Another cleanout to follow post 2008

[cwrcyn]

Those retiring or in the gun at the end of 2008

Harvey
Gehrig
Rix
Gwilt
M.Gardiner
Ferguson
Jones

I'd say all the others are safe

[borderbarry]

There are a lot of non-experts posting in this thread. All those names and no mention of Birss and L.Fisher. The fact he was offered to the Swans should tell you where he stands in the clubs opinion.

[cwrcyn]

Leigh Fisher was in our top three players up until round 14 this year. He's no speedster, but he's an honest hard worker who you know will give 100% in every single contest.

Birss is wishy-washy and would need to improve about 20% to become a regular in our team.

Not all players need to be superstars to stay on the list.

[st_Trav_ofWA]

i think L Fisher will find himself in the Brett voss position of being in the the team once sec then out the next

birss is an interesting one as he has shown some signs of improvment and could easily go that next step like joey did to become a more consistant performer

either way if those tow oare our worst players then we have come along way

CJ i feel is gone next year we got him for his pace and his forward line pressure he may get the odd game next year but i feel he was not brought to the club as a long term prospect mainly to fill the void while Armo grew into his body a bit more

in all honesty i dont think we will see gardi up and running and if we do i cant see him making much of an impact so i think the likes of VR or Mcevoy will get an opertunity this year

[Dan Warna]

Ball - you guys don't realise how good he is, even with 80% fitness.
.

absolutely concur

the guy is no.1 or no.2 for tackles (and people are creaming themselves over the 3 career tackles CJ gets )

he's close to top for hard ball gets, and clearances at st kilda, and he is one of about 3 or 4 people who shepherd, block and spoil at every opportunity.

on top of that he gets 22 odd possessions at 80% efficiency.

he is 22 or 23 and probably as good as nathan burke at his best, when ball is 80% fit.

anyone who thinks ball is trade bait or delist material clearly hasn't seen a game of luke balls.

get a grip and a reality check.

the OP lists ball and NOT CJ. if CJ's games were 1/10 as good as Ball i'd be suprised.

Ball will be a 200 game plus player for st kilda, injured or not.

[yipper]

Ball - you guys don't realise how good he is, even with 80% fitness.
.

absolutely concur

the guy is no.1 or no.2 for tackles (and people are creaming themselves over the 3 career tackles CJ gets )

he's close to top for hard ball gets, and clearances at st kilda, and he is one of about 3 or 4 people who shepherd, block and spoil at every opportunity.

on top of that he gets 22 odd possessions at 80% efficiency.

he is 22 or 23 and probably as good as nathan burke at his best, when ball is 80% fit.

anyone who thinks ball is trade bait or delist material clearly hasn't seen a game of luke balls.

get a grip and a reality check.

the OP lists ball and NOT CJ. if CJ's games were 1/10 as good as Ball i'd be suprised.

Ball will be a 200 game plus player for st kilda, injured or not.

Amen to that Dan, couldn't have said it better!!

[stinger]

Ball - you guys don't realise how good he is, even with 80% fitness.
.

absolutely concur

the guy is no.1 or no.2 for tackles (and people are creaming themselves over the 3 career tackles CJ gets )

he's close to top for hard ball gets, and clearances at st kilda, and he is one of about 3 or 4 people who shepherd, block and spoil at every opportunity.

on top of that he gets 22 odd possessions at 80% efficiency.

he is 22 or 23 and probably as good as nathan burke at his best, when ball is 80% fit.

anyone who thinks ball is trade bait or delist material clearly hasn't seen a game of luke balls.

get a grip and a reality check.

the OP lists ball and NOT CJ. if CJ's games were 1/10 as good as Ball i'd be suprised.

Ball will be a 200 game plus player for st kilda, injured or not.

love ya posts when you are just talking footy dan.......

[saintsRrising]

Ball - you guys don't realise how good he is, even with 80% fitness.
.

absolutely concur

the guy is no.1 or no.2 for tackles (and people are creaming themselves over the 3 career tackles CJ gets )

he's close to top for hard ball gets, and clearances at st kilda, and he is one of about 3 or 4 people who shepherd, block and spoil at every opportunity.

on top of that he gets 22 odd possessions at 80% efficiency.

he is 22 or 23 and probably as good as nathan burke at his best, when ball is 80% fit.

anyone who thinks ball is trade bait or delist material clearly hasn't seen a game of luke balls.

get a grip and a reality check.

the OP lists ball and NOT CJ. if CJ's games were 1/10 as good as Ball i'd be suprised.

Ball will be a 200 game plus player for st kilda, injured or not.

Ball will be back to beinga most valuable player again..

I don't know if he will be 100%....but the prognosis on the type of surgery he had is good.

So I am looking forward to have the real Ball back....

