This will sound like heresy

[joffaboy]

The poster made a fool of himself with the ignorant and totally inaccurate hyperbole.



Reactionary and totally lacking in any thought on the subject except to label and accuse

thank goodness most on this thread have the intelligence to see the real question and the topic not turn it into the usual pissing contest for puffed up egotists trolls and thread jackers.

not surprisingly ....those three sentences aptly describe you...... to a tee..


also not surprised to see the quality posters defending you.....

listen you troll go and flame another thread - you have had nothing to say on the subject at all.

You have been reported to the mods for constant trolling.

[matrix]

[Richter]

FOr me the interesting point to make goes further than the absence of Harvs.

For the last couple of years we have IMO relied on 3 players to win us games.....

- Harvey

- Lenny

- Riewoldt

Now in the first two games of this year Harv.s was absent from both, Lenny from the first and didn't do much in the second, and Roo has been down in both.

The important point is that the rest of the team HAS picked up - in particular Dal, Ball, Kosi, Gardiner. The reason why? Perhaps because none of the players think anymore who is going to win us this game. but each thinks - we are going to do it together. Who can really know? But it has happened and is the reason why Walls thinks we're a chance and why we have some reason to feel genuinely excited about this year.

[WayneJudson42]

FOr me the interesting point to make goes further than the absence of Harvs.

For the last couple of years we have IMO relied on 3 players to win us games.....

- Harvey

- Lenny

- Riewoldt

Now in the first two games of this year Harv.s was absent from both, Lenny from the first and didn't do much in the second, and Roo has been down in both.

The important point is that the rest of the team HAS picked up - in particular Dal, Ball, Kosi, Gardiner. The reason why? Perhaps because none of the players think anymore who is going to win us this game. but each thinks - we are going to do it together. Who can really know? But it has happened and is the reason why Walls thinks we're a chance and why we have some reason to feel genuinely excited about this year.

I'll buy that logic.

Have said it for a while... it has to be player driven. This whole coach thing is null AFAIAC. Same coach and so far a new look team.

The coach can only lay down the rules... it's then up to the players to do what they have to. And so far, this appears to be happening.

[joffaboy]

yeah good points Richter.

The reliance on the top few seems to have become less.

There have been a few threads regarding the way RL has moulded the group in his own image and mabye this has more to do with the second tier players taking more responsibility in the past two games.

Really the retirement of a club great wouldn't be the only thing to have to do with any new mindset - it would be a combination of things and you are correct Riewoldt is still working into the season and Lenny was extremely underdone last night - niether had much influence however the team seemed to be in control for most of the night.

[stinger]

The poster made a fool of himself with the ignorant and totally inaccurate hyperbole.



Reactionary and totally lacking in any thought on the subject except to label and accuse

thank goodness most on this thread have the intelligence to see the real question and the topic not turn it into the usual pissing contest for puffed up egotists trolls and thread jackers.

not surprisingly ....those three sentences aptly describe you...... to a tee..


also not surprised to see the quality posters defending you.....

listen you troll go and flame another thread - you have had nothing to say on the subject at all.

You have been reported to the mods for constant trolling.

why don't you go and have a real sook, bookkeeper....ffs....i have done nothing but comment on your piss poor op......don't want pple to have a go at you...don't post rubbish.....

...i'm reporting you to the mods for offensive name calling....i am not a troll....

[Beej]

Ross Lyon and co must be coaching better too. Lyon has already attributed our forward-pressure to the acquisition of Leigh Tudor, but I'm not so sure.

It must be due to the fact that Robert Harvey is no longer looking over the shoulders of everyone at the club.

Such a wave of relief has swept through Moorabbin since Harvey packed his bags. The whole place is buzzing now without the shackles that Robert Harvey had us in for far too long.

We're 2-0. Yes, that's right, 2 and zip. But it's not just the fact that this is undoubtably the greatest 2-0 start in VFL/AFL history, not just the fact we're playing footy from another planet, it's the manner in which our players have suddenly lived up to their potential in the space of only two weeks. So much so that we need to look for reasons for this AMAZING turnaround in fortunes. And the answer is obvious - we're structurally and psychologically better off now without the burden that was Robert Harvey.

