will we or won't we....do we have balls

[stinger]

are we prepared to separate from the herd.....i flowering hope so....


"
Saints having second thoughts as Ben Cousins confronts coalition of unwilling



Stephen Rielly | November 22, 2008
Article from: The Australian

THE AFL opened its door to Ben Cousins this week, which is not to say it extended a warm invitation to him on Tuesday.

In fact, as the week passed it became more obvious that a sense of obligation - legal and medical - rather than any sincere desire or goodwill brought the nine AFL commissioners to their decision.

That Cousins has, in their view, shamed the game and not only refused to acknowledge as much but demanded a return, offering in exchange little more than a smirk and a begrudging confession to an addiction to illicit drugs, rankles. Is contrition not a necessary step to recovery, they ask.

It galls them, too, that for all of the indications of substance abuse apparent in his increasingly erratic behaviour in 2006 and 2007, the competition's illicit drug testing program was unable to catch him out. Or, perhaps more accurately, out of it.

It is that much harder for the league to defend its reputation and the enlightened principles underpinning its recreational drug policy when all anyone has to do, even the most ignorant critic, is utter the name Cousins.

There are many reasons why Collingwood, having spent a number of months sorting through the pros and cons of recruiting the 2005 Brownlow medallist and former West Coast captain, decided in September to leave him be.

A concern that, at 30 years of age, he might not be physically capable of rising again to his extraordinary standards was one. The memory of the hamstring complaint that dogged his last season with the Eagles in 2007 and troubled him again this year, as he trained for his comeback, was another.

After being suspended for the first half of the season by the Eagles, Cousins played only seven games in 2007 before being deregistered by the league for bringing the game into disrepute.

There was the idea, too, that Cousins can only be a short-term proposition and therefore of limited value to a side that is being rebuilt to contend in the mid-term. Would he enable the Magpies to surpass or even close on Hawthorn or Geelong in 2009? The answer, as it was at Carlton and a number of other possible destinations, was no.

There was intelligence gathered for the club by a private detective that was taken into account, as was a private discussion with the chief of Victoria Police, Christine Nixon.

This cost-benefit analysis alone was enough to discourage the Magpies, but they certainly found it difficult, too, to ignore a strong suspicion the AFL would rather Cousins stay out in the cold. They are not alone in believing this, either. Cousins certainly holds to it and the only club still giving thought to recruiting him, St Kilda, is aware of the sentiment, of the distrust.

Well before he was informed this week that to play again next year he will have to submit to as many as three urine tests a week and regular hair testing that, to an extent, will dictate even how long or short his mop must be, Cousins felt the league did not want him back.

The AFL Players Association appeared to think along this line, too, when it asked on Wednesday for an explanation of the strict and unique terms of his return, wanting a sound medical rationale to dismiss the thought that the true motive must lie elsewhere. The AFLPA says it is still sifting through the evidence. Not that Cousins helped his cause at all by closely cropping the hair on his head and waxing his body this month.

It may simply have been an expression of appreciation for metrosexual fashion, and Cousins did pass yet another urine test at the time, but it was not a look that pleased AFL medical officials who were unable to complete their testing for the lack of a strand of hair at least three centimetres long. Such a sample can provide a history of drug use going back months.

Cousins says he wants foremost to return for the sake of his health, which made the threat to walk away from the game that was aired by his manager, Ricky Nixon, on Tuesday such a foolish position to adopt. By Wednesday, Cousins was committed to playing. He must nominate for next Saturday's national draft by Wednesday or the pre-season draft by December 9.

But he is also motivated by a powerful determination to prove wrong his detractors - a coalition, as he sees it, that includes the AFL and would condemn him to retirement as a disgraced figure.

In any event, St Kilda must gird itself if, at a board meeting on Tuesday, it decides to recruit Cousins. It is much easier to run with the herd than break from it. The club will truly be out on its own if it agrees to take him, and every sceptic, on."

[joffaboy]

How effing much more can these hacks wring out of this story.

This crap and this from Smith

Importantly, coach Ross Lyon is said not to be in favour of the club drafting Cousins. But the coach has been over-ruled before. It is believed Lyon was not at all keen in Fraser Gehrig coming back to the club last year after the full-forward had previously announced his retirement. As it was, Gehrig played just five games and kicked nine goals. He was a liability as opponents ran off him at will, much as Lyon had feared.

So he is "said" to not be in favour??? By whom? More Smith mythical sources???

As for Gehrig - that is a blatant mistruth by Smith. A lie. A bit fat porky. (Sorry just slipped into Phatpryck style for a second there). It was Lyon who spoke to Gehrig and Lyon who decided to take him in the draft.

