Birss out is a joke!
Perfectly suited to the Sydney style of play and has been one of our better players over the last few weeks!
WTF is going on at St Kilda!?
team this week
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saintspremiers
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Look,
It's easy to get pissed off when we are playing like squibs, but regardless of who Lyon plays we will get thumped.
Anyway, Gilbo will play - I'm pretty confident he's pumped and ready to go, so that's a big positive!
...oh, and what does Lovechild Schneider have to do to get dropped??
It's easy to get pissed off when we are playing like squibs, but regardless of who Lyon plays we will get thumped.
Anyway, Gilbo will play - I'm pretty confident he's pumped and ready to go, so that's a big positive!
...oh, and what does Lovechild Schneider have to do to get dropped??
Last edited by saintspremiers on Thu 12 Jun 2008 9:08pm, edited 1 time in total.
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thenumber9
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older saint
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Just relax a little
Harvey Unlikey to play - Birrs back in
Kosi Doubtful - Ferguson to Full Forward ( if wet McQualter in if Dry Fiora)
Mcqaulter not in yet coulod be salary cap issue to as more payments per senior game could be an issue.
King back rules out McEnvoy and Allen as too top heavy plus both not great in res in recent weeks.
Ferg and Gwilt deserve more than 1 bad games before dropped. Using that theory many plkayers would be dropped each week.
Armitage needs game time so back to reserves to get quality time
Harvey Unlikey to play - Birrs back in
Kosi Doubtful - Ferguson to Full Forward ( if wet McQualter in if Dry Fiora)
Mcqaulter not in yet coulod be salary cap issue to as more payments per senior game could be an issue.
King back rules out McEnvoy and Allen as too top heavy plus both not great in res in recent weeks.
Ferg and Gwilt deserve more than 1 bad games before dropped. Using that theory many plkayers would be dropped each week.
Armitage needs game time so back to reserves to get quality time
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perfectionist
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My guess is that Robert Harvey won't play and Shane Birss will. But who knows?
On Gwilt, Armitage, Fiora, etc., the reality is that none of them can play. We are stuck with duds until we get rid of them - easier said than done. I could go through their fatal weaknesses again, but I've done that ad infinitum. So I will just pick on the poster boy - a "kid" who is twenty in four days. Armitage has the pace of Birss, kicks like Ball (and like me on his right foot) and marks like Milne.
The window closed when Penny and then Hamill went but it could reopen with some smart recruiting in the next five years. Our real "guns", like the Nicks, Ball, Hayes, etc will still be around and will know what is required. We need to start planning NOW for 2012-13. I've waited 42 years, another five won't kill me.
On Gwilt, Armitage, Fiora, etc., the reality is that none of them can play. We are stuck with duds until we get rid of them - easier said than done. I could go through their fatal weaknesses again, but I've done that ad infinitum. So I will just pick on the poster boy - a "kid" who is twenty in four days. Armitage has the pace of Birss, kicks like Ball (and like me on his right foot) and marks like Milne.
The window closed when Penny and then Hamill went but it could reopen with some smart recruiting in the next five years. Our real "guns", like the Nicks, Ball, Hayes, etc will still be around and will know what is required. We need to start planning NOW for 2012-13. I've waited 42 years, another five won't kill me.
Last edited by perfectionist on Thu 12 Jun 2008 8:29pm, edited 1 time in total.
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bigcarl
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looking at that you'd expect us to be one of the more aerially dominant teams in the afl as most of those guys have good hands. on the other hand it could, and has, left us exposed for pace at times.Our team looks VERY TALL for the SCG
King
Gardiner
Fergo
Gilbert
Dempster
Roo
Kossi
Max H
S Fisher
Blake
somehow our supposed aerial strength hasn't seemed to have helped us.
anyone have a theory as to why apart from "football isn't played like that any more"?
are we not playing to our strengths? are guys not making position? are we simply not getting enough of the ball?
Last edited by bigcarl on Thu 12 Jun 2008 8:41pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Shaggy
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Important stat that. He is doing really well for a 2nd year player given the limited time he has had on the ground.SaintBot wrote:59% average with the Saints this year.saints11 wrote:what has is average game time beenOtiman wrote:That was the party line from the last time he was dropped. Played low TOG at Casey as well, so who knows.older saint wrote:Armitage needs game time so back to reserves to get quality time
Surely they are playing ducks and drakes. There's no way Birss could actually be dropped? Unless Lyon is tanking.
My guess is Harves won't play, and Birss will. Still doesn't explain Armo. Terribly stiff when compared with Ferguson, Dempster, Gwilt, Geary, Schneider.