Luke Ball kicked 50 metres from a set-shot on Friday night too. Maybe because Robert Harvey struggled to kick 50 during his final years that Luke Ball thought it wasn't effective to do so either, such is the high esteem Ball held Harvey in.

Wow. This is all making sense.

How we managed to finish top four last season DESPITE Robert Harvey playing for us is a miracle. Credit to the coaching staff and the players for battling through such crippling circumstances.

Good riddance Banger, don't let the door smack your ass on the way out.

RIP Saintsational.

[WayneJudson42]

The poster made a fool of himself with the ignorant and totally inaccurate hyperbole.



Reactionary and totally lacking in any thought on the subject except to label and accuse

thank goodness most on this thread have the intelligence to see the real question and the topic not turn it into the usual pissing contest for puffed up egotists trolls and thread jackers.

not surprisingly ....those three sentences aptly describe you...... to a tee..


also not surprised to see the quality posters defending you.....

listen you troll go and flame another thread - you have had nothing to say on the subject at all.

You have been reported to the mods for constant trolling.

why don't you go and have a real sook, bookkeeper....ffs....i have done nothing but comment on your piss poor op......don't want pple to have a go at you...don't post rubbish.....

...i'm reporting you to the mods for offensive name calling....i am not a troll....

Q: You know what happens when you drink lemon juice and eat Twisties all day, don't you?

A: You become a bitter and twisted person.

[SainterK]

No, I don't agree at all....

But, I do think we need to move on to 2009. By all means Robert Harvey is legend of the club, and we should never forget his contribution and service. But these kind of threads are futile IMO, he is now at Carlton and I am sure soley focused to the task at hand.

If you want to be inspired by Harvey, well we should do much of the same...focus

[joffaboy]

...i'm reporting you to the mods for offensive name calling....i am not a troll....

please post on subject and stop trolling and attempting to jack the thread in a flame war.

You have been reported and i will do so again if you continue to troll.

You ARE trolling this thread and attempting to take it OT.

Doesn't matter if you deny it or not - it is the definition of trolling. You have made it personal and your post have nothing to do with the thread.

Go and wreck a different thread - or better still start a new thread on football and try to have a discussion about it instead of attempting to make the thread about you and your ego.

You are on ignore in this thread because anything you post is obviously a troll and is worthless.

[WayneJudson42]

Ross Lyon and co must be coaching better too. Lyon has already attributed our forward-pressure to the acquisition of Leigh Tudor, but I'm not so sure.

It must be due to the fact that Robert Harvey is no longer looking over the shoulders of everyone at the club.

Such a wave of relief has swept through Moorabbin since Harvey packed his bags. The whole place is buzzing now without the shackles that Robert Harvey had us in for far too long.

We're 2-0. Yes, that's right, 2 and zip. But it's not just the fact that this is undoubtably the greatest 2-0 start in VFL/AFL history, not just the fact we're playing footy from another planet, it's the manner in which our players have suddenly lived up to their potential in the space of only two weeks. So much so that we need to look for reasons for this AMAZING turnaround in fortunes. And the answer is obvious - we're structurally and psychologically better off now without the burden that was Robert Harvey.

Luke Ball kicked 50 metres from a set-shot on Friday night too. Maybe because Robert Harvey struggled to kick 50 during his final years that Luke Ball thought it wasn't effective to do so either, such is the high esteem Ball held Harvey in.

Wow. This is all making sense.

How we managed to finish top four last season DESPITE Robert Harvey playing for us is a miracle. Credit to the coaching staff and the players for battling through such crippling circumstances.

Good riddance Banger, don't let the door smack your ass on the way out.

RIP Saintsational.

Ok, Mrs Harvey... we get your point.

[stinger]

Wooo hooo we're 2 and zip. We're on fire. Give us the flag now. And what is the reason for our Premiership form? Harvey's gone, it must be the fact he's missing.

Kosi's playing good footy. He must be reveling in the fact Harves' shadow isn't following him around anymore. Dal Santo too.

Joey has been playing well, thank god he's been released from those chains that Harves had him in.

In hindsight, we should've delisted Harves long ago had we known the lads would respond like this.

The post-Harvey era has begun.

