Youth Policy

[makaveli]

Im really interested to hear anyones thoughts on this... I really fear we are going to have a tough year next year.

We have quite a strong backline - lead by some guns (Fish and Maxy), that gell well and work together.

We have a strong and potentially very potent foward line with some gun key fowards and excellent crumbing options.

BUT

What we lack is pace and hardness in the middle. Lenny and Bally cant do it all and neither are the quickest going around. More run and tougher bodies through this area are essential - not only to provide more foward thrusts thus presenting Roo and the like with more opportunities but also placing more defensive pressure on the opposition mids, helping the boys down back too. We have been shown up by teams with quicker midfields a number of times in the last few years. Geelong and Hawthorn tore us to shreds in the finals and as good as I think Ball is, he wasnt the difference between us getting much closer to these teams. We have virtually ignored bolstering this area in all our trading!

Im excited about the guys we have picked up in the National draft and to a lesser extent the Rookie draft, but these are players who we cant expect to step directly into league footy and have an impact. The selections we have made suggest RL is looking more to the future rather than reaching the ultimate sucess in the next few years. Ray and Begley are not going to fill the void between us and the Hawks & Cats.... And with Carlton and Richmond probably on their way to being genuine contenders in the next few years I think we are actually further away than we want to believe.

There is no use going over the BC situation, but he was one individual the club could have selected to significantly bridge the gap between us and the pace setters of the comp.

The 'youth policy' is great for our future, and I look foward to watching some of the new guys come through - But how many times as Saints fans have we had to look forward to the future. 6 years ago the future was Ball, Goddard, Roo, Kosi, Maguire, X etc... Still no flag.

Are we starting again here????

[Saints94]

I'd prefer a youth policy then be a sydney and have a team avarage of

28 years old

[Armoooo]

I don't think we are, I think we are doing a mini rebuild, it may see us fall around the middle for a year or two, maybe even closer to the bottom but it will bring future success built around our core group which are just entering their prime...

[makaveli]

I'd prefer a youth policy then be a sydney and have a team avarage of

28 years old

I couldnt give a stuff if we had a team of 28yo's if wed won a flag in the last 4 years!!.... or 50...

[Saints94]

Ross Lyon and crew are planning for the future and the crop of kids

that we have drafted so far its looking great and a bright future

[Saints94]

I'd prefer a youth policy then be a sydney and have a team avarage of

28 years old

I couldnt give a stuff if we had a team of 28yo's if wed won a flag in the last 4 years!!

Well i would prefer to plan for the future and have long-term players

[james rose]

I don't think its too bad.... natural development of some of the younger guys should get us some pace as do begly and ray...

Goddard/Gram?Fisher though the middle
ball playing
The clarkes improving/playing
Maguire- hopefully

[WayneJudson42]

Midfield reipe...

Start with Ball and Lenny.

Add:

Joey
Dal
Ray
Gram
BJ


Hmmm. Not bad for a slow middle.

[Animal Enclosure]

I think it's incorrect to say that 1st year players cannot have a influence immediately, especially if they are playing support roles with established players doing to majority of the work. If Lynch & Heyne get their chance I would not be at all surprised if either become best 22 players by the end of the season.

The pace issues will remain until Gram realises that he should be an elite player & stops his half hearted efforts. He is the one who can instantly change the whole make up of our midfield. Adding BJ and Bakes to Bally & Lenny gives us as tough and hard hitting an on ball division as anyone. We also desperately need Dal & Joey to take the next step & be consistently elite.

Simply put we need all blokes to put their hands up & play come career best footy. We've got the cattle in the middle, it's just application & injuries that have made us look average.

[Saints94]

Midfield reipe...

Start with Ball and Lenny.

Add:

Joey
Dal
Ray
Gram
BJ


Hmmm. Not bad for a slow middle.

Add Smith, Jones, Heyne, Steven, Choo,choo to that and theres your long term future

[makaveli]

Midfield reipe...

Start with Ball and Lenny.

Add:

Joey
Dal
Ray
Gram
BJ


Hmmm. Not bad for a slow middle.

Love all our players... BUT apart from BJ, nobody here gets the hard footy (excluding ball & lenny of course).. Dal will get 45 touches against Melbourne again this year, and wont get a touch when he plays on a half decent tagger, Gram is a gun but doesnt get much of his own footy, Ray has HUGE question marks about him (IN - F.RAY, OUT - A.FIORA) and Joey can go missing too.

Apart from Ball, Lenny and BJ in the midfield we dont have much consistency and we dont have enough hardness. If we do have the pace we sure as hell dont use it!

[Saints94]

Midfield reipe...

Start with Ball and Lenny.

Add:

Joey
Dal
Ray
Gram
BJ


Hmmm. Not bad for a slow middle.

Love all our players... BUT apart from BJ here nobody here gets the hard footy (excluding ball & lenny of course).. Dal will get 45 touches against Melbourne again this year, Gram is a gun but doesnt get much of his own footy, Ray has HUGE questionmarks about him (IN - F.RAY, OUT - A.FIORA) and Joey can go missing too.

