Goose or Gwilt?

[meher baba]

Gwilt is currently a liability IMHO, lacks intensity, looks far too laconic without really impacting in any meaningful way

Sorry you missed the game. A replay is available here.

http://www.afl.com.au/video/tabid/76/default.aspx

McEvoy, Maguire and Armitage need more game time in the best 22!

The players I mentioned are potentially very pivotal to us in raising the bar that little bit extra we need if we're to really take it up to Geelong and really should be getting more game time!

It is hard to find a place for all of them at once but at the very least either McEvoy or Maguire should come in for Gwilt, without further delay!

Gwilt is currently playing a crucial role at half foward, exerting physical pressure and - along with Schneider - using his superior kicking skills to provide a link between the midfield and Riewoldt/Kosi/Milne (and Schneider when he ventures further forward). He is also meant to provide a dangerous third option when Riewoldt and Kosi are double-teamed: and he was particularly effective in this role in the first and fourth quarters against the Bombers.

I know it's a big call, but I reckon a Gwilt-type player could make a big impact against Geelong (Hamill, of course, would be far better, but Gwilt might have to do for now). Against the Cats, you need lots of different options for kicking goals. The Hawks showed that last season, with Geelong struggling to counter the combined forward thrust of Roughead, Franklin, Williams, Bateman, Dew, etc.

I don't think any of Armo, McEvoy or Goose can provide the sort of combined bumping/linking/tackling/decoying performance than Gwilt delivers at his best. Eddy is a bit closer to the mark, but I think Gwilt's superior kicking puts him slightly ahead at the moment.

I suppose Raph and, eventually, Dempster, have to be factored in somewhere, but I prefer them at the back, with perhaps Ray moving forward to replace Gwilt. But, once again, Ray has better kicking skills.

Dropping a player from a winning side and replacing him with an entirely different sort of player, and then shuffling the team around, was the sort of thing GT sometimes did, but Lyon - who cares enormously about structure - is far less likely to do it. And that's the aspect of Lyon's approach that I thought particularly appealed to GT-haters like you.

[bigcarl]

goose is a key position player (who can pinch hit in the ruck, according to the coach). mcevoy is a ruckman who might be able to pinch hit as a key position forward.

so i don't see either replacing gwilt.

i think the threat to gwilt is more likely to come from raph or armitage or eddy, all of whom seem more likely than him to impact on the scoreboard.

none of which is to deny that gwilt has been useful at times as a defensive forward.

i'd dearly love to see goose in, but i just don't know about him and kosi in the same forward line.

if one of them was to play second ruck, then yes.

[barks4eva]

Gwilt is currently a liability IMHO, lacks intensity, looks far too laconic without really impacting in any meaningful way

Sorry you missed the game. A replay is available here.

http://www.afl.com.au/video/tabid/76/default.aspx

McEvoy, Maguire and Armitage need more game time in the best 22!

The players I mentioned are potentially very pivotal to us in raising the bar that little bit extra we need if we're to really take it up to Geelong and really should be getting more game time!

It is hard to find a place for all of them at once but at the very least either McEvoy or Maguire should come in for Gwilt, without further delay!

Gwilt is currently playing a crucial role at half foward, exerting physical pressure and - along with Schneider - using his superior kicking skills to provide a link between the midfield and Riewoldt/Kosi/Milne (and Schneider when he ventures further forward). He is also meant to provide a dangerous third option when Riewoldt and Kosi are double-teamed: and he was particularly effective in this role in the first and fourth quarters against the Bombers.

I know it's a big call, but I reckon a Gwilt-type player could make a big impact against Geelong (Hamill, of course, would be far better, but Gwilt might have to do for now). Against the Cats, you need lots of different options for kicking goals. The Hawks showed that last season, with Geelong struggling to counter the combined forward thrust of Roughead, Franklin, Williams, Bateman, Dew, etc.

I don't think any of Armo, McEvoy or Goose can provide the sort of combined bumping/linking/tackling/decoying performance than Gwilt delivers at his best. Eddy is a bit closer to the mark, but I think Gwilt's superior kicking puts him slightly ahead at the moment.

I suppose Raph and, eventually, Dempster, have to be factored in somewhere, but I prefer them at the back, with perhaps Ray moving forward to replace Gwilt. But, once again, Ray has better kicking skills.

Dropping a player from a winning side and replacing him with an entirely different sort of player, and then shuffling the team around, was the sort of thing GT sometimes did, but Lyon - who cares enormously about structure - is far less likely to do it. And that's the aspect of Lyon's approach that I thought particularly appealed to GT-haters like you.

I don't hate GT, I like him, he provides much comic relief, but as far as coaching is concerned he's a fair dinkum buffoon!

Thankfully Milne wasn't traded and Gardiner was picked up as Thomas has stated he would not have touched him with a ten foot pole.