[Dan Warna]

Amen to that Dan, couldn't have said it better!!

yep folks are quick to bring out balls bad games, but even banger has had the odd bad game in his illustrious career.

IMO in 2006 in the last 11 games, ball was beaten twice.

playing in the centre winning or breaking even 9/11 is a pretty good job.

in 2007 he clearly came back early from the head injury he sustained against melbourne but after than he was more than solid although he continued to get hit.

probably won or broke even 75% of the games he played as a 1v1 situation as well as doing every 1 percenter that was humanly possible.

[stinger]

[quote="Dan Warna"][quote="yipper"]



yep folks are quick to bring out balls bad games, but even banger has had the odd bad game in his illustrious career.

/quote]


can only remember one actually........don't believe there were more.....

[Oh When the Saints]

Unless they improve significantly, the following players are almost certainly gone at the end of '08:
Gwilt, Ferguson, C. Jones


Leigh Fisher is another I didn't think of who is going to struggle to play many games in the team. The fact that the club were prepared to trade him, and his tapering form towards the end of the year (bar one or two games) means he is under the pump.

Needs to lose weight and improve his endurance and running ability if he is to play as a tagger down back and through the midfield.

Will be under enormous pressure from Dempster and Birss for his spot.

[SaintBot]

these players are playing their last year for the club.....some might not get to play at all.....

charlie gardiner....not good enough....ross will realise why sad sack gave him the flick....

Think you are wrong on this one. I have a feeling he may make you eat your words.

Everything I have heard and seen of him in the last 6 months points to him being a bonus pick for us.

Bookmark this thread... (although it will disappear into cyberland within a few months..)

i agree with you here n1ck...gardiner has got great potential and football ability he just needs someone to make him utilise it

at training the other day i was pleasantly surprised to see how good his endurance was...with his height and endurance put together we might have got ourselves a slightly poor man's Ryan O'keefe

exactly what we need giving the absence of hamill

[Barney2]

well said. X and Raph sh*t me. Soft at the ball, x plays one good game in 10, Raph always groined, X was uninjured for the first time all year and was still not really serviceable. Matty Ferg-I like him. He plays where he is told, so he cant go forward if RL wants him down back. Gwilt, yes, I agree, one more year but give him a go. Funny how Bevo picks thesae players out of nowhere and then the AFL talent scout Sheehan says he is a wonder at picking up players not involved in the U18 system. They aren't there besides N Ablett because they simply arent good enough in the first place Bevo. Did here a rumour though that delisted Sweeny couldnt make it to U18 training from where he lived. Anyway, well said.
Yeah, Gardiner last legs. He won't play ever again anyway. Milne-Need him. Just dont play him Midlfield RL. Get rid of that blonde WA boy, clinton Jones. He annoys me worse than Milne and worse on his wrong side too. Other than that, we have a great side. Top 4 next year.

[fonz_#15]

well said. X and Raph sh*t me. Soft at the ball, x plays one good game in 10, Raph always groined, X was uninjured for the first time all year and was still not really serviceable. Matty Ferg-I like him. He plays where he is told, so he cant go forward if RL wants him down back. Gwilt, yes, I agree, one more year but give him a go. Funny how Bevo picks thesae players out of nowhere and then the AFL talent scout Sheehan says he is a wonder at picking up players not involved in the U18 system. They aren't there besides N Ablett because they simply arent good enough in the first place Bevo. Did here a rumour though that delisted Sweeny couldnt make it to U18 training from where he lived. Anyway, well said.
Yeah, Gardiner last legs. He won't play ever again anyway. Milne-Need him. Just dont play him Midlfield RL. Get rid of that blonde WA boy, clinton Jones. He annoys me worse than Milne and worse on his wrong side too. Other than that, we have a great side. Top 4 next year.

i read 1 line of your post and was convinced that i was wasting my time..

[fonz_#15]

are we all convinced this will be G's last year? i for 1 am not too sure myself, he seems very keen to get back into it and for that reason i am not so sure it will be just 1 more year of fraser.

[stinger]

well said. X and Raph sh*t me. Soft at the ball, x plays one good game in 10, Raph always groined, X was uninjured for the first time all year and was still not really serviceable. Matty Ferg-I like him. He plays where he is told, so he cant go forward if RL wants him down back. Gwilt, yes, I agree, one more year but give him a go. Funny how Bevo picks thesae players out of nowhere and then the AFL talent scout Sheehan says he is a wonder at picking up players not involved in the U18 system. They aren't there besides N Ablett because they simply arent good enough in the first place Bevo. Did here a rumour though that delisted Sweeny couldnt make it to U18 training from where he lived. Anyway, well said.
Yeah, Gardiner last legs. He won't play ever again anyway. Milne-Need him. Just dont play him Midlfield RL. Get rid of that blonde WA boy, clinton Jones. He annoys me worse than Milne and worse on his wrong side too. Other than that, we have a great side. Top 4 next year.

i read 1 line of your post and was convinced that i was wasting my time..

only takes me half a line to work out that b4e's posts are a waste of time and space.......

