If possible we should really try and get Warnock, I would be willing to give up number 1 draft pick and a Fiora type fringe player to get him, he is going to be a star!!Animal Enclosure wrote:Priority #1- A ruckman! A decent one at that. Hille, Jolly, Warnocke, Seaby, etc.
Load up on more young midfielders, develop Jarryd Allen as a key defender.
Who should be on the Saints shopping list?
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Armoooo
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ROBERT HARVEY A.K.A The Great Man, Banger, Harves, Ol' Man River...
384 games, 4 B&F's, 3 EJ Whitten Medals, St.Kilda Captain, 2 Time Brownlow Medalist, 8 Time All Australian, 2nd Highest Brownlow votes poller.... The greatest of ALL TIME!!
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CeilidhSaint
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We need to promote almost all our midfield rookies - we just need more midfield depth.
Draft more midfielders and rookie some as well.
We need a third tall for the forward line regardless of plays FF - we just don't have enough options if FG and NR don't kick goals - and FG won't be kicking many next year!! Hopefull A Hamill is there!
We need 7 genuine midfilelders, inside and out and change the game plan so from 50 we look for goal, not short pass!!!
Harvey, Dal, Ball, Monty, Lenny should be told they should be kicking a goal agame and in the preseason drag them if they don't go for goal when in distance!
Goddard should play mid - he is a genuine goal kicker and can spot up from 80 out.
Gilbert, Allen, Maguire, Fisher, Clarke, Fisher, Max, Baker, Wall (skinny yes, but Gilbert is no he man and neither was Lappin!), Gram should be a decent start for a back line!
This year was a heart breaker but we don't have to slash everyone in response.
Draft more midfielders and rookie some as well.
We need a third tall for the forward line regardless of plays FF - we just don't have enough options if FG and NR don't kick goals - and FG won't be kicking many next year!! Hopefull A Hamill is there!
We need 7 genuine midfilelders, inside and out and change the game plan so from 50 we look for goal, not short pass!!!
Harvey, Dal, Ball, Monty, Lenny should be told they should be kicking a goal agame and in the preseason drag them if they don't go for goal when in distance!
Goddard should play mid - he is a genuine goal kicker and can spot up from 80 out.
Gilbert, Allen, Maguire, Fisher, Clarke, Fisher, Max, Baker, Wall (skinny yes, but Gilbert is no he man and neither was Lappin!), Gram should be a decent start for a back line!
This year was a heart breaker but we don't have to slash everyone in response.
TB 1 - The Brightest Light on the Darkest Night - we miss you.
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SaintWodonga
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vacuous space
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at the time spider had left the club, Kosi had back injuries and we went for a young ruckman who was in the system, had quality and talent and was highly rated as a junior because we needed a ruckman.
we didn't go for a quick fix (say a 27 year old or a 33 year old) we went for a young kid with potential
at the time our midfield rotation was harvey, thompson ball, baker, powell, etc etc
also at the time we DIDN"T know that carlton were going to get wiped out of the draft, we assumed that carlton would get goddard and possibly wells, then we would get pick 3 which could have gone for salopek, and pick 8 or whatever we were going to trade away for a young ruckman with a 10 plus season future.
history showed carlton lost their draft picks after the trading period, and richmond also had traded their draft picks away for kane johnson and adelaide traded pick 4 to north for carey...
as a result of carlton getting wiped, we got goddard instead of potentially salopek who missed a LOT of football with injury and has recently racked up 60 games (yes I know 50 odd more than brooks) but spent a lot of time injured with limited return)
also north got wells isntead of whatever they were going to get for pick 4.
port thought they were getting pick 8 in a relatively thin draft and were absolutely rapt they were getting pick 6 instead.
of course if we did draft salopek folks would be hounding for us to delist him as he was injured and a liability a la ferguson, watts, etc.
north waited what 5 seasons for maccintosh to come good? port have invested how many years in developing salopek through injury and limited game time? would we have the patience to spend 5 years putting a playre on the pine for 70 minutes of a game to develop him as port did with salopek?
