Etihad Stadium deal costs Saints $1.40 a fan

[clarky449]

http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/sport/ ... 42,00.html

[ace]

So we didn't win afterall, we lost.

Games against interstate teams run up losses because there are very few away team supporters.
Home games against Victorian based clubs are at least profitable but don't produce much return for effort.

[Nattens]

Thanks very much corporate AFL.

Victorian teams forced to use 2 stadiums at their cost while their old homes are left to rot.

[ace]

[quote="Nattens"]Thanks very much corporate AFL.

Victorian teams forced to use 2 stadiums at their cost while their old homes are left to rot.[/quote]

Except Geelong who get to play against interstate teams at Semi Skilled Stadium.
Semi because the ground capacity is only half that of a genuine stadium.
But unlike St Kilda homes games with larger crowds these Geelong home games are highly profitable.

[Nattens]

Semi because the ground capacity is only half that of a genuine stadium. But unlike St Kilda homes games with larger crowds these Geelong home games are highly profitable.

Exactly. Because there is no middle man looking for a profit. The Kar Park is Geelong's ground and all it goes to the footy club. Where as our home games at Etihad Stadium we have to go through the stadium itself to get to play there. Absolutely ridiculous.

[bigred]

I have said it before and I will say it again.

The AFL made one monumental c**k up when they sold Waverley park.

Seriously, if they spent a third of the money on Waverley that they pumped into Telstra Dome, they would have an absolutely brilliant flagship stadium that all these clubs could use.

Instead, they piked it and for who knows what reason, just dropped the thing. In hindsight, I see this to be an critical stuff up.

With all the money that has been floating around Victoria over the past decade, especially in the building industry, who is to say that the state government could not be persuaded to deliver some infrastructure out that way....Train line extensions etc...light rail. Waverley is now smack bang in between Eastlink and the M1 on Wellington road. Traffic in the area is nothing like it used to be.

The thought of playing home games at Princes Park is sickening to me but it would be an instant (insert buzz word here) "clean" stadium that the AFL could control.

Is anyone actually surprised that with Ian Collins at the helm @ Docklands, that this is all happening?

25k against Freo in this town is an acceptable number ffs and we get done in...Geelong would turn a healthy profit with that number @ semi...

The sad thing about all this is that we actually have one of the more stable and stronger deals with Docklands. We took the safer option when we last renewed so that we were not as vulnerable to lower crowd numbers, at the expense of extra cash for full house games. The dogs and North must be absolutely bleeding cash. BLEEDING

I love TD as a venue. Awesome place to watch footy. Just brilliant. But seriously, I would rather move games to Tassie or the Gold Coast if it means we will be more viable. Fcuk Docklands. The stadium would not even exist if it wasn't for footy. Bite the hand that feeds you why don't you.

The AFL shot itself in the foot big time here and they have one hell of a mess.

Could have had a 70k capacity boutique CLEAN stadium out in Waverley....could have had it. Could have been made to be a lot more comfortable, better facilities, more protection from the elements for punters...sheesh.

Who was at the helm at the time? Wayne Jackson? The same d1ckhead that now wants clubs to merge? Go back to the farm buddy and get back to arranging your kids wedding to their 2nd cousins....seriously. Thanks for nothing.


/end rant.

[The Fireman]

Not happy Jan, clubs won't survive financially if we have to wait for the AFL to own this venue, at least they are in the courts trying to sort something out as we speak.
But thank God we left Waverely, what a dump that place was, couldn't get out of the car park, couldn't get there by public transport and you could nearly freeze to death in the outer so no matter what battles we must now have to make Docklands a viable option it far outweighs the pain of enduring that s*** hole at Waverely.

[rocksolid]

Its time for us to be the pacesetter, bite the bullet and make our new home at Belvedere Park the Boutique Stadium everyone is talking about.

30,000 seats right next to Eastlink and the railway line.
Not sure about car parks, don't know the area to well but if they can build a stadium they can build a car park.

It would put us ahead of most Vic. clubs!

[Mr Magic]

Does anybody actually know what the formula is at the Dome?

How many paying customers have to go through teh turnstiles before we start to make monewy in a game?

