Next finals - lessons our selectors hopefully have learnt

[samoht]

We shouldn't be blaming any particular small forward -it's just that 3 small forwards don't work in the high pressure finals games.

That became crystal clear this year.

Small forwards find the finals tough going - you don't exacerbate the problem by taking 3 small forwards - that's a no no !

3 small forwards - that's half our forward line !!

Our 3 small forwards (Mcqualter, Schneider and Milne) kicked 4 goals between them over the 3 finals... that's about 1 goal/final between 3 players.

Whereas Riewoldt maintained his average - even with his sore knee and adductor and kicked 10 goals on his own in the 3 finals and averaged over 3 goals/final's game on his own as a CHF.

So the lesson is - take 1 small only into final games- just choose 1 for balance.

i know we don't have ready made medium forwards - but for forward line balance we need 2 medium players to replace our 2 small forwards next year and whoever they may be they'll certainly do better than the 2 smalls they replace - as our forward line will be able to withstand the physical pressure better for starters and also to dish some out.

[Milton66]

let's worry about round 1 and see who's available come finals time.

[SainterK]

Well Milton, you officially party pooped this thread huh?

[saint66au]

Wasnt the players we selected..its what they did with the ball time and again when given the chance to get very gettable goals

[plugger66]

Well Milton, you officially party pooped this thread huh?

I reackon it was wrecked when the poster wanted one small forward for balance when the Cats won a flag this year with 3 small forwards for balance.

[St Fidelius]

Well Milton, you officially party pooped this thread huh?

I reackon it was wrecked when the poster wanted one small forward for balance when the Cats won a flag this year with 3 small forwards for balance.

Yep, one does wonder...

BTW

I wouldn't count Steve Johnson on two counts...

Played a shyte, and @ 189cm I really don't class him as a small forward..

But in saying that, small was the way to go considering the conditions in the GF, just what the OP wanted in our forward setup, with that weather forecast is anyone's guess

[plugger66]

Well Milton, you officially party pooped this thread huh?

I reackon it was wrecked when the poster wanted one small forward for balance when the Cats won a flag this year with 3 small forwards for balance.

Yep, one does wonder...

BTW

I wouldn't count Steve Johnson on two counts...

Played a shyte, and @ 189cm I really don't class him as a small forward..

But in saying that, small was the way to go considering the conditions in the GF, just what the OP wanted in our forward setup, with that weather forecast is anyone's guess

Not counting him. Chapman Varcoe and Byrnes. Chapman won the medal and Byrnes and Varcoe's last quarter was excellent.

[Saintersss]

Kosi didn't have a good final series, does that mean 2 big forwards don't work well?

Talk about overeacting!

Why is everyone making so many dramatic changes when we were 20-2 in the H&A season and 1 goal off a premiership.

Maybe they should just work on their goalkicking instead?

[bigcarl]

Kosi didn't have a good final series, does that mean 2 big forwards don't work well?

Talk about overeacting!

Why is everyone making so many dramatic changes when we were 20-2 in the H&A season and 1 goal off a premiership.

Maybe they should just work on their goalkicking instead?

yes, good points well made. let's not throw the baby out with the bathwater.

i think we need to build on what we achieved in 2009, not obliterate it and start from scratch.

one change i would definitely make, though, is to find a third tall/medium forward who can kick goals as well as defend.

gwilt/dempster are good at locking the ball in but don't offer much in the way of goals and are generally ignored as targets.

the forwards apart from riewoldt had disappointing finals campaigns. he's our greatest strength, but our over-reliance on him under pressure is something we have to fix to win it.

[plugger66]

Kosi didn't have a good final series, does that mean 2 big forwards don't work well?

Talk about overeacting!

Why is everyone making so many dramatic changes when we were 20-2 in the H&A season and 1 goal off a premiership.

Maybe they should just work on their goalkicking instead?

yes, good points well made. let's not throw the baby out with the bathwater.

i think we need to build on what we achieved in 2009, not obliterate it and start from scratch.

one change i would definitely make, though, is to find a third tall/medium forward who can kick goals as well as defend.

gwilt/dempster are good at locking the ball in but don't offer much in the way of goals and are generally ignored as targets.

Dont think the third tall has had to much influence on the last few flag winners. Overated but wasnt isnt overated is kicking well for goals. Just ask the last 2 sides that have lost the flag.