we didn't go for a quick fix (say a 27 year old or a 33 year old) we went for a young kid with potential
at the time our midfield rotation was harvey, thompson ball, baker, powell, etc etc
also at the time we DIDN"T know that carlton were going to get wiped out of the draft, we assumed that carlton would get goddard and possibly wells, then we would get pick 3 which could have gone for salopek, and pick 8 or whatever we were going to trade away for a young ruckman with a 10 plus season future.
history showed carlton lost their draft picks after the trading period, and richmond also had traded their draft picks away for kane johnson and adelaide traded pick 4 to north for carey...
as a result of carlton getting wiped, we got goddard instead of potentially salopek who missed a LOT of football with injury and has recently racked up 60 games (yes I know 50 odd more than brooks) but spent a lot of time injured with limited return)
also north got wells isntead of whatever they were going to get for pick 4.
port thought they were getting pick 8 in a relatively thin draft and were absolutely rapt they were getting pick 6 instead.
of course if we did draft salopek folks would be hounding for us to delist him as he was injured and a liability a la ferguson, watts, etc.
north waited what 5 seasons for maccintosh to come good? port have invested how many years in developing salopek through injury and limited game time? would we have the patience to spend 5 years putting a playre on the pine for 70 minutes of a game to develop him as port did with salopek?
Bewaire krime, da krimson bolt is comeing to yure nayborhood to smach krime
SHUT UP KRIME!
SHUT UP KRIME!
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Stephen Theodore
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Shannon Byrnes from Geelong. Seems to have fallen out of favor, due to the development on Stokes and Varcoe. Has real dash and can snag a few. Eddie Sansbury has been playing in the twos all year same sort of player, although he kicked 5 yesterday against the doggies so i doubt the Roos would want to let him go now.
top post Dan, very accurate summary of what happened around the time of the Brooks trade. Salopek was widely tipped as the third best player that year, the only reason he slipped to 6 was that the doggies were desperate for a tall and sydney and brisbane went for local kids.
As for brooks, I have no idea what will happen to him now. Hes been playing well in the 2s and we need a ruckman. However he hasnt been named as an emergency for weeks now so it would seem he is earmarked for delisting.
I think he might just be saved due to the number of retirements this year
As for brooks, I have no idea what will happen to him now. Hes been playing well in the 2s and we need a ruckman. However he hasnt been named as an emergency for weeks now so it would seem he is earmarked for delisting.
I think he might just be saved due to the number of retirements this year
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BAM! (shhhh)
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What a surprising thread given the tone of posts on Saints recruiting I've seen on this board...
Personally, I'd be against the Saints trading their 1st rounder, unless the return was going to step stright in, have an impact, and be around for some time to come. Charman/Seaby who could ruck/forward along with Kosi would fit the bill, but I still would hesitate, and suspect someone else will give up as much/more for Charman (if he really is moving), so on the whole, would rather see the Saints use the pick.
More interested tradewise in seeing if we can work out a deal for an out of favour player ala Sherman (was big props for him a year ago, he's stunk it up in '07, but would slot right into the Birss role as an improvement) for someone outside of our core with a low pick. Are Brisbane sold on Hooper? i.e. would they be interested in Milne? Probably not, but I'm more thinking that this off seasons trade work is a lot of phone calls to re-arrange deck chairs rather than making a big splash. Most of our players are either required, or not going to command a lot in return.
More interested in seeing Watts/Brooks than trying to trade for G's replacement. More interested in getting the development pipeline going than trading for upgrades on most players. See what Armo can do after a year in the gym, see whether Mini's ready to swim at AFL level (he'll get his chance with the Baker suspension), see whether Hammill and Gardiner can get on the park in '08.
Not exactly fodder for an exciting November, but IMO the 2 most important ingredients for team building are patience and common sense.
Personally, I'd be against the Saints trading their 1st rounder, unless the return was going to step stright in, have an impact, and be around for some time to come. Charman/Seaby who could ruck/forward along with Kosi would fit the bill, but I still would hesitate, and suspect someone else will give up as much/more for Charman (if he really is moving), so on the whole, would rather see the Saints use the pick.