I assume that part of each Reserved Seat sold to Saints members already goes to the Dome?

SO the rest of the cost in opening the Stadium has to be covered by the sale of GA tickets and Reserved Seats on the day?

SO what's the magic number?

[Spinner]

Its time for us to be the pacesetter, bite the bullet and make our new home at Belvedere Park the Boutique Stadium everyone is talking about.

30,000 seats right next to Eastlink and the railway line.
Not sure about car parks, don't know the area to well but if they can build a stadium they can build a car park.

It would put us ahead of most Vic. clubs!

I'd rather make a loss at Etihad.

[Ice Wolf]

I posted this at BF but it completely relevant to this topic

The Clubs should just work out the cost for a 0 attendance, pay that to Docklands and then just play the game somewhere else and make more money, Docklands will get the money it is contractually guaranteed and the clubs could make more money.

Maybe Hawthorn St Kilda and Richmond should pitch in to redevelop Moorabbin as a 30k seater.

[rocksolid]

I'd rather make a loss at Etihad.



Thank God your not running the place!

[The Fireman]

I posted this at BF but it completely relevant to this topic

The Clubs should just work out the cost for a 0 attendance, pay that to Docklands and then just play the game somewhere else and make more money, Docklands will get the money it is contractually guaranteed and the clubs could make more money.

Maybe Hawthorn St Kilda and Richmond should pitch in to redevelop Moorabbin as a 30k seater.

We have already had problems with the council there...Nth Melbourne have touted the idea of developing the Showgrounds..maybe these 4 clubs could look at that but in all honesty I think the Docklands will remain our ground, the AFL will have to make it viable for us.

[Ice Wolf]

I posted this at BF but it completely relevant to this topic

The Clubs should just work out the cost for a 0 attendance, pay that to Docklands and then just play the game somewhere else and make more money, Docklands will get the money it is contractually guaranteed and the clubs could make more money.

Maybe Hawthorn St Kilda and Richmond should pitch in to redevelop Moorabbin as a 30k seater.

We have already had problems with the council there...Nth Melbourne have touted the idea of developing the Showgrounds..maybe these 4 clubs could look at that but in all honesty I think the Docklands will remain our ground, the AFL will have to make it viable for us.

Showgrounds?? thats great for North Melbourne and the maybe the Dogs, but it would be s*** for us.

Kingston might be agreeable to having an AFL playing venue compared to just a trainging oval.

[howlinwolf]

In our first 3 home games we got 88000 fans through the gates and have had to write a cheque out for $126 000.

This is crazy and unsustainable. It isn't hard to see why the club was keen to give up our home game against Melbourne to the Gold Coast.
We would have lost here again.

Now we seem to be snookered with the two main venues in Melbourne. I can't imagine how much a third stadium would be to build but must be way beyond what 3-4 clubs could afford.

It would be interesting to see how popular the showgrounds option would
be ?

It would need to be a decent stadium and not a mickey mouse one.

B.T.W Geelong currently get $650 000 for a crowd at Kardinia Park equivalent to what we get for a home Freo game.

Good luck to them for having the foresight in upgrading their ground. I just wish our club had've seen this coming.

I'd suggest for now all we can do for now is be as generous as you can afford in fund raisers.

[saint vince]

The major problems started when the afl sold Waverley and told us we had to play at the DOcklands. I agree it is great to watch the footy there but I loved watching the Saints at Waverley and at Moorabin also. The ground is not what is important it is the footy that is.

The AFL made us go there so they now need to compensate us and all the other clubs. Either offer us an alternative or give us some more cash otherwise we will end up in West SYdney or Tasmania.

[Stephen Theodore]

I always thought that Channel 7 owned Docklands, and within ? years the AFL would own it outright.

[howlinwolf]

Apparently Mirvac has major interests and some superannuation companies in The Dome.
In 2025 it is handed over to the AFL.

You would think if the AFL had no hidden agenda they would supplement the clubs with poor deals as it would be in their own interests.

However you have to wonder whether quietly they don't mind clubs struggling with the poor deal as it could lead to clubs relocating.

Why else wouldn't they help the hand that feeds them ?

