Max King

[B.M]

Said on here

We signed him for another 6

But is still haven’t seen it officially reported

[SAINT-LEE]

Hey
I said the same thing to a mate last night. We scoured the net and found every story grew out of Cleary's 'inside scoop' the Max was signing on. Zero facts to the story, yet.

[King Max]

[CURLY]

Great news

[skeptic]

I’m pretty rapt

I wanna see Maxy put egg on the face of his critics

[Killa]

Noting those critics are supposed St Kilda “supporters”

[B.M]

Good stuff

[Otiman]

Great for the club, hopefully he can deliver.

[bobmurray]

Hope this new deal works out for all involved.

[bigcarl]

It will be interesting to see what the plan is for Max next year given our vastly-improved scoring towards the end of the season in his absence.

Let’s hope the lesson has been learned: Over-reliance on one player is never healthy and that if King stays in the forward line, he is AN option - not THE option.

I don’t ever again want to see him stranded deep and stationary under a long bomb being mauled by two or more opponents.

I mean how dumb and predictable is that?

Kick it to someone else FFS. It’s not rocket surgery

Try him up the ground with instructions to lead and present. Sharman or Caminiti or Owens or Higgins or Membrey deep. We’ve plenty of capable options. Use them.

If we can’t make it work with King as a forward - and I think we can - we might have to get him out of there altogether. Intercept defender? Ruck or second ruck?

Anyway - apart from assembling a really good midfield, I see this as a major priority that RTB and the brains trust need to sort out.

[bakes]

Yes, I am a critic and saints 'supporter' and very much hope to have egg on my face.

Love all the decisions the club has made over the past 2 years since appointing Lyon, but this decision I cannot understand.

I hope to be proven wrong.

[silverhalo]

It will be interesting to see what the plan is for Max next year given our vastly-improved scoring towards the end of the season in his absence.

Let’s hope the lesson has been learned: Over-reliance on one player is never healthy and that if King stays in the forward line, he is AN option - not THE option.

I don’t ever again want to see him stranded deep and stationary under a long bomb being mauled by two or more opponents.

I mean how dumb and predictable is that?

Kick it to someone else FFS. It’s not rocket surgery

Try him up the ground with instructions to lead and present. Sharman or Caminiti or Owens or Higgins or Membrey deep. We’ve plenty of capable options. Use them.

If we can’t make it work with King as a forward - and I think we can - we might have to get him out of there altogether. Intercept defender? Ruck or second ruck?

Anyway - apart from assembling a really good midfield, I see this as a major priority that RTB and the brains trust need to sort out.

Fantastic news for the Saints that Max has committed long term!
I will say though that this is a significant risk for the club given that he seems to be injury prone but hoping that the risk pays off!

[silverhalo]

It will be interesting to see what the plan is for Max next year given our vastly-improved scoring towards the end of the season in his absence.

Let’s hope the lesson has been learned: Over-reliance on one player is never healthy and that if King stays in the forward line, he is AN option - not THE option.

I don’t ever again want to see him stranded deep and stationary under a long bomb being mauled by two or more opponents.

I mean how dumb and predictable is that?

Kick it to someone else FFS. It’s not rocket surgery

Try him up the ground with instructions to lead and present. Sharman or Caminiti or Owens or Higgins or Membrey deep. We’ve plenty of capable options. Use them.

If we can’t make it work with King as a forward - and I think we can - we might have to get him out of there altogether. Intercept defender? Ruck or second ruck?

Anyway - apart from assembling a really good midfield, I see this as a major priority that RTB and the brains trust need to sort out.

Fantastic news for the Saints that Max has committed long term!
I will say though that this is a significant risk for the club given that he seems to be injury prone but hoping that the risk pays off!

Can we please make it easier for the big fella by trying to put the ball on his chest rather than these rainmakers that invariably see him crunched by 2-3 defenders. We got a lot better at lowering the eyes in the second half of the season, let's see it continue next year.

[St Dave]

It will be interesting to see what the plan is for Max next year given our vastly-improved scoring towards the end of the season in his absence.

I addressed this in the original report thread but appreciate people don't read everything so I will add it here too and try to dispell some of this myth.

