More Pace

[locoplayaz]

With Byron Schammer, Kane Tenace, Troy Selwood all up for trade why are we not going hard after one of all of them?

[fonz_#15]

pace is overrated, get a player whocan play football. nottosay that the 3 names you suggest arent any good but pace does not make you a great player,you still need to find the ball.

I dont regard harvey as the paciest man around, hasnt stopped him from being great has it?

[evertonfc]

It seems obvious to us, but then again, Ross Lyon persisted with Blake on Cousins after half-time.

Let's hope they do the right thing and chase these midfield prospects. Throw Brad Symes into the mix as well.

[Dan Warna]

With Byron Schammer, Kane Tenace, Troy Selwood all up for trade why are we not going hard after one of all of them?

tenace is crapulant so far.

schammer is 21 or 22, about as effective and xavier clarke, bit hit and miss in form.

selwood is 23 and a tagger, dont know that he has that much pace.

[Batnoe]

Would prefer Schammer in that lot

however if we got Troy, we could pick up his brother later in the draft, maybe use it as a ploy, i would imagine Adam Selwood would move back to Vic as well if the other 3 are there, especially his twin

[Saints43]

pace is overrated, get a player whocan play football. nottosay that the 3 names you suggest arent any good but pace does not make you a great player,you still need to find the ball.

I dont regard harvey as the paciest man around, hasnt stopped him from being great has it?

No player runs as fast as the ball moves through the air. Have someone who can kick it and someone who can get it and that's as fast as it gets.

[st_Trav_ofWA]

pace is overrated, get a player whocan play football. nottosay that the 3 names you suggest arent any good but pace does not make you a great player,you still need to find the ball.

I dont regard harvey as the paciest man around, hasnt stopped him from being great has it?

No player runs as fast as the ball moves through the air. Have someone who can kick it and someone who can get it and that's as fast as it gets.

well put i would rather a kid who can hit a target from 40 m on both his left and right boot then a kid who can run the 100m in under 10sec
pace is wasted if disposal is poor E.G. CJ

[TimeToShineFellas]

well put i would rather a kid who can hit a target from 40 m on both his left and right boot then a kid who can run the 100m in under 10sec
pace is wasted if disposal is poor E.G. CJ

Nail on the head...............

[SaintWodonga]

Let's get our pace through pick 9. Would like pace with a young player.

[Dan Warna]

note noone says more speed anymore

[n1ck]

Id take schammer in a second.

Could be a superstar in the Crawford mould if he pulled his socks up.

[st_Trav_ofWA]

Id take schammer in a second.

Could be a superstar in the Crawford mould if he pulled his socks up.

im suprised how quick hes come back to AFL level after he had his apendix (i think it was ) taken out he was really sick for a long time and lost a whole heap of weight (in the paper they showed him he looked like a bag of bones ) to come back from that sooo quickly is some effort

[Oh When the Saints]

It seems obvious to us, but then again, Ross Lyon persisted with Blake on Cousins after half-time.

Let's hope they do the right thing and chase these midfield prospects. Throw Brad Symes into the mix as well.

Blake kept Cousins to 9 possessions in the first half. To that point, it was a match-winning move.

Then Attard did his knee, and Lyon lost his other tagger (Baker was out).

At three-quarter time, Cousins had started to cut loose, although Blake was still doing okay.

But who else could we have put on him? Gram was winning his position and Hayes and Dal were providing us with good run. Ball was out.


Had there been more defensive players on the field to choose from, I would criticise Lyon for not making the move.

But we didn't have anyone fit enough to go with Cousins. Blake is the fittest player at St Kilda and couldn't make the same 2nd/3rd efforts in the last quarter.

It wouldn't have mattered if we'd had the best tagger in the world ... no-one was going to stop Cousins that night.

[evertonfc]

It seems obvious to us, but then again, Ross Lyon persisted with Blake on Cousins after half-time.

Let's hope they do the right thing and chase these midfield prospects. Throw Brad Symes into the mix as well.

Blake kept Cousins to 9 possessions in the first half. To that point, it was a match-winning move.

Then Attard did his knee, and Lyon lost his other tagger (Baker was out).

At three-quarter time, Cousins had started to cut loose, although Blake was still doing okay.

But who else could we have put on him? Gram was winning his position and Hayes and Dal were providing us with good run. Ball was out.


Had there been more defensive players on the field to choose from, I would criticise Lyon for not making the move.

But we didn't have anyone fit enough to go with Cousins. Blake is the fittest player at St Kilda and couldn't make the same 2nd/3rd efforts in the last quarter.

It wouldn't have mattered if we'd had the best tagger in the world ... no-one was going to stop Cousins that night.

