Where are all the Lyon supporters now ?

[Teflon]

Players are to blame, no doubt about that.

Coach has to take alot of the brunt of the blame though. Its obviousl his 'message' isnt getting through to the players. He has to cop it for that.

I agree his message with this group isnt getting through - but is the cattle there?

Sadly I dont think it is.

[Saints43]

Teflon.

I reckon Ross Lyon is a useless coach.

Why do you believe he isn't?

Here's my openeing argument:

We are below Carlton. Two games away from our home ground so far this year.

I reckon our list management from 2004 onwards might just be better than thiers.

I reckon Ross Lyon is a useless coach.

Why do you believe he isn't?

[degruch]

The only person letting players off the hook is our coach.

But hey, I bet he's popular with the players.

Well, he's on stage now...does he turn nasty and chop some heads? I hope so. In this situation, I'd love to see players scarred s**tless of him...how would you like mto face Dean Laidley on Monday after a performance like that? That's how I'd like to see Ross get ugly...he won't respect (especially from you JD) unless he does, eh?

[Teflon]

Teflon.

I reckon Ross Lyon is a useless coach.

Why do you believe he isn't?

Here's my openeing argument:

We are below Carlton. Two games away from our home ground.

I reckon our list management from 2004 onwards might just be better than theirs.

I reckon Ross Lyon is a useless coach.

Why do you believe he isn't?

You cant judge Lyon on what weve seen - I reckon we have hugely overrated players and have not developed this list since 04. Outside Gram (and hes had 1 good year) and S Fisher - who else has developed to become elite??????

Fiora?
Blake?
Gwilt?
Rix?
Mqualter?
Ferguson?
L Fisher?

Thomas recruitments......and weve developed you say?

Nah.....Lyons just a "bad" coach.....

[Saints43]

Teflon.

I reckon Ross Lyon is a useless coach.

Why do you believe he isn't?

Here's my openeing argument:

We are below Carlton. Two games away from our home ground.

I reckon our list management from 2004 onwards might just be better than theirs.

I reckon Ross Lyon is a useless coach.

Why do you believe he isn't?

You cant judge Lyon on what weve seen - I reckon we have hugely overrated players and have not developed this list since 04. Outside Gram (and hes had 1 good year) and S Fisher - who else has developed to become elite??????

Fiora?
Blake?
Gwilt?
Rix?
Mqualter?
Ferguson?
L Fisher?

Thomas recruitments......and weve developed you say?

Nah.....Lyons just a "bad" coach.....

Hang on.

We are below Carlton. How many ELITE players have Carlton produced since 2004?

We were playing finals while they were having spasmodics on Optus Oval due to ecstacy overuse.

Why didn't you mention Schnieder in the list? (Rix.. ffs)

When can we judge Ross Lyon then ? Why do you think he is a good coach?

[Saints43]

Teflon.

I reckon Ross Lyon is a useless coach.

Why do you believe he isn't?

Here's my openeing argument:

We are below Carlton. Two games away from our home ground.

I reckon our list management from 2004 onwards might just be better than theirs.

I reckon Ross Lyon is a useless coach.

Why do you believe he isn't?

You cant judge Lyon on what weve seen - I reckon we have hugely overrated players and have not developed this list since 04. Outside Gram (and hes had 1 good year) and S Fisher - who else has developed to become elite??????

Fiora?
Blake?
Gwilt?
Rix?
Mqualter?
Ferguson?
L Fisher?

Thomas recruitments......and weve developed you say?

Nah.....Lyons just a "bad" coach.....

Hang on.

We are below Carlton. How many ELITE players have Carlton produced since 2004?

We were playing finals while they were having spasmodics on Optus Oval due to ecstacy overuse.

Why didn't you mention Schnieder in the list? (Rix.. ffs)

When can we judge Ross Lyon then ? Why do you think he is a good coach?

We are below Carlton. How many ELITE players have Carlton produced since 2004?

We were playing finals while they were having spasmodics on Optus Oval due to ecstacy overuse.

Why didn't you mention Schnieder in the list? (Rix.. ffs)

When can we judge Ross Lyon then ? Why do you think he is a good coach?