The Australian is a crappy rag at the best of times and their coverage of AFL is worse than the rest of their reporting.

The rag would love to drag out the story so they dont have to do any real work and actually find a new story.

Pitiful.

[fonz_#15]

with no quotes from people at the club i find it hard to believe

[saint66au]

Still looking through that article for any evidence that the Saints are having second thoughts...nope..cant even see it MENTIONED in the body of the article anywhere!!!

Loo Paper >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The Australian

[ausfatcat]

are we prepared to separate from the herd.....i flowering hope so....

Theres a reason the heard heads in one direction together

[saint75]

Has anyone stopped to think that maybe the others clubs have pulled out because they know it is a done deal already? Remember, the draft has to been seen as fair and *cough* equitable. Maybe it is more of a 'saving face' by saying they don't want him instead of it being more of a situation that Ben doesn't want them? Food for thought anyway.

[stinger]

are we prepared to separate from the herd.....i flowering hope so....

Theres a reason the heard heads in one direction together

lemmings?????

[WayneJudson42]

An interesting point in the paper about why some clubs aren't interested... and the fact that we're probably one of 4 genuine contenders for a flag.

If the filth or the scum believed they were a genuine chance, they'd be after him... make no mistake.

Port are happy to get Carr back, so having both probably won't work.

As for the reast, by the time they are in contention, BC will be too old.

Makse sense to me.

[stinger]

Has anyone stopped to think that maybe the others clubs have pulled out because they know it is a done deal already? Remember, the draft has to been seen as fair and *cough* equitable. Maybe it is more of a 'saving face' by saying they don't want him instead of it being more of a situation that Ben doesn't want them? Food for thought anyway.

nail..... hammer ....head....i was told months ago that benny was a done deal........came from benny's own mouth......the filth were just saving face...they lost out to us over fraser and couldn't face the fact that even a hop head....abet reformed ...would walk over them to play for the saints.......

[WayneJudson42]

Has anyone stopped to think that maybe the others clubs have pulled out because they know it is a done deal already? Remember, the draft has to been seen as fair and *cough* equitable. Maybe it is more of a 'saving face' by saying they don't want him instead of it being more of a situation that Ben doesn't want them? Food for thought anyway.

nail..... hammer ....head....i was told months ago that benny was a done deal........came from benny's own mouth......the filth were just saving face...they lost out to us over fraser and couldn't face the fact that even a hop head....abet reformed ...would walk over them to play for the saints.......

If that's the case, then I hope your'e right. Coz it means he's decided to prove a point and is committed.

[saint66au]

I'm convinced that the Pies pulled out from sponsor pressure, given that some of their sponsors might be hanging by a thread as it is given the events of last year

St Kilda dont have that problem

[saintspremiers]

I'm convinced that the Pies pulled out from sponsor pressure, given that some of their sponsors might be hanging by a thread as it is given the events of last year

St Kilda dont have that problem

Me too.

And would you blame them, given the Pies recent history?

I mean, they've even dumped Joffa from their latest advertising campaign!!!

As for Benny, we need him as much as he needs us.

[SainterK]

Has anyone stopped to think that maybe the others clubs have pulled out because they know it is a done deal already? Remember, the draft has to been seen as fair and *cough* equitable. Maybe it is more of a 'saving face' by saying they don't want him instead of it being more of a situation that Ben doesn't want them? Food for thought anyway.

nail..... hammer ....head....i was told months ago that benny was a done deal........came from benny's own mouth......the filth were just saving face...they lost out to us over fraser and couldn't face the fact that even a hop head....abet reformed ...would walk over them to play for the saints.......

So why didn't he name us as a preferred club like everyone anticipated, because he is actually handling this in house? (which I realise is the opposite to what the media would have us believe)

[Langi]

I was just surfing the net and came acrooss a picture of cuz chatting with friends at the opening of some clothes shop in perth, this is after he landed back in perth after meeting the saints directors ( thats what the paper said ) anyway ben looks happy in this picture, typical cuz smugness if you like which suggests to me he didn't exactly get bad news while he was in melbourne.

I know i'm probably clutching at straws a little bit but if he was told we were not going to pick him up i wouldn't think he would look as happy and relaxed as he seemed in that picture.

u can view that picture on the west australian website if u like.

Anyway thats my take on it and really hope we give ben a go.

[stinger]

I'm convinced that the Pies pulled out from sponsor pressure, given that some of their sponsors might be hanging by a thread as it is given the events of last year

St Kilda dont have that problem

no....they were never going to get him.......he wants to play footy with his mate.....

