Should we Relocate to the Gold Coast?

[rodgerfox]

The same goes for the move to Docklands, but it is a soulless modern facility

All clubs in the AFL are souless these days.

Manufactured to serve the AFL interests.

The only soul that AFL clubs have is exactly what the AFL says they can.

[Oh When the Saints]

Very cynical view rodgerfox.

Tell that to the 70-year old trainers who are still alive and kicking at some clubs, or the volunteers who run the Saints museum. Their blood is red, white and black, and they would sit through anything for a premiership.

Supporters give a club it's soul IMO.

[rodgerfox]

Supporters give a club it's soul IMO.

Agree. Agree totally.

So when supporters can't stroll down to their home ground and watch their team train.

And when they can no longer have a kick on the ground in the forward pocket when the players are training up the other end.

And when you need to sit in an allocated seat to watch your team play.

And when you need to pay to view your team play.

And when the AFL remove aspects of the game that we love, without any input from the supporters - the souls of the clubs.

And when you're no longer considered a supporter by many if you don't buy a membership.

And so on and so on.


This is exactly why the soul of all footy clubs have been ripped out and are now owned by the AFL. Because the heartbeat of our game - the supporters, have never been treated with such contempt and been so alienated like this before.

It's why the AFL are basically deciding that the Roos will go to the Gold Coast - the 'supporters' won't get a say at all.

The AFL owns the souls of all the clubs.

A Saints flag in this era, regardless of where we call 'home' at the time, wouldn't be worth 10% of what it would have been worth 10 years ago.

[Oh When the Saints]

This is exactly why the soul of all footy clubs have been ripped out and are now owned by the AFL. Because the heartbeat of our game - the supporters, have never been treated with such contempt and been so alienated like this before.

You're exactly right.

[ausfatcat]

This is exactly why the soul of all footy clubs have been ripped out and are now owned by the AFL. Because the heartbeat of our game - the supporters, have never been treated with such contempt and been so alienated like this before.

You're exactly right.

yet more people go to the footy than ever before...... I really find it hard to believe that is the case.

[Oh When the Saints]

Two things with that ausfatcat ...

1) Melbourne's population is half a million people bigger than it was fifteen years ago. By extension, more people are going to attend football.

2) The connection with their club is gone for many people. They still love the club, but are not involved or feel the same sense of belonging as previously. You only have to listen to an hour of talkback on 3AW or SEN on the weekend to understand this is the case. Finey's show on SEN is a great one for hearing the sentiment of average footy fans.

Perfect example was a thread a few weeks back ... just 15 years ago, Thursday nights at training, the social club was open. People could have a kick of the footy, a couple of drinks, a meal, watch training and there were raffles and the players would be there.

That is gone. It involved many, many people with the club.


Contrast with the local footy club, where you can walk down to a barbecue or a pie night, have a few beers and watch the footy. Everyone is mates and there's a great sense of belonging and community.

AFL clubs used to have that - or should I say VFL clubs used to have that.

It's gone.


Football supporters have never felt so disconnected from the game and from their clubs.

[rodgerfox]

yet more people go to the footy than ever before...... I really find it hard to believe that is the case.

If you want any access to your team at all - you have to go.

Far less games are televised, so if you want to see your team play to have to go.

These days, the AFL hold you to emotional ransom to ensure you buy a membership. So once you've forked out the $150 for a membership - of course you're going to go.

The AFL always pluck these figures out to claim 'the game has never been better', but the figures are fudged.

[Barney2]

get real. If we move to GC, I off the wagon. We are debt free, apparently witha big supporter base, good home advantage. Why move. We are St Kilda, a melbourne name.

[rodgerfox]

get real. If we move to GC, I off the wagon. We are debt free, apparently witha big supporter base, good home advantage. Why move. We are St Kilda, a melbourne name.

Good home advantage??

We seem to play well at Docklands, but I'd hardly say we get an 'advantage' there.

[BAM! (shhhh)]

Supporters give a club it's soul IMO.

This is exactly why the soul of all footy clubs have been ripped out and are now owned by the AFL. Because the heartbeat of our game - the supporters, have never been treated with such contempt and been so alienated like this before.

...

A Saints flag in this era, regardless of where we call 'home' at the time, wouldn't be worth 10% of what it would have been worth 10 years ago.

