Is Kosi overrated?

[fonz_#15]

i agree with you on many things armooo but imo judd is head and shoulders above anybody in the comp.

[Armoooo]

i agree with you on many things armooo but imo judd is head and shoulders above anybody in the comp.

That's fair enough anyone is entitled to their opinion and I am not denying that Judd is a spectacular player, I would probably say that he is the best player but IMO it would be a very hard choice... it really comes down to what criteria the best player in the league is based upon, if I was the coach of Gold Coast and I could choose any player in the league it would be between Cox and J.Brown...

[fonz_#15]

i dont think you will see many players rack up 30 touches and multiple goals consistently like judd has the ability to do. that is the reason i consider him the best in the league at the moment.

[skeptic]

how great Judd is will be made clearer in the next few seasons when he's taken away from the support of Cox, Kerr, Cousins, Embley etc

will be very interesting to watch next season

[Armoooo]

Well Bartel, Hodge, Judd and Dal were all drafted the same year...
Since drafting they have averaged...
Disposals:
Judd 21
Bartel 20.7
Hodge 20.5
Dal Santo 19.5

Marks:
Bartel 5.3
Hodge 4.5
Dal Santo 4
Judd 2.3

Tackles:
Bartel 4
Judd 3.6
Dal Santo 3.4
Hodge 3.3

Goals:
Judd 1
Hodge .6
Bartel .6
Dal Santo .5

So statistically there is no real difference, I will admit that Judd's possessions are worth a lot more than Bartel's and Hodge's because they get too many cheap ones in the back pocket, Judd will also get less marks because he usually wins the ball at ground level... He kicks hardly anymore goals then the others either...

IMO everything he does just seems better because you have the umpires drooling over him as he does it...

Judd is the new Buckley, Hird, Voss... A superstar no doubt however no better than the Bartels (Harvey), Hodges (Riccutio) etc...

[plugger66]

well thanks for checking hes still a great player in my eyes

This is probably overrating however on his day I believe him to be in the top few players in the league, right up there with Brown and Judd...

lets wait and see how judd go's a carlton first he a good player but i dont think hes anywhere near as good as some ppl make him out to be

Judd who no doubt is the best player in the AFL

No doubt? I think you are buying into the hype a little too much IMO, what puts him so far ahead of everyone else? He rarely dominates a game like Jonathan Brown can and he doesn't have the consistency of B.Harvey or Bartel... His best days aren't that much better than that of Ablett, Dal or Burgoyne...

You are right. He isnt as consistant as Harvey or bartel. He voted in the first 8 games in this years brownlow but it ranged from best on the ground to 3rd best on the ground. Should have been more consistant and only been best on the ground for the first 8 games.

[BAM! (shhhh)]

Can't really believe what I'm reading. I'm not sure who's been guilty of overrating Kosi, it seems a bit of a strawman argument - of course he hasn't achieved as much as the Riewoldt's and Judds of the league. Not exactly going out on a limb to say that. Add Brown, Cox and Pavlich to the list (and many more)... while it's easy to get excited about some of the things he does, he hasn't put his stamp ona position at this stage.

That said, he does a lot of things very, very well, and if he can put his injuries behind him, it's hard to doubt his ability - the only reason to set up the strawman is to say he might be able to play at that level.

Hasn't put it all together yet, but is a very good footballer, who is capable of taking a game apart and a big plus when he's on the park. Glad he's a Saint.

[rodgerfox]

how great Judd is will be made clearer in the next few seasons when he's taken away from the support of Cox, Kerr, Cousins, Embley etc

will be very interesting to watch next season

I agree Skeptic.

Judd is a gun no doubt - but when you consider the impact the loss of Hayes and Ball has on Dal Santo's output, it will be interesting to see how Judd goes.

[spert]

I think you really get rated by being on the field and doing well over consecutive seasons. Injury has knocked Kozis rating badly and although he has played some great games, he has also been ordinary in many, so the work is ahead of him now.

[Armoooo]

well thanks for checking hes still a great player in my eyes

This is probably overrating however on his day I believe him to be in the top few players in the league, right up there with Brown and Judd...

lets wait and see how judd go's a carlton first he a good player but i dont think hes anywhere near as good as some ppl make him out to be

Judd who no doubt is the best player in the AFL

No doubt? I think you are buying into the hype a little too much IMO, what puts him so far ahead of everyone else? He rarely dominates a game like Jonathan Brown can and he doesn't have the consistency of B.Harvey or Bartel... His best days aren't that much better than that of Ablett, Dal or Burgoyne...

