Lovett lodges notice of grievance with club

[GrumpyOne]

So it had nothing to do with his rape charge........ Yeah right.

not the charge although many will say that

it was the events around his behaviour and actions on the night in question, this was stated at the time of the club rejecting grievance. ( not the alleged charge) but his responses on the night.

his failure to follow directions and course of action.

Fine line... glad I don't have to defend that action.

[saintbrat]

So it had nothing to do with his rape charge........ Yeah right.

not the charge although many will say that

it was the events around his behaviour and actions on the night in question, this was stated at the time of the club rejecting grievance. ( not the alleged charge) but his responses on the night.

his failure to follow directions and course of action.

Fine line... glad I don't have to defend that action.

yes fine line and glad Club have employment lawyer on board to assist.

[PJ]

Personally I think it should just read failure full stop, don't even bother qualifying it.

[Bernard Shakey]

He will end up getting nothing. Silly silly boy.

[bergsone]

He will end up getting nothing. Silly silly boy.

Hope you are right

BUT ?

[GrumpyOne]

He will end up getting nothing. Silly silly boy.

Hope you are right

BUT ?

Wasn't much of a choice Bern. He either gets nothing now or a faint chance of something later. What would you choose?

[Bernard Shakey]

He will end up getting nothing. Silly silly boy.

Hope you are right

BUT ?

Wasn't much of a choice Bern. He either gets nothing now or a faint chance of something later. What would you choose?

He could have take 350 large today, but either he or his legal team are being rather greedy. I would have taken the $350,000.00

[joffaboy]

He will end up getting nothing. Silly silly boy.

Hope you are right

BUT ?

Wasn't much of a choice Bern. He either gets nothing now or a faint chance of something later. What would you choose?

Sorry, have I missed something?

Why are people surmising that Lovett will now get nothing? I thought today was a deadlock and they needed to go back to the Greivance tribunal.

Why is he going to get nothing? Good result form the club, but it seems strange.

[joffaboy]

He will end up getting nothing. Silly silly boy.

Hope you are right

BUT ?

Wasn't much of a choice Bern. He either gets nothing now or a faint chance of something later. What would you choose?

He could have take 350 large today, but either he or his legal team are being rather greedy. I would have taken the $350,000.00

Sorry BS, I dont quite understand, are you saying his chances are blown? And why?

Again sorry, this isn't an inquisition, I just aren't up to speed on why he would miss out.

[plugger66]

He will end up getting nothing. Silly silly boy.

Hope you are right

BUT ?

Wasn't much of a choice Bern. He either gets nothing now or a faint chance of something later. What would you choose?

Sorry, have I missed something?

Why are people surmising that Lovett will now get nothing? I thought today was a deadlock and they needed to go back to the Greivance tribunal.

Why is he going to get nothing? Good result form the club, but it seems strange.

Totally agree. We arent getting out of it for nothing even if we should.

[saintslegendLH]

so does this mean lovett is trying to force the clubs hand to let him back in the fold and let him train?? or essentially just seeking a payout for his "troubles"

Lovvet wil never train or play or attend any St.kilda functions because he allegedly sexually assulted one of Gram's good friends, gram clearly said to the club, its me or lovvett. even if lovvett was found not guilty the club wont let him in because gram is valued higher than he is. 2ndly lovett is only filieing to be payed out a sum of cash higher than his three year payment. meaning that because " he is under extreme stress to be fired is against some stupid rule aparently. thats why his lawyers are saying " but that wil fall through imo. i imagine that the club may have to pay out his 3 year contract though

[ace]

Lose his trial and Lovett gets nothing.
Get acquitted and he gets 2 million.
Damages for his cancelled contract plus damages to future earnings.

If he believes he will get convicted he should take what St Kilda offers now.
If he believes he will be acquitted he will not settle until after his trail.

[Solar]

Lose his trial and Lovett gets nothing.
Get acquitted and he gets 2 million.
Damages for his cancelled contract plus damages to future earnings.

If he believes he will get convicted he should take what St Kilda offers now.
If he believes he will be acquitted he will not settle until after his trail.

I actually back the club in that the outcome of the trial with have no baring on the payout. Basically the idea of today was to stop it going further, similar to someone saying they will sue a company and the company settles to stop the press. But it sounds like lovett wanted a large amount and the saints did not budge. Good on them

[Unforgiven]

Yeah thats how I interpreted it as well. Hutchy on the footy show seemed to be under the impression that the saints would play 'hard ball' and that this wasn't going to be an easy process for Lovett. I am happy with the clubs actions thus far.

[The OtherThommo]

We'll cop somewhere between 1 and 2 years salary as a settlement - that's the way this stuff works. We have one interest - to end it.

[ace]

Lovett will never play for St Kilda regardless of the outcome of the trial.
Even if he was proved to be a saint on the night in question, there is too much water under the bridge for Lovett to ever want to play for St Kilda.

Therefore all we can hope for is the club gets out of this situation at minimum cost.

[The OtherThommo]

And, therein lies the basis of negotiation.

[plugger66]

"Are you actually serious. Comparing Hurley with what AL could be charged with is a disgrace. You have no idea. Sexual assult on a woman is one of the worst crimes that can happen. No wonder you only come on late at night when no one can challenge such a stupid statement." From Plugger 66.

