The Swans or the Lions ?

[CURLY]

It’s just good list management

Yep getting every gift the AFL offers is the easiest list management of all.

[St Dave]

They were contending in 2012-16 with that list

Those those players were only18-20 at the time

This is a whole new list

Built around
Heeney - Academy
Warner - Pick 39
Gulden - Pick 32
Grundy - Great Trade!
Rowbottom - Pick 25
Blakey - Academy
Papley - Pick 14 Rookie Draft
Luke Parker - Pick 40
McCartin - Pick 33
Lloyd - Pick 16 Rookie Draft
Ollie Florent Pick 11


Mills has hardly played a game this season

Then they’ve got Role players
Melican, Cunningham, Jordan, McLean

Great list build

I don't understand how you can look at this list and come to the conclusion that the Swans are getting preferential treatment from the AFL when they get similar academy concessions to other interstate clubs. It's not the AFL's fault our past stars had daughters, or didn't railroad their sons in to an AFL pathway from an early age.

Those 7 players picked after 25/in the rookie draft don't become great players by accident.
The reason Sydney is successful and others eg gold coast (though their pathway is developing so see where they sit in 5 years) are not is all the effort they put in to talent acquisition and importantly development. Something we have struggled with for a decade until (hopefully) a few years ago.

It isn't the AFL's fault we have struggled to develop a national draft pick in to a great player since probably Seb Ross in 2011. Hopefully the current crop can change that.

[saynta]

I don't really give a rats. Do you?

[D.B.Cooper]

They were contending in 2012-16 with that list

Those those players were only18-20 at the time

This is a whole new list

Built around
Heeney - Academy
Warner - Pick 39
Gulden - Pick 32
Grundy - Great Trade!
Rowbottom - Pick 25
Blakey - Academy
Papley - Pick 14 Rookie Draft
Luke Parker - Pick 40
McCartin - Pick 33
Lloyd - Pick 16 Rookie Draft
Ollie Florent Pick 11


Mills has hardly played a game this season

Then they’ve got Role players
Melican, Cunningham, Jordan, McLean

Great list build

Take Heeney and Blakey out there lucky to be playing finals let alone the GF. Incredible gift from the AFL.

What did you think of our AFL gifts?

#1 - 2000 priority pick
#2 - 2001 priority pick
Brendan Goddard (stripping Carlton of pics)

Yep we finished last and second last so we got the picks everyone else gets.

When we lost the GF the AFL didn't give us the best kid in Australia and then do the same again the following year. Then 2 years later give us the best key defender in the draft.

So we didn’t get #1 as a priority pick in 2000 giving us 1&2?

We didn’t get #2 in 2001 giving us 2&5?

Penalizing Carlton didn’t gift us Goddard?

WTF are you on about?

[CURLY]

They were contending in 2012-16 with that list

Those those players were only18-20 at the time

This is a whole new list

Built around
Heeney - Academy
Warner - Pick 39
Gulden - Pick 32
Grundy - Great Trade!
Rowbottom - Pick 25
Blakey - Academy
Papley - Pick 14 Rookie Draft
Luke Parker - Pick 40
McCartin - Pick 33
Lloyd - Pick 16 Rookie Draft
Ollie Florent Pick 11


Mills has hardly played a game this season

Then they’ve got Role players
Melican, Cunningham, Jordan, McLean

Great list build

Take Heeney and Blakey out there lucky to be playing finals let alone the GF. Incredible gift from the AFL.

What did you think of our AFL gifts?

#1 - 2000 priority pick
#2 - 2001 priority pick
Brendan Goddard (stripping Carlton of pics)

Yep we finished last and second last so we got the picks everyone else gets.

When we lost the GF the AFL didn't give us the best kid in Australia and then do the same again the following year. Then 2 years later give us the best key defender in the draft.

So we didn’t get #1 as a priority pick in 2000 giving us 1&2?

We didn’t get #2 in 2001 giving us 2&5?

Penalizing Carlton didn’t gift us Goddard?

WTF are you on about?

I can only assume you’re deliberately being argumentative as it’s not hard to comprehend.

Finishing bottom it means your list needs help and the draft is set up that way. If you are playing in GF’s and then adding kids rated top 3 in the draft that is an amazing advantage to an AFL list. They also have the added advantage of what sort of player they are guaranteed to receive to can draft and accordingly.

