raph

spert · Post: # 835438Post **spert** » Mon 28 Sep 2009 10:49am

The team overall played a great pressure game, but whoever was playing on Chapman in the last quarter really stuffed up -Chapman had very little pressure when he got the ball for his goals..probably the easiest three goals he has had for a while. Raph was clearly having leg problems and couldn't run flat out, but his three bad turnovers early give me no confidence in his ability.

Con Gorozidis · Mon 28 Sep 2009 11:02am

bozza1980 wrote:
Con Gorozidis wrote:
saintjake wrote:i like him,
yes at the start he did some TERRIBLE things.
but i really am coming around to the big fella.
Ok so every media commentator and every other fan from every other club is wrong? saints fans see raph through thick rose tinted lenses.
Since when do we make desicions on our players based on what other clubs' supporters think?? Are you kidding me?? All year these same idiots told us we were overrated and no good, yet they have some idea about our players, spare me!!

Media other club supporters I don't care what anybody else thinks, Raph was a solid contributor yesterday. He has picked up the mantle of St Kilda whipping boy that Jason Blake was finally able to shake off this year. I'm glad for Blake but sorry for Raph and I'll be sorry for the bloke that inherits the mantle from Raph.

I don't have rose or any other coloured glasses, he is not our best player and he never will be, but he is in our best 22 and bleating about his mistakes until you blow a gasket isn't going to change this.

ok fine. lets just not win a flag ever then. suit yourself. i dont know what game u watching. but his tackling efforts were abysmal. so weak - watch the effort whn selwood kicks that goal. he let people run past him with no effort to stop them. just a flail of the arms and a dive to the turf. when he hurt his leg it was when he fell over by himself. he has NO speed. no intensity. no vision. no body strength. his only attribute is his long limbs which means he is good at getting in a spoil in or a smother.

but if we are after a flag. we need a better 22.

Thinline · Post: # 835471Post **Thinline** » Mon 28 Sep 2009 11:29am

Con, re the Selwood goal, shouldn't your venom be directed at Clint Jones for missing the tackle?

Con Gorozidis · Mon 28 Sep 2009 12:08pm

Thinline wrote:Con, re the Selwood goal, shouldn't your venom be directed at Clint Jones for missing the tackle?

i think clint was worried about getting him too high cos selwood always ducks his head. but while that was going on raph could have come from the side and wrapped him up.

Geezer · Post: # 835557Post **Geezer** » Mon 28 Sep 2009 12:20pm

dempster will move to accross half back next year at the expense of raph clarke.
his awareness with and without the ball is next to nothing.
every time he goes near the ball i cringe.
he also makes the wrong decision too many times. . . including times in the last quarter on both wings that he should have taken the man out of the contest with a bump . .it would have negated a few forward thrusts for geelong.
we need to find a legitamate lead up mid range forward.
gwilt is too inconsistent and milne is pushed off the ball and goes too ground way to often.
the wick was turned up on milne this finals series . . .and he hasnt met the challenge.

SideshowMilne · Mon 28 Sep 2009 12:29pm

who was the Saints player running alongside (4m right) Raph when he got caught for the cats 1st?

ralphsmith · Mon 28 Sep 2009 12:43pm

SideshowMilne wrote:who was the Saints player running alongside (4m right) Raph when he got caught for the cats 1st?

It was Gilbert.

saintbob · Post: # 835592Post **saintbob** » Mon 28 Sep 2009 12:47pm

mr six o'clock wrote:10 guys worse than raph today, had that costly mistake early but all the backmen make a couple of them a game

Spot on!!!

Con Gorozidis · Mon 28 Sep 2009 1:07pm

saintbob wrote:
mr six o'clock wrote:10 guys worse than raph today, had that costly mistake early but all the backmen make a couple of them a game
Spot on!!!

not sure what game u were watching. unless falling over is considered good play. he did play awesomer agsins the dogs though. but saturday was a stinker. no point denying it.

i also dont rate dempster. he was very very slow and immobile as i watched him saturday. i think begley might be worth persiting with for a wehil.

older saint · Mon 28 Sep 2009 2:27pm

ralphsmith wrote:
SideshowMilne wrote:who was the Saints player running alongside (4m right) Raph when he got caught for the cats 1st?
It was Gilbert.

IT WAS SAM FISHER not GILBERT .
he chose to peel off ( in to traffic ) rather than shepard Rooke .

degruch · Post: # 835744Post **degruch** » Mon 28 Sep 2009 2:38pm

older saint wrote:
ralphsmith wrote:
SideshowMilne wrote:who was the Saints player running alongside (4m right) Raph when he got caught for the cats 1st?
It was Gilbert.
IT WAS SAM FISHER not GILBERT .
he chose to peel off ( in to traffic ) rather than shepard Rooke .

Definately Fisher...I was yelling at him through the TV set for not putting a shepard on Rooke, and then WHAM, the inevitable happened. Almost as inevitable as this thread appearing!