Without doing any analysis on the quality of opposition or home vs away etc, over the last two seasons (47 games) we have won 10 games with King and won 14 games without him. Seems like we are slightly better without him.

However, over the last two years on average scores we are only just over 4 points better off without him (74.4 point avg vs 78.7 point avg), so not really a major change to our offensive performance.

If you change the Rd 17 2023 game against Melbourne to no Max (given he got injured after 1% of game time), the averages change to 75.1 points with vs 77.9 points without, just under 3 points difference.

In reality, it isn't really a big enough sample size (only just over 20 games either way, look at the impact of flipping that one game), and there is a pretty big mitigating factor over the last two years being him clearly being hampered by injury stopping him from performing consistently (particularly in 2024 where he was performing a goal worse per game, 1.58 vs 2.55 avg).

Just as a hypothetical, I added an extra goal to all games Max played in 2024 (to simulate his 2023 goal output, noting he was still very impacted by injury in that year), it actually levels out our average scoring over those last two years to 78 points with, 78.7 points without (or with the Melbourne game flipped actually sees Max better at 78.9 avg with vs 77.9 avg without), but interestingly it actually flips 3 games, GWS in round 6, Hawks in round 10, and Port in round 17 which could have seen us finish on 14 wins and likely 7th on the ladder.

Tldr: Over 2 years of injured Max we are still only 3-4 points worse off per game. Lots of room for upside with healthy Max so fingers crossed he can get his body right.

[MC Gusto]

Very happy with this

[MC Gusto]

Very happy with this

[spert]

Just hope the big guy keeps his body together and can contribute to a season of good footy- we need consistency.

[D.B.Cooper]

If you want to sign free agents you need your stars to commit to the club and the program.

Good signing by the club, I am happier with this than 3 years for Hill and Wood.

[magnifisaint]

I reckon he will be the power forward like no other. He looks really strong in the videos and looks to have a single kindness about him.

[bigcarl]

Without doing any analysis on the quality of opposition or home vs away etc, over the last two seasons (47 games) we have won 10 games with King and won 14 games without him. Seems like we are slightly better without him.

Interesting stats. Thanks.

I’m not great at percentages, does that mean we’ve won 40 per cent more games - over the past two seasons - without King than with?

Of the ones we lost, I’m wondering how many could have been won were we not mindlessly bombing it to an outnumbered Max.

Look, don’t get me wrong, I rate King as a talent very highly. My problem is with a gameplan and structure that places an overreliance on any one player. The club needs to get on top if it. Let’s hope the lessons have been learned … but I wouldn’t count on it.

Btw, could you clear up how you arrived at those figures? If there were 47 games in the past two seasons and we won 10 with King and 14 without, what happened to the other 23 games? Sincerely it confuses me. I don’t quite get it.

On actual scoring, I’d like to see a comparative statistical analysis of the latter part of this season when we finally got the multi pronged forward line going. I couldn’t be bothered doing the research, but from memory we kicked some particularly high scores for Ross Lyon coached teams

[King Max]

Without doing any analysis on the quality of opposition or home vs away etc, over the last two seasons (47 games) we have won 10 games with King and won 14 games without him. Seems like we are slightly better without him.

Interesting stats. Thanks.

I’m not great at percentages, does that mean we’ve won 40 per cent more games - over the past two seasons - without King than with?

Of the ones we lost, I’m wondering how many could have been won were we not mindlessly bombing it to an outnumbered Max.

Look, don’t get me wrong, I rate King as a talent very highly. My problem is with a gameplan and structure that places an overreliance on any one player. The club needs to get on top if it. Let’s hope the lessons have been learned … but I wouldn’t count on it.

Btw, could you clear up how you arrived at those figures? If there were 47 games in the past two seasons and we won 10 with King and 14 without, what happened to the other 23 games? Sincerely it confuses me. I don’t quite get it.

The numbers don't mean much unless you know how many games he played and how many he missed.
Either way, I wouldn't read too much into them.

This year we won 47.8% of games.
With Ryan Byrnes in the team we won 60%
Without him we won 25%

He's a good footballer but does anyone think he's the difference between a 25% record and a 60% record?

[Scollop]

Without doing any analysis on the quality of opposition or home vs away etc, over the last two seasons (47 games) we have won 10 games with King and won 14 games without him. Seems like we are slightly better without him.

