ROO TO HAVE SURGERY!!

[BigMart]

are we saying the club never makes mistakes with players rehab???

thats right you must believe, back and support every thing StK...trust people, don't be cynical....our history of success demands this

[fingers]

This won't be as big a problem as everyone thinks. Yes we will miss him. How could we not. But even Shane Crawford commented on the Sunday footy show that the whole plan for the Saints and what wins them games is the structure.

We are a machine and we will replace this important part with another one. Maybe not as good but we have options. BJ, Fisher, Gilbert, Gwilt, Gardiner will all rotate through the forward line.

We will be ok. It's why we play the way we play.

[Saintsfan]

This sounds like 2004/2005 all over again

'When (insert gun player(s)) return we will be sweet'

That turned out well

[saintsRrising]

Oddly, I don't think this is such a huge problem.

I actually do think this is a blessing in disguise.


.

Well I would not quite call it a blessing.

But yes I agree with the essence of your post.

We get to trial other forward set-ups. Other players will get their chance and the team gets used to using other scoring paths.

This can only stand us in good stead come the finals.

[Thinline]

HEALY just quoted 16 weeks... F*** @@@@@@@

If its 12 weeks we are gonna feel this big time.

Everyone suggesting we will just beat sides without Riewoldt is dreaming.

It brings our fwd line right back to the pack, changes our structure performance in that while we may plonk another big body there their success rate will not be that of Riewoldt....

Still the bigger picture is finals - whatever it take get him right and pray we have enough games to get some run/form into him before the main stuff....cause imo we will not win it without him (you dont just lose the best player in the game and not feel it...)

You are as soft as hot butter!

What contribution did Roo make on Fri night? Pretty much diddly. We still beat an apparent contender pretty comfortbly in the end. Why? Because we have a structure that is ingrained, disciplined hardarse players who never give up, and a top ten or twelve players that are the envy of every club because of their ruthless and unending committment.

So quit the doom and gloom, bud. Smell the roses.

[Saintsfan]

HEALY just quoted 16 weeks... F*** @@@@@@@

If its 12 weeks we are gonna feel this big time.

Everyone suggesting we will just beat sides without Riewoldt is dreaming.

It brings our fwd line right back to the pack, changes our structure performance in that while we may plonk another big body there their success rate will not be that of Riewoldt....

Still the bigger picture is finals - whatever it take get him right and pray we have enough games to get some run/form into him before the main stuff....cause imo we will not win it without him (you dont just lose the best player in the game and not feel it...)

You are as soft as hot butter!

What contribution did Roo make on Fri night? Pretty much diddly. We still beat an apparent contender pretty comfortbly in the end. Why? Because we have a structure that is ingrained, disciplined hardarse players who never give up, and a top ten or twelve players that are the envy of every club because of their ruthless and unending committment.

So quit the doom and gloom, bud. Smell the roses.

But Collingwood are not a contender. That is the issue.

Geelong and possibly Footscray and Hawthorn are contenders.

All we need is one of those teams to beat us in a prelim or a gf and its all gone to waste again.

[rodgerfox]

This won't be as big a problem as everyone thinks. Yes we will miss him. How could we not. But even Shane Crawford commented on the Sunday footy show that the whole plan for the Saints and what wins them games is the structure.

We are a machine and we will replace this important part with another one. Maybe not as good but we have options. BJ, Fisher, Gilbert, Gwilt, Gardiner will all rotate through the forward line.

We will be ok. It's why we play the way we play.

I actually think the biggest impact will be on the 'structure' (I really think if you asked 1000 footy followers what that term actually means 999 wouldn't know).

By suggesting our structure will hold up, suggests someone else will take on Roo's role in our structure.

If we try to do this, then we will literally be without the comp's best player and naturally will miss him sorely. No one can play his role like he does.

However if we alter our structure due to him not being there (like Friday night's last quarter), and rely on our discipline, team ethos, fitness, desire and the rest of our gun players then we'll minimise the impact of one player not being out on the ground.

[Thinline]

HEALY just quoted 16 weeks... F*** @@@@@@@

If its 12 weeks we are gonna feel this big time.

Everyone suggesting we will just beat sides without Riewoldt is dreaming.

It brings our fwd line right back to the pack, changes our structure performance in that while we may plonk another big body there their success rate will not be that of Riewoldt....

Still the bigger picture is finals - whatever it take get him right and pray we have enough games to get some run/form into him before the main stuff....cause imo we will not win it without him (you dont just lose the best player in the game and not feel it...)