FWIW, OK game, but knew he wasn't gonna be great from the second he went the bump on Milburn (?) instead of a tackle...he fell over the top and was lucky not to give away a free. Nervous brain fade.

Beej · Post: # 835766Post **Beej** » Mon 28 Sep 2009 2:52pm

Gilbert, Fisher, whoever it was, they're professional footballers.

I would be astounded if Fisher wasn't talking to Raph about what was around him. "Yes, Raph, quick" "You're hot" "Man on"

Fisher was obviously expecting the handball as he's the main creator out of the backline.

It's Fisher's job to tell Raph what was behind and if he failed to do that, then it's obviously not Raph's fault.

But you wouldn't be able to get a game in the AFL if you didn't talk on the field. It becomes second nature as a 15 year old.

degruch · Post: # 835771Post **degruch** » Mon 28 Sep 2009 2:55pm

OLB wrote:Gilbert, Fisher, whoever it was, they're professional footballers.

I would be astounded if Fisher wasn't talking to Raph about what was around him. "Yes, Raph give it quickly" "You're hot" "Man on".

On replay you can see that Fisher is saying something, but he also doesn't seem to be too aware of Rooke either, strangely. You're right that he probably would have been expecting a handball and block from Raph, but the whole event with the two players just looks sloppy. Who knows...more nervous brain fading?

joffaboy · Post: # 835782Post **joffaboy** » Mon 28 Sep 2009 3:03pm

Con Gorozidis wrote:
saintbob wrote:
mr six o'clock wrote:10 guys worse than raph today, had that costly mistake early but all the backmen make a couple of them a game
Spot on!!!
not sure what game u were watching. unless falling over is considered good play. he did play awesomer agsins the dogs though. but saturday was a stinker. no point denying it.

i also dont rate dempster. he was very very slow and immobile as i watched him saturday. i think begley might be worth persiting with for a wehil.

I betcha Jason Blake sighs with relief when he sees Raph in the team. The scapegoat tag has been passed across to Raph.

In saying that. Raph had an ordinary game. Wa caught for our first goal against ( nice for a voice from a teammate maybe - but still had to realise that he was in a GF.

In the last qtr Byrnes turned him inside out about 3 times on the wing. Poor matchup by Ross. Should have fixed that earlier.

I agree with persisting with Begley, especially now Max is gone and maybe Goose.

Give Dempster a bit of a go. Coming back after a knee reco.

I still reckon the finger should be pointed at the Forwards, not the backs for saturday if you want to point fingers.

Solar · Post: # 835795Post **Solar** » Mon 28 Sep 2009 3:08pm

still think we missed a chance in that third quarter with BJ out of action to throw raph down forward. He was playing on hawkins at one stage and ross keep trying to find a match up for him.

maybe swapping mini with raph and stop trying to bomb it long. I know the coaches will learn from this and the importance of the hit up forward in that final quarter (see hawkins goals 1 min in final quarter).

Has only played 50 odd games and will improve. As people have said, the forwards cost us the match more then the backs who were magnificant!

borderbarry · Mon 28 Sep 2009 3:42pm

Its funny but it was Dawson I was blaming early in the game. He made some shocking errors, but on this forum some only see Raph's errors. And I was against Dempster being picked in the team ahead of Geary and Armitage, and his performance justified my feelings. 2 kicks and 3 handballs in 64% gametime. ANd someone on here said he was awsome. My god, some are easily pleased.

Solar · Post: # 835837Post **Solar** » Mon 28 Sep 2009 3:45pm

borderbarry wrote:Its funny but it was Dawson I was blaming early in the game. He made some shocking errors, but on this forum some only see Raph's errors. And I was against Dempster being picked in the team ahead of Geary and Armitage, and his performance justified my feelings. 2 kicks and 3 handballs in 64% gametime. ANd someone on here said he was awsome. My god, some are easily pleased.

what did the player he played on do? I would think geelongs key rebounder barely found the ball and was unable to rebound.

hate to say it but if you want someone to blame and I'm trying not to but schneids said it himself

Beej · Post: # 835887Post **Beej** » Mon 28 Sep 2009 4:25pm

Solar wrote:
borderbarry wrote:Its funny but it was Dawson I was blaming early in the game. He made some shocking errors, but on this forum some only see Raph's errors. And I was against Dempster being picked in the team ahead of Geary and Armitage, and his performance justified my feelings. 2 kicks and 3 handballs in 64% gametime. ANd someone on here said he was awsome. My god, some are easily pleased.
what did the player he played on do? I would think geelongs key rebounder barely found the ball and was unable to rebound.

hate to say it but if you want someone to blame and I'm trying not to but schneids said it himself

Yep, I always knew that stopping Enright was important given the form he was in leading up to the GF and Dempster played his role well.

Enright was BOG against the Dogs in the QF and one of the BOG against the Pies. He is their Sam Fisher.