Does look very top-heavy to me. Wouldn't mind if Mini came in actually.
My guess is Harves won't play, and Birss will. Still doesn't explain Armo. Terribly stiff when compared with Ferguson, Dempster, Gwilt, Geary, Schneider.
Does look very top-heavy to me. Wouldn't mind if Mini came in actually.
STRENGTH THROUGH LOYALTY.
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To the top
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Armitage was very poor last week, and did not contribute to the mid-field rotations which is why we ultimately got thumped.
Birss may have kicked a couple of goals but otherwise did not contribute, again bringing nothing to the mid-field rotations.
Harvey, Gilbert and King are all automatic selections in this side.
The side is much the better for the inclusion of each of those 3.
Gwilt was not the worst last week, with the problems being a lack of pace and disposal skills. He did work over the ball and got a bit of it using his frame, although his 188cm's mean he is under pressure in the key defensive positions, noting he finished at full back last week.
Ferguson was woeful. Simply, to quote someone else who is more articulate than me, he is a KPP in a mid-fielder's body - and not good enough at either.
Milne was no better, and surely this must be his last chance. A one-trick pony who plays one game a year, resulting in opposition teams realising that they can not afford to pay him no attention, man up on him and that is the end of him. Non-contributor.
The continuing references to McQualter amaze me. Can not play at this level. Does not have the body for in-and-under and does not have the skills outside - in a competition where you need both to survive. Players of his size require the skills of Harvey of North Melbourne. McQualter is not even 5% there.
Our best chance against Sydney is to play the team selected, because the loss of either of Harvey, King or Gilbert will seriously weaken us.
And there was nothing wrong with Gilbert's form before injury - he has skill, discipline, great closing speed and good spoiling skills overhead and on the lead with his "Inspector Gadget" arms.
The fact that he is playing in defence, and is being accountable, may lead some to muse that he is not replicating last season's form where he was generating from the mid-field and in attack but, in fact, he was playing better footy for the team before injury curtailed him.
An automatic selection.
Harvey, say no more.
And King adds to the presence of Gardiner and allows Gardiner (and King) to float to strategic positions, forward and back with big bodies plugging holes defensively and adding options forward.
Birss may have kicked a couple of goals but otherwise did not contribute, again bringing nothing to the mid-field rotations.
Harvey, Gilbert and King are all automatic selections in this side.
The side is much the better for the inclusion of each of those 3.
Gwilt was not the worst last week, with the problems being a lack of pace and disposal skills. He did work over the ball and got a bit of it using his frame, although his 188cm's mean he is under pressure in the key defensive positions, noting he finished at full back last week.
Ferguson was woeful. Simply, to quote someone else who is more articulate than me, he is a KPP in a mid-fielder's body - and not good enough at either.
Milne was no better, and surely this must be his last chance. A one-trick pony who plays one game a year, resulting in opposition teams realising that they can not afford to pay him no attention, man up on him and that is the end of him. Non-contributor.
The continuing references to McQualter amaze me. Can not play at this level. Does not have the body for in-and-under and does not have the skills outside - in a competition where you need both to survive. Players of his size require the skills of Harvey of North Melbourne. McQualter is not even 5% there.
Our best chance against Sydney is to play the team selected, because the loss of either of Harvey, King or Gilbert will seriously weaken us.
And there was nothing wrong with Gilbert's form before injury - he has skill, discipline, great closing speed and good spoiling skills overhead and on the lead with his "Inspector Gadget" arms.
The fact that he is playing in defence, and is being accountable, may lead some to muse that he is not replicating last season's form where he was generating from the mid-field and in attack but, in fact, he was playing better footy for the team before injury curtailed him.
An automatic selection.
Harvey, say no more.
And King adds to the presence of Gardiner and allows Gardiner (and King) to float to strategic positions, forward and back with big bodies plugging holes defensively and adding options forward.
said perfectly!older saint wrote:Just relax a little
Harvey Unlikey to play - Birrs back in
Kosi Doubtful - Ferguson to Full Forward ( if wet McQualter in if Dry Fiora)
Mcqaulter not in yet coulod be salary cap issue to as more payments per senior game could be an issue.
King back rules out McEnvoy and Allen as too top heavy plus both not great in res in recent weeks.
Ferg and Gwilt deserve more than 1 bad games before dropped. Using that theory many plkayers would be dropped each week.