A Saints flag would be worth less because supporters role has changed? What a crock. A Saints flag is worth far more, because the playing field is far more competitive. That's the advent of professionalism. The game is faster, fiercer, more demanding, less forgiving, and more compelling than ever before. If you want to watch your mates play, spend more time at a local oval. Keep in mind that even before this "disconnect" a lot of fans/supporters were TV fans, never met the players, never followed teh VFL/AFL for their own esteem, but because it was the best of the best.

If you want to watch the best of the best, watch the AFL.

And in the modern era, when the Saints pull down a flag, there will be nobody who can say they weren't the best of the best.

[rodgerfox]

Supporters give a club it's soul IMO.

This is exactly why the soul of all footy clubs have been ripped out and are now owned by the AFL. Because the heartbeat of our game - the supporters, have never been treated with such contempt and been so alienated like this before.

...

A Saints flag in this era, regardless of where we call 'home' at the time, wouldn't be worth 10% of what it would have been worth 10 years ago.

A Saints flag would be worth less because supporters role has changed? What a crock.

It is a crock. That's why I never said it.

If you want to watch the best of the best, watch the AFL.

And in the modern era, when the Saints pull down a flag, there will be nobody who can say they weren't the best of the best.

Lots of people could - and would. Because it's not an even playing field. It's not a competition anymore - it's a business.

It's not about pitting the best against the best at all. It hasn't been for several years. It's about making money.

[Otiman]

I'm going to change my tune on this.

I've always wanted to live somewhere in S.E. Qld, which is mostly climate related. One of the biggest stepping stones would have been to give up seeing the Saints regularly.

If we move to the gold coast, i'll more than likely take up residence there myself, at least until I get bored of it and move back to Melbourne.

[BAM! (shhhh)]

Supporters give a club it's soul IMO.

This is exactly why the soul of all footy clubs have been ripped out and are now owned by the AFL. Because the heartbeat of our game - the supporters, have never been treated with such contempt and been so alienated like this before.

...

A Saints flag in this era, regardless of where we call 'home' at the time, wouldn't be worth 10% of what it would have been worth 10 years ago.

A Saints flag would be worth less because supporters role has changed? What a crock.

It is a crock. That's why I never said it.

Ah, paraphrasing is rife for miscommunication. It appeared to me from the above, that you were implying a modern era flag was worth less because of supporters changing place withong the game. If you'd like to correct my inference, I'm happy to refer to any other implication of lessening value of flags in the modern era as a crock in it's place

If you want to watch the best of the best, watch the AFL.

And in the modern era, when the Saints pull down a flag, there will be nobody who can say they weren't the best of the best.

Lots of people could - and would. Because it's not an even playing field. It's not a competition anymore - it's a business.

It's not about pitting the best against the best at all. It hasn't been for several years. It's about making money.

Well of course people would say it. I was on a role and not going to let the ridiculous things other people would inevitably to say get in the way of ridiculous exagerations I want to make.

However.

In a similar inference-implication circle to the above, I don't see how AFL making money stops it being about the best... while for the business interests necessary to ensure a professional competition, it's about making money, and the motivation for some players is also doubtless money, i can't see how a case can be made that for the average fan it's about making money. For the average fan, it has to be, at some level, about here's the best aussie rules footy players, playing the game. Otherwise there would be no money to make.

Money has done many bad things, but it's made the players full time, given them elite facilities (well, most of them ) and added to performance pressure. In short, it's made them the best.

[Oh When the Saints]

Yes, but at the end of the day the game is for the supporters. The players are transient. The supporters are not.

[rodgerfox]

Oh, by the way I don't think we should move

[mandystkilda]

Are you crazy? Move to Gold Coast that is the dumbist thing I have erver heard! What membership cost $150?

[rodgerfox]

The reason for BUMPING this thread, is simply to see the differing views on this topic now, in Moccha's thread, compared to those posted back last year in this thread.

I've changed my view on it.

[Newman]

Hey Eppo - interested to read your a Mentone boy. Me too - grew up at Allandale Rd went to Parkdale High. Now living in Brisbane after 10 years on Gold Coast. Selfishly, I wouldn't mind Saints moving to Gold Coast. Still play a bunch of games in Melb and if it means seeing the boys doing a victory lap on Grand Final day at the 'G' - I'd be happy.

[Saint Bev]

It will not happen. No Melb sides will be shifting to the coast. AFL have stated that it will be a new start up team.