I pray the great man, the greatest our club has seen, doesn't read this forum. Total lack of respect.

at the risk of being abused , called a troll, threatened with the mods and accused of still trying to hijack jb's thread, ...i must say i totally agree with the sentiments so eloquently expressed by you in your well thought out and constructed response to one of the most offensive op's i have had the misfortune to read.....

dont read it then. Nobody forces you to come on to a thread and troll and abuse and threaten

I do find it amusing that you would side with one of the most ignorant and silly posts on the thread.

The poster made a fool of himself with the ignorant and totally inaccurate hyperbole.

That you would agree does not suprise me in the least.

Reactionary and totally lacking in any thought on the subject except to label and accuse

thank goodness most on this thread have the intelligence to see the real question and the topic not turn it into the usual pissing contest for puffed up egotists trolls and thread jackers.

Not suprised you are at the forefront and attempt to wreck another thread.

You have nothing to say on the subject of any worth apart to rubbish it.

So typical.

think he must have been referring to you and me qlb............seeing that neither of us have the intelligence to understanfd what this grat man is trying to say.....you would wonder why he bothers to reply to either of us at all.....must have struck a nerve.....eh?...he must know how silly his op really is.....

[WayneJudson42]

Wooo hooo we're 2 and zip. We're on fire. Give us the flag now. And what is the reason for our Premiership form? Harvey's gone, it must be the fact he's missing.

Kosi's playing good footy. He must be reveling in the fact Harves' shadow isn't following him around anymore. Dal Santo too.

Joey has been playing well, thank god he's been released from those chains that Harves had him in.

In hindsight, we should've delisted Harves long ago had we known the lads would respond like this.

The post-Harvey era has begun.

I pray the great man, the greatest our club has seen, doesn't read this forum. Total lack of respect.

at the risk of being abused , called a troll, threatened with the mods and accused of still trying to hijack jb's thread, ...i must say i totally agree with the sentiments so eloquently expressed by you in your well thought out and constructed response to one of the most offensive op's i have had the misfortune to read.....

dont read it then. Nobody forces you to come on to a thread and troll and abuse and threaten

I do find it amusing that you would side with one of the most ignorant and silly posts on the thread.

The poster made a fool of himself with the ignorant and totally inaccurate hyperbole.

That you would agree does not suprise me in the least.

Reactionary and totally lacking in any thought on the subject except to label and accuse

thank goodness most on this thread have the intelligence to see the real question and the topic not turn it into the usual pissing contest for puffed up egotists trolls and thread jackers.

Not suprised you are at the forefront and attempt to wreck another thread.

You have nothing to say on the subject of any worth apart to rubbish it.

So typical.

think he must have been referring to you and me qlb............seeing that neither of us have the intelligence to understanfd what this grat man is trying to say.....you would wonder why he bothers to reply to either of us at all.....must have struck a nerve.....eh?...he must know how silly his op really is.....

wow, you've finally got a friend...

I'm hurt.

[Beej]

Wooo hooo we're 2 and zip. We're on fire. Give us the flag now. And what is the reason for our Premiership form? Harvey's gone, it must be the fact he's missing.

Kosi's playing good footy. He must be reveling in the fact Harves' shadow isn't following him around anymore. Dal Santo too.

Joey has been playing well, thank god he's been released from those chains that Harves had him in.

In hindsight, we should've delisted Harves long ago had we known the lads would respond like this.

The post-Harvey era has begun.

I pray the great man, the greatest our club has seen, doesn't read this forum. Total lack of respect.

at the risk of being abused , called a troll, threatened with the mods and accused of still trying to hijack jb's thread, ...i must say i totally agree with the sentiments so eloquently expressed by you in your well thought out and constructed response to one of the most offensive op's i have had the misfortune to read.....

dont read it then. Nobody forces you to come on to a thread and troll and abuse and threaten

I do find it amusing that you would side with one of the most ignorant and silly posts on the thread.

The poster made a fool of himself with the ignorant and totally inaccurate hyperbole.

That you would agree does not suprise me in the least.

Reactionary and totally lacking in any thought on the subject except to label and accuse

thank goodness most on this thread have the intelligence to see the real question and the topic not turn it into the usual pissing contest for puffed up egotists trolls and thread jackers.

Not suprised you are at the forefront and attempt to wreck another thread.

You have nothing to say on the subject of any worth apart to rubbish it.