If everyone listened to you, Lyon would have been sacked by this time last year!




FAIR DINKUM, I'd wait to hear what you reckon then do the exact opposite!

[barks4eva]

Gwilt is currently a liability IMHO, lacks intensity, looks far too laconic without really impacting in any meaningful way when players such as McEvoy, Maguire and Armitage need more game time in the best 22!

The players I mentioned are potentially very pivotal to us in raising the bar that little bit extra we need if we're to really take it up to Geelong and really should be getting more game time!

It is hard to find a place for all of them at once but at the very least either McEvoy or Maguire should come in for Gwilt, without further delay!

Yep McEvoy for gwilt. Good team balance and you basically have a go at another poster about not knowing anything about footy.

Your irrelevant point is?

My point is you want another ruckman in for a HFF. Where is the logic. Sorry there isnt any logis it is B4E.

Both Maguire or McEvoy could play as a third tall forward, replacing Gwilt!

Is that enough logis for you!

[SainterK]

I wouldn't play McEvoy as a third tall myself, we need to get this guy rucking and have him ready to go for the future.

[meher baba]

I wouldn't play McEvoy as a third tall myself, we need to get this guy rucking and have him ready to go for the future.

Too right. B4E, in relation to McEvoy, you don't have a rucking clue.

In fact, you are a wrench-holding, toggle-tugging, dongle-donking, wood-turning, johnson jerking customer of Madame Palm and her five daughters!!

[Devilhead]

Gram - is having a fairly bad run at the moment - whether it is injury (as you mentioned last week) or just loss of form it seems as though he could do with either having a week off or a run in the twos

Doesn't be suprised if he goes

[Milton66]

Settle down kids...

Gwilt has role which is similar to Hamill's. Any goals he kicks are a bonus.

Hamill never set the world on fire on the scorebloard, but he did apply pressure which creates opportunities for the forwards.

I'm confused. People want us to give the "kids" game time, yet Gwilt doesn't qualify? He had a chance, he's taken it, and he's done enough to keep it so far.

Isn't that what player development is all about?

On the one hand, people argue to give the kids game time. Yet you still want to drop players who are performing well?

Gee, that's "premiership" logic if ever I've heard it. what a great message to send to the players: Bust yer @rse in the VFL and bang the door down. We'll geive you a fe games, and regardless if you play well, we'll drop you so we can test other players. With no guarantee that you'll play seniors again.

[Milton66]

I wouldn't play McEvoy as a third tall myself, we need to get this guy rucking and have him ready to go for the future.

Too right. B4E, in relation to McEvoy, you don't have a rucking clue.

In fact, you are a wrench-holding, toggle-tugging, dongle-donking, wood-turning, johnson jerking customer of Madame Palm and her five daughters!!

... who told us what a saviour Rix would be.

[stinger]

Gwilt is currently a liability IMHO, lacks intensity, looks far too laconic without really impacting in any meaningful way

Sorry you missed the game. A replay is available here.

http://www.afl.com.au/video/tabid/76/default.aspx



[.

[SainterK]

Settle down kids...

Gwilt has role which is similar to Hamill's. Any goals he kicks are a bonus.

Hamill never set the world on fire on the scorebloard, but he did apply pressure which creates opportunities for the forwards.

I'm confused. People want us to give the "kids" game time, yet Gwilt doesn't qualify? He had a chance, he's taken it, and he's done enough to keep it so far.

Isn't that what player development is all about?

On the one hand, people argue to give the kids game time. Yet you still want to drop players who are performing well?

Gee, that's "premiership" logic if ever I've heard it. what a great message to send to the players: Bust yer @rse in the VFL and bang the door down. We'll geive you a fe games, and regardless if you play well, we'll drop you so we can test other players. With no guarantee that you'll play seniors again.

I'm with you on this one, Gwilt is only 23 (I think) and around the same age as Gilbert and McQualter. I would still classify him as one of younger players, and he has done very well to contribute and play his role for the team each week this year.

[barks4eva]

anybody who questions milne's value to the team knows f*** all about footy.....

Thomas was going to trade Milne, thank god Butterss sacked him before he got the chance, because going by your logic, Thomas knows f*** all about footy.......... finally we agree on something afterall

[saintsRrising]

who told us what a saviour Rix would be.

Interesting post for someone who only joined the forum on May 19.

A previous forumite back with a new ID perhaps?

[saintsRrising]

Both Maguire or McEvoy could play as a third tall forward, replacing Gwilt!

Is that enough logis for you!

Maguire yes...McEvoy no....or ta least no when one of the other two is Kosi.

That would make our forward line too slow...and would also impact on our ability to apply forward pressure.

Our HFs need to be apply to run and chase as soon as the opposition backs win the ball.

Having both Kosi and McEvoy as permanent forwards would impair that ability.

