Match Thread: Saints vs Hawks

[samoht]

The pies were obviously having a run of poor form after winning the flag ... with a reduced pre-season following their extended flag-winning season, Teflon.

How do you on the other hand explain the hot and cold form of our players?
Our players were obviously good enough to beat the pies!

You can't have it both ways.

You didn’t answer my question
The game plan is terrible
What’s the difference you think genius?

Theres no need for sarcasm... it's just a discussion.
A bit of respect.

[The_Dud]

I see RoMa had a ton of Supercoach points, grab, kick, turnover...Meek beat him in the ruck contest and gave their, equally average, midfield a better than 50% chance of a clearance.

We need a genuine centre bounce ruck or else we will always be playing catch up from our D50. But, hey, RoMa got alot of points.

RoMa is a very good player but we need a ruckman who can give our mids a chance. Centre clearances mean nothing if our forwards are not advantaged.

Marshall is great around the ground, ordinary in the ruck.

Would rather him feed our mids a bit instead of just grabbing and hacking the ball out.

[SaintWiki]

So Ross has failed with this team Teflon?

He is going to rebuild now?!

lol
We surprised opposition for the first 5 rounds and snuck into the 8 since then have won 9 out of the last 27


Not the genius you lead us to believe

And remember, when Ratten was coach - it was all about the coach?!

Its still all about the coach.

This time Teflon is blaming Richo for our losses. His legacy players in Seb Ross and Tim Membrey are the only players he blanes for todays loss

Ignore the game style, ignore the continual low scores, ignore the boring conservative selections, ignore the fact Sinclair and Hill cannot do it all every week and if you continue to play them for 85% game time you risk burning them out

Both Sincs and Hill were spent in the last quarter

If RTB had got off his a*se and revved the players up on the bench earlier, Sincs and Hill may have had some more in the tank to grab the 4 points at least. Today demonstrated that this rebuild may take longer than the remaining years of my life.

[B.M]

Since when are we rebuilding?

[Scollop]

The pies were obviously having a run of poor form after winning the flag ... with a reduced pre-season following their extended flag-winning season, Teflon.

How do you on the other hand explain the hot and cold form of our players?
Our players were obviously good enough to beat the pies!

You can't have it both ways.

You didn’t answer my question
The game plan is terrible
What’s the difference you think genius?

Theres no need for sarcasm... it's just a discussion.
A bit of respect.

He's an arsehole and a bully

Don't get sucked in by him

He likes to put smiley faces in his posts and laughing faces...to mock people

He likes to poke fun in your face instead of addressing the topic at hand. He has me on ignore at the moment

You should let Teflon know that the guy with the biggest smile and laugh at the end of the game today was the assistant coach in the Hawthorn box. His first name is Brett

[ace]

Did I see a vile lying dog turd in the Hawthorn team song celebration ring ?

[Ghost Like]

Since when are we rebuilding?

Let's be fair B.M, we are rebuilding every year we do not win our 2nd Premiership. To say we are there without adding to our list, is a fallacy and a denial. Every club rebuilds, including the Premiers.

[B.M]

Rebuilding to me


Means you are changing your core and building a different list

There is also and element of bottoming out for a few years to get access to the best talent to build a new core

We still have
Steele, Sinclair, Hill, Butler, Marshall, Ross, Membrey

Pretty much all from Ratten’s list and a few from Richardson’s

Aren’t we running a dual narrative?!
If rebuilding means just bringing in you nominal DPs then every club is rebuilding all the time?!

[The Fireman]

Melt down or pointing out some home truths?

Melt down

[samoht]

Dual narrative is someone talking out of his arse, BM.
It doesn't get any more dual than that.

[nefron55]

There’s been no talking out of our collective arses. Pretty sure the club have signaled multiple times to the supporters via direct email that we think we need more talent and that we were “kidding ourselves” before.

[Yorkeys]

Dual narrative is someone talking out of his arse, BM.
It doesn't get any more dual than that.

And then there can be plain contrary/argumentative. That can be fun when you know so much. Toy with the plebs.

[Brunswicksainter]

Rebuilding to me


Means you are changing your core and building a different list

There is also and element of bottoming out for a few years to get access to the best talent to build a new core

We still have
Steele, Sinclair, Hill, Butler, Marshall, Ross, Membrey

Pretty much all from Ratten’s list and a few from Richardson’s

Aren’t we running a dual narrative?!
If rebuilding means just bringing in you nominal DPs then every club is rebuilding all the time?!

I’d be really upset if we clear house now and start again. We have a very strong young core and should be bullish around our 3-5 year horizon in my view. Just need to top up via trade and free agency.

[B.M]

I like what Essendon have done!

Don’t know how they did it?

But they have a solid list now - will be top 8 for the next 3-4 years

[Brunswicksainter]

I like what Essendon have done!

Don’t know how they did it?