So typical.

think he must have been referring to you and me qlb............seeing that neither of us have the intelligence to understanfd what this grat man is trying to say.....you would wonder why he bothers to reply to either of us at all.....must have struck a nerve.....eh?...he must know how silly his op really is.....

I am gobsmacked that someone could write that. It's not that JB doesn't know his footy either because he's definitely one of the more knowledgeable on the forum but that was just an excuse to be a little controversial.

The thing that puzzles me is that we're only 2-0. It's not as if we're setting the world alight at the moment.

Who's to say we won't finish higher than we did last season?

Who's to say that Adelaide won't be cannon fodder for most teams home or away for the rest of the season?

It's not as if it's a totally remarkable turnaround, is it?

And to suggest that Robert Harvey not being around is in some way the catalyst in all of this is just a lack of respect for the greatest ever St Kilda player I've ever seen.

[stinger]

...i'm reporting you to the mods for offensive name calling....i am not a troll....

please post on subject and stop trolling and attempting to jack the thread in a flame war.

You have been reported and i will do so again if you continue to troll.

You ARE trolling this thread and attempting to take it OT.

Doesn't matter if you deny it or not - it is the definition of trolling. You have made it personal and your post have nothing to do with the thread.

Go and wreck a different thread - or better still start a new thread on football and try to have a discussion about it instead of attempting to make the thread about you and your ego.

You are on ignore in this thread because anything you post is obviously a troll and is worthless.

on ignore.....????...i thought that only worked on my computer......i have grumpy one and that other creep on ignore.....


..i have said i don't agree with you...that your op is a joke..that you are casting dispersions on the character and integrity of the st kilda players who have represented the club for the past two games...don't agree with me...i don't give a rats....but i will give you marks for your ingenuity....you are not game to abuse me ,as you have the other posters who have disagreed with you.....so you call me a troll, and accuse me of trying to hijack your thread....cute

but ...returning to your thread...i'm sure kossi and roo appreciate banger not being there as he made it look to easy for them...you know ...those dinky little 20 metre passes on to their chest made them soft......better to have to run and fight for their kicks....ffs...

[WayneJudson42]

Wooo hooo we're 2 and zip. We're on fire. Give us the flag now. And what is the reason for our Premiership form? Harvey's gone, it must be the fact he's missing.

Kosi's playing good footy. He must be reveling in the fact Harves' shadow isn't following him around anymore. Dal Santo too.

Joey has been playing well, thank god he's been released from those chains that Harves had him in.

In hindsight, we should've delisted Harves long ago had we known the lads would respond like this.

The post-Harvey era has begun.

I pray the great man, the greatest our club has seen, doesn't read this forum. Total lack of respect.

at the risk of being abused , called a troll, threatened with the mods and accused of still trying to hijack jb's thread, ...i must say i totally agree with the sentiments so eloquently expressed by you in your well thought out and constructed response to one of the most offensive op's i have had the misfortune to read.....

dont read it then. Nobody forces you to come on to a thread and troll and abuse and threaten

I do find it amusing that you would side with one of the most ignorant and silly posts on the thread.

The poster made a fool of himself with the ignorant and totally inaccurate hyperbole.

That you would agree does not suprise me in the least.

Reactionary and totally lacking in any thought on the subject except to label and accuse

thank goodness most on this thread have the intelligence to see the real question and the topic not turn it into the usual pissing contest for puffed up egotists trolls and thread jackers.

Not suprised you are at the forefront and attempt to wreck another thread.

You have nothing to say on the subject of any worth apart to rubbish it.

So typical.

think he must have been referring to you and me qlb............seeing that neither of us have the intelligence to understanfd what this grat man is trying to say.....you would wonder why he bothers to reply to either of us at all.....must have struck a nerve.....eh?...he must know how silly his op really is.....

I am gobsmacked that someone could write that. It's not that JB doesn't know his footy either because he's definitely one of the more knowledgeable on the forum but that was just an excuse to be a little controversial.

The thing that puzzles me is that we're only 2-0. It's not as if we're setting the world alight at the moment.

Who's to say we won't finish higher than we did last season?

Who's to say that Adelaide won't be cannon fodder for most teams home or away for the rest of the season?

It's not as if it's a totally remarkable turnaround, is it?