[stinger]

Has anyone stopped to think that maybe the others clubs have pulled out because they know it is a done deal already? Remember, the draft has to been seen as fair and *cough* equitable. Maybe it is more of a 'saving face' by saying they don't want him instead of it being more of a situation that Ben doesn't want them? Food for thought anyway.

nail..... hammer ....head....i was told months ago that benny was a done deal........came from benny's own mouth......the filth were just saving face...they lost out to us over fraser and couldn't face the fact that even a hop head....abet reformed ...would walk over them to play for the saints.......

So why didn't he name us as a preferred club like everyone anticipated, because he is actually handling this in house? (which I realise is the opposite to what the media would have us believe)

never had to......

[undecided]

voss flew to Perth to meet with Cousins over to weekend so Brisbane still might not be out of the race

[rodgerfox]

are we prepared to separate from the herd.....i flowering hope so....

Theres a reason the heard heads in one direction together

There is.

And that's to remain 'average'. To not stand out.

If you take the tact to do everything the same as everyone else - just hopefully better than them, that's fine. Good luck.

Or you can try to do things in certain areas that set you apart from the herd, in order to get an advantage.

[Saints Premiers 2008]

are we prepared to separate from the herd.....i flowering hope so....

Theres a reason the heard heads in one direction together

There is.

And that's to remain 'average'. To not stand out.

If you take the tact to do everything the same as everyone else - just hopefully better than them, that's fine. Good luck.

Or you can try to do things in certain areas that set you apart from the herd, in order to get an advantage.

its nothing to do with having balls or going with herds, the fact is that most clubs should not draft cousins due to it being pointless

especially in such an age whereby its imperitive to use every possible place on your list wisely and effectively, i.e. a team rebuilding from the ground up do not need cousins...he is a waste of space

[rodgerfox]

are we prepared to separate from the herd.....i flowering hope so....

Theres a reason the heard heads in one direction together

There is.

And that's to remain 'average'. To not stand out.

If you take the tact to do everything the same as everyone else - just hopefully better than them, that's fine. Good luck.

Or you can try to do things in certain areas that set you apart from the herd, in order to get an advantage.

its nothing to do with having balls or going with herds, the fact is that most clubs should not draft cousins due to it being pointless

especially in such an age whereby its imperitive to use every possible place on your list wisely and effectively, i.e. a team rebuilding from the ground up do not need cousins...he is a waste of space

To quite a wise man - "well derrrrrr".

[Pilgram]

its nothing to do with having balls or going with herds, the fact is that most clubs should not draft cousins due to it being pointless

especially in such an age whereby its imperitive to use every possible place on your list wisely and effectively, i.e. a team rebuilding from the ground up do not need cousins...he is a waste of space

i find that comment slightly ignorant when you consider the need for another quality midfielder.

[SainterK]

its nothing to do with having balls or going with herds, the fact is that most clubs should not draft cousins due to it being pointless

especially in such an age whereby its imperitive to use every possible place on your list wisely and effectively, i.e. a team rebuilding from the ground up do not need cousins...he is a waste of space

i find that comment slightly ignorant when you consider the need for another quality midfielder.

I think you will find that he is not referring to St Kilda...

[Pilgram]

saying that cousins is a waste of space to any team rebuilding from the ground up may be correct, however st. kilda are in the business of playing finals football and i fail to see what relevance the remark has.

[Ice Wolf]

its nothing to do with having balls or going with herds, the fact is that most clubs should not draft cousins due to it being pointless

especially in such an age whereby its imperitive to use every possible place on your list wisely and effectively, i.e. a team rebuilding from the ground up do not need cousins...he is a waste of space

i find that comment slightly ignorant when you consider the need for another quality midfielder.

Most teams aren't close enough for 1 quality midfielder to make a difference.
The bottom 12 would be wasting a pick if they were to pick him up, the bulldogs are covered on midfielders they need talls, Hawthorn and Geelong are covered on midfielders, Geelong might need a forward but thats it, Hawthorn could use tall defenders.
The only team that could be seen as to not wasting a pick is us.

[stinger]

its nothing to do with having balls or going with herds, the fact is that most clubs should not draft cousins due to it being pointless

especially in such an age whereby its imperitive to use every possible place on your list wisely and effectively, i.e. a team rebuilding from the ground up do not need cousins...he is a waste of space

of course it does........collingwood and brisbane both wanted him...but didn't have the balls to pursue him when the heat in the kitchen got to hot.....