[bigcarl]

Dont think the third tall has had to much influence on the last few flag winners. Overated but wasnt isnt overated is kicking well for goals. Just ask the last 2 sides that have lost the flag.

what i'm really talking about here is finding someone else, apart from riewoldt, who can stand up and kick goals under extreme pressure.

in the finals no-one else really did.

goddard could do it, but is probably going to be needed elsewhere.

[xander]

We shouldn't be blaming any particular small forward -it's just that 3 small forwards don't work in the high pressure finals games.

That became crystal clear this year.

Small forwards find the finals tough going - you don't exacerbate the problem by taking 3 small forwards - that's a no no !

3 small forwards - that's half our forward line !!

Our 3 small forwards (Mcqualter, Schneider and Milne) kicked 4 goals between them over the 3 finals... that's about 1 goal/final between 3 players.

Whereas Riewoldt maintained his average - even with his sore knee and adductor and kicked 10 goals on his own in the 3 finals and averaged over 3 goals/final's game on his own as a CHF.

So the lesson is - take 1 small only into final games- just choose 1 for balance.

i know we don't have ready made medium forwards - but for forward line balance we need 2 medium players to replace our 2 small forwards next year and whoever they may be they'll certainly do better than the 2 smalls they replace - as our forward line will be able to withstand the physical pressure better for starters and also to dish some out.

Firstly they kicked 8 goals over 3 games not 4. Secondly where are we going to get these 2 medium forwards that are going to play as good as they do. Dempster was our medium in the GF and he only got 5 touches compared to the smalls who all got 10 or over. Thirdly are you suggesting we play 3 smalls during h&a and then suddenly omit 2 of them when finals come around? Also those 3 players kicked around 100 goals between them over the season, about a quarter of our overall goals. Why would we want to get rid of that?

[plugger66]

We shouldn't be blaming any particular small forward -it's just that 3 small forwards don't work in the high pressure finals games.

That became crystal clear this year.

Small forwards find the finals tough going - you don't exacerbate the problem by taking 3 small forwards - that's a no no !

3 small forwards - that's half our forward line !!

Our 3 small forwards (Mcqualter, Schneider and Milne) kicked 4 goals between them over the 3 finals... that's about 1 goal/final between 3 players.

Whereas Riewoldt maintained his average - even with his sore knee and adductor and kicked 10 goals on his own in the 3 finals and averaged over 3 goals/final's game on his own as a CHF.

So the lesson is - take 1 small only into final games- just choose 1 for balance.

i know we don't have ready made medium forwards - but for forward line balance we need 2 medium players to replace our 2 small forwards next year and whoever they may be they'll certainly do better than the 2 smalls they replace - as our forward line will be able to withstand the physical pressure better for starters and also to dish some out.

Firstly they kicked 8 goals over 3 games not 4. Secondly where are we going to get these 2 medium forwards that are going to play as good as they do. Dempster was our medium in the GF and he only got 5 touches compared to the smalls who all got 10 or over. Thirdly are you suggesting we play 3 smalls during h&a and then suddenly omit 2 of them when finals come around? Also those 3 players kicked around 100 goals between them over the season, about a quarter of our overall goals. Why would we want to get rid of that?

Because he doesnt understand footy.

[saintspremiers]

Milne can't play finals to save himself.

He is our H&A "specialist".

Ditch him come September!

[plugger66]

Milne can't play finals to save himself.

He is our H&A "specialist".

Ditch him come September!

Well that would make perfect sense. imagine he was dropped after the 11 goals against brisbane. By the way how was kosi's finals series ot Gardiner or King or a few others.

[saintspremiers]

Milne can't play finals to save himself.

He is our H&A "specialist".

Ditch him come September!

Well that would make perfect sense. imagine he was dropped after the 11 goals against brisbane. By the way how was kosi's finals series ot Gardiner or King or a few others.

Kosi and Gardy were shyte, correct.

Please remind me how finals games Milne has played and how many of them he has been up to his usual standard?

[plugger66]

Milne can't play finals to save himself.

He is our H&A "specialist".

Ditch him come September!

Well that would make perfect sense. imagine he was dropped after the 11 goals against brisbane. By the way how was kosi's finals series ot Gardiner or King or a few others.

Kosi and Gardy were shyte, correct.

Please remind me how finals games Milne has played and how many of them he has been up to his usual standard?