Apart from Ball, Lenny and BJ in the midfield we dont have much consistency and we dont have enough hardness. If we do have the pace we sure as hell dont use it!

Armo will add that more hardness at the footy and maybe Heyne?

[makaveli]

Midfield reipe...

Start with Ball and Lenny.

Add:

Joey
Dal
Ray
Gram
BJ


Hmmm. Not bad for a slow middle.

Love all our players... BUT apart from BJ here nobody here gets the hard footy (excluding ball & lenny of course).. Dal will get 45 touches against Melbourne again this year, Gram is a gun but doesnt get much of his own footy, Ray has HUGE questionmarks about him (IN - F.RAY, OUT - A.FIORA) and Joey can go missing too.

Apart from Ball, Lenny and BJ in the midfield we dont have much consistency and we dont have enough hardness. If we do have the pace we sure as hell dont use it!

Armo will add that more hardness at the footy and maybe Heyne?

I sure hope so. The thing is we need them now. Not next year. Not in the future. This club has too much talent to be wasted 'developing' again. Now is the time. We have Roo, Kosi, BJ, Ball, Dal, X, Fish, Max, Milne, Shnider, King, Joey, Lenny, Gram.... if Armo & Heyne step up next year and fill in for our soft midfilders then we are a chance.

[james rose]

lets not forget that eddy has been serviceable and provides pace likewise jones

[makaveli]

Dal Santo and pick 13 for D.Kerr.

B.Cousins for nothing.

Jeeeze wed be booked in for the last Saturday in September!

[Saints94]

lets not forget that eddy has been serviceable and provides pace likewise jones

Jones just needs to learn how to kick straight...... example DeBour is a ball winning magnet but got overlooked for Dawson all DeBour needs to do is improve his kicking

[mick13]

Dal Santo and pick 13 for D.Kerr.

B.Cousins for nothing.

Jeeeze wed be booked in for the last Saturday in September!

Yeah for sure.

[bergholt]

Elite:
Hayes
Dal Santo
Ball
Goddard
Montagna
Gram

These six are very solid, with serious improvement still possible from both Goddard and Gram. Not to mention Joey had a poor year last year, and Bally would have much more impact if fit all year. If everything goes right, this group alone can carry us to the finals.

Good:
Fisher S
Jones
Ray
Schneider
Clarke X
McQualter
Eddy

This is the problematic group. Sammy Fisher and Jones are reliable but not superstars (in that area). The others variously provide an effort (X, Mini, Eddy) or flash in and out of games (Schneider, Ray). None have yet shown themselves to be reliable ball-winners or playmakers week-in, week-out.

But there's upside. I still have in-and-under faith in X, if he can stay fit. Ray, Jones and Eddy have still got a lot of potential. But S Fisher is more useful in defence, Schneider will never be more than a cameo small forward in the Nick David mould, and I don't rate McQualter except for heart. We desperately need players to move up into this group.

Others:
Armitage
Baker
Fisher L
Geary
Blake
Begley
Clarke R
Dempster
Gwilt
Gilbert

This one's a really mixed bag, but this is where our improvement has to come from. Armo and Geary are the big hopes for this year, with a couple of pre-seasons under the belt now - let's hope the penny drops for both and they lift to consistent AFL level. Bakes and L Fisher could still be regular senior players, hopefully, as they both were good once. The rest are probably better suited elsewhere on the ground.

Kids:
Howard, Connors, Steven, Heyne, McGarry, Smith

And who knows what will happen with these - anything in the short term would be a bonus.

[Saints94]

Elite:
Hayes
Dal Santo
Ball
Goddard
Montagna
Gram

These six are very solid, with serious improvement still possible from both Goddard and Gram. Not to mention Joey had a poor year last year, and Bally would have much more impact if fit all year. If everything goes right, this group alone can carry us to the finals.

Good:
Fisher S
Jones
Ray
Schneider
Clarke X
McQualter
Eddy

This is the problematic group. Sammy Fisher and Jones are reliable but not superstars (in that area). The others variously provide an effort (X, Mini, Eddy) or flash in and out of games (Schneider, Ray). None have yet shown themselves to be reliable ball-winners or playmakers week-in, week-out.

But there's upside. I still have in-and-under faith in X, if he can stay fit. Ray, Jones and Eddy have still got a lot of potential. But S Fisher is more useful in defence, Schneider will never be more than a cameo small forward in the Nick David mould, and I don't rate McQualter except for heart. We desperately need players to move up into this group.

Others:
Armitage
Baker
Fisher L
Geary
Blake
Begley
Clarke R
Dempster
Gwilt
Gilbert

This one's a really mixed bag, but this is where our improvement has to come from. Armo and Geary are the big hopes for this year, with a couple of pre-seasons under the belt now - let's hope the penny drops for both and they lift to consistent AFL level. Bakes and L Fisher could still be regular senior players, hopefully, as they both were good once. The rest are probably better suited elsewhere on the ground.