Match-winning move? Steady up mate

It wasn't just fitness which cost Blake - watch the tape again.

He stands three-four metres off Cousins at the centre bounces...and never makes up the ground.

Birss and L Fisher draw my ire from time to time, but I would have backed both to at least sit on Cousins and frustrate him - not play him in such a way that invites him to dominate. Lyon didn't seem to pick this up.

You can fry it, boil it, curry it, bake it, roast it or grill it, but it was still a bad coaching move to stick with him when it was clear he was getting carved up.

I wouldn't call it a match-losing move, but it basically ensured we'd get flogged at the clearences.

[Oh When the Saints]

I disagree ... I don't think anyone would have done better.

Cousins was running like R. Harvey or S. Crawford in the last quarter. Do any St Kilda players have that sort of fitness, apart from Banger?

Until 3-quarter time, the move was at least a break-even one. You can't blame RL for sticking with it, especially when we were a man down, and robbing our midfield rotation of a Birss-type would have left us even more disadvantaged.

[evertonfc]

I disagree ... I don't think anyone would have done better.

So why did he stand so far off him?

[Oh When the Saints]

Honestly didn't notice that everton.

If true ... then RL should have told the runner to tell him to stick closer.

Blake is not called the 'Space Cadet' for nothing ... needs specific instructions.

I still maintain RL had no other options that would have kept the team structure settled.

[sax]

Seriously, with so much footy knowledge, you should be the coach Everton!!!!!

[barks4eva]

I disagree ... I don't think anyone would have done better.

So why did he stand so far off him?

Ev is correct

Blake was sometimes 5 metres away from him at the ball ups

For someone who was supposed to be tagging him

I remember it clearly , as I was bagging the crap out of him for it

[st_Trav_ofWA]

the heavy blocks that the eagles put on blake had alot to do with that every time benny ran past an eagles team mate blake got a whack for his troubles ... but hey lets not let the truth get in the way

[samoht]

pace is not over rated - it's an ingredient that we need more of - for team balance.

All else being equal - pace is a major consideration - and what St Kilda needs more of.

consider this

1. when the ball is in open spaces - and the MCG has plenty of open spaces - we get beaten to the ball more often than not.
All a quicker opposition side needs to do is kick the ball out into the open
and they free up their quicker players.

2. we need players that can run the lines

3. we need players that can chase down, tackle and pressure opponents and create turnovers.

Fact -
You could be the hardest player but you're not going to beat a quicker opponent to a loose ball or be able to apply the necessary pressure to a quicker opponent.
a quicker and softer "outside" player can however chase down a harder slower opponent.

[saintsRrising]

Honestly didn't notice that everton.

If true ... then RL should have told the runner to tell him to stick closer.

.

Yes I remember thinking about it at the time....and in particular as that is also when Cox really started to palm the ball beautifually...

So with Cox palming well...back and forwards...and Cousins in space.....it was not good.

BUT as you say OWTS Attard had gone down.

However I think another discussion point was one reason why Blake's tagging job on Crawford was made easier was that Crawford was mainly playing in space....and Blake just had to run with him.

At centre ball ups Blake played less the tag...and more tried to win it himself....which with Cox directing it to Cousins was nota wise move...

[BAM! (shhhh)]

I disagree ... I don't think anyone would have done better.

So why did he stand so far off him?

I've seen that tactic employed by a few taggers on faster opponents... and a couple of Saints this year. They watch for the fall of the ball, and if it is anything other than directly to your opponent, you know pretty much where they're going, or if the opponent runs off, the tagger follows and tightens up. Not as good at stopping touches, but impacts on effectiveness, and I suppose if you can create an inneffective touch when the opponent wins the ball, it's better than chasing them around while lesser lights rack up effective disposals. Ideally, it also forces your opponent to pay you more respect because it gives you a better chance of winning the ball.

I suppose it's a similar idea to tagging a faster player in open ground where you'll sometimes see a tagger let their opponent loose in the back half of the ground so they can't get burned on a hard run forward.

It's not something the Saints employed under GT, you were either tagging or you weren't, but I recall seeing L. Fisher use the same tactic against Carazzo, who racked up 40 touches on the day and grinding my teeth... though I also recall seeing Fisher win a clearance just as I was whinging about how stupid it was to do it against Carlton who weren't blocking.

When taps go directly to the tagee of course (e.g. Cousins) it not only doesn't work, it looks stupid. Given that Blake on Cousins was also a tag that was getting dropped at the halfway mark, Blake not only was towelled up, but in classic Blake fashion, when he does something bad, he looked even worse.

Anyway, that's my rationalisation for something I hadn't seen the Saints do till '07, only noticed when it didn't work, and didn't like.