You are as soft as hot butter!

What contribution did Roo make on Fri night? Pretty much diddly. We still beat an apparent contender pretty comfortbly in the end. Why? Because we have a structure that is ingrained, disciplined hardarse players who never give up, and a top ten or twelve players that are the envy of every club because of their ruthless and unending committment.

So quit the doom and gloom, bud. Smell the roses.

But Collingwood are not a contender. That is the issue.

Geelong and possibly Footscray and Hawthorn are contenders.

All we need is one of those teams to beat us in a prelim or a gf and its all gone to waste again.

Do you want a tissue?

Fair dinkum.

[58ter]

last i saw Nick he had 2 arms 2 legs ie human.
look at Ottens last year came back fit and well, clarke keating in previous brisbane teams. we only need to finish 4th or better thats only 12 games out of the next 19. Can't wait to see our players and coaching staff meet ths challange

[rodgerfox]

This sounds like 2004/2005 all over again

'When (insert gun player(s)) return we will be sweet'

That turned out well

I don't think it's anything like 2004/2005.

2004 most were available - we just weren't good enough.

2005 we missed 6-8 of our 22 in the Prelim.


Not one dude for 6-10 weeks at the start of the year.

[Thinline]

last i saw Nick he had 2 arms 2 legs ie human.
look at Ottens last year came back fit and well, clarke keating in previous brisbane teams. we only need to finish 4th or better thats only 12 games out of the next 19. Can't wait to see our players and coaching staff meet ths challange

You bet.

[Saintsfan]

HEALY just quoted 16 weeks... F*** @@@@@@@

If its 12 weeks we are gonna feel this big time.

Everyone suggesting we will just beat sides without Riewoldt is dreaming.

It brings our fwd line right back to the pack, changes our structure performance in that while we may plonk another big body there their success rate will not be that of Riewoldt....

Still the bigger picture is finals - whatever it take get him right and pray we have enough games to get some run/form into him before the main stuff....cause imo we will not win it without him (you dont just lose the best player in the game and not feel it...)

You are as soft as hot butter!

What contribution did Roo make on Fri night? Pretty much diddly. We still beat an apparent contender pretty comfortbly in the end. Why? Because we have a structure that is ingrained, disciplined hardarse players who never give up, and a top ten or twelve players that are the envy of every club because of their ruthless and unending committment.

So quit the doom and gloom, bud. Smell the roses.

But Collingwood are not a contender. That is the issue.

Geelong and possibly Footscray and Hawthorn are contenders.

All we need is one of those teams to beat us in a prelim or a gf and its all gone to waste again.

Do you want a tissue?

Fair dinkum.

I'm sorry but...what?

You are attempting to put a spin on something here...probably to make yourself feel better that Nick Reiwoldt is not going to be playing for 10 weeks.

What is this structure? or structures? it seems to be just a media word that players mentioned repeatedly during presser's just to brush off questions.

They can be hardarse all they want but if they have nobody to kick to what is the use in being hardarse? Kosi should do the job however what if he doesn't? We will not win a huge amount of games only kicking 9 goals per match.

But sure, I will go back to spinning this into a positive that we get to try new things with new players that will be useless come a Preliminary Final or Grand Final as they won't be playing.

[Thinline]

For answer re structure go watch a few games rather that Roo highlights reels.

And quit sooking.

Seriously. You're prob a great guy and I'm sorry for slinging mud at you, but mate we've got a real good list, we have to cope, and we will.

[rodgerfox]

They can be hardarse all they want but if they have nobody to kick to what is the use in being hardarse? Kosi should do the job however what if he doesn't? We will not win a huge amount of games only kicking 9 goals per match.

Maybe not 9.

But we can still win plenty of games by kicking 11 or 12. That's the beauty of where the team is now at.

[Saintsfan]

They can be hardarse all they want but if they have nobody to kick to what is the use in being hardarse? Kosi should do the job however what if he doesn't? We will not win a huge amount of games only kicking 9 goals per match.

Maybe not 9.

But we can still win plenty of games by kicking 11 or 12. That's the beauty of where the team is now at.

Welcome to 2007 style Ross Lyon lockdown football....except now we know how to play it

[maverick]

Oddly, I don't think this is such a huge problem.

I actually do think this is a blessing in disguise.


I know for the diehards, winning every week so you don't cop shiit from your mates is very important. But the reality is, we only need to win enough to make the top 4.
Ideally, enough to make the top 2 - but with Adelaide, Port, West Coast etc. being reeky this year the top 2 most likely won't be that big a deal to us.

