Robert Harvey and the Big 3

[Saints in 20??]

This most recent age top 50, has once again highlighted that most journalists rate Hird, Buckley and Voss higher Robert Harvey.
Its more than just his refusal to promote himself. Its more than not being part of a premiership, as Buckley hasn't either.
For those of us who watched his entire career, this assessment is not only laughable but insulting. For a guy to play to such standards over 20 years at the one club when none of those three played as long or i believe as consistently and to be downvalued is outrageous.
Robert Harvey was the standout player on several occasions in interstate games when the cream of the footballers played and as such truly the best of the best.
The will power required to play so hard every game and drag the team over the line at times when it has seemed he is the only one trying is superhuman. I don't think there has been any time when anyone has questioned his dedication, work ethic and commitment. Brisbane, Collingwood and Essendon didnt have such long periods when they were hopeless as the saints have been during his career.
I have seen Lockett, Burke, Loewe and Winmar retire, but can't imagine the Saints without Robert Harvey in number 35.

[Beno88]

Spot On!

Harvey

Daylight

Hird
Voss
Buckley

[ThePunter]

I actually think Voss was the best out of those four. Hird was the most natural footballer, and was probably capable of playing the best football, but injuries and his body shape let him down. Buckley toiled in a terrible Collingwood side for a long time.

What does mark against Harvey is primarily his avoidance of self-promotion. All other three worked the media significantly.

Also, Harvey's finals record. Now, we know better, but with Hird and Voss being premiership captains, and Buckley being a Norm Smith medallist, this is the knock on Harvey. No one mentions how Harvey got 35 touches in the 1997 Grand Final, and the heroics of the 2005 QF have been overshadowed by the events of thirteen days later.

However, I would have Voss ahead of the other three, Harvey and Buckley pretty close, and Hird fourth.

[Hurricane]

Spot On!

Harvey

Daylight

Hird
Voss
Buckley

Totally agree with the exception of

Harvey

Daylight
More Daylight
Still More Daylight

Everyone else

BANG BANG

[Lenny = legend]

i think Mike Sheehan rates banger on the same level as those 3.

correct me if im wrong but I think in Mike's top 50 of all time Harvs was ahead of 2 of them; it went like Hird, Harvey, Voss, Buckley!

At the end of the day, the biggest champion is still out there getting kicks.

[terry smith rules]

um firstly it was NOT a panel of journalists but a panel of former players

secondly yes banger is much under rated

however to dismiss m.voss is very risky.

he was a sensational player, an amazing captain and leader, you need to watch the 3 grand finals again to see just how he could influence the game

he was as hard as anyone to play in recent times, he put his body over the ball and could not be moved, his delivery (both hand and foot) great.

fqf

[my les foote]

um firstly it was NOT a panel of journalists but a panel of former players



fqf

Who did Ron Carter play for?

How though anyone could rate Banger behind the likes of Cousins, Gary Wilson and John Rantall is beyond me.

[Dan Warna]

folks won't like me for saying this but from my recent years the two best players I would have at their peak at st kilda is leigh matthews and michael voss.

I would take lethal as a coach in a flash if he felt he wanted to coach st kilda and had as they say the 'fire in the belly'

[TimeToShineFellas]

however to dismiss m.voss is very risky.

he was a sensational player, an amazing captain and leader, you need to watch the 3 grand finals again to see just how he could influence the game

he was as hard as anyone to play in recent times, he put his body over the ball and could not be moved, his delivery (both hand and foot) great.

Agree with this assessment, this whole thread is poor to say the least.

Further proof that most St Kilda supporters base their success on an INDIVIDUAL'S success more than the TEAM'S success......

Probably explains why the Club's only won one flag, when the supporters always take into account the individual more than the team in terms of success. Still we're all happy with that hey.....

[terry smith rules]

um firstly it was NOT a panel of journalists but a panel of former players



fqf

Who did Ron Carter play for?

How though anyone could rate Banger behind the likes of Cousins, Gary Wilson and John Rantall is beyond me.

sorry apart from Carter

I agree with you entirely on the players mentioned. I would add Schmilbusch to the list as well.

Cousins in particular really gets me, especially whne Judd is not on the list at all

[Dan Warna]

however to dismiss m.voss is very risky.

he was a sensational player, an amazing captain and leader, you need to watch the 3 grand finals again to see just how he could influence the game

he was as hard as anyone to play in recent times, he put his body over the ball and could not be moved, his delivery (both hand and foot) great.