Teflon?

[fonz_#15]

our problems run a lot deeper than Lyon.

in fact, he isn't the problem

[matrix]

i said it when he was appointed and ill say it again...........

we will not win a premiership with him.

im not sayin anything else about this weeks game, the coach or any of the players.

theres enough crap on here already tonight.....dont need my negative rants as well

[Teflon]

Teflon.

I reckon Ross Lyon is a useless coach.

Why do you believe he isn't?

Here's my openeing argument:

We are below Carlton. Two games away from our home ground.

I reckon our list management from 2004 onwards might just be better than theirs.

I reckon Ross Lyon is a useless coach.

Why do you believe he isn't?

You cant judge Lyon on what weve seen - I reckon we have hugely overrated players and have not developed this list since 04. Outside Gram (and hes had 1 good year) and S Fisher - who else has developed to become elite??????

Fiora?
Blake?
Gwilt?
Rix?
Mqualter?
Ferguson?
L Fisher?

Thomas recruitments......and weve developed you say?

Nah.....Lyons just a "bad" coach.....

Hang on.

We are below Carlton. How many ELITE players have Carlton produced since 2004?

We were playing finals while they were having spasmodics on Optus Oval due to ecstacy overuse.

Why didn't you mention Schnieder in the list? (Rix.. ffs)

When can we judge Ross Lyon then ? Why do you think he is a good coach?

We are below Carlton. How many ELITE players have Carlton produced since 2004?

We were playing finals while they were having spasmodics on Optus Oval due to ecstacy overuse.

Why didn't you mention Schnieder in the list? (Rix.. ffs)

When can we judge Ross Lyon then ? Why do you think he is a good coach?

Teflon?

Judge Ross Lyon at the end of this year at a minimum.

Why do you hark back to days when we played finals and Carlton were no good - have you seen what Carlton have coming through? You do realise its not 2004?

This IS THE SINGLE BIGGEST PROBLEM OUR SUPPORTERS HAVE - we STILL look at this team on "paper" and think back to our "glory" days when we had a 33 yr old Harvs, a dual coleman medallist, a fit Maguire, younger Hudgton, a gun in a young Luke Ball - THOSE DAYS ARE GONE.

Why is it hard to understand this?

Yet all you want is to sack the coach?

Let em ask you - is it game plan that sees players miss easy goals from 2Omtrs out? or players constantly turn the footy over via poor skills/decisions????????

In your wold the coach must play for them as well....delusional

F@Rk me.

[Saints43]

I harked back to 2004 because you asked how many elite players he had produced since then. I used Calton as a guide as to where we are now as opposed to then

I'm not lloking to the past. I'm asking a simple f'n question of somone who supported the appointment of Ross Lyon and tells others publicly to get behinf Ross Lyon:

Why do you think he is a good coach?

Stop avoiding the question. If you don't know - if it's the vibe - just say so.

Why do you think he is a good coach?

[chook23]

Our recruiting since Thommo was handed some players on a platter has been terrible..........

during GT era and appears also during RL short period

[plugger66]

Our recruiting since Thommo was handed some players on a platter has been terrible..........

during GT era and appears also during RL short period

So what they may show that it isnt the coaches fault but the club who havent spent enough in this area.

[Teflon]

I harked back to 2004 because you asked how many elite players he had produced since then. I used Calton as a guide as to where we are now as opposed to then

I'm not lloking to the past. I'm asking a simple f'n question of somone who supported the appointment of Ross Lyon and tells others publicly to get behinf Ross Lyon:

Why do you think he is a good coach?

Stop avoiding the question. If you don't know - if it's the vibe - just say so.

Why do you think he is a good coach?

Ive told you you simplistic knob - judge Lyon at seasons end.

Your telling us all based one being 4/5 and after a shocking 07 full of injury you KNOW hes a dud coach - f@Rk off mate

If Lyon isnt the man for the job Ive no problems with that - but (as Andrew Thompson pointed out) he DESERVES his chance and he hasnt had a run at it yet or at least not one long enough to make stupid judgements.

Many said Allistair Clarkson couldnt coach either early in his tenure.......they aint saying it now...