But they have a solid list now - will be top 8 for the next 3-4 years

Essendon’s 22 tonight was a year and a half older than ours. They had no players playing under the age of 20.

St Kilda have fielded the 2nd or 3rd youngest 22 every week the season. We have played more under 20’s this season than any other side. Our overall list is younger than west coast and only 58 days older than north. That’s the difference champ.

[B.M]

And what does that mean?

Perhaps if we did not - we wouldn’t be 3-6

[Ghost Like]

We can do the same if we are willing to realise some senior players on our list are expendable.

[seano1]

And trying to hang on to those core players whose instincts would be telling them ….we will be lucky to play in a grand final … but 2 of the top clubs saying come n play finals with us

[Scollop]

And what does that mean?

Perhaps if we did not - we wouldn’t be 3-6

We dropped to 15th on the ladder in 2018. We refused to trade out Jack Steven when he was worth something at the end of that year. We brought in a banged up and washed up ex champion in Dan Hannebery. Swans keenly and gladly let go of him

I think Essendon had been banking top ten draft picks for a few years when they were doing their rebuild.

We should have bitten the bullet and done our own rebuild but both Lethlean and Richo were trying to save their jobs

When we saw that the strategy of going for broke didn’t work…what do we do at the end of 2019 (when we could have just taken pick 5 or whatever in the draft)?? Sure it got diluted with NGA picks from Swans, Gold Coast etc.. but we sold the farm…we doubled down and brought in 5-6 more senior players instead of going for a rebuild.

That’s why we are at the bottom of the ladder and Essendon are sitting at the top

[B.M]

The 2019 trade period has gotten us to 2 finals series and meant we were competitive for a few years

But it in hindsight should’ve been a rebuild

[Darth Vader]

Whether the game plan is right or wrong doesn’t explain dropped marks, fumbles, missed tackles, mis-kicks, poor accuracy. Too many players not up to it.

[Teflon]

Whether the game plan is right or wrong doesn’t explain dropped marks, fumbles, missed tackles, mis-kicks, poor accuracy. Too many players not up to it.

Thank you
This “game plan is crap” is just a puff piece for weak minded apologists letting sone of their “heroes” off the hook
So so many fumbles , **** dropped chest marks??, handballs to a player WITH A HAWK breathing down there neck?? WTF has that got to do with game plan???
We carry sooo many sub AFL level players who would struggle to play elsewhere…let’s benchmark this lot against top 4 (where we want to be)

Seb Ross
Tim Membrey
Zac Jones
Liam Stocker
Dan Butler
Riley Bonner

4 of those played today - wouldn’t get a game in best sides
We need to tank it up , draft pick offload deadwood
We are not challenging till we do

I still have doubts on sone of our so called young stars too but let’s cut some slack BUT IF Windhager, Owens turn out to be another Hunter Clarke or Coffield and development stalls….we are rooted

[Yorkeys]

The sad part is we are quite capable of winning games like this, should win games like this, but there always seems to be a few have stinkers, clutch moments are fluffed, big moments missed. I'd look at the club psych.
I'd also start dropping players that regularly let the side down under pressure. No future.
Trouble is we don't have depth or leaders that can stand up and show the way.
Gives the opposition a huge psychological advantage and a similar level of handicap to our players. They know we don't score a lot of points . Can't rally, have no match winners. Sad. But the younger brigade might be made of sterner stuff than the seniors.

[MCG-Unit]

Match thread discussion

Tip out Bonner - bring in Henry

Yep good one

Bonner 30 disp 81% TOG 87% DE

Henry 4 disp 82% TOG

[Ghost Like]

Whether the game plan is right or wrong doesn’t explain dropped marks, fumbles, missed tackles, mis-kicks, poor accuracy. Too many players not up to it.

Thank you
This “game plan is crap” is just a puff piece for weak minded apologists letting sone of their “heroes” off the hook
So so many fumbles , **** dropped chest marks??, handballs to a player WITH A HAWK breathing down there neck?? WTF has that got to do with game plan???
We carry sooo many sub AFL level players who would struggle to play elsewhere…let’s benchmark this lot against top 4 (where we want to be)

Seb Ross
Tim Membrey
Zac Jones
Liam Stocker
Dan Butler
Riley Bonner

4 of those played today - wouldn’t get a game in best sides
We need to tank it up , draft pick offload deadwood
We are not challenging till we do

I still have doubts on sone of our so called young stars too but let’s cut some slack BUT IF Windhager, Owens turn out to be another Hunter Clarke or Coffield and development stalls….we are rooted

Game plan is one thing and I agree we have the right plan but we clearly lacked anything resembling dangerous once the ball hit the ground in our forward line. Butler and Higgins are sadly missed.

I also think Bonner has become a convenient scapegoat, perhaps papering over other cracks. Who is our HB who can defend and hit targets? Bonner, for what we paid, is returning good dividends.