Armitage needs game time so back to reserves to get quality time
fergo and gwilt have played 2 and 1 games respectivly, and there on their last legs, so we need to see if they have what it takes.
armo hasnt played that flash in the last couple of games.
let him dominate in the vfl.
just over half the game he needs heaps moreSaintBot wrote:59% average with the Saints this year.saints11 wrote:what has is average game time beenOtiman wrote:That was the party line from the last time he was dropped. Played low TOG at Casey as well, so who knows.older saint wrote:Armitage needs game time so back to reserves to get quality time
Happy to see Gwilt get another go... I actually thought he was quite good last week and showed alot of improvement in weaknesses he has.. deserved to be retained...
I am not a Ferg fan, and thought he was woeful last week and would prefer to see Allen or even McEvoy as a forward target... Dare i say, Raph... However, I hope he steps up..
Now to the Armitage disgrace... I wish he was coached by Malthouse, cos he would be a far more developed and damaging player than he is under Lyon... Ross is crucifying this kid, both with ridiculous game time and selection... I hope Armo is mentally strong enough to see through Ross's BS...
In that, Harvs, King and Gilbert all pick themselves (although i'd prfer to see BigMac in as no.2 ruck instead of King), but Armo should have been fit in somewhere... Dempster, Schnider maybe??...
I am not a Ferg fan, and thought he was woeful last week and would prefer to see Allen or even McEvoy as a forward target... Dare i say, Raph... However, I hope he steps up..
Now to the Armitage disgrace... I wish he was coached by Malthouse, cos he would be a far more developed and damaging player than he is under Lyon... Ross is crucifying this kid, both with ridiculous game time and selection... I hope Armo is mentally strong enough to see through Ross's BS...
In that, Harvs, King and Gilbert all pick themselves (although i'd prfer to see BigMac in as no.2 ruck instead of King), but Armo should have been fit in somewhere... Dempster, Schnider maybe??...
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Shaggy
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We differ. Gilbert was struggling big time before injury. As for Mini well he is now much more mature and playing the best footy of his life. He is not a tagger and his Casey performances demand he gets another chance (and not as a tagger).To the top wrote: The continuing references to McQualter amaze me. Can not play at this level. Does not have the body for in-and-under and does not have the skills outside - in a competition where you need both to survive. Players of his size require the skills of Harvey of North Melbourne. McQualter is not even 5% there.
Our best chance against Sydney is to play the team selected, because the loss of either of Harvey, King or Gilbert will seriously weaken us.
And there was nothing wrong with Gilbert's form before injury - he has skill, discipline, great closing speed and good spoiling skills overhead and on the lead with his "Inspector Gadget" arms.
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howlinwolf
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Just my .02 cents worth.
Willing to be howled down but with respect.
I think if Birss is dropped it will be perplexing as he has been very accountable. A must against the Swans. He has been better this year than last imo.
Armo... had an "average" game last week. I read somewhere that the last time he was dropped was for disciplinary reasons. Could be the same or last weeks accountability ?
Gilbert could be a bit of risk this game as first game back after long term njury as accountability is paramount against the Swans, of all teams. He's had a lot of time out of the game.His form prior to that wasn't as great as reported, I believe.
Last year's was far better.
We could be seen as top heavy but Jolly seems to be fairing well and Everitt is back as well ?
Go Saints !!!!!!!!
Willing to be howled down but with respect.
I think if Birss is dropped it will be perplexing as he has been very accountable. A must against the Swans. He has been better this year than last imo.
Armo... had an "average" game last week. I read somewhere that the last time he was dropped was for disciplinary reasons. Could be the same or last weeks accountability ?
Gilbert could be a bit of risk this game as first game back after long term njury as accountability is paramount against the Swans, of all teams. He's had a lot of time out of the game.His form prior to that wasn't as great as reported, I believe.
Last year's was far better.
We could be seen as top heavy but Jolly seems to be fairing well and Everitt is back as well ?
Go Saints !!!!!!!!
Possible Lineup
StKilda
Sydney
# - Can play ruck.
Notes:
Obvious one first, Dempster to go head to head with Goodes. He has the height, he's got no obvious matchup in the backline and L.Fisher did a good job in round 1. Goodes will kill him for explosive speed but most of our players will be.
Dal Santo to start on the bench and come on with Harvey after the first few physical close in minutes. Hopefully their class and skills being added suddenly to the game with create a few quick and effective clearances.
Hudghton to take Hall. Max loves these kinds of challenges and he won't be worried about standing up to Barry. Gwilt can relieve Sam Fisher by taking up O'Loughlin - Fisher, Goddard, Gram or whoever is loose will have to be switched on to cutting off O'Loughlin's and Hall's leading space.