And to suggest that Robert Harvey not being around is in some way the catalyst in all of this is just a lack of respect for the greatest ever St Kilda player I've ever seen.

With respect, you've over reacted IMO. Harvey like anyone should be open to discussion.

I don't agree with the OP, but understand the question. I reckon tha Ricther put it into perspective.

Maybe it's not so much the departure of 35... but a change in attitude.

[joffaboy]

Ross Lyon and co must be coaching better too. Lyon has already attributed our forward-pressure to the acquisition of Leigh Tudor, but I'm not so sure.

yes good point.

It must be due to the fact that Robert Harvey is no longer looking over the shoulders of everyone at the club.

Whose shoulder was RH looking over? Harvs was the consumate club man.

Such a wave of relief has swept through Moorabbin since Harvey packed his bags. The whole place is buzzing now without the shackles that Robert Harvey had us in for far too long.

I dont understand your derision and sarcasm. Nobody said it was Harveys fault or he was a hinderance to the club. he did everthing in his power and MORE to get the Saints a flag.

mabye if some of his teammates tried a little harder and didn't leave him to do so much heavy lifting for so long he may well have got the flag he so richly deserved.

We're 2-0. Yes, that's right, 2 and zip.

Yes thats correct. A fairly good start - long way to go. Every thinking person acknowledges that.

But it's not just the fact that this is undoubtably the greatest 2-0 start in VFL/AFL history,

who said that???

not just the fact we're playing footy from another planet, it's the manner in which our players have suddenly lived up to their potential in the space of only two weeks.

Nobody has stated that. We are playing pretty good hard iat it football but as St.Mart has stated our disposal and footskills still leave a lot to be desired.

i would say a good start but not extraordinary.

So much so that we need to look for reasons for this AMAZING turnaround in fortunes. And the answer is obvious - we're structurally and psychologically better off now without the burden that was Robert Harvey.

There has been no AMAZING turnaround. It is just that the team is playing a much better brand of TEAM football where the second tier players are not leaving it to the few as has always been the case with the Saints.

Anyway my Op was a question not a statement. Mabye you should re-read the OP and stop being silly.

Luke Ball kicked 50 metres from a set-shot on Friday night too. Maybe because Robert Harvey struggled to kick 50 during his final years that Luke Ball thought it wasn't effective to do so either, such is the high esteem Ball held Harvey in.

Why would this be the case? Luke Ball has had OP for years and may finally be shaking it off. Harv's had hammy problems and so tailored his kicking to that limitation.

I really dont understand how you could get any similarity.

Wow. This is all making sense.

No you are not making much sense at all I'm afraid.

How we managed to finish top four last season DESPITE Robert Harvey playing for us is a miracle. Credit to the coaching staff and the players for battling through such crippling circumstances.

We made the top four BECAUSE of Banger. If you wish to want to totally misrepresent my OP - go ahead - however you are making a fool of yourself in the process.

the majority of posters who replied on this thread did not think that Harv's retirement had much to do with what the club is doing now on the field - but at least have the good sense and decency not to totally take the OP and totally misrepresent the sentiment involved in it.

Good riddance Banger, don't let the door smack your ass on the way out.

One of the worst things I have read from a poster on here about Robert Harvey.

Harvey was one of our greatest players and should be honoured. Posters like you should not make such terrible statements about Robert Harvey - he played his guts out for the club.

You should hang your head in shame for posting that about Harvey

RIP Saintsational.

Rip any sensible discussion when you are involved apparently.

[matrix]

[stinger]

[
I am gobsmacked that someone could write that. It's not that JB doesn't know his footy either because he's definitely one of the more knowledgeable on the forum but that was just an excuse to be a little controversial.

well...yes...but you may be being a little too kind there.....

[WayneJudson42]

...i'm reporting you to the mods for offensive name calling....i am not a troll....

please post on subject and stop trolling and attempting to jack the thread in a flame war.

You have been reported and i will do so again if you continue to troll.

You ARE trolling this thread and attempting to take it OT.

Doesn't matter if you deny it or not - it is the definition of trolling. You have made it personal and your post have nothing to do with the thread.

Go and wreck a different thread - or better still start a new thread on football and try to have a discussion about it instead of attempting to make the thread about you and your ego.