More interested tradewise in seeing if we can work out a deal for an out of favour player ala Sherman (was big props for him a year ago, he's stunk it up in '07, but would slot right into the Birss role as an improvement) for someone outside of our core with a low pick. Are Brisbane sold on Hooper? i.e. would they be interested in Milne? Probably not, but I'm more thinking that this off seasons trade work is a lot of phone calls to re-arrange deck chairs rather than making a big splash. Most of our players are either required, or not going to command a lot in return.
More interested in seeing Watts/Brooks than trying to trade for G's replacement. More interested in getting the development pipeline going than trading for upgrades on most players. See what Armo can do after a year in the gym, see whether Mini's ready to swim at AFL level (he'll get his chance with the Baker suspension), see whether Hammill and Gardiner can get on the park in '08.
Not exactly fodder for an exciting November, but IMO the 2 most important ingredients for team building are patience and common sense.
"Everything comes to he who hustles while he waits"
- Henry Ford
- Henry Ford
Sherman was being discussed on teh ABC or SEN I think on the radio on the way in on Saturday.
lot of folks think he is GONE.
issues outside football could be affecting him.
confidence gone, motivation gone = skill gone..
might be worth a round 3 draft pick or something, wouldn't waste a first round or even a second round draft pick on him.
probably a 'project player' at this stage or in caydn beetham zone.
might be awesome, might be trash.
lot of folks think he is GONE.
issues outside football could be affecting him.
confidence gone, motivation gone = skill gone..
might be worth a round 3 draft pick or something, wouldn't waste a first round or even a second round draft pick on him.
probably a 'project player' at this stage or in caydn beetham zone.
might be awesome, might be trash.
Bewaire krime, da krimson bolt is comeing to yure nayborhood to smach krime
SHUT UP KRIME!
SHUT UP KRIME!
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True Blue Sainter
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Reckon Sherman is a touch above Beetham's level DW 
I think he would be a terrific acquisition; either for a 3rd round pick, or our 2nd roudner for Sherman & their 3rd rounder. He is ready to slot straight into the side, can play back, midfield or up forward, has a little bit of toe and isn't at all soft. Would love him in the side.
Would definitely like Shannon Byrnes or Kayne Pettifer in a HFF/FP role. A decent ruckman is a MUST. Wood/Seaby/Meesen/Griffin fits the bill here.
I think he would be a terrific acquisition; either for a 3rd round pick, or our 2nd roudner for Sherman & their 3rd rounder. He is ready to slot straight into the side, can play back, midfield or up forward, has a little bit of toe and isn't at all soft. Would love him in the side.
Would definitely like Shannon Byrnes or Kayne Pettifer in a HFF/FP role. A decent ruckman is a MUST. Wood/Seaby/Meesen/Griffin fits the bill here.
The Saints are coming!
TBSTrue Blue Sainter wrote:Reckon Sherman is a touch above Beetham's level DW
I think he would be a terrific acquisition; either for a 3rd round pick, or our 2nd roudner for Sherman & their 3rd rounder. He is ready to slot straight into the side, can play back, midfield or up forward, has a little bit of toe and isn't at all soft. Would love him in the side.
Would definitely like Shannon Byrnes or Kayne Pettifer in a HFF/FP role. A decent ruckman is a MUST. Wood/Seaby/Meesen/Griffin fits the bill here.
Beetham had a TREMENDOUS amount of talent.
where he went wrong was between the ears.
he was a powerful mark, massive body, reasonable engine, booming kick. had everything that say buckley had.
what he didn't have was discipline, refused to chase, refused to tackle, refused to shepherd for his team mates.
compare that to the work ethic of harvey, nathan burke, lenny hayes etc.
frankly hayes could get by and be a reasonably rated footballer drifting off packs and making space for rebounds, but he chases, tackles, blocks, shepherds etc.
Beethams talent is one that was definately wasted.
I dont know how true it is, but when he was told st kilda was interested in him, he replied that dont bother he'd be gone before st kilda got their pick...
probably should have picked up from that attitude that he was going to be a problem.
Bewaire krime, da krimson bolt is comeing to yure nayborhood to smach krime
SHUT UP KRIME!
SHUT UP KRIME!
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B W and R all over
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Hamish McIntosh went to the Kangaroos two picks later.vacuous space wrote:And we need a ruck/forward right now more than we need a midfielder. We had the right idea, just didn't get the player we were hoping for.SaintWodonga wrote:We could have had Salopek, but we gave up the selection for Brooks..