Now why dont you answer my fkn question re the playing group who you have CONSTANTLY avoided and let off the hook?

Is it game plan that Dal santo/Montagna lay 1 tackle between them?

Lets have it "yabby"...

[Saint Bev]

We are all desperate for this premiership and we have all had a gut full of waiting. But realistically it was always going to be a big call for a new coach like RL to bring us the holy grail that quickly. Also I started to get nervous in 2004 when there was no new young players coming through. We are now paying the price big time.

[Teflon]

We are all desperate for this premiership and we have all had a gut full of waiting. But realistically it was always going to be a big call for a new coach like RL to bring us the holy grail that quickly. Also I started to get nervous in 2004 when there was no new young players coming through. We are now paying the price big time.

I agree Bev but I like many thoguht this group was good enough. There hasnt been the development coming on thats majorly dissapointing...

[Teflon]

our problems run a lot deeper than Lyon.

in fact, he isn't the problem

I agree Foz but not all is lost yet.

[Iceman234]

[]

Ive told you you simplistic knob - judge Lyon at seasons end.

Your telling us all based one being 4/5 and after a shocking 07 full of injury you KNOW hes a dud coach - f@Rk off mate

If Lyon isnt the man for the job Ive no problems with that - but (as Andrew Thompson pointed out) he DESERVES his chance and he hasnt had a run at it yet or at least not one long enough to make stupid judgements.

Many said Allistair Clarkson couldnt coach either early in his tenure.......they aint saying it now...

Now why dont you answer my fkn question re the playing group who you have CONSTANTLY avoided and let off the hook?

Is it game plan that Dal santo/Montagna lay 1 tackle between them?

Lets have it "yabby"... [/quote]

I'd say it's runs on the board - but prob goes beyond that.

Expectations were high - tell us how RL has lived up to the average member's expectations.

We're not coaches or committee men, just paying members who want results.

A few of us may have played a few games here and there and be armchair coaches but still, we're not on 500 gorillas a year.

We want our money's worth.

[desertsaint]

Bottom line - what was Ross Lyons agenda as seen by the club and as promoted by him?
Was it to rebuild, as the current list wasn't up to it, or was it to fine tune a team on the verge of glory - bring some much needed game day nous and player 'accountability' and top up the list

I don't know - i wasn't there - but i'd guess the latter -especially looking at player recruitment under him.

Now hindsight is a wonderful thing but i for one was happy with this agenda - but not happy with GT's sacking given the 14 wins gained with massive injury concerns. I thought the list nearly there - as i'm sure we all did.

The simple fact is that the coach has not delivered - all those apologists for ross - why is it fine for you to bag the players but you'll howl down anyone who blames the coach?

Should we sack him? I can't see how it'll help at this moment - either he'll somehow discover how to motivate his players or he'll hopefully be gone at seasons end. I truly hope he gets something out of this team but to me the biggest problem is not the players themselves, but how they are playing - uninspired and lacking confidence.

[Washedup]

Teflon.

I reckon Ross Lyon is a useless coach.

Why do you believe he isn't?

Here's my openeing argument:

We are below Carlton. Two games away from our home ground.

I reckon our list management from 2004 onwards might just be better than theirs.

I reckon Ross Lyon is a useless coach.

Why do you believe he isn't?

You cant judge Lyon on what weve seen - I reckon we have hugely overrated players and have not developed this list since 04. Outside Gram (and hes had 1 good year) and S Fisher - who else has developed to become elite??????

Fiora?
Blake?
Gwilt?
Rix?
Mqualter?
Ferguson?
L Fisher?

Thomas recruitments......and weve developed you say?

Nah.....Lyons just a "bad" coach.....

Hang on.

We are below Carlton. How many ELITE players have Carlton produced since 2004?

We were playing finals while they were having spasmodics on Optus Oval due to ecstacy overuse.

Why didn't you mention Schnieder in the list? (Rix.. ffs)

When can we judge Ross Lyon then ? Why do you think he is a good coach?

We are below Carlton. How many ELITE players have Carlton produced since 2004?

We were playing finals while they were having spasmodics on Optus Oval due to ecstacy overuse.