You are on ignore in this thread because anything you post is obviously a troll and is worthless.

on ignore.....????...i thought that only worked on my computer......i have grumpy one and that other creep on ignore.....


..i have said i don't agree with you...that your op is a joke..that you are casting dispersions on the character and integrity of the st kilda players who have represented the club for the past two games...don't agree with me...i don't give a rats....but i will give you marks for your ingenuity....you are not game to abuse me ,as you have the other posters who have disagreed with you.....so you call me a troll, and accuse me of trying to hijack your thread....cute

but ...returning to your thread...i'm sure kossi and roo appreciate banger not being there as he made it look to easy for them...you know ...those dinky little 20 metre passes on to their chest made them soft......better to have to run and fight for their kicks....ffs...

Gee mods, when will you get rid of this moron? All he does is abuse people and swear, and just gets away with it. Are you that scared of this gutless keyboard hero?

[joffaboy]

With respect, you've over reacted IMO. Harvey like anyone should be open to discussion.

Apparently not. I didn't realise the messiah complex ran so deep in some on here that they would purposely misrepresent the OP and completey skew the purpose.

I don't agree with the OP, but understand the question. I reckon tha Ricther put it into perspective.

Hey I probably dont either. It was a question after all - not a statement.

Richter got to the heart of it.

Maybe it's not so much the departure of 35... but a change in attitude.

And that was the whole point of the OP. Not to say were were "worse off" as some of the more excitable posters claimed - but to look at reason to why we are playing more as a team.

As I have stated - it is probably a combination of many things - Players maturing - Lyon's influence coming into the third season of coaching and his players playing gto his gameplan - a cnage in attitude because they cant rely on the great man (or men) to do it for them because Harvs will never be next to them on a football fiels as a player again.

That mental shift is subtle - but could be significant and is in line with GT's statement the other day (about St.Kilda and its culture of individualism) and Lyons statement about Cousins and no one individual will win them a flag.

Mabye the truth has finally started to sink in with some of these players.

And yes as I have stated many times - it is only two games into the season.

And BTW I think the question would still be valid if Harvs was still at the club as he is not a player anymore.

[stinger]

Gee mods, when will you get rid of this moron? All he does is abuse people and swear, and just gets away with it. Are you that scared of this gutless keyboard hero?

have a nice holiday stalker...

[joffaboy]

Gee mods, when will you get rid of this moron? All he does is abuse people and swear, and just gets away with it. Are you that scared of this gutless keyboard hero?

Just ignore it WJ42.

Really the guy is a troll and I have reported him to the mods. Hopefully they will do something about his blatant and fragrant trolling and jacking.

OLB is very anti my OP. Fair enough. At least he had the decency to deride it and post on topic even though his posting was lwo rent - sarcastic - and misrepresentative. But at least it had some semblance of relevance

[WayneJudson42]

I reckon it's a combo of some players waking up and the delisting of some fragile players who weren't prepared to put in the work required.

Sometimes it can be like 98 where many players admitted that they simply expected to win the flag.

Lyon's statement about Cousins hit the nail on the head. He threw out the challenge to sertain players, and so far, they have responded.

His attitude about this was made clear last year when he continually hosed down the hype about Harvey's retirement. To me, that sounds like someone who had an inkling about the prevailing attitude amongst the team.

Add to that Voss article earlier in the year, and you see a pattern emerging. I dare say that Walls would also be privvy to what;s going on, given his relationship with RL.

What would be interesting would be a fly on the wall when RL made his statement about BC, and if there was any reference to history of relying on individuals... and if he thought the team expected or relied on a few players to get them over the line, and therefore were in cruise mode.

[WayneJudson42]

Gee mods, when will you get rid of this moron? All he does is abuse people and swear, and just gets away with it. Are you that scared of this gutless keyboard hero?

have a nice holiday stalker...

Why, were am I going? I thought you were ignoring me?

Truth too much to face up to, is it?

You call women fat, and commentators t^rds, and then have the hypocrisy to call me a stalker.

LOL. Get off the lemon juice and twistes.

Oh, give me an H... H!

Give me a Y... Y!

Give me a P... P!

Give me an O... O!

Give me a C... C!

Give me an R... R!

Give me an I... I!

Give me a T... T!

Give me an E... E!

What do they spell???

Stinger, clap clap clap.

Stinger, clap clap clap.