[B.M]

I think you’re just green with envy and sooking about what others have got

I just think it’s hats off to them for getting the 4 pillars right

It’s a woe is me attitude

We had every opportunity to select Christian Petracca, Clayton Oliver or Marcus Bontempelli- we did not

That simple

[CURLY]

I think you’re just green with envy and sooking about what others have got

I just think it’s hats off to them for getting the 4 pillars right

It’s a woe is me attitude

We had every opportunity to select Christian Petracca, Clayton Oliver or Marcus Bontempelli- we did not

That simple

I am envious it’s a magnificent advantage to get. Imagine here you are StKlida Max King is yours. Excellent let us trade pick 4 for 12 28 36. Use 28 36 and 52 for King and we will use 12 on Zac Butters.

Yep all clubs can name a host of players they should have drafted.

[B.M]

They are the rules

As long as they pay a price for a player

Trading picks is just smart list management

[CURLY]

They are the rules

As long as they pay a price for a player

Trading picks is just smart list management

We know they are the rules and it’s a huge leg up.

[King Max]

It’s just good list management

It’s good list management AND they get a leg up.

Both things can be true.

[B.M]

Why complain about though, as I said we got more of a ‘leg up’ when we built our list 2000-2011

But we got 2 of the 4 pillars wrong

[King Max]

A. it was 24 years ago

B. The rules were well known and applied to every club.

[CURLY]

Why complain about though, as I said we got more of a ‘leg up’ when we built our list 2000-2011

But we got 2 of the 4 pillars wrong

No we didn’t we weren’t getting top three rated kids while playing finals and grand finals.

[B.M]

We got

Our usual pick - pick 1
And got a priority pick (bonus pick) just for being s***

And guess what
We got another priority pick the next year!!!!

4 top 5 picks in 2 years

Then we had pick 3 in 2002 and we were completely set on Stephen Salopek - Carlton got kicked out of the draft - losing Goddard and Wells - and we got a gift in BJ

Are you THAT one eyed?!

You can’t see when we are gifted actual extra picks at the top of the draft - twice
Isn’t more charitable than using your own draft capital or first round selection to secure an academy player whom you’ve developed for 5 years

[Scollop]

Why complain about though, as I said we got more of a ‘leg up’ when we built our list 2000-2011

But we got 2 of the 4 pillars wrong

No we didn’t we weren’t getting top three rated kids while playing finals and grand finals.

Like B.M said. You need all parts of your club humming. It's not just about getting top 10 talent

Otherwise, Gold Coast would have had as much success as GWS by now. They both got a leg up and yet they've never made finals

Melbourne got a leg up and support and early picks and they won a flag. We got support and early picks but didn't!!

[D.B.Cooper]

Swans have also worked tirelessly to develop their young talent in a non traditional AFL state, just like GCS are doing now.

We got gifts that we gave up nothing for, but we weren’t good enough to capitalize on them. swans got their guns cheap, Heaney was rated top 5, they got him with 18.

Jeez it must be tiresome to those people in Curly’s life who would never hear anything other than bitching and moaning about all life’s injustices.

Stop spooking like a bitch and get over it Curly.
Great drafting (Goulden, Warner, McCartin) over many years, good player development, savy trading (Grundy) great culture, stability and academy guns have all contributed to a powerful competitive club.

If Curly can’t see that he’s as blind on this topic as he is on umpire bias and cheating.

Dear lord

[Otiman]

Swans have also worked tirelessly to develop their young talent in a non traditional AFL state, just like GCS are doing now.

I'm not sure I buy this angle. The AFL is pulling the strings on this one.

The (in)competency of Gold Coast as a club doesn't match their success as an academy.

[CURLY]

Swans have also worked tirelessly to develop their young talent in a non traditional AFL state, just like GCS are doing now.

We got gifts that we gave up nothing for, but we weren’t good enough to capitalize on them. swans got their guns cheap, Heaney was rated top 5, they got him with 18.

Jeez it must be tiresome to those people in Curly’s life who would never hear anything other than bitching and moaning about all life’s injustices.

Stop spooking like a bitch and get over it Curly.
Great drafting (Goulden, Warner, McCartin) over many years, good player development, savy trading (Grundy) great culture, stability and academy guns have all contributed to a powerful competitive club.

If Curly can’t see that he’s as blind on this topic as he is on umpire bias and cheating.

Dear lord

So Sydney put time into kids they know that if they want them they are guaranteed to get. How very noble of them.

Its morons like you that whinge about StKilda not bridging the gap but the gap is orchestrated to widen with hand outs like Sydney receive.

[SaintPav]

JFC.

These teams get assistance that we don’t have access to.