Agree with this assessment, this whole thread is poor to say the least.

Further proof that most St Kilda supporters base their success on an INDIVIDUAL'S success more than the TEAM'S success......

Probably explains why the Club's only won one flag, when the supporters always take into account the individual more than the team in terms of success. Still we're all happy with that hey.....

of course we aren't happy, but we have to take what enjoyment we can out of the years.

I certainly want to see a premiership, as one carlton supporter pointed out, 1/4 of ALL our wins over carlton have happened in the last 8 years.

thats a reflection on how bad we were.

and yeah it was pretty depressing watching those flogings we received year in year out.

no-one is happy, we all want a premiership, that doesn't mean we can't enjoy the feats of plugger, loewe, winmar, harvey and others over the years.

[Red]

As a midfielder Banger was as good as them but the other 3 could go

forward and had the ability to kick goals. I think that has to be an advantage

to the others. Overall I thought Voss was the best (best captain as well)

followed by Hird / Harvey and Buckley coming in last.

[Teflon]

I was dumbfounded by this Age top 50 and how ridiulous it was.

I mean seriously Ben Cousins ahead of Harvey? Greg Williams ahead of Harvey? Gary Wilson ahead of Harvey? FFS.....Ive heard it all......read the write ups on some of their selections - they even had 1 guy they selected (cant remember the name) cause as Tommy Hafey said "you couldnt leave him out cause he played 17 years consistentlt at the top level" - I read this and went WTF???? er.....try 21yrs???

Robert Harvey IMHO does not get the plaudits for changing how midfield football was played in the modern era - that is the gut busting, tag burnrng ability and endurance to be able to do this consistently all day. Before Harvey started doing it the "burn off a tag with endurance" wasn't the factor it is now. I was staggered recently when I heard on radio some clown suggesting this was Shane Crawford - FFS Shane Crawfords a fkn actor (poor one) and certainly followed Harvey - NOT the other way round.

Face facts - in this day and age all people see is the highlights reel and the goals from 50. They pay little respect to a guy many NOW start to understand possibly had the best 30 meter pass to a FF on the lead going round. A guy who just may have hit the games greatest goal kicker on the chest with regular monotony that it was simply expectected and not lauded for the skill that it involved. Finally, a guy who Buckley himself admitted to getting copies of tapes so he could study how he carried the football through traffic and broke tackles and got hands free - cause none did it better in that time.

Robert Harvey has NEVER IMHO truly been given the football respect he deserves and I do believe its because he didnt play for a succesful club OR Collingwood. Look at how we "rose color glass" Greg Williams - who I saw Harvey carve up often...but again...he played for the famous "old dark navy blues".....

Makes me sick. I stopped reading the Ages "Top 50" and relegated it to a bunch of old men (mostly from the "big clubs") sitting round talking bout glory days...........

History will judge Robert Harvey and it will do far more justice than those clowns ever could.

[The OtherThommo]

Don't worry 'bout it. The Man From Mt Eliza is who he is. Who gives a rat's freakin' freckle 'bout those that want to challenge him?

There is one great senior citizen playing AFL ball today. The best, the greatest, the athlete, the genius, the man that Darrell Baldock said kept him interested.

Ah, F*** it. When he goes, we're done.

[Teflon]

Don't worry 'bout it. The Man From Mt Eliza is who he is. Who gives a rat's freakin' freckle 'bout those that want to challenge him?

There is one great senior citizen playing AFL ball today. The best, the greatest, the athlete, the genius, the man that Darrell Baldock said kept him interested.

Ah, F*** it. When he goes, we're done.

I like the sig Thommo......about says it all....

[Richter]

Er, peeps, why do you reckon there is no Harvey, Judd or any other current player in the top 50.

Perhaps because it is a top 50 list of FORMER players - anybody still playing has not been included.



After all, Judd could yet win another flag/ Brownlonw, as could G Ablett. Lance Franklin, Johno Brown - surely they will be in the top 50 by the end of their careers.

IMO R Harvey has another 20 years in him. 2 more B and F's, a Norm Smith and 3 premierships.....

[The OtherThommo]

Not the point, "R" man. The criteria explained did not exclude anyone still playing. Ergo, your line is nonsense. Face it, the quiet man has never been rated by, mostly, the Dirty Digger's mob.

Who rate's him? His opponents. From Buckley's adoration, to Archer's celebration, back to Voss's salute, and then to Carey's recommendation.