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BAM! (shhhh)
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On Justin Sherman:
Brisbane doesn't have to delist anybody. Chris Scott, Michael Voss, Chris Johnson gone means that's their 3. They only delist further if there's a potential player they want to add.
No doubt Sherman has had a stinker of a year, and personal issues are always the rumour when a player goes that far downhill for no apparent reason. It's also definately of note that forward/outside mid has to be one of the positions on the field that lends intself most to enigmatic performance... you count on the team for delivery like a forward, have the form variance of an outside mid, and at the end of the day, are almost guarenteed to look bad in a loss with no guarentee of looking good in a win.
Sherman played on ball quite a lot last year, the return of Lappin, rise of Notting, Adcock combined with early form from Rischitelli (who also faded behind the previous 3 mentioned, but looked more likely than Sherman), and as good as he was last year, commanding on ball time from the HFF was something Akermanis struggled to do at times. Sherman showed plenty in '06 to keep him around for '08.
My point is this: If I'm Brisbane, I'm certainly not delisting the kid (unless I know something that makes me think he's a cert. to not recover) and am going to try for a 1st round, and perhaps settle for a 2nd round pick. There's no way I give him up for a 3rd rounder when I don't have to...
Brisbane doesn't have to delist anybody. Chris Scott, Michael Voss, Chris Johnson gone means that's their 3. They only delist further if there's a potential player they want to add.
No doubt Sherman has had a stinker of a year, and personal issues are always the rumour when a player goes that far downhill for no apparent reason. It's also definately of note that forward/outside mid has to be one of the positions on the field that lends intself most to enigmatic performance... you count on the team for delivery like a forward, have the form variance of an outside mid, and at the end of the day, are almost guarenteed to look bad in a loss with no guarentee of looking good in a win.
Sherman played on ball quite a lot last year, the return of Lappin, rise of Notting, Adcock combined with early form from Rischitelli (who also faded behind the previous 3 mentioned, but looked more likely than Sherman), and as good as he was last year, commanding on ball time from the HFF was something Akermanis struggled to do at times. Sherman showed plenty in '06 to keep him around for '08.
My point is this: If I'm Brisbane, I'm certainly not delisting the kid (unless I know something that makes me think he's a cert. to not recover) and am going to try for a 1st round, and perhaps settle for a 2nd round pick. There's no way I give him up for a 3rd rounder when I don't have to...
"Everything comes to he who hustles while he waits"
- Henry Ford
- Henry Ford
if we took him, prior to 07 3/4 of the sainters would be demanding he be delisted.B W and R all over wrote:Hamish McIntosh went to the Kangaroos two picks later.vacuous space wrote:And we need a ruck/forward right now more than we need a midfielder. We had the right idea, just didn't get the player we were hoping for.SaintWodonga wrote:We could have had Salopek, but we gave up the selection for Brooks..
in 07 they would be all saying but cox is better
and at the end of 07 they would be saying I wonder if we can trade him for a young potential ruckman...we need someone new to abuse at springvale
Bewaire krime, da krimson bolt is comeing to yure nayborhood to smach krime
SHUT UP KRIME!
SHUT UP KRIME!
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Armoooo
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My ruckman wishlist would look like this...
1. Warnock
2. Griffin
3. Seaby
4. Wood
5. Charman
6. Hille
7. Lade
HFF:
1. Pettifer
2. Headlan
3. Jericho
Midfield:
1. Nathan Jones
2. Haselby
3. Prismall
4. Salopek (No chance just re-signed)
3.
1. Warnock
2. Griffin
3. Seaby
4. Wood
5. Charman
6. Hille
7. Lade
HFF:
1. Pettifer
2. Headlan
3. Jericho
Midfield:
1. Nathan Jones
2. Haselby
3. Prismall
4. Salopek (No chance just re-signed)
3.
ROBERT HARVEY A.K.A The Great Man, Banger, Harves, Ol' Man River...
384 games, 4 B&F's, 3 EJ Whitten Medals, St.Kilda Captain, 2 Time Brownlow Medalist, 8 Time All Australian, 2nd Highest Brownlow votes poller.... The greatest of ALL TIME!!
