Billings wants out

[Scollop]

Apart from rewarding players with bonuses for playing all games, I don't know why selection committees feel the need to have some blokes playing each and every week. There is a cost to the team and it is only a benefit to the individual.

It was evident that a fair few of our star players had weeks where their form dropped off.

It happened to Crouch early in the year. It happened to the captain when he struggled with ankle and knee complaints. It happened to Wilkie and even to Sincs for a game or two.

Remember when we all couldn't believe that Windy was playing at Sandringham a week after getting 40 and kicking a couple of goals?

Billings didn't need to play 15 games. He just needed to create the impression that he was going to be close to being selected each week. Maybe just 3-4 extra games to keep the regulars like Higgins and the youngster like Pou on his toes.

We had a 5 day break and we had interstate games and 6 day breaks coming off interstate games where the whole playing list wasn't utilised.

Billings, Byrnes, Bytel, Cordy, Coffield, Campbell and Peris were available as well as Paton but hardly used. It doesn't matter if they were not part of Ross's plans going forward.

They were (and could still be) assets that could help motivate and encourage better performances from the regulars

[CQ SAINT]

Jack is just scared of the pre-season that is coming. That's Jacks problem.
Surgery, late starts, catching up, a tweak here and a niggle there. Treated unfairly my arse. Put in the work and become durable or play VFL.

[ace]

Ratten loved him, but Ratten has left North and maybe is giving away coaching.
If Ratten goes elsewhere that is where JB may go because Lyon does not want him.

Had the talent but not the application and dedication of a Bontempelli.

[SaintPav]

How old is he 27?

Both parties need a new start.

[skeptic]

Jack is just scared of the pre-season that is coming. That's Jacks problem.
Surgery, late starts, catching up, a tweak here and a niggle there. Treated unfairly my arse. Put in the work and become durable or play VFL.

100%.

Completely capable of being an elite mid. Should be the fittest player at the club and he never has been.

To me, no one player exemplifies the do the minimum amount to get by aura of the list over the Richo and to a lesser extent the Ratten years then Billings. A list of players that seemed very capable but never seemed fit enough to run out games, consistently shocking set shots and plain erratic skills.

Others seem content to let him go for nothing after all this time, money and effort.

Me personally… I say run him into the ground, make him do the work and drag the potential out of him

[The_Dud]

Agree he was harshly done by and on merit should have played more this year.

[takeaway]

Jack is just scared of the pre-season that is coming. That's Jacks problem.
Surgery, late starts, catching up, a tweak here and a niggle there. Treated unfairly my arse. Put in the work and become durable or play VFL.

100%.

Completely capable of being an elite mid. Should be the fittest player at the club and he never has been.

To me, no one player exemplifies the do the minimum amount to get by aura of the list over the Richo and to a lesser extent the Ratten years then Billings. A list of players that seemed very capable but never seemed fit enough to run out games, consistently shocking set shots and plain erratic skills.

Others seem content to let him go for nothing after all this time, money and effort.

Me personally… I say run him into the ground, make him do the work and drag the potential out of him

There seems to be an impression that Billings is not a hard worker/trainer. Where did that come from? Last 2 years obviously mostly out with injury.
I had the impression that Billings was good on the track and hence very fit. Always in the top 3-4 for distance covered in a game, check any year when he played most of the year. For example, his last full year, 2021, 3rd in the average distance covered behind Sinclair and Wilkie, and he had injections each game for his crook foot!

People seem to think that if you have a spate of injuries, you can't be fit enough. Surely not that simple.

My view is that he should take the game on more, take more risks, and probably make more mistakes. Instead of a quick handball, try to evade and break clear and use your foot skills for instance.

If he stays, certainly get into it pre season now that his body is ok. Not that he hasn't trained hard in the past.

Maybe he will be better for a change to another club. Trading him away though for something like a 3rd rounder would be plain stupid.
Hope he stays.

[saynta]

Ratten loved him, but Ratten has left North and maybe is giving away coaching.
If Ratten goes elsewhere that is where JB may go because Lyon does not want him.

Had the talent but not the application and dedication of a Bontempelli.

Ratts has gone to the hawks.

[CQ SAINT]

Jack is just scared of the pre-season that is coming. That's Jacks problem.
Surgery, late starts, catching up, a tweak here and a niggle there. Treated unfairly my arse. Put in the work and become durable or play VFL.

100%.

Completely capable of being an elite mid. Should be the fittest player at the club and he never has been.

To me, no one player exemplifies the do the minimum amount to get by aura of the list over the Richo and to a lesser extent the Ratten years then Billings. A list of players that seemed very capable but never seemed fit enough to run out games, consistently shocking set shots and plain erratic skills.

Others seem content to let him go for nothing after all this time, money and effort.

Me personally… I say run him into the ground, make him do the work and drag the potential out of him

There seems to be an impression that Billings is not a hard worker/trainer. Where did that come from? Last 2 years obviously mostly out with injury.
I had the impression that Billings was good on the track and hence very fit. Always in the top 3-4 for distance covered in a game, check any year when he played most of the year. For example, his last full year, 2021, 3rd in the average distance covered behind Sinclair and Wilkie, and he had injections each game for his crook foot!