Must be a reason Gilbert's been rushed back and it would be that his perfect opponent O'Keefe is playing. Restrain O'keefe's game and we significantly improve our odds.
The selected Sydney side is very top heavy and I can imagine they will make a change being Roberts-Thomson/Playfair out for Bird.
StKilda
Sydney
- FB: B.Goddard* - J.Gwilt - J.Blake#
FF: P.Bevan* - M.O'Loughlin - P.Everitt#
HB: S.Gilbert - M.Hudghton - J.Gram*
HF: R.O'Keefe - B.Hall - A.Buchanan*
SM: S.Fisher*
C: L.Montagna* - L.Hayes* - C.Jones*
C: J.McVeigh* - B.Kirk* - K.Jack*
SM: N.Maleski
HF: N.Riewoldt - A.Schneider*
HB: C.Bolton - T.Kennelly*
FF: S.Milne - J.Koschitzke# - M.Ferguson
FB: M.Mattner* - T.Richards - L.Barry
R: S.King# - L.Ball* - S.Dempster*
R: D.Jolly# - J.Bolton* - A.Goodes*
I/C: R.Harvey* - J.Geary* - N.Dal Santo* - M.Gardiner#
I/C: L.Ablett* - J.Moore* - H.Playfair# - L.Roberts-Thomson#
# - Can play ruck.
Notes:
Obvious one first, Dempster to go head to head with Goodes. He has the height, he's got no obvious matchup in the backline and L.Fisher did a good job in round 1. Goodes will kill him for explosive speed but most of our players will be.
Dal Santo to start on the bench and come on with Harvey after the first few physical close in minutes. Hopefully their class and skills being added suddenly to the game with create a few quick and effective clearances.
Hudghton to take Hall. Max loves these kinds of challenges and he won't be worried about standing up to Barry. Gwilt can relieve Sam Fisher by taking up O'Loughlin - Fisher, Goddard, Gram or whoever is loose will have to be switched on to cutting off O'Loughlin's and Hall's leading space.
Must be a reason Gilbert's been rushed back and it would be that his perfect opponent O'Keefe is playing. Restrain O'keefe's game and we significantly improve our odds.
The selected Sydney side is very top heavy and I can imagine they will make a change being Roberts-Thomson/Playfair out for Bird.
What a effing joke this forum is 
We get the bejesus smashed out of us in the midfield last week, everybody squells like stuck pigs, but when two mids are dropped because we were farking pantsed this place goes into meltdown.
Birss - lol. All year the usual halfwit hysterics on here have told us how Birss is a reject, a top up, not good enough for the AFL. Now after he is dropped he is the pinup boy for the frikken forum and is a world beater .
Armitage. Love this forum has a man crush on a kid who will make it, but who form has trailed off badly the last couple of weeks. needs to have a rest and play out the final two months of the season strongly.
Now having two mids out may give you bunch of reactionary sooks an effing clue. Have a think and see who you think may work through the midfield on the SCG toy ground? Who kicks it a country mile in the team? Another clue, Gilbert is coming back into the team probably in defence.
Got it you bunch of Einstiens???
We have had the ignoramouses calling to play Ferg and Gwilt all season and when they get a go people scream.
Ferg has scored a big round duck egg in his two games up forward and Gwilt did three fifths of F*** all but can kick the s.hite out of it if he ever gets the pill. Deserve a chance before they are cut forever from an AFL list.
All this bitching and moaning. Fair Dinkum.
One particular typical hysteric was going to quit as a supporter when Armitage was dropped last week.
Well Iwetmyseat, Armitage is dropped, are you all talk as we all suspect or are you going to stop supporting the Saints?
Show us all you are not the hysterical idiot you have so far shown and go, as you promised you would.
We get the bejesus smashed out of us in the midfield last week, everybody squells like stuck pigs, but when two mids are dropped because we were farking pantsed this place goes into meltdown.
Birss - lol. All year the usual halfwit hysterics on here have told us how Birss is a reject, a top up, not good enough for the AFL. Now after he is dropped he is the pinup boy for the frikken forum and is a world beater
.Armitage. Love this forum has a man crush on a kid who will make it, but who form has trailed off badly the last couple of weeks. needs to have a rest and play out the final two months of the season strongly.
Now having two mids out may give you bunch of reactionary sooks an effing clue. Have a think and see who you think may work through the midfield on the SCG toy ground? Who kicks it a country mile in the team? Another clue, Gilbert is coming back into the team probably in defence.
Got it you bunch of Einstiens???
We have had the ignoramouses calling to play Ferg and Gwilt all season and when they get a go people scream.