We won 20 games last year, but in the end it just didn't matter. We played 4th. So if we finished 4th - same scenario.

Anyway, he'll be back this season.

He'll be back for the finals, and fit by then. No niggles, no moon boots, no helicopters circling Moorabbin trying to suss out if his knee is really cactus or not.

Put it this way, if he does have any niggles they can clean them up too whilst he's under.


The other thing, like it or not, we are reliant on him. But, credit to the coach - I don't actually think it's because we have to be.

We were pretty average on Friday night I thought against a plodding team without one of their best players and no forward line. Gutsy and tough, but not brilliant by any stretch.
I wouldn't at all be surprised if Collingwood missed the 8.

We actually looked better when Roo went off. We can score without him, but I just don't think we try to score without him necessarily. I think we figure 'well he's there, so why not use him'.

Cause when he goes off the ground altogether, we actually look very coherent.
When he's on the ground and quiet, we look average.


So, this is a blessing.

What we need Roo to be for us to win the flag, is to play a role. Not the role.
When he comes back, we'll be settled and will have luxury of slotting the best player in the comp back in to add to the team - not be the team.

We only need to win 11 more games to finish top 4. That's 58% of games.

If we need one guy to win 58% of our remaining games, then so be it. We are what we are.

But I'd be very surprised if that's what we are.

I agree with this 100%, good post.
The whole point of our structure is the way its played and everyone plays their role, one player no matter how good should not break it down. In the biggest games such as finals and the Cats etc this will hamper us significantly, but not make it mission impossible.

[plugger66]

How anyone thinks losing a player for a heap of the season with no guarantee of him playing again this season is a blessing is beyond me. Obviously we cant do anything about it but there is absolutely no positive in this at all for this season. maybe will help in the future but surely for us it is all about this season.

[maverick]

This won't be as big a problem as everyone thinks. Yes we will miss him. How could we not. But even Shane Crawford commented on the Sunday footy show that the whole plan for the Saints and what wins them games is the structure.

We are a machine and we will replace this important part with another one. Maybe not as good but we have options. BJ, Fisher, Gilbert, Gwilt, Gardiner will all rotate through the forward line.

We will be ok. It's why we play the way we play.

I actually think the biggest impact will be on the 'structure' (I really think if you asked 1000 footy followers what that term actually means 999 wouldn't know).

By suggesting our structure will hold up, suggests someone else will take on Roo's role in our structure.

If we try to do this, then we will literally be without the comp's best player and naturally will miss him sorely. No one can play his role like he does.

However if we alter our structure due to him not being there (like Friday night's last quarter), and rely on our discipline, team ethos, fitness, desire and the rest of our gun players then we'll minimise the impact of one player not being out on the ground.

I think of our structure in a different sense, more of a style and way we go about it. As I think you allude to, we will need to change our forward set up (structure if you will) but not the team structure nor the style of footy.

I think Lyon was on record encouraging our mids to go forward and kick more goals as it was, this will only help that as well.

Given we have had Sam Fisher out for some length of time, he is one that could go forward IMO without affecting our structure too much. Will ultimately improve both ends of the ground, with regards to our reliance.

[maverick]

How anyone thinks losing a player for a heap of the season with no guarantee of him playing again this season is a blessing is beyond me. Obviously we cant do anything about it but there is absolutely no positive in this at all for this season. maybe will help in the future but surely for us it is all about this season.

Correct and the finals are part of this season.
Yes we need to get there, blessing may be a bit strong, but the concept has merit.

There are too many in the team that don't think kicking goals are part of their responsibilities. This will change.

[Leo.J]

Oddly, I don't think this is such a huge problem.

I actually do think this is a blessing in disguise.


I know for the diehards, winning every week so you don't cop shiit from your mates is very important. But the reality is, we only need to win enough to make the top 4.
Ideally, enough to make the top 2 - but with Adelaide, Port, West Coast etc. being reeky this year the top 2 most likely won't be that big a deal to us.

We won 20 games last year, but in the end it just didn't matter. We played 4th. So if we finished 4th - same scenario.

Anyway, he'll be back this season.

He'll be back for the finals, and fit by then. No niggles, no moon boots, no helicopters circling Moorabbin trying to suss out if his knee is really cactus or not.

Put it this way, if he does have any niggles they can clean them up too whilst he's under.


The other thing, like it or not, we are reliant on him. But, credit to the coach - I don't actually think it's because we have to be.