People seem to think that if you have a spate of injuries, you can't be fit enough. Surely not that simple.

My view is that he should take the game on more, take more risks, and probably make more mistakes. Instead of a quick handball, try to evade and break clear and use your foot skills for instance.

If he stays, certainly get into it pre season now that his body is ok. Not that he hasn't trained hard in the past.

Maybe he will be better for a change to another club. Trading him away though for something like a 3rd rounder would be plain stupid.
Hope he stays.

The impression I get is that previously, until this year, he has been under-prepared before playing big sets of games in the afl to find form. He is a form player, not an out and out star.

I also get the impression that he hasn't been injury free or fully fit since 2019 and medical records would show that he jabbed his way through 2019, 2020 and 21, while he was shopping himself to Essendon and was playing good football.

Since we got stuck with, err, resigned him, we actually need to preserve what we can of him because unless he gets a hail mary contract via Hawthorn, he might struggle to gain and maintain full fitness.

I though his year was a year of recovery. He should be good to go. Let's see.

I'm sure this will all be sold off as Ratten liked him and Lyon didn't, but I'd suggest Corey Enright has a little more history.

If Jack wasn't worried and was fully fit, nd believes he can smash the program, surely he wouldn't be looking to go somewhere else?

[Scollop]

Here's what JB said back in June 2019 when he was playing his best footy of his career and (luckily for him) he signed a fresh deal ...on big money at the time

Glen McFarlane at the Herald Sun:

“I am a loyal person. We’ve got a great group here.

“Personally, I am just hoping I can play a part in winning the club’s second premiership. “That’s obviously the focus as the list we have got coming through is really exciting.

“I’m pumped. I just love so many of the young boys coming through, and hopefully we can build towards something special.”

Righto Jack. Time to repay the loyalty from St Kilda FC over the last 4 years to you... and get to work

[Otiman]

I mean, it's great that he is a talented kid who trains well and does his recovery well, and he put on the jumper for all 24 games....but what did it achieve?

I think he played his worst football for the last 3 games of the year.

For a guy who is clearly motivated to be the best, throwing him to the wolves is a good way of ensuring he understands what effort needs to be put in over the preseason, and why.

You wouldn't do it to a quiet achiever like Nas.

[B.M]

JB is one of the more professional players on the list


Where are some ignorant posters getting there info

Again, I see the lazy comparison to Bontempelli

[B.M]

Why is it so hard to believe the club hasn’t or isn’t screwing up?

Maybe just have a look at our history of fk ups

I know most want to put faith in the magical be regime - but to believe they won’t screw up is naive

[CQ SAINT]

JB is one of the more professional players on the list


Where are some ignorant posters getting there info

Again, I see the lazy comparison to Bontempelli

Then he would be really looking forward to a Lyon pre-season and a chance to play finals again then, wouldn't he. Or he wants out. He can hope for a saviour elsewhere, but we are going to find out. Ross Lyon will find out.

[takeaway]

Jack is just scared of the pre-season that is coming. That's Jacks problem.
Surgery, late starts, catching up, a tweak here and a niggle there. Treated unfairly my arse. Put in the work and become durable or play VFL.

100%.

Completely capable of being an elite mid. Should be the fittest player at the club and he never has been.

To me, no one player exemplifies the do the minimum amount to get by aura of the list over the Richo and to a lesser extent the Ratten years then Billings. A list of players that seemed very capable but never seemed fit enough to run out games, consistently shocking set shots and plain erratic skills.

Others seem content to let him go for nothing after all this time, money and effort.

Me personally… I say run him into the ground, make him do the work and drag the potential out of him

There seems to be an impression that Billings is not a hard worker/trainer. Where did that come from? Last 2 years obviously mostly out with injury.
I had the impression that Billings was good on the track and hence very fit. Always in the top 3-4 for distance covered in a game, check any year when he played most of the year. For example, his last full year, 2021, 3rd in the average distance covered behind Sinclair and Wilkie, and he had injections each game for his crook foot!

People seem to think that if you have a spate of injuries, you can't be fit enough. Surely not that simple.

My view is that he should take the game on more, take more risks, and probably make more mistakes. Instead of a quick handball, try to evade and break clear and use your foot skills for instance.

If he stays, certainly get into it pre season now that his body is ok. Not that he hasn't trained hard in the past.

Maybe he will be better for a change to another club. Trading him away though for something like a 3rd rounder would be plain stupid.
Hope he stays.

The impression I get is that previously, until this year, he has been under-prepared before playing big sets of games in the afl to find form. He is a form player, not an out and out star.

I also get the impression that he hasn't been injury free or fully fit since 2019 and medical records would show that he jabbed his way through 2019, 2020 and 21, while he was shopping himself to Essendon and was playing good football.

Since we got stuck with, err, resigned him, we actually need to preserve what we can of him because unless he gets a hail mary contract via Hawthorn, he might struggle to gain and maintain full fitness.