You are right. He isnt as consistant as Harvey or bartel. He voted in the first 8 games in this years brownlow but it ranged from best on the ground to 3rd best on the ground. Should have been more consistant and only been best on the ground for the first 8 games.

Yeah fair enough because the brownlow is the absolute authority on who was the best on ground? I competely agree, Ablett, Carey, Matthews, they were all ordinary players anyway that's why they didn't deserve to ever win a brownlow... Simon Goodwin's 2006 was quite poor aswell... You have to remember the umpires live in the same world as we do, they hear how good he is non stop and he is always right under their noses, everytime he does something they're going to pay a lot mroe attention to it then if Priddis or Rosa did the exact same thing, my biggest problem with the Brownlow medal is not that is has become a midfielder's award but that it has become a media award, this seems to have gotten so much worse in the last 3 years...

[Vodka Vixen]

Kosi is awesome! As an Eagles fan I fear him. Did you guys see what he did at Subiaco oval this year?

Sheesh! Hell no, he isnt overrated! He is just an injury free year away from being a real star!

[Armoooo]

Kosi is awesome! As an Eagles fan I fear him. Did you guys see what he did at Subiaco oval this year?

Sheesh! Hell no, he isnt overrated! He is just an injury free year away from being a real star!

Lol, oh yeah we saw it
They are the sort of consistent performances we need to see from him on a regular basis, there is not a backline in the league that could stop a fit Roo, Kosi and G...

[Vodka Vixen]

Kosi is awesome! As an Eagles fan I fear him. Did you guys see what he did at Subiaco oval this year?

Sheesh! Hell no, he isnt overrated! He is just an injury free year away from being a real star!

Lol, oh yeah we saw it
They are the sort of consistent performances we need to see from him on a regular basis, there is not a backline in the league that could stop a fit Roo, Kosi and G...

I was watching with my head burried under a pillow! I kept saying to my boy...is it over yet?

You are right...a fit Roo, Kosi and Gehrig will be unbeatable.

[Saints94]

Kozi killed Glass over in the West

I was looking forward for them to meet again

but now Fraser is back (in a good way)

[Joffa Burns]

Depends if you rate him on potential or what he has produced to date.

Any player who has the potential to dominate matches and get a string of BOG's must be feared by any opposition.

He is potentially a champion but time is running out for him to fulfill that possibility. His best and his worst are a long way apart.

I think 2008 will determine whether he becomes A grade or plays out his career as a good league footballer who occasionally plays a blinder.

[Armoooo]

Kozi killed Glass over in the West

I was looking forward for them to meet again

but now Fraser is back (in a good way)

IIRC Glass was on Roo when Kosi kicked his 4 goals, I don't think he managed to kick another goal when Glass was put on him, I think he was on Grayham maybe....

However that is still fine by me, when Glass plays on him next year that gives Roo a weaker opponent and you know what he can do

[Saints94]

Kozi killed Glass over in the West

I was looking forward for them to meet again

but now Fraser is back (in a good way)

IIRC Glass was on Roo when Kosi kicked his 4 goals, I don't think he managed to kick another goal when Glass was put on him, I think he was on Grayham maybe....

However that is still fine by me, when Glass plays on him next year that gives Roo a weaker opponent and you know what he can do

Don't forget Kozi done his hammy in that game

[Saints94]

Kozi killed Glass over in the West

I was looking forward for them to meet again

but now Fraser is back (in a good way)

IIRC Glass was on Roo when Kosi kicked his 4 goals, I don't think he managed to kick another goal when Glass was put on him, I think he was on Grayham maybe....

However that is still fine by me, when Glass plays on him next year that gives Roo a weaker opponent and you know what he can do

I think Glass will get Gehrig mate

[BAM! (shhhh)]

Kozi killed Glass over in the West

I was looking forward for them to meet again

but now Fraser is back (in a good way)

During the 1st half when Kosi was tearing it up, he wasn't playing on Glass, he was messing their coverage. Any time he'd get an opponent in the ruck, he'd run forward, and creat a mismatch where you had a bona fide forward threat being covered by a non-defender. Any time Glass was switched on to him, he'd run back into the ruck, where regardless of the coverage Kosi was getting, West Coast was playing without their AA fullback at fullback.