384 games, 4 B&F's, 3 EJ Whitten Medals, St.Kilda Captain, 2 Time Brownlow Medalist, 8 Time All Australian, 2nd Highest Brownlow votes poller.... The greatest of ALL TIME!!
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congorozides
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I agree with this guy.locoplayaz wrote:R.Lyon said he wants more Mid-Fielders and Small Fwds.
Mid-Fielders
Richard Tambling (Rich)
Paul Haselby (Frem)
Brett Peake (Fre)
Kane Tenace (Gee)
Ryan Crowley (Frem)
Byron Schammer (Frem)
Jordan McMahon (Bull)
Mark Nicoski (West)
Jude Bolton (Syd)
Travis Johnstone (Melb)
Brent Moloney (Melb)
Small Fwds
Andrew Krakouer (Rich)
Ashley Sampi (West)
Kayne Pettifer (Rich)
Andrew Lovett (Ess)
Justin Sherman (Bris)
Mark Williams (Haw)
Adam Schneider (Syd)
Any of the above except Krakour would be good. And maybe Jude is too old. But apart from that. Good names. Well done.
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st_Trav_ofWA
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locoplayaz wrote:R.Lyon said he wants more Mid-Fielders and Small Fwds.
Mid-Fielders
Richard Tambling (Rich)-dunno a bit hot and cold but maybe a change could see him do a Rodan
Paul Haselby (Frem) - would cost too much
Brett Peake (Fre) - would take in a heartbeat
Kane Tenace (Gee) - would look at it
Ryan Crowley (Frem)- definatly but the dockers wont let him go
Byron Schammer (Frem) - coming back form a worse injury run then kosi but still a classy player
Jordan McMahon (Bull) - would look at again if the price was right
Mark Nicoski (West) - not sold on him with judd kerr and cousins in the mids its easier to play without a tag
Jude Bolton (Syd) - 2 years ago yes not now
Travis Johnstone (Melb) - would be to high priced
Brent Moloney (Melb) - dunno ?
Small Fwds
Andrew Krakouer (Rich) - yes would add some excitement to the team
Ashley Sampi (West) - wouldnt touch with a barge pole too slow has personal problems and gets homesick in perth ?!?! no thanks
Kayne Pettifer (Rich)- yes but i feel he will cost too much
Andrew Lovett (Ess) - yes and now without sheedy essendon will not hold the "project" players in such high regard?
Justin Sherman (Bris)- questions on his mental attributes ?
Mark Williams (Haw) one trick pony but that one trick is still pretty good
Adam Schneider (Syd) maybe with the sydney link ?
"The team that wins in the most positions and makes the least amount of mistakes, usually wins the game." -- Allan Jeans
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went on the sydney forums re: jude bolton.
the reckon he is everything a couragious footballer should be except in disposal.
JD junior, sprays it more than aerogard etc.
now everytime Bolton plays against us, its usually a spanker, but against almost every other team he couldn't hit the side of the barn door from 10 yards according to his own fans.
the reckon he is everything a couragious footballer should be except in disposal.
JD junior, sprays it more than aerogard etc.
now everytime Bolton plays against us, its usually a spanker, but against almost every other team he couldn't hit the side of the barn door from 10 yards according to his own fans.
Bewaire krime, da krimson bolt is comeing to yure nayborhood to smach krime
SHUT UP KRIME!
SHUT UP KRIME!
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SaintWodonga
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I'd prefer to recruit kids. We have too many players from other clubs now I think.Armoooo wrote:My ruckman wishlist would look like this...
1. Warnock
2. Griffin
3. Seaby
4. Wood
5. Charman
6. Hille
7. Lade
HFF:
1. Pettifer
2. Headlan
3. Jericho
Midfield:
1. Nathan Jones
2. Haselby
3. Prismall
4. Salopek (No chance just re-signed)
3.
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Armoooo
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I agree that is why I chose Warnok and Griffin over guys like Lade and Hille...SaintWodonga wrote:I'd prefer to recruit kids. We have too many players from other clubs now I think.Armoooo wrote:My ruckman wishlist would look like this...