[aussierules0k]

[sunsaint]

yet more people go to the footy than ever before...... I really find it hard to believe that is the case.

If you want any access to your team at all - you have to go.

Far less games are televised, so if you want to see your team play to have to go.

Rodger
Far more games are televised than ever before under the Seven/Ten alliance. . . only Foxtel has reduced their coverage.
First up the Saints wont be moving to the Gold Coast, which is a great pity because in ten years time all the supporters here will be howling about the GoldCoast Sharks and how unfair the system is. An alliance with Southport will make any future club up there one of the power houses of the AFL.

But the thing is and OTWS can take note as well.
I was there during the so called good old days at Linton St.
Yes you could go and have a beer at the social club, the kids could have a kick on the ground (although there is more open access to the ground now) Have dinner on thursday nights and watch the training sessions. And Saturday nights at the Disco used to jump.
I also remember the players getting pissed as newts, the player brawls in the disco, oh and the mediocrity on the field.
Then came Waverley and there was a corresponding on field improvement. The same with the Dome. The Southport Saints would be a guaranteed flag.
Back at Linton St the public had access to the club on a level that is not the same as today. But as the players became professional, this changed, and I guarantee the players of today, would not want to go back to the old days(except maybe Fev, Buddy), and if they did they would be playing EDFL or VFL.

[plugger66]

yet more people go to the footy than ever before...... I really find it hard to believe that is the case.

If you want any access to your team at all - you have to go.

Far less games are televised, so if you want to see your team play to have to go.

Rodger
Far more games are televised than ever before under the Seven/Ten alliance. . . only Foxtel has reduced their coverage.
First up the Saints wont be moving to the Gold Coast, which is a great pity because in ten years time all the supporters here will be howling about the GoldCoast Sharks and how unfair the system is. An alliance with Southport will make any future club up there one of the power houses of the AFL.

But the thing is and OTWS can take note as well.
I was there during the so called good old days at Linton St.
Yes you could go and have a beer at the social club, the kids could have a kick on the ground (although there is more open access to the ground now) Have dinner on thursday nights and watch the training sessions. And Saturday nights at the Disco used to jump.
I also remember the players getting pissed as newts, the player brawls in the disco, oh and the mediocrity on the field.
Then came Waverley and there was a corresponding on field improvement. The same with the Dome. The Southport Saints would be a guaranteed flag.
Back at Linton St the public had access to the club on a level that is not the same as today. But as the players became professional, this changed, and I guarantee the players of today, would not want to go back to the old days(except maybe Fev, Buddy), and if they did they would be playing EDFL or VFL.

Just one point on your post. The disco has never been Saturday night it was always Friday night. The Southport Saints maybe a guareented flag but we are St Kilda not Southport.

[st_Trav_ofWA]

Very cynical view rodgerfox.

Tell that to the 70-year old trainers who are still alive and kicking at some clubs, or the volunteers who run the Saints museum. Their blood is red, white and black, and they would sit through anything for a premiership.

Supporters give a club it's soul IMO.

just on a side note i heard a whisper that the Museum was a low to non existant priority for the club when the move happens to frankston ... our history isnt part of our future i belive was mentioned....... but that may have changed from the last time is went to Melbourne

[perfectionist]

On one condition.... they re-name Surfers Paradise "St.Kilda".

Hey, that's not a bad idea, but with one addition. Loyal Saints fans - determined by the quality (not quantity) of their posts to the Saintsational Forum - will also be relocated to a luxury apartment not far from the ground (and other assorted exotic features).

Put it to Andy, I say.

[iwantmeseats]

Very cynical view rodgerfox.

Tell that to the 70-year old trainers who are still alive and kicking at some clubs, or the volunteers who run the Saints museum. Their blood is red, white and black, and they would sit through anything for a premiership.

Supporters give a club it's soul IMO.

just on a side note i heard a whisper that the Museum was a low to non existant priority for the club when the move happens to frankston ... our history isnt part of our future i belive was mentioned....... but that may have changed from the last time is went to Melbourne

Yeah well if anyone actually said that they should be sacked immediately for the complete dickwad that they are. That goes for anyone from the top down. Just a totally disgraceful and disrespectful attitude to have. People like that can G and GF. Not wanted at this club. Lets all remember, admin are NOT the club, just custodians. That is ALL. The AFL admin would do well to remember this as well.