Why didn't you mention Schnieder in the list? (Rix.. ffs)

When can we judge Ross Lyon then ? Why do you think he is a good coach?

Teflon?

Judge Ross Lyon at the end of this year at a minimum.

Why do you hark back to days when we played finals and Carlton were no good - have you seen what Carlton have coming through? You do realise its not 2004?

This IS THE SINGLE BIGGEST PROBLEM OUR SUPPORTERS HAVE - we STILL look at this team on "paper" and think back to our "glory" days when we had a 33 yr old Harvs, a dual coleman medallist, a fit Maguire, younger Hudgton, a gun in a young Luke Ball - THOSE DAYS ARE GONE.

Why is it hard to understand this?

Yet all you want is to sack the coach?

Let em ask you - is it game plan that sees players miss easy goals from 2Omtrs out? or players constantly turn the footy over via poor skills/decisions????????

In your wold the coach must play for them as well....delusional

F@Rk me.

At last after 3 pages someone speaks some sense. Comparing us of 2008 to the model of 2004 really is ridiculous. The list is in no where near as good a shape as it was back then, mainly due to pathetic drafting and list management. RL has not set the world on fire, but he came into a club that was already going backwards. Are we to suggest that all of a sudden John Worsfold has become a terrible coach because he has taken a premiership team of 18 months ago to a team in the bottom 4?
He still has the majority of that premiership list at his disposal, so to most on this thread he must be useless and a dud coach now. Just goes to show you, you lose a couple of guns and dont adaquately replace them then your team will go backwards fast, just like we have

[JeffDunne]

Hang on just a minute guys.

Weren't you telling us just a couple of months ago that on the strength of the last 11 games in 2007, the recruiting 'coups' of King, Schneider & Dumpster and the players learning the game plan we were going to be a premiership threat?

Seriously, some of you should be competing in Beijing with your ability to perform backflips.

[sainters man]

i support ross, maybe our list isn't as good as we first thought!

And yeah be a good idea sacking the coach, i mean st kilda are known for doing it! i have just relised when things get tough you's all turn or each other and start bitching!

pathetic, support your team

[Teflon]

Hang on just a minute guys.

Weren't you telling us just a couple of months ago that on the strength of the last 11 games in 2007, the recruiting 'coups' of King, Schneider & Dumpster and the players learning the game plan we were going to be a premiership threat?

Seriously, some of you should be competing in Beijing with your ability to perform backflips.

I fail to see the problem Jeffery?
You and Dodg backflip weekly....and dont have problems...

Many made the call at the start of this season that St Kilda was a top 4 certainty - Im not ashamed to say I did also - so what?

Once again you focus on a trivial, incidental side factor and contribute NOTHING to the real question: Why is this side struggling?

SPIT IT OUT JEFF.

I have a view (now informed by watching enough of this team so far) that it is absolutely an issue of personell. It is dissapointing to say it but this list is carrying way to many imposters.

You simply want to sack a coach less than half way through his contract......

[JeffDunne]

Spit it out?

Do I need to draw you a picture?

[Teflon]

Spit it out?

Do I need to draw you a picture?

Gotta be better than your writing.....

I always had you down as a crayons man.....

[meher baba]

The crap I and many others had to listen to from you over analysing naval gazing drop kicks about our 'tactical' messiah from Sydney being the icing on an otherwise well baked cake makes me sick.

Im here Kenny - only gutless squibs like your or Jeffery and co jump off and call for the coach to be sacked less than 2 yrs in.

Refreshing to hear A Thompson say on radio today how much he respected Lyon after playing under him and that he WILL get his chance to mould this side.

Turn the heat up on soft, underperforming players and lets at least identify and cut the loafers from this list.

Teflon, name the them, the ones you think they are.

Ill make it easy for you...

My only players exempt from some heat would be Lenny, Harvey Max, S Fisher.

Id delist the following:

Fiora
Gwilt
Rix
Mqualter
Raph

For a start......id trade some names also but thats for another day..

What a hoot teffers!!

You reckon rix, gwilt and mcqualter have played a big part in what has gone wrong in 2008? Get a grip!!