[SaintPav]

We got

Our usual pick - pick 1
And got a priority pick (bonus pick) just for being s***

And guess what
We got another priority pick the next year!!!!

4 top 5 picks in 2 years

Then we had pick 3 in 2002 and we were completely set on Stephen Salopek - Carlton got kicked out of the draft - losing Goddard and Wells - and we got a gift in BJ

Are you THAT one eyed?!

You can’t see when we are gifted actual extra picks at the top of the draft - twice
Isn’t more charitable than using your own draft capital or first round selection to secure an academy player whom you’ve developed for 5 years

23 years ago!!!

[CURLY]

We got

Our usual pick - pick 1
And got a priority pick (bonus pick) just for being s***

And guess what
We got another priority pick the next year!!!!

4 top 5 picks in 2 years

Then we had pick 3 in 2002 and we were completely set on Stephen Salopek - Carlton got kicked out of the draft - losing Goddard and Wells - and we got a gift in BJ

Are you THAT one eyed?!

You can’t see when we are gifted actual extra picks at the top of the draft - twice
Isn’t more charitable than using your own draft capital or first round selection to secure an academy player whom you’ve developed for 5 years

What the hells wrong with you? We got top picks because we were s*** the same as every other s*** team gets.

With those picks we went from being s*** and we were again in contention only 4 seasons later.

Sydney are starting with a good list and getting the top end picks each year. That is a ridiculous advantage.

People keep saying they have a winning culture, well of course they do the AFL has set it up so they can't fail.

[St Dave]

Swans have also worked tirelessly to develop their young talent in a non traditional AFL state, just like GCS are doing now.

I'm not sure I buy this angle. The AFL is pulling the strings on this one.

The (in)competency of Gold Coast as a club doesn't match their success as an academy.

The academies help grow the game by bringing in kids (and their families) who might not otherwise be interested in footy. Allowing them to stay in the state with their families is part of this deal that entices them in. It would be nice if it worked more like American sports when new players were it is part of the deal that you just go wherever you are drafted, but we maybe forget that for those sports the recruits are coming out of college 99% of the time (so are 20+) on contracts that could allow them to relocate their whole families if they wanted, where as for us it would be asking 17/18 year olds to move hundreds of kilometres away which families might be more nervous about at that initial stage.

Ultimately there are advantages and disadvantages each way. Vic clubs get travel advantages and a home grand final if they make it. Interstate gets academies, but Vic clubs are starting to see advantage from NGAs now to balance that a bit. And if you are talking about draft equity, you have to get rid of father sons and everything else, and I think they help make our game more special (even if we rarely get that benefit).

At the end of the day, look at Sydney and Geelong. Two of the most consistent modern era clubs in terms of making finals if not winning it all. One has an academy, but they both know how to identify and develop talent once they are in the system. That is the more critical skill, not getting a couple of kids maybe a bit cheaper than they otherwise would have.

[CURLY]

Swans have also worked tirelessly to develop their young talent in a non traditional AFL state, just like GCS are doing now.

I'm not sure I buy this angle. The AFL is pulling the strings on this one.

The (in)competency of Gold Coast as a club doesn't match their success as an academy.

The academies help grow the game by bringing in kids (and their families) who might not otherwise be interested in footy. Allowing them to stay in the state with their families is part of this deal that entices them in. It would be nice if it worked more like American sports when new players were it is part of the deal that you just go wherever you are drafted, but we maybe forget that for those sports the recruits are coming out of college 99% of the time (so are 20+) on contracts that could allow them to relocate their whole families if they wanted, where as for us it would be asking 17/18 year olds to move hundreds of kilometres away which families might be more nervous about at that initial stage.

Ultimately there are advantages and disadvantages each way. Vic clubs get travel advantages and a home grand final if they make it. Interstate gets academies, but Vic clubs are starting to see advantage from NGAs now to balance that a bit. And if you are talking about draft equity, you have to get rid of father sons and everything else, and I think they help make our game more special (even if we rarely get that benefit).

At the end of the day, look at Sydney and Geelong. Two of the most consistent modern era clubs in terms of making finals if not winning it all. One has an academy, but they both know how to identify and develop talent once they are in the system. That is the more critical skill, not getting a couple of kids maybe a bit cheaper than they otherwise would have.

Yes Geelong identified two of the best players in the AFL in Cameron and Dangerfield.

[B.M]

I agree with the Northern Academies

[CURLY]

I agree with the Northern Academies

If everyone has access to them yes.