Cop this you bonehead, yes, I am claiming that, exactly. Ever been bashed senseless for no reason? Ever spent months being afraid in public places? Do you have any understanding that a crime of violence is a crime of violence, irrespective of your gender or race. THAT'S WHAT CRIMES OF VIOLENCE ARE, you ignorant tosser.

Why have women's movements spent so long trying to ensure sexual assualt is treated as PRECISELY a crime of violence, and not a sexual crime? Why don't you spend a bit of time and actually keep up.

And, I'll tell you why I only come on here late at night - because when I read what you put forward when I pop in during the day, it bores me shyteless. I need a decent night out, and a belly full of grog, to even respond to the garbage you spit out 24/7.

You hold no superior position to lecture on crimes of violence. They are what they are - heinous, horrid, terrifying for every victim.

And, your claims that one type is worse than another just confirms to me what little you really know. And, when you know little, you really should STFU.

I suggest you take your superior knowhow to the Court system and help them understand how the cab driver dragged out of his cab by Hurley, bashed until he went horizontal, and then kicked in the head, is not as worthy a victim as the woman who claims to have been sexually assualted by Lovett.

I was going to add, how you make me laugh and vomit at the same time, but I figured that might be over the top.

Until 2 a.m. next week, eh?

Apparently being charged with rape is no more serious than what Hurley did. Very interesting.

[skeptic]

working in the psychiatric field and having been the victim of a serious physical assualt myself (at work), i would say that I got over it in a few months.
The victims i see that have been sexually assualted stay traumatised for years upon years upon years. Some of them never get over it.

[ausfatcat]

everyone deals with things differently takes different amount of time to get over things. Someone may take a week to get over something like this and anther 20 years, making judgements on how someone can get over things without knowing that person is of no benefit.

Skeptic your point of view within your field you would tend to see only the long term or more seriously effected people, you wouldn't see the people that recover fairly quickly, it's the nature of your job.

I am not trying to say it is a trivial matter I to have seen the efffects of this stuff can have on people just that we don't know what effect it is having on this particular person.

I work in a similar field as skeptic and I to have been seriously assaulted (hospitalised) years ago and felt the effects mentally for about a month, but my house was robbed 12 months ago and still feal the effects now, different things effect different people differently.

[Bernard Shakey]

For those who don't think he will get nothing, from today's Age.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/s ... -q49o.html

"The next step will be to refer the grievance immediately to the grievance tribunal and we intend to do that immediately on Monday morning," said Lovett's solicitor, Derek Humphery-Smith of Lander & Rogers.

The grievance tribunal will decide whether Lovett was lawfully sacked.

If so, St Kilda will not be required to pay him anything. If not, it will be required to pay compensation of all or part of his three year, $1-million contract.

[Eastern]

Could it be that Lovett's Lawyers (Humpty Dumpty & Co) feel that they NEED to keep fighting a LOSING BATTLE because "If he gets NOTHING, they get NOTHING? !!

[skeptic]

Skeptic your point of view within your field you would tend to see only the long term or more seriously effected people, you wouldn't see the people that recover fairly quickly, it's the nature of your job.

Well I kind of do in that not all ppl that come in contact with psych services with a history of SA are coming in for reasons relating to the SA, and you're right in that ppl recover differently from different things.

I'm just saying that in my experience, an assualt of a sexual nature is generally more traumatic than a physical assualt... obviously thats a generalisation and it varies on extremes/extent of the assualt + there are exceptions and so forth.

I'm interested Ausfacat, in what area of the field do you work? I'm not asking for specifics, but i'm an IPU person myself... Sounds like you may be with an MST or Cat perhaps?

[ausfatcat]

Totally agree in my experience people find it more traumatic


I have worked at the disability forensics centre (basicly full of psych and young offenders with ID's) and a lot of people with dual diagnosis but that was a fair while ago now, have had a bit to do with non-clinical side of psych as well a few years back. But I have mainly worked with ID people in recent times...


Was looking at going down the physc path full time and in a more professional way (ie go back to school) but decided the current work load and the current pay and the current management in my area in the psych field it was just not a smart idea. I am/was involved with HACSU (do you know what I am talking about) a bit so know a fair few psych people, and whats been going on in the field over the last few years.


edit: forgot I worked at Alfred hospital psych unit ten years ago

[Legendary]

Whether or not Lovett is found guilty of rape is irrelevant to his contractual situation and the mediation process underway.

Lovett's dismissal occured prior to the rape charge being brought before court, so it is not revelant. It cannot be argued that a guilty finding of rape has any bearing on whether Lovett was fairly dimissed.

St Kilda must prove that Lovett has brough the club into disrepute, and has failed to meet the standards outlined in his employment contract.

If they can do that (and my advice is that St Kilda's legal position is VERY strong), then not only will Lovett get nothing from the Saints, he will have to pay our legal costs. Big money for a guy no longer playing AFL football.

If Lovett brings an action against St Kilda for unfair dismissal, it is completely separate to and in no way related to his charge of one count of rape.


Basically Lovett will cave in at some point prior to this matter ending up in the Supreme Court. If it does end up in court, the Saints will win and escape without needing to pay a cent. Lovett probably knows this, but it's all part of the game.

It's just a question of when Lovett's lawyers cave in and decide to come to the party.

Thing of it as holding a straight flush and knowing your opponent has a pair of five's, but letting him play out his bluff as long as possible.