Then he strained a quad. lost the mobility, and Glass had an easy time taking care of him in the 2nd half.

It's the flexibility, mobility, kicking and contested marking package that make Kosi such a handy player... it the complexity of the task that makes it so hard for Kosi to really put his stamp on the game and fulfill his potential. The ideal player to try and stop him would have been a CHB, and the role is somewhat like a 2nd CHF with rucking duties... but in both cases, they're not opening up Riewoldt for anything, and since we've got Riewoldt, we're not about to play anyone else at CHF.

[Armoooo]

Kozi killed Glass over in the West

I was looking forward for them to meet again

but now Fraser is back (in a good way)

IIRC Glass was on Roo when Kosi kicked his 4 goals, I don't think he managed to kick another goal when Glass was put on him, I think he was on Grayham maybe....

However that is still fine by me, when Glass plays on him next year that gives Roo a weaker opponent and you know what he can do

I think Glass will get Gehrig mate

Lol, I wouldn't mind that

If I had to guess thought it would be Kosi V Glass, Roo V Hunter, Selwood v Schneider, Butler v Xavier, Wirrpand V Milne and Graham V Gerhig....

[Teflon]

well thanks for checking hes still a great player in my eyes

This is probably overrating however on his day I believe him to be in the top few players in the league, right up there with Brown and Judd...

lets wait and see how judd go's a carlton first he a good player but i dont think hes anywhere near as good as some ppl make him out to be

Agree with you there, one of the best players in the league no doubt, but he is not the legend that he is made out to be.... I am so sick of hearing commentators blowing his load every time he gets the ball....

However his best day is probably better than anyone elses....

so true - could not agree more.

I had Des Headland down as an excitement machine at Brisbane......

Judds a great player but if I was picking my side Id have Browne, Riewoldt, Pavlich Cox picked well ahead...

[Barney2]

Didn't he win the Rising Star in his first year of football, playing at CHB?
I would have thought that was a pretty consistent year of footy.

I'm pretty sure the other 15 coaches spend plenty of time worrying about who to match up with him, wherever he plays.

Yes, his first year of football. Nothing consistant since. One year wonder at the moment for me until he can have a consistant injury free year and string consistant games together and have more impact, rather than one good game here and there

[Armoooo]

Kozi killed Glass over in the West

I was looking forward for them to meet again

but now Fraser is back (in a good way)

During the 1st half when Kosi was tearing it up, he wasn't playing on Glass, he was messing their coverage. Any time he'd get an opponent in the ruck, he'd run forward, and creat a mismatch where you had a bona fide forward threat being covered by a non-defender. Any time Glass was switched on to him, he'd run back into the ruck, where regardless of the coverage Kosi was getting, West Coast was playing without their AA fullback at fullback.

Then he strained a quad. lost the mobility, and Glass had an easy time taking care of him in the 2nd half.

It's the flexibility, mobility, kicking and contested marking package that make Kosi such a handy player... it the complexity of the task that makes it so hard for Kosi to really put his stamp on the game and fulfill his potential. The ideal player to try and stop him would have been a CHB, and the role is somewhat like a 2nd CHF with rucking duties... but in both cases, they're not opening up Riewoldt for anything, and since we've got Riewoldt, we're not about to play anyone else at CHF.

You bring up an interesting point on how much he moved around that game, we probably shouldn't pencil him in for FF next year because chances are he will spend time in the forwardline, backline and even the ruck...

I would love to see him cause trouble with the opposition matchups, snag a few goals and help around the ground...

[mischa]

Like most threads this is 'much ado about nothing'. The answer is NO>

[cuz60]

Just happy to see Kosi even out on the park last season! The bloke has had more injuries than the majority of players have throughout their career. Kosi hopefully will turn out to be the star we know he can be! Late 2006 I saw him play Geelong and I was waiting for the trainers to bring out the screen and put him down... could hardly raise a gallop.

Last season there was encouraging signs, his game against West Coast being one. Kosi in full flight is inspiring and that sort of leadership is what we are crying out for at the moment. Lets all hope we see the best of Kosi next season and not become another saints player who leaves to play his best footy at Sydney.