Ferg has scored a big round duck egg in his two games up forward and Gwilt did three fifths of F*** all but can kick the s.hite out of it if he ever gets the pill. Deserve a chance before they are cut forever from an AFL list.
All this bitching and moaning. Fair Dinkum.
One particular typical hysteric was going to quit as a supporter when Armitage was dropped last week.
Well Iwetmyseat, Armitage is dropped, are you all talk as we all suspect or are you going to stop supporting the Saints?
Show us all you are not the hysterical idiot you have so far shown and go, as you promised you would.
Lance or James??
There comes a point in every man's life when he has to say, "Enough is enough." For me, that time is now. I have been dealing with claims that I cheated and had an unfair advantage in <redacted>. Over the past three years, I have been subjected to a <redacted>investigation followed by <redacted> witch hunt. The toll this has taken on my family, and my work for <redacted>and on me leads me to where I am today – finished with this nonsense. (Oops just got a spontaneous errection <unredacted>)
There comes a point in every man's life when he has to say, "Enough is enough." For me, that time is now. I have been dealing with claims that I cheated and had an unfair advantage in <redacted>. Over the past three years, I have been subjected to a <redacted>investigation followed by <redacted> witch hunt. The toll this has taken on my family, and my work for <redacted>and on me leads me to where I am today – finished with this nonsense. (Oops just got a spontaneous errection <unredacted>)
Joffaboy
I think the main issue that people have is that while Birss and Armo may not have been the best, they were far from the worst performers!
I would have thought that Schnieder, Dempster and L Fisher would have been easily on the chopping block. Both Armo and Birss have been effective at their respective roles. Birss has been the best tagger for the team over the last few matches, not only does he stop his opponent but he has also hurt the opposition with goal kicking capability!
Armo unfortunately has had little time on the ground - so to have a majority of our mids - however he has provided us with another potential avenue to goal.
The fact that Fiora is named as an emergency is also a point of debate as you would rather hope that Armo would at least be placed on the emg list.
The fact that Harves is listed to play is suprising to say the least i would not expect someone listed as being 1-2 weeks away to actually play so i have my fingers crossed that Birss comes back in or McQualter i don't believe that Fiora has proven this year that he deserves a spot in the 22.
I just hope that King is fit and the same with Kosi because if they dont play then instead of being too tall we wont be tall enough! Suprised that McEvoy is not an emergency because i would expect either of those two not to be playing at 100% and that has been a major flaw this year. We have players that are injured and therefore cannot play to the best of their ability!
I think the main issue that people have is that while Birss and Armo may not have been the best, they were far from the worst performers!
I would have thought that Schnieder, Dempster and L Fisher would have been easily on the chopping block. Both Armo and Birss have been effective at their respective roles. Birss has been the best tagger for the team over the last few matches, not only does he stop his opponent but he has also hurt the opposition with goal kicking capability!
Armo unfortunately has had little time on the ground - so to have a majority of our mids - however he has provided us with another potential avenue to goal.
The fact that Fiora is named as an emergency is also a point of debate as you would rather hope that Armo would at least be placed on the emg list.
The fact that Harves is listed to play is suprising to say the least i would not expect someone listed as being 1-2 weeks away to actually play so i have my fingers crossed that Birss comes back in or McQualter i don't believe that Fiora has proven this year that he deserves a spot in the 22.
I just hope that King is fit and the same with Kosi because if they dont play then instead of being too tall we wont be tall enough! Suprised that McEvoy is not an emergency because i would expect either of those two not to be playing at 100% and that has been a major flaw this year. We have players that are injured and therefore cannot play to the best of their ability!
Thats Mr. Smartarse to you
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howlinwolf
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Joffa,
Birss has played better than last year. Fact imo. He has been more accountable and kicked a few moreso than others this year.He's no world beater but then again neither is most of our side this year.
No hysteria there.
Rate him against Gwilt and I'd take Birss nearly every time. Especially against a side like Sydney. He's accountable. Gwilt is NOT.
Take it easy mate. We're all brothers and sisters here. All Sainters. Respectfull discussion is the answer to problems.
We're all frustrated.
Birss has played better than last year. Fact imo. He has been more accountable and kicked a few moreso than others this year.He's no world beater but then again neither is most of our side this year.
No hysteria there.
Rate him against Gwilt and I'd take Birss nearly every time. Especially against a side like Sydney. He's accountable. Gwilt is NOT.
Take it easy mate. We're all brothers and sisters here. All Sainters. Respectfull discussion is the answer to problems.
We're all frustrated.