[bigred]

B.T.W Geelong currently get $650 000 for a crowd at Kardinia Park equivalent to what we get for a home Freo game.

Good luck to them for having the foresight in upgrading their ground. I just wish our club had've seen this coming.

Unfortunately we would really have needed to have put it in motion back in the early nineties....Financially we were a basket case at the time. We had no chance.

The move to Waverley was supposed to guarantee sustainability. The move to Docklands was supposed to guarantee financial viability.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing of course.

The position these clubs are now in is really concerning. Not just St.Kilda.

[gringo]

Under Wayne Jackson there was a focus on loosing a couple of melbourne clubs in the interest of a national competition.

He forced the marginal teams like the saints into signing at the docklands or else taking on the cost of redevelopment of waverley etc at their own cost .

The poorer clubs had to go and take what was offered as the afl was to guarantee the club was not worse off than at waverley for the first couple of years.

To hear him sniping the dees and roos makes me want to point out that he should worry about the s*** heap that is Port Adelaide sitting in his own backyard.

Princess park is the only really viable suburban ground as Jack Elliot spent money on it and it is being fixed up currently. It is close to transport and the city at least.

As long as carlton doesnt profiteer from it.

[saintspremiers]

On SEN, Smorgon (Dogs Prez) said that WJ should not interfere as he is an EX CEO and his opinion is irrelevant.......bagged the crap out of WJ actually!

Was quite supportive though of AndyD.

[OneEyedSainter77]

This story make my blood boil. Up until now, I've tried to maintain the belief that all things considered, the AFL doesn't actually want clubs to die - but its very hard to see them as anything other than an evil, black-hearted, vicious, corporate blood sucking machine.

Financially, are in trouble? I mean, we're down on members from last year and what we've projected, we're losing money from our stadium "deal" - I don't really understand the financial part of AFL, but could this put us in trouble? If it continues?

If we have to keep shelling out money each time we play an interstate club, what could be the overall effect on the club? And on its supporters?

If ES isn't financially viable for us, what the hell can we do then? Its not like we can say "OK, we'll just shift our games to this ground or that ground" - who's to say we'd fare any better there.

I hate to say it but perrhaps we bailed out of the Tassie deal a little earlier than we should've... or am I just overreacting there?

[perfectionist]

I posted this on another thread (which was started before this one) on the same subject:

Whilst the raw numbers look bad, it is important to look at the reason behind the differences. In Melbourne, we have the best sporting facilities of any large city in the world - bar none. And when that rectangular stadium is completed at Olympic Park, they will be even better. But it all comes at a cost.

For the first time this year, I attended at game at Subiaco. It looks alright on TV, but it is not much better facility wise (toilets, food outlets, access, etc) than Moorabbin was twenty years ago. AAMI stadium is not much better, the Gabba is OK but cramped and Sydney is, well, Sydney.

The financing of the Docklands Stadium was and remains (mainly because of the new rectangular stadium) a risky business. I have taken guests there from interstate and overseas and they simply cannot believe that such a large stadium can have a roof. The new facilities at the MCG are outstanding, but once again, the MCC Trust is right up against the financing wall, depending on the Boxing Day Test to make a profit each year. Fortunately, the continued success of our test team over recent years has provided that surplus, but these things may come and go over a 30 year financing arrangement.

On the other hand, the AFL brass are wanting to get the best deal for local clubs, particularly at this time when (perhaps) sponsorships might dwindle.

I must admit that Etihad is not ideally situated for the St Kilda supporter group. Last Sunday's attendance is evidence of that. However, the reality is that grounds with modern facilities require multiple games to be played on them each weekend, not one, to ensure financial viability. So you can't just share with one team (like Hawthorn at AFL park), but multiple teams.

I'm glad we're spoilt in Melbourne as I appreciate the facilities, but there is a (small) price to pay.

[Stillwaiting]

This really worries me, does anybody know when this deal lapses, i cant see eddiehad wantting to give up there gravy train

[howlinwolf]

2025 is when the Dome is handed to to the AFL. I'm not sure if our contract runs that long.

There is a clause in the current contract which prevents clubs from playing on any new ground.

This is why Visy Park is being looked at so closely