1. Warnock
2. Griffin
3. Seaby
4. Wood
5. Charman
6. Hille
7. Lade
HFF:
1. Pettifer
2. Headlan
3. Jericho
Midfield:
1. Nathan Jones
2. Haselby
3. Prismall
4. Salopek (No chance just re-signed)
3.
I believe that we should make it our goal to get either Warncok, Wood, Griffin or Seasby we need one of these 4 even if it means giving up a 2nd orund pick and downgrading a third round pick... but honestly is there any difference between pick 45 and 51?
ROBERT HARVEY A.K.A The Great Man, Banger, Harves, Ol' Man River...
384 games, 4 B&F's, 3 EJ Whitten Medals, St.Kilda Captain, 2 Time Brownlow Medalist, 8 Time All Australian, 2nd Highest Brownlow votes poller.... The greatest of ALL TIME!!
384 games, 4 B&F's, 3 EJ Whitten Medals, St.Kilda Captain, 2 Time Brownlow Medalist, 8 Time All Australian, 2nd Highest Brownlow votes poller.... The greatest of ALL TIME!!
One player on the top of my wishlist is Drew Petrie and I'd be willing to give a lot up for him like our 1st and 3rd round pick. Not really sure if this is around the right mark. He had a real beakout season this year and gives off the impression he is going to explode.
Not quite sure on him as a ruckmen but with Gehrig going we are in a precarious postion. I think to have a dangerous enough forward line we need Kosi at FF so he can play like J. Brown. I think he'd be capable of 70+ goals. However, this robs him from the ruck and then if Gardiner doesn't come up we would be really screwed. So, with Petrie if Gardiner doesn't come up he can spend a fair bit of time in the ruck and if he does he can play ruck-forward in the way Kosi played this year.
The Kangaroos would be very loathe to trade him but considering they have good rucks and Thompson returning next year we may be able to convince them that he is dispensable especially considering a top 10 draft pick would look pretty good to them because they haven't had many high top 10 picks in recent years.
I definately think we need a ruckmen and I don't want another second rate ruckmen i.e Ackland, Rix, Clarke so he'd have to be pretty good. Then if we got a good ruckmen to be #1 and then Gardiner did come up we would be wasting them a bit becuase I don't really like the idea of two #1 rucks. Petrie would also us to play him as a forward if Gardiner did come up and he definately wouldn't be wasted. He's one of the best contested marks in the league so add him to Kosi and Reiwodlt and you have some type of forward line. He is also only 24, nearly 25 so very similiar age to Kosi and Roo so hsi best footy still in front of him.
Of course, this is more a wish or thought rather than anything realistic and I have no idea about his contract situation plus he's prbably really happy at the roos. But, I wouldn't mind us having a real big go at a decnt bigman such as Petrie.
Not quite sure on him as a ruckmen but with Gehrig going we are in a precarious postion. I think to have a dangerous enough forward line we need Kosi at FF so he can play like J. Brown. I think he'd be capable of 70+ goals. However, this robs him from the ruck and then if Gardiner doesn't come up we would be really screwed. So, with Petrie if Gardiner doesn't come up he can spend a fair bit of time in the ruck and if he does he can play ruck-forward in the way Kosi played this year.
The Kangaroos would be very loathe to trade him but considering they have good rucks and Thompson returning next year we may be able to convince them that he is dispensable especially considering a top 10 draft pick would look pretty good to them because they haven't had many high top 10 picks in recent years.
I definately think we need a ruckmen and I don't want another second rate ruckmen i.e Ackland, Rix, Clarke so he'd have to be pretty good. Then if we got a good ruckmen to be #1 and then Gardiner did come up we would be wasting them a bit becuase I don't really like the idea of two #1 rucks. Petrie would also us to play him as a forward if Gardiner did come up and he definately wouldn't be wasted. He's one of the best contested marks in the league so add him to Kosi and Reiwodlt and you have some type of forward line. He is also only 24, nearly 25 so very similiar age to Kosi and Roo so hsi best footy still in front of him.
Of course, this is more a wish or thought rather than anything realistic and I have no idea about his contract situation plus he's prbably really happy at the roos. But, I wouldn't mind us having a real big go at a decnt bigman such as Petrie.