I though his year was a year of recovery. He should be good to go. Let's see.

I'm sure this will all be sold off as Ratten liked him and Lyon didn't, but I'd suggest Corey Enright has a little more history.

If Jack wasn't worried and was fully fit, nd believes he can smash the program, surely he wouldn't be looking to go somewhere else?

Your impressions and assumptions are different to mine. I'd say he is looking around because he has been encouraged to explore his options. A mistake. In my view unless we get a good deal in picks or player in return, he stays.

[Scollop]

I mean, it's great that he is a talented kid who trains well and does his recovery well, and he put on the jumper for all 24 games....but what did it achieve?

I think he played his worst football for the last 3 games of the year.

For a guy who is clearly motivated to be the best, throwing him to the wolves is a good way of ensuring he understands what effort needs to be put in over the preseason, and why.

You wouldn't do it to a quiet achiever like Nas.

Seriously...I don't get your logic... You can't expect an 18 year old to perform for 22 games per year (plus practice games in February/March and then plus possible finals in September). He's not a 22 year old with 4 years of preseason under his belt.

You think if Pou was managed for just 1 or 2 games for the whole year, that he might not have understood what effort is needed in preseason??

The fact remains that Pou ran out of gas in his last 3 games. Was it best for the team that he wasn't managed?

Did Marcus Bontempelli's career suffer because he only played 16 games of h&away in his 1st year and 19 in his second?

[Yorkeys]

Jack B seems to be tagged as a forward. He then has to find a niche competing against these forwards: Higgins, Butler, Sharman, King, Owens, Phillipou, maybe Membrey, maybe Wood, maybe Gresham's replacement. Perhaps he is not prepared to contest, even though he is probably better than several that are established. Does he have that ferocious competitive edge, or is he prepared to accept luke warm acknowledgement from the coaches. Be great if he simply knuckled down and proved his point. Opting out with 2 years on your contract after the club has nursed you through a spate of injuries might be seen as a bit wishy washy.

[Sanctorum]

Jack Billings at age 28 is not going to get any better, his best years are behind him. It's alright to say that Ross Lyon doesn't rate or like him but I'm sure if Hayes, Harvey and Enright felt JB should be selected that would have happened.

There's a mistaken tendency by supporters who don't like RL to accuse him of exerising autocratic control of selections, which in my view is not in any way the case since he's come back to coach the Saints for a second time. And for the record, I'm not besotted with the man and despised him for being outcoached in the GFs of 2009/10. I just think he's learnt from his past coaching period, he's very passionate about the Saints and is absolutely the right man for the job!

The assertion that JB should have been selected ahead of Mattaes Phillipou doesn't stack up, they are totallly different players and as someone else pointed out will have benefitted immensely from the handfull of poor games he played towards the end of the season. Phillipou together with Owens, Wanganeen Milera, and Windhager are the future of our club, JB most certainly is not.

[The Fireman]

If Billings was any good and if he could stay on the track He’d be on it

Is what it is
Just bad luck.
We move on

[Vortex]

Could it be Jack wants to play finals and doesn't want to be part of the rebuild and believes we will be out of finals for the next 2 or 3 years while Lyon bloods young players. Probably Pou getting a game when he shouldn't have was enough for for Jack to jump to such conclusions?

[CURLY]

Billings can play but he was injured. Far better player than Pou at this stage of career.

If he was fit he would have played 23 games you'd think.

[CQ SAINT]

Could it be Jack wants to play finals and doesn't want to be part of the rebuild and believes we will be out of finals for the next 2 or 3 years while Lyon bloods young players. Probably Pou getting a game when he shouldn't have was enough for for Jack to jump to such conclusions?

It could be. Probably why he hasn't bothered dipping into Grand dads influential fund at Essendon.

[CURLY]

Could it be Jack wants to play finals and doesn't want to be part of the rebuild and believes we will be out of finals for the next 2 or 3 years while Lyon bloods young players. Probably Pou getting a game when he shouldn't have was enough for for Jack to jump to such conclusions?

Nice troll.

[CQ SAINT]

Billings was pulled up in 2016 for declaring himself fully fit but not contributing to team tackle rules and was dropped by Richo, endorsed by Riewoldt, who was still setting standards.

Billings proved himself durable but went from kicking goals, to running around more, 2017 - 20 and became a consistent 20 possession high half, who could get loose on a wing, take a good mark and he is a lovely field kick, who kicked a goal every second game.

In round 13 2021, he injured himself, its happened again and again, ankle, hamstring, knee, thumb, broken leg, hamstring, hamstring.

Since signing a four year deal he hasn't had a pre-season and hasn't played 6 games on the trot.

He was given every chance from frounds 17 - 20 this year, after a bad luck delayed start to the season and further set backs and he did another 2 hamstrings. In those games his output barely matches Phillipou's.

[CQ SAINT]

We arent having this conversation because we want Phillipou to go back to the ressies to get 25 possessions and kick 4 goals.