[bigcarl]

are we all convinced this will be G's last year? i for 1 am not too sure myself, he seems very keen to get back into it and for that reason i am not so sure it will be just 1 more year of fraser.

big blokes who don't have to run far can go on a bit longer. alastair lynch was one example. i wouldn't be surprised if fraser pulled them on in 2009 barring injury

[LTN16]

My prediction is that the following players will get the axe at the end of 2008:

Jones - needs to improve his kicking and work rate.
Ferguson - needs to find a spot in the team weather it is Forward or Back.

Maybe's:
Rix - Luke van Rheenen could be ready for '09 so he could get the axe as the Back-up Ruckman.
Gwilt - needs to find a spot in the team and hold it.
M.Gardiner - if he doesn't get fit. Needs to play over 15 games.
Howard - if he doesn't show any improvement.
C.Gardiner - has to improve a lot from his days at Geelong to hold his spot on the List.

Retirements:
Harvey
Gehrig

[supersaints]

To those who think we should dump Ball, suggest you go and support another club - Ball would walk into any other club...

[Richter]

Interesting thread. Good to read a bit of St Kilda footy again after a bit of a break! My tuppenth worth......

..... for the players, it is not just those on the fringe playing for their livelihood. All the players are doing that. There is a finite wage pie that needs to be sliced. Some players on a decent whack are in danger of getting a big pay drop if they don't live up to potential IMO. Yes, Aaron going and the G-train dropping wage help free up some dosh but it is inevitable that some are making claims for bigger dough then some must give some up.

Deserving of pay rise - Sam Fisher, Jason Gram, Sam Gilbert, Brendon Goddard (as of early 2007 form), Leigh Montagna, Nick Riewoldt (cannot pay him enough IMO - our best and most consistent player for 4 seasons)

Likely to stay the same/minor changes - most players

May be looking at a substantial drop IMO - Ball, Maguire, X Clarke, Baker (although may not really be on big dollars)

[supersaints]

Interesting thread. Good to read a bit of St Kilda footy again after a bit of a break! My tuppenth worth......

..... for the players, it is not just those on the fringe playing for their livelihood. All the players are doing that. There is a finite wage pie that needs to be sliced. Some players on a decent whack are in danger of getting a big pay drop if they don't live up to potential IMO. Yes, Aaron going and the G-train dropping wage help free up some dosh but it is inevitable that some are making claims for bigger dough then some must give some up.

Deserving of pay rise - Sam Fisher, Jason Gram, Sam Gilbert, Brendon Goddard (as of early 2007 form), Leigh Montagna, Nick Riewoldt (cannot pay him enough IMO - our best and most consistent player for 4 seasons)

Likely to stay the same/minor changes - most players

May be looking at a substantial drop IMO - Ball, Maguire, X Clarke, Baker (although may not really be on big dollars)

Did not know you were privy to what each players contract is worth??? I am not but I did read that almost all our top tier players opted to hang in together and play with each other...therefore take a pay cut, this included Ball and Maguire and X.... You should appreciate that they could all play elsewhere for more money, besides if Balls operation is successful you will see him become one of the best who ever played for the Saints... even injured he is better than 80% of the leagues centermen

[jill]

Don't agree that X &R are soft at the ball. X in particular puts body on the line & has sometimes sustained injuries as a result. Feel this was unfair comment.

[supersaints]

Don't agree that X &R are soft at the ball. X in particular puts body on the line & has sometimes sustained injuries as a result. Feel this was unfair comment.

I agree with you Jill, It amazes me how many formanites seem to want to get rid of half our list, anyone who makes AFL grade is probably a lot tougher than anyone on the forum...........

[Richter]

Oh dear...... a forum..... a place for debate and discussion.

No, I don't know what each player is on. But I'm prepared to bet that Riewoldt is on more than Ball who is on more than Gilbert, for instance.

As for being able to do their job - so what? In case you hadn't noticed footy is a spectator sport, so we're all going to have opinions. If all you want to say is that the Saints are great and look how tough the players are perhaps conversing on a FORUM ain't for you.

[Dan Warna]

did someone suggest X was soft?

OMG

the normal criticism of X is he doesn't have any self preservation circuits and gets anhilated because of his own courage.

X possibly along with reiwoldt and ball are amongst the most couragious players in the team.

along with thompson, burke, v2, amongst the most couragious we've had.

acuse him of poor decision making on ocassion, having bad luck with injuries, perhaps even poor pregame preparation, even throw choking in front of goal. Plenty to criticise the x man over, but IMO anyone who has seen the way he throws his body around couldn't possibly accuse him of being soft.