Jack McCrae

[Scollop]

Ok. There we have it.

In Mcrae

Out Dow

[CURLY]

Ok. There we have it.

In Mcrae

Out Dow

Yep if McCrae comes and is playing better footy.

Byrnes can go.

[Brunswicksainter]

So is the signal that Crouch is done?

Macrae is a has been. 1 year cover at beat. Other than that his days are done. Inside mids fall off the cliff faster than any other position.

Ryder was bought in for a purpose to protect and develop Marshall and it worked perfectly. Very different scenario to Macrae positional powers.

SEN trade bell reported today that crouch has an arthritic knee condition from a botched surgery. Will very likely never play again but is contracted for next year.

[B.M]

I honestly think Ryder hindered Marshall’s development as a ruckman

Marshall dominated as Number 1 ruck in 2019, 2023, 2024

He was underwhelming in 2020, 2021, 2022 as a forward/back up ruckman

Ryder played a few good games and was a decent player but had nowhere near the impact Marshall has had when he was the solo ruckman

[Brunswicksainter]

I honestly think Ryder hindered Marshall’s development as a ruckman

Marshall dominated as Number 1 ruck in 2019, 2023, 2024

He was underwhelming in 2020, 2021, 2022 as a forward/back up ruckman

Ryder played a few good games and was a decent player but had nowhere near the impact Marshall has had when he was the solo ruckman

I 100% agree with this. I also don't think the signing of Ryder was such a great thing for the club as people make out. We are in a much better position now with Marshall as a solo ruck than we were with him sitting inside 50 not impacting games.

[mr six o'clock]

The Club
In conjunction with the Danny Frawley centre
Ought to working hard to obtain sponsorship from Kimberley Clarke.
As we seem to be a destination club for the elderly perhaps we'd be able to get a whole range of free products from them .
Imagine how good the old boys & girls would look playing with a bit extra junk in the trunk .

[CURLY]

Who are all these elderly players we apparently keep picking up?

I'm sure if McCrae went to Collingwood next season and was getting 30 a week everyone would be whinging why we didn't grab him. Or asking why we can't attract players.

[Killa]

Given the criticism of Lyon, a staple with some on this site

The debate is that St Kilda will be in a position to challenge in 5 years, what a nonsense that is

And to drill down on this nonsense should we be trading out the likes of Marshall, Sinclair, Wilkie, Wood et al, all approaching 30 years of age and who will be mid 30’s in the magical 5 years time?

You always look to add to what you have and for the purpose of competing year upon year, every year offering up where the shortfalls needing to be addressed are

[Scollop]

Given the criticism of Lyon, a staple with some on this site

The debate is that St Kilda will be in a position to challenge in 5 years, what a nonsense that is

And to drill down on this nonsense should we be trading out the likes of Marshall, Sinclair, Wilkie, Wood et al, all approaching 30 years of age and who will be mid 30’s in the magical 5 years time?

You always look to add to what you have and for the purpose of competing year upon year, every year offering up where the shortfalls needing to be addressed are

What the f?

Wilkie, Sincs, Steele and Marshall will be 32 in 2028. You call that mid 30's?? They'll be 33 in September 2029.

Why do you like making up nonsense and going from one discussion (don't bring in a 30 year old) to talk about getting rid of our senior experience. You're making up an argument that no one actually proposed

North gutted their list and had virtually ZERO senior guys left

We've had Hannebery, Ryder, Geary, and now Seb and Crouch retiring over a 2 year period, but we still have Wood, Hill, Steele, Marshall, Wilkie, Sinclair and Webster.

I think we're building nicely. Should in a position to challenge when Darcy Wilson, Mattaes Phillipou, Owens, Windhager and Nasiah Wanganeen-Millera are approaching and some surpassing the 100 game stage. With some young guns and some class coming in, it builds the core group and builds the foundations.

I thought the President was clear with his letter in May that the club was on a course to do things correctly... not quickly. A sugar hit in 2025 of scraping in to the top 8 is just going to put us back a few notches while North Melbourne, West Coast, Essendon, and Adelaide catch up to us.

Hawthorn has already gone past us

Obviously we want to win a flag every year...who doesn't, but realistically, I think the club needs to aim for top 4 within 5 years. If a Premiership comes in 2027 or 2028, that's beautiful. That should be the grand plan. Not a haphazard strategy of looking at 'every' disgruntled 30 year old.

[Sanctorum]

Crikey Scollop, correct me if I'm wrong but I'm starting to get the distinct impression that you don't agree with St Kilda recruiting Jack Macrae!

Just to ease your mind, look at it this way, he is merely replacing another ageing midfielder in Brad Crouch, which should have not the slightest impact on the prospects of the exciting youngsters vying for midfield spots in 2025 and beyond.

This debate is a molehill, not a mountain........

[Beno88]

I honestly think Ryder hindered Marshall’s development as a ruckman

Marshall dominated as Number 1 ruck in 2019, 2023, 2024

He was underwhelming in 2020, 2021, 2022 as a forward/back up ruckman

Ryder played a few good games and was a decent player but had nowhere near the impact Marshall has had when he was the solo ruckman

Rowan Marshall himself has spoken about how important Paddy was for his development.

Ryder was arguably our most important player in 2020. We'd have got a lot closer to Richmond in that Semi Final had Paddy not been out injured.