[Quixote]

OK without having read all of this thread --

I have watched about a game and a half worth of Saints' replay replay tonight.

THERE IS NO WAY GWILT IS GOING ANYWHERE.

His contribution is priceless for mine - last thing I saw, before pausing to write this, was him setting up our 2nd goal in the first Q vs the Pies.


As I scream at the game each week - James Gwilt, YOU ARE INSTRUMENTAL!!!

[saintsRrising]

There is no doubt that Gwilt after stagnating for a while...is now in a rapid improvement phase.

difference me-thinks is largely that he is being more actively developed.

Fora player such as Gwilt who is not a "natural" footballer...adequate coaching is very important.

[Quixote]

I just watched the 1st half of the Pies game (and now its bed time).

2 points --

Luke Ball was PHENOMENAL, and I thought our best.

If anyone is to go for Maguire, it is, shhhh, Blake.

[ace]

I wrote on another thread that given how well we went with Penny / Max, I see no reason why u can't have both.

Hear, hear,
Penny would take the gorilla and Hudghton would take the fast lead forward.

Zac has the height and now strength to take the gorilla leaving Max who has the speed to take the fast leading forward.

[starsign]

Do you think there is a remote possibility, that Ross tried out Gilbert in the forward line during the preseason because our backline would soon be getting a major boost with some big names returning from injury?

Dunno, just attempting to get into the inner workings of our coaches mind

primarily driven by our lack of tall forwards I'd say, ( as he mentioned On the Couch mon night ), but no doubt the possibility of plenty of defenders down the track facilitated it

[Milton66]

who told us what a saviour Rix would be.

Interesting post for someone who only joined the forum on May 19.

A previous forumite back with a new ID perhaps?

Erm, no.

Have you considered the possibility that I've followed here without joining?

Maybe I should have stated the cliched "Hi everyone. long time viewer, first time poster" line?

cheers.

[starsign]

Maguire needs a break out game at CHB at VFL level to really press. And when he does that opportunity will come. Of that there is no doubt.

That'll be tough while Ross is successfully trialling him as a forward. And it seems Ross likes the fact that he's now "taking the game on"- so don't expect him to go back to CHB at VFL level for awhile.

Have a read of the transcipt RL on Goose playing forward[/posted in the RL On the Couch Thread

RL on playing Goose forward

GH:………(on his recent 5 goal hauls for Zebs) my spies tell me he’s too slow for defence at present. Do you think looking forward he is a backup for Roo or Kozi if they go down?

RL: There is a couple of reasons…..
We are a little bit thin for tall forwards and there is no doubt about that potential backup.
We just wanted to give Matt the chance to take the game on and not follow someone around. His level of frustration is obviously building, he’s probably played 9 or 10 games in a row….
Is elite the right term? He is certainly a bonefide AFL player….. so it’s been tough.
We wanted to create some opportunities more than waiting for an opportunity down back,….. and we also believe he can be a mobile ruckman
So he’s a terrific character and we think he is really going to play a part this year, how big a part we just don’t know yet !

[Milton66]

Maguire needs a break out game at CHB at VFL level to really press. And when he does that opportunity will come. Of that there is no doubt.

That'll be tough while Ross is successfully trialling him as a forward. And it seems Ross likes the fact that he's now "taking the game on"- so don't expect him to go back to CHB at VFL level for awhile.

Have a read of the transcipt RL on Goose playing forward[/posted in the RL On the Couch Thread

RL on playing Goose forward

GH:………(on his recent 5 goal hauls for Zebs) my spies tell me he’s too slow for defence at present. Do you think looking forward he is a backup for Roo or Kozi if they go down?

RL: There is a couple of reasons…..
We are a little bit thin for tall forwards and there is no doubt about that potential backup.
We just wanted to give Matt the chance to take the game on and not follow someone around. His level of frustration is obviously building, he’s probably played 9 or 10 games in a row….
Is elite the right term? He is certainly a bonefide AFL player….. so it’s been tough.
We wanted to create some opportunities more than waiting for an opportunity down back,….. and we also believe he can be a mobile ruckman
So he’s a terrific character and we think he is really going to play a part this year, how big a part we just don’t know yet !

Interesting read. I get the impression that Ross doesn't see a major role for Goose in the current structure, so they are throwing him around to see if they can find a role for him. My gut feel is that the game has evolved past Goose. I hope I'm wrong.

[barks4eva]

As I scream at the game each week - James Gwilt, YOU ARE INSTRUMENTAL!!!

Personally I'd prefer him to get some lyrics!

[barks4eva]

anybody who questions milne's value to the team knows f*** all about footy.....

Thomas was going to trade Milne, thank god Butterss sacked him before he got the chance, obviously going by your logic, you agree that Thomas knows f*** all about footy.......... finally we agree on something afterall