Kids:
Howard, Connors, Steven, Heyne, McGarry, Smith

And who knows what will happen with these - anything in the short term would be a bonus.

Great read but Sam Fisher should be in the elite section as he is our club champion of 2008

[bergholt]

Great read but Sam Fisher should be in the elite section as he is our club champion of 2008

Yeah, but he's not elite in the midfield. Good, but it's as a rebounding defender that he's top-line.

[Saints94]

Great read but Sam Fisher should be in the elite section as he is our club champion of 2008

Yeah, but he's not elite in the midfield. Good, but it's as a rebounding defender that he's top-line.

When Ray or Begley free up Fisher then he will be elite in the midfield

[sunsaint]

Ross Lyon and crew are planning for the future and the crop of kids

that we have drafted so far its looking great and a bright future

I love this argument, "look at what we have drafted" !!!
havent all clubs done exactly the same thing?
I agree makaveli, going into '08 I was happily confident about our prospects, we had drafted well & improved our stocks. And when Dempster went down he left a big hole. This year the team list has gone backwards, call it what you like mini rebuild etc. but the way I see it unless you are on the bottom then you have to improve every year, and list maintenance should be split between what is good for next season and some young ones. The thing you have to remember is that Hawks/Geelong will be up there for the next 2-3yrs, Crows Carlton/Tigers are coming and will be up for at least 5yrs, Ess are calling to push the eight.
I think in our circumstance 5yrs is a very long time

[Saints94]

Ross Lyon and crew are planning for the future and the crop of kids

that we have drafted so far its looking great and a bright future

I love this argument, "look at what we have drafted" !!!
havent all clubs done exactly the same thing?
I agree makaveli, going into '08 I was happily confident about our prospects, we had drafted well & improved our stocks. And when Dempster went down he left a big hole. This year the team list has gone backwards, call it what you like mini rebuild etc. but the way I see it unless you are on the bottom then you have to improve every year, and list maintenance should be split between what is good for next season and some young ones. The thing you have to remember is that Hawks/Geelong will be up there for the next 2-3yrs, Crows Carlton/Tigers are coming and will be up for at least 5yrs, Ess are calling to push the eight.
I think in our circumstance 5yrs is a very long time

Our draft record has been woefull over the last couple of years (except Gilbert) and i thought we filled in the holes for this years draft

[WayneJudson42]

Ross Lyon and crew are planning for the future and the crop of kids

that we have drafted so far its looking great and a bright future

I love this argument, "look at what we have drafted" !!!
havent all clubs done exactly the same thing?
I agree makaveli, going into '08 I was happily confident about our prospects, we had drafted well & improved our stocks. And when Dempster went down he left a big hole. This year the team list has gone backwards, call it what you like mini rebuild etc. but the way I see it unless you are on the bottom then you have to improve every year, and list maintenance should be split between what is good for next season and some young ones. The thing you have to remember is that Hawks/Geelong will be up there for the next 2-3yrs, Crows Carlton/Tigers are coming and will be up for at least 5yrs, Ess are calling to push the eight.
I think in our circumstance 5yrs is a very long time

Our draft record has been woefull over the last couple of years (except Gilbert) and i thought we filled in the holes for this years draft

Agree. The addition of ready made players such as Begs and Ray doesn't count for anything?

This is what gets me... apart from Gtrain who didn't play... all we've lost is Banger. On the plus side, we'll get Baker back as well as Goose and X. Farren Ray adds depth and give us more than enough options to replace Harvey. So how have we gone backwards?

[Saints94]

Ross Lyon and crew are planning for the future and the crop of kids

that we have drafted so far its looking great and a bright future

I love this argument, "look at what we have drafted" !!!
havent all clubs done exactly the same thing?
I agree makaveli, going into '08 I was happily confident about our prospects, we had drafted well & improved our stocks. And when Dempster went down he left a big hole. This year the team list has gone backwards, call it what you like mini rebuild etc. but the way I see it unless you are on the bottom then you have to improve every year, and list maintenance should be split between what is good for next season and some young ones. The thing you have to remember is that Hawks/Geelong will be up there for the next 2-3yrs, Crows Carlton/Tigers are coming and will be up for at least 5yrs, Ess are calling to push the eight.
I think in our circumstance 5yrs is a very long time

Our draft record has been woefull over the last couple of years (except Gilbert) and i thought we filled in the holes for this years draft

Agree. The addition of ready made players such as Begs and Ray doesn't count for anything?

This is what gets me... apart from Gtrain who didn't play... all we've lost is Banger. On the plus side, we'll get Baker back as well as Goose and X. Farren Ray adds depth and give us more than enough options to replace Harvey. So how have we gone backwards?

Like i said we drafted for the long term future and we filled all of our holes on the list