Solar · Post: # 835893Post **Solar** » Mon 28 Sep 2009 4:27pm

OLB wrote:
Solar wrote:
borderbarry wrote:Its funny but it was Dawson I was blaming early in the game. He made some shocking errors, but on this forum some only see Raph's errors. And I was against Dempster being picked in the team ahead of Geary and Armitage, and his performance justified my feelings. 2 kicks and 3 handballs in 64% gametime. ANd someone on here said he was awsome. My god, some are easily pleased.
what did the player he played on do? I would think geelongs key rebounder barely found the ball and was unable to rebound.

hate to say it but if you want someone to blame and I'm trying not to but schneids said it himself
Yep, I always knew that stopping Enright was important given the form he was in leading up to the GF and Dempster played his role well.

Enright was BOG against the Dogs in the QF and one of the BOG against the Pies. He is their Sam Fisher.

hence why we needed to tweak the forwadline a little as we couldn't move dempster, would like to see mini get a chance to play back and midfield to give us a little more flexibility.

BTW raph is going no-where, was a key to our finals campaign and will improve out of sight.

fingers · Post: # 835916Post **fingers** » Mon 28 Sep 2009 4:46pm

thejiggingsaint wrote:Will bashing individual players here alter the result? Please Folks! don't let your disappointment and frustration at a loss today, cloud your judgement. The team were let down by POOR KICKING!!! If we had built up the lead our play deserved we could have been praising Raph!!

No time for bitterness, let us build for NEXT YEAR!!!!!!

Come on Dave - this is no time for common sense

Gurgman · Post: # 835973Post **Gurgman** » Mon 28 Sep 2009 5:26pm

reincarnated wrote:had a terrible first quarter. Look afriad and scared

Reincarneted thinks himself is a flog , Oh he was right

bozza1980 · Post: # 836093Post **bozza1980** » Mon 28 Sep 2009 7:41pm

Con Gorozidis wrote: ok fine. lets just not win a flag ever then. suit yourself.

I'm not sure where I said i don't want to win a flag, I'm pretty sure to paraphrase I said:

- that I didn't think we should make decisions on our players based on what the press and/or opposition supporters thought of our players

- that I believed Raph was solid on GF day, that he has inherited the mantle of most maligned player from Jason Blake and that he was far from our worst player on GF day.

- that bleating about his mistakes will not change the fact he is in our best 22

If you can tell me where in all this I said i don't want us to win a flag, I'm all ears.

I truly believe that Raph draws far more critisicm than his performances deserve. There are some players in our team that our supporters are more than happy to forgive mistakes from and others who the mere mention of their name seems to draw a vitriolic rant.

Con Gorozidis wrote:but if we are after a flag. we need a better 22.

This I do agree with, we need to be better again next season if we want to go that one step further than we did this year. I have no doubt that the men employed by our club to make the decisions, will make the necessary decisions to take us closer to the reward that we all seek.
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saint75 · Post: # 836100Post **saint75** » Mon 28 Sep 2009 7:45pm

bozza1980 wrote:
Con Gorozidis wrote: ok fine. lets just not win a flag ever then. suit yourself.
I'm not sure where I said i don't want to win a flag, I'm pretty sure to paraphrase I said:

- that I didn't think we should make decisions on our players based on what the press and/or opposition supporters thought of our players

- that I believed Raph was solid on GF day, that he has inherited the mantle of most maligned player from Jason Blake and that he was far from our worst player on GF day.

- that bleating about his mistakes will not change the fact he is in our best 22

If you can tell me where in all this I said i don't want us to win a flag, I'm all ears.

I truly believe that Raph draws far more critisicm than his performances deserve. There are some players in our team that our supporters are more than happy to forgive mistakes from and others who the mere mention of their name seems to draw a vitriolic rant.

Con Gorozidis wrote:but if we are after a flag. we need a better 22.
This I do agree with, we need to be better again next season if we want to go that one step further than we did this year. I have no doubt that the men employed by our club to make the decisions, will make the necessary decisions to take us closer to the reward that we all seek.
[/i]

Thank goodness. Sanity prevails.

Poor Raph is everyone's whipping boy. Even when he plays a great game he gets no plaudits for it. If he was to be delisted/traded, who will that mantle fall to next..?? Surely he must stay for that reason alone.

BigMart · Post: # 836113Post **BigMart** » Mon 28 Sep 2009 7:59pm

Still rubbish.....

and people still going into bat for him......for what reason???.....strength through loyalty????......simple answer is, he cannot cut the mustard under the pump....

He was clearly our second worse in the GF......

Teflon · Post: # 836478Post **Teflon** » Tue 29 Sep 2009 1:14am

Im still not convinced Raph doesnt have what it takes to provide that 3rd lead up option in the fwd line.

Hes now played enough to learn "Defence" - this pressure needs to come across to the HFF with him but hes got speed (looks laconic but no mean feat to keep Burns honest...)..