars and my life that he will do well.

You obviously dont own a house or cars but surely you are still alive?

[dcstkfc]

Time for Kosi and the Tip-Rat to stand up!

[sunsaint]

The game is not to kick a high score..the game is to score more than our opposition.

yep the sydney squeeze will be the game plan for a while
the backline will stay the same as much as possible
this week I think RL will go with three ruckman McEvoy, King & Gardiner
Gardiner and McEvoy to maybe rest at FF and will go for a very fast mobile H/forward line
Freo are quick..
next week against PA Kosi will add a few options, but I still think he should stay round the goal square with a mobile H/forward line.
the reason for me thinking this way is how he used Stanley in the NAB. We all got a good look at him but come the H/A he was dropped straight away.

[saintsRrising]

You make some good points.

yep the sydney squeeze will be the game plan for a while

However...No..I think it will be more how we normally set up. However forward entry will not be as easy as with Roo.

When we play the Swans the defensive aspects are accentuated because the Swans are very good at controlling play as well. But their style of play is different to ours. Their stoppage play also really jams up things.

[sunsaint]

When we play the Swans the defensive aspects are accentuated because the Swans are very good at controlling play as well. But their style of play is different to ours. Their stoppage play also really jams up things.

I have been kicking this quandry round for a while now
I still reckon we play with a weight of numbers around the ball
and more telling we play for stoppages as they did/do.
(hence the reason why we get pinged for holding the ball a fair bit)
Now I know people dont like this comparison but when a pack forms watch the players, the intention is always to get a ball up.
The new trick being learned by Geelong and hawthorn lately is to actually wrench the ball our of the opposition hands.

[mohannair]

Also I think "Goose" would have proved more than handy. Last year he played forward & kicked bagfull for Sandy.

[borderbarry]

I think you will find that Raph is bought into the team in the next couple of weekls, maybe this week even.