We were pretty average on Friday night I thought against a plodding team without one of their best players and no forward line. Gutsy and tough, but not brilliant by any stretch.
I wouldn't at all be surprised if Collingwood missed the 8.

We actually looked better when Roo went off. We can score without him, but I just don't think we try to score without him necessarily. I think we figure 'well he's there, so why not use him'.

Cause when he goes off the ground altogether, we actually look very coherent.
When he's on the ground and quiet, we look average.


So, this is a blessing.

What we need Roo to be for us to win the flag, is to play a role. Not the role.
When he comes back, we'll be settled and will have luxury of slotting the best player in the comp back in to add to the team - not be the team.

We only need to win 11 more games to finish top 4. That's 58% of games.

If we need one guy to win 58% of our remaining games, then so be it. We are what we are.

But I'd be very surprised if that's what we are.

Could not of put it better myself RF.

[ace]

How anyone thinks losing a player for a heap of the season with no guarantee of him playing again this season is a blessing is beyond me. Obviously we cant do anything about it but there is absolutely no positive in this at all for this season. maybe will help in the future but surely for us it is all about this season.

Losing Riewoldt is definitely a major disaster, but that does not mean that we should break down and cry.

When ever you suffer a disadvantage, you should immediately examine how you can take advantage of the circumstances.
These circumstance allow the club to try other players in the team and to develop structures and alternate game plans.
Game plans that can be used in the finals if Riewoldt, is being swamped as occured in last years Grand Final.
The loss of Riewoldt can still be used to improve the club's chances of winning this year's premiership.

I call it taking advantage of disadvantage.

[plugger66]

How anyone thinks losing a player for a heap of the season with no guarantee of him playing again this season is a blessing is beyond me. Obviously we cant do anything about it but there is absolutely no positive in this at all for this season. maybe will help in the future but surely for us it is all about this season.

Losing Riewoldt is definitely a major disaster, but that does not mean that we should break down and cry.

When ever you suffer a disadvantage, you should immediately examine how you can take advantage of the circumstances.
These circumstance allow the club to try other players in the team and to develop structures and alternate game plans.
Game plans that can be used in the finals if Riewoldt, is being swamped as occured in last years Grand Final.
The loss of Riewoldt can still be used to improve the club's chances of winning this year's premiership.

I call it taking advantage of disadvantage.

I agree but it could never be called a positive. As I said we obviously have no choice.

[linz]

Riewoldt is one player of 22 so I agree we'll lose a couple more than we would've but we should still make top 4.

I'm assuming we'll lose to Geelong and Footscray. We know we can beat Collingwood without him.

So who else is there right now who can beat us without Roo? I'm GUESSING we're a 4 goal LESS efficient side per week without Roo.

What other sides got within breathing distance of us last year except for North & Essendon who also beat us?

It could turn out to be advantageous as we can now work out other avenues to goal.

When Roo returns we'll be far LESS one dimensional.

When Roo returns, (with FULL fitness) I believe we will be a 6 goal MORE efficient side as our other avenues to goal mindset will make us far less predictable. 12 extra points in last years GF would've been handy for us.

One for the optimists among us.

[Saintsfan]

How anyone thinks losing a player for a heap of the season with no guarantee of him playing again this season is a blessing is beyond me. Obviously we cant do anything about it but there is absolutely no positive in this at all for this season. maybe will help in the future but surely for us it is all about this season.

Well we are not going to win the flag in 5 years time so why not now...oh wait this is super forward planning for the future because we are constantly preparing for the future despite our bench chance in a zillion years is now...

[ace]

How anyone thinks losing a player for a heap of the season with no guarantee of him playing again this season is a blessing is beyond me. Obviously we cant do anything about it but there is absolutely no positive in this at all for this season. maybe will help in the future but surely for us it is all about this season.

Losing Riewoldt is definitely a major disaster, but that does not mean that we should break down and cry.

When ever you suffer a disadvantage, you should immediately examine how you can take advantage of the circumstances.
These circumstance allow the club to try other players in the team and to develop structures and alternate game plans.
Game plans that can be used in the finals if Riewoldt, is being swamped as occured in last years Grand Final.
The loss of Riewoldt can still be used to improve the club's chances of winning this year's premiership.

I call it taking advantage of disadvantage.

I agree but it could never be called a positive. As I said we obviously have no choice.

It is not a postiive yet but it can still be turned into a postive.

It is like losing your job - not a positive.
Using your unemployment the find a better, more rewarding and better paid job - turned into a positive.
It is all in how you react to disadvantage.