[Scollop]

Crikey Scollop, correct me if I'm wrong but I'm starting to get the distinct impression that you don't agree with St Kilda recruiting Jack Macrae!

Just to ease your mind, look at it this way, he is merely replacing another ageing midfielder in Brad Crouch, which should have not the slightest impact on the prospects of the exciting youngsters vying for midfield spots in 2025 and beyond.

This debate is a molehill, not a mountain........

I'm not saying that there's zero possibility that there will be some positives* in bringing him across, but I seriously see it as a cop out from recruiters and our list managers.

They're playing it safe and trying to stay afloat instead of sticking to a longer term strategy that totally ignores where you finish on the ladder. They're trying to stay competitive around 7th-12th on the ladder instead of building the list for the longer term.

I get it. It's people's careers at stake and they're desperate. I just don't see Mcrae having an impact for more than 12 months. I'm dead against bringing in a 30 year old on a 3 year contract (unless he's in super form or he's a superstar of the game).

* It would be interesting to put up a list of the pros and cons. e.g some Pros. 1. He wants to come to us. 2. He is experienced and he's generally shown good durability. 3. He's not currently injured so could have a very good start to 2025. 4. He brings across valuable footy ip from another club. 5. He seems to be a decent person

e.g. some Cons: 1. Leg speed. 2. Best footy is past him. 3. Older players and especially inside mids tend to drop off in form dramatically. 3. His age could mean once he starts sustaining injuries, they're harder for older blokes to recover from. 4. He takes a spot on the list that could have gone on a rookie who is picked up by another club and potentially becomes a good long term asset. 5. He takes time away from the middle for our guys like Clark, Windhager, Dow and others who showed very good signs in 2024.

[B.M]

Where’s the evidence that he’s lost any ‘leg speed’

He’s 30yo

Collingwood have 9 players over 30, Geelong won a premiership with more.

Your career isn’t done at 30, unless your body is fkd (like Crouch)

If you are physically sound and still motivated and you can play good AFL footy, there is no reason why you can’t play until 34/35 - there is no physiological reason - bar injury

As late as this season, MacRae has played AFL at a high level. Whilst given limited opportunity by a d**khead coach with ridiculous options

[The_Dud]

Jack Macrae average disposals per game:

2021 - 33.9
2022 - 30.6
2023 - 25.3
2024 - 18.4

Any maths wizz's out there able to chart that for me?

[Scollop]

Watch the games where he played for 4 quarters and you'll realise he's lost leg speed.

E.g Round 8 vs Hawthorn. Game was at Marvel. Bont was huge that day but Dogs lost. Libba copped a head knock early in the game. Mcrae got 21 touches and was ranked 6th among mids. Should have been 7th. Mcrae- 66 DT points. Libba was dazed and down on his usual output and off ground for a large period and got 20 touches and 65 DT points. There was 1 kick in it with minutes to go and Bevo sat Jack on his arse on the bench for the last 3 minutes.

Round 9 vs Richmond. Massive win for the Dogs. Mcrae was the 6th ranked mid. Behind Treloar, Richards, Harmes, Bont, Williams. Probably should have been 7th in rankings. Mcrae had 24 touches, 8 contested and only 3 clearances. Garcia was arguably more damaging with 19 touches, 6 contested, 2 clearances and he kicked 2 goals.

E.g Round 18 where the Dogs beat Carlton. Mcrae was one of the lowest ranked mids. He can't chase. He doesn't defend. The d**khead coach was forced to make him the sub the following week.

The Dogs still ended up playing well in Round 19 without him

[Mr Magic]

Statistics can be used to make any point you want them to.
If you take out the 4 games he was the sub, then his total disposals become 316 in 15 games which is an average of 21per game.
If you do a similar thing for Brad Hill and Hunter Clark they end up with averages of 19.9 and 19.5 respectively.

[takeaway]

Statistics can be used to make any point you want them to.
If you take out the 4 games he was the sub, then his total disposals become 316 in 15 games which is an average of 21per game.
If you do a similar thing for Brad Hill and Hunter Clark they end up with averages of 19.9 and 19.5 respectively.

Plus he played forward a bit this year didn't he? And what was his actual role? Stats aren't much use.

With the experienced Ross and probably Crouch gone, Jones injury prone, contract?, getting MacRae is a no brainer PROVIDED Saints get him for a reasonable cost draft wise.

[B.M]

How much midfield time there???

Stats are meaningless unless you know the role they play

What were
Dow
Clark
Ross
Jones

Numbers this season

[The_Dud]

Statistics can be used to make any point you want them to.
If you take out the 4 games he was the sub, then his total disposals become 316 in 15 games which is an average of 21per game.
If you do a similar thing for Brad Hill and Hunter Clark they end up with averages of 19.9 and 19.5 respectively.

But he was sub/subbed…

[WellardSaint]

How much midfield time there???

Stats are meaningless unless you know the role they play

What were
Dow
Clark
Ross
Jones

Numbers this season

i looked at Clark's TOG this season.
11 games
60% or less- 5 games
61-70% - 5 games
78%- that Port game in the wet

(thanks AFL tables)

[B.M]

Because he can’t run out of sight in a dark night

[SaintPav]

How’s Byrnes even remotely relevant here?

Idiot season.

[The_Dud]

How much of his salary will we make the Dogs pay??

[B.M]

None

[The_Dud]

None

Why?