Not many at all but that comes with the position unless you sre a bigger guy like Chapman. not sure dropping a guy that plays all year to get you in the position to win a flag and then bring in someone who isnt good enough to play all year helps anyone. Either he doesnt play most of the year or you stick with him. I go the latter.

[To the top]

That is why the most obvious deficiency is being aired now - before the season has commenced.

Why have we traded for Lovett - and Peake?

And not relented with the requirements put before Ball - and the remainder of the players because the need to address deficiencies and improve skills is before every player?

I wonder what has been said to Milne in the face of such challenges being placed before every other player?

[SainterK]

Kosi didn't have a good final series, does that mean 2 big forwards don't work well?

Talk about overeacting!

Why is everyone making so many dramatic changes when we were 20-2 in the H&A season and 1 goal off a premiership.

Maybe they should just work on their goalkicking instead?

yes, good points well made. let's not throw the baby out with the bathwater.

i think we need to build on what we achieved in 2009, not obliterate it and start from scratch.

one change i would definitely make, though, is to find a third tall/medium forward who can kick goals as well as defend.

gwilt/dempster are good at locking the ball in but don't offer much in the way of goals and are generally ignored as targets.

the forwards apart from riewoldt had disappointing finals campaigns. he's our greatest strength, but our over-reliance on him under pressure is something we have to fix to win it.

Maybe they need to address the fact that someone like a Gwilt/Dempster is being ignored as a target?

[bigcarl]

Kosi didn't have a good final series, does that mean 2 big forwards don't work well?

Talk about overeacting!

Why is everyone making so many dramatic changes when we were 20-2 in the H&A season and 1 goal off a premiership.

Maybe they should just work on their goalkicking instead?

yes, good points well made. let's not throw the baby out with the bathwater.

i think we need to build on what we achieved in 2009, not obliterate it and start from scratch.

one change i would definitely make, though, is to find a third tall/medium forward who can kick goals as well as defend.

gwilt/dempster are good at locking the ball in but don't offer much in the way of goals and are generally ignored as targets.

the forwards apart from riewoldt had disappointing finals campaigns. he's our greatest strength, but our over-reliance on him under pressure is something we have to fix to win it.

Maybe they need to address the fact that someone like a Gwilt/Dempster is being ignored as a target?

Maybe they do. Or maybe we need a more dangerous offensive type in that position who can also defend.

[SainterK]

Kosi didn't have a good final series, does that mean 2 big forwards don't work well?

Talk about overeacting!

Why is everyone making so many dramatic changes when we were 20-2 in the H&A season and 1 goal off a premiership.

Maybe they should just work on their goalkicking instead?

yes, good points well made. let's not throw the baby out with the bathwater.

i think we need to build on what we achieved in 2009, not obliterate it and start from scratch.

one change i would definitely make, though, is to find a third tall/medium forward who can kick goals as well as defend.

gwilt/dempster are good at locking the ball in but don't offer much in the way of goals and are generally ignored as targets.

the forwards apart from riewoldt had disappointing finals campaigns. he's our greatest strength, but our over-reliance on him under pressure is something we have to fix to win it.

Maybe they need to address the fact that someone like a Gwilt/Dempster is being ignored as a target?

Maybe they do. Or maybe we need a more dangerous offensive type in that position who can also defend.

Still needs to get the delivery...

[bigcarl]

Still needs to get the delivery...

i take your point, but if you had the choice of giving it to goddard, just for example, or dempster, which one would you kick it to?

and which would be more likely to finish off with a goal?

[SydneySainter]

Kosi didn't have a good final series, does that mean 2 big forwards don't work well?

Talk about overeacting!

Why is everyone making so many dramatic changes when we were 20-2 in the H&A season and 1 goal off a premiership.

Maybe they should just work on their goalkicking instead?

Mostly agree, though am I the only one who thinks Kosi actually played a good game in the first final? Kicked two but could have been five, certainly had enough scoring shots, but that supports the point of working on goal kicking.

[SainterK]

Still needs to get the delivery...

i take your point, but if you had the choice of giving it to goddard, just for example, or dempster, which one would you kick it to?

and which would be more likely to finish off with a goal?

Gwilt

[bigcarl]

Still needs to get the delivery...

i take your point, but if you had the choice of giving it to goddard, just for example, or dempster, which one would you kick it to?

and which would be more likely to finish off with a goal?

Gwilt

good one