Interesting stats. Thanks.

I’m not great at percentages, does that mean we’ve won 40 per cent more games - over the past two seasons - without King than with?

Of the ones we lost, I’m wondering how many could have been won were we not mindlessly bombing it to an outnumbered Max.

Look, don’t get me wrong, I rate King as a talent very highly. My problem is with a gameplan and structure that places an overreliance on any one player. The club needs to get on top if it. Let’s hope the lessons have been learned … but I wouldn’t count on it.

Btw, could you clear up how you arrived at those figures? If there were 47 games in the past two seasons and we won 10 with King and 14 without, what happened to the other 23 games? Sincerely it confuses me. I don’t quite get it.

The numbers don't mean much unless you know how many games he played and how many he missed.
Either way, I wouldn't read too much into them.

This year we won 47.8% of games.
With Ryan Byrnes in the team we won 60%
Without him we won 25%

He's a good footballer but does anyone think he's the difference between a 25% record and a 60% record?

If our bottom 6-8 players are as productive as Ronnie we'll be playing finals in 2025.

His manager will be happy with those numbers. Compelling statistics

Obviously undervalued by a few simpletons.

His running has always been good, but what we saw at the back end of the year was a player who is improving his decision making. That's what happens with experience.

He's getting the odd clearance here and there and he's putting himself in the right positions to either win contested footy or lay a tackle to hold up the opposition.

[SinCitySainter]

Remember, every single person who confuses correlation with causation ends up dying.

[Scollop]

Can we please make it easier for the big fella by trying to put the ball on his chest rather than these rainmakers that invariably see him crunched by 2-3 defenders. We got a lot better at lowering the eyes in the second half of the season, let's see it continue next year.

What's the point of recruiting a tall lanky 6' 8" player as your full forward if the idea is to 'make it easier' for him by hitting him up on the chest?

Membrey, Owens, Sharman and even Butler and Higgins are capable of leading and marking on their chest too.

I remember a game against Brisbane at the Gabba midway through 2022 where Max was playing against Harris Andrews and he showed everyone his value as a tall marking option. When he gets airborne, not even Andrews has the reach to be able to spoil.

We were in front at half time by 12 points before Owens and McKenzie both suffered severe concussions and also Zak Jones went off injured in the 3rd quarter with a hamstring.

Incidentally, Max was the difference in the game against Adelaide (in Adelaide) a couple of weeks before the Gabba match where he kicked 6 goals straight. We were flying before injuries curtailed our year and it cost Ratts his job.

Anyhoo...back to King and the long term deal..he said this;

"There is pressure and I think if you ignore it and pretend it’s not there you’re in a bit of trouble, but I guess it’s about learning to accept the pressure and deal with it"

His captain said this;

Expectations are a compliment that prove one player, or many, are capable of more.

[Yorkeys]

Without doing any analysis on the quality of opposition or home vs away etc, over the last two seasons (47 games) we have won 10 games with King and won 14 games without him. Seems like we are slightly better without him.

Interesting stats. Thanks.

I’m not great at percentages, does that mean we’ve won 40 per cent more games - over the past two seasons - without King than with?

Of the ones we lost, I’m wondering how many could have been won were we not mindlessly bombing it to an outnumbered Max.

Look, don’t get me wrong, I rate King as a talent very highly. My problem is with a gameplan and structure that places an overreliance on any one player. The club needs to get on top if it. Let’s hope the lessons have been learned … but I wouldn’t count on it.

Btw, could you clear up how you arrived at those figures? If there were 47 games in the past two seasons and we won 10 with King and 14 without, what happened to the other 23 games? Sincerely it confuses me. I don’t quite get it.

The numbers don't mean much unless you know how many games he played and how many he missed.
Either way, I wouldn't read too much into them.

This year we won 47.8% of games.
With Ryan Byrnes in the team we won 60%
Without him we won 25%

He's a good footballer but does anyone think he's the difference between a 25% record and a 60% record?

Ryan won a crucial contested ball v Carlton that contributed directly to that win, it was skilful, authoritive, strong play. So I can see how Ryan could well contribute to reconciling that gap. Been steadily improving and quite impressive late in the season.