There's only one and he is the best.

I continually get pissed off because this bloke is so underrated. When Doc said 'bout 4 years ago, that his joy from footy these days is watching Robert play, by Christ that's great. Baldock rates Banger as the reason he keeps watching? Jesus, that's enormous.

The greatest player we've had enjoys the greatest player we've had. Go figure.

[Teflon]

Er, peeps, why do you reckon there is no Harvey, Judd or any other current player in the top 50.

Perhaps because it is a top 50 list of FORMER players - anybody still playing has not been included.



After all, Judd could yet win another flag/ Brownlonw, as could G Ablett. Lance Franklin, Johno Brown - surely they will be in the top 50 by the end of their careers.

IMO R Harvey has another 20 years in him. 2 more B and F's, a Norm Smith and 3 premierships.....

Ummm...you might want to check the list of players who were "excluded" Richter...there you will find the name of R Harvey among others as having "just missed out"

BTW - who says Ben Cousins if finished???

[Dan Warna]

BTW - who says Ben Cousins if finished???

Many people say he is finished.

most clubs don't want him.

the rest shouldn't trust him, he's a liar, a proven liar, and even if he says he's off the sauce, you'd want substantive tests to prove it, because his word isn't worth anything.

i certainly have no respect for anything he's achieved because you have no proof how far back his on field achievements were 'tainted'.

[Iceman234]

BTW - who says Ben Cousins if finished???

Many people say he is finished.

most clubs don't want him.

the rest shouldn't trust him, he's a liar, a proven liar, and even if he says he's off the sauce, you'd want substantive tests to prove it, because his word isn't worth anything.

i certainly have no respect for anything he's achieved because you have no proof how far back his on field achievements were 'tainted'.

Second that.

Dirty little lying drug addicted piece of rubbish.

Would never want that piece of crap near our boys.


Cheat and should never be allowed to play at the highest level ever again.

Lying scum.

[Teflon]

BTW - who says Ben Cousins if finished???

Many people say he is finished.

most clubs don't want him.

the rest shouldn't trust him, he's a liar, a proven liar, and even if he says he's off the sauce, you'd want substantive tests to prove it, because his word isn't worth anything.

i certainly have no respect for anything he's achieved because you have no proof how far back his on field achievements were 'tainted'.

Once again the point goes past Dan.......not for the first time...

Ben Cousins HAS nominatd to commence training at VFL level. He will innevitably want to play at the highest levl where he comes from.

All the "dirty drug cheat" talk (while true) is irrelevant. He will register and the AFL have said he can. The rest is your "moral" adjudication.

[esaint66]

Well yesterday they had a poll for who should be the number one out of the 50 and Robert came in 4th behind G. Ablett snr, W. Carey and L. Matthews. Just goes to show you that the fans know more about the game then the journos.

[Eastern]

I notice that every time this debate comes up in the media, Nathan Buckley ALWAYS puts Robert Harvey's name up when the journos either forget or don't bother. If nothing else, Buckley is respectful of the game and its champions !!

[esaint66]

I notice that every time this debate comes up in the media, Nathan Buckley ALWAYS puts Robert Harvey's name up when the journos either forget or don't bother. If nothing else, Buckley is respectful of the game and its champions !!

Exactly!

IMO he isn't a better player than Banger, but like you say he is respectful of the game and his champions. He is also the only commentator on channel 7 who isn't stats crazy and actually calls the game.

[Dan Warna]

BTW - who says Ben Cousins if finished???

Many people say he is finished.

most clubs don't want him.

the rest shouldn't trust him, he's a liar, a proven liar, and even if he says he's off the sauce, you'd want substantive tests to prove it, because his word isn't worth anything.

i certainly have no respect for anything he's achieved because you have no proof how far back his on field achievements were 'tainted'.

Once again the point goes past Dan.......not for the first time...

Ben Cousins HAS nominatd to commence training at VFL level. He will innevitably want to play at the highest levl where he comes from.

All the "dirty drug cheat" talk (while true) is irrelevant. He will register and the AFL have said he can. The rest is your "moral" adjudication.

the point hasn't gone past me

some dozen or so clubs have said they don't want cousins.

the vfl don't really have a drug testing policy and the AFLs drug testing policy was and is a joke.

if he does start with an opposing AFL side i certainly do intend to verbal him from the stands, and i hope we don't pick him up.

i believe he has nothing to offer st kilda.