Our Bobby Hill

[Zed]

Which of our current players is capable of putting on a Bobby Hill style performance in a Grand Final ?

Butler is too prone to attempting his Harlem Globetrotters style flick ons, party tricks, and goals around the corner from 40m out - none of which ever come off against good teams in pressure situations

Huggins is dangerous within 15m of the goal line, but beyond that distance he plays like an undersized bush full forward who is out his depth at AFL.

Dare I say it, Gresham is the player that always looks capable of kicking 4 goals as a small forward, capable of the freak goals on the run from the boundary and never afraid to have a shot a goal .

[Banger9798]

Bobby had a great final series and terrific year.
He is as fast as Butler, as evasive as Gresham, and as good if not better mark tha Higgins...a better set shot than any of them

So that seems to be our issue, we have players with weapons but also some serious trad off's.

Like our midfield, we have either pace or clearance players, not both (hence Jones gets an extension on his own tract).

Maybe Michito and Pou will start to combine these assets and that will elevate us to contender status.

[shanegrambeau]

Butler is our closet impression of Bobby Hill. Maybe Gresh? Charlie and Bobby today/yesterday were brilliant. How they can deceive and evade in a flash like that makes me think we aint got the goods, but Butts and Higgo do have some chops..It just hurt to see Butts not being able to nail those shots in the final. I supposed he was nervous. Just terrible kicks. But then we had Milney niss many in finals, and Schnieder too.

[Yorkeys]

Higgins. Except he misses set shots. Drops clutch marks. Other than that they could be twins.

Conversely I doubt if this year any of our defenders played such a stinker as Starcevich yesterday. Be interesting if he can come back from his man being N.Smith medalist and losing the GF.

[Mr Magic]

Notwithstanding yesterday’s performances, I rate Cameron over Hill.
Hill operated in a forward setting devoid of any real KPF and therefore, along with Elliot, became the main avenue to goal
Cameron, like most great small forwards, operated on the scraps he steals from the Brisbane KPFs - much like Milne did.
Interestingly Brisbane kept Starcevich on Hill all game.

[TheGreatZacsby]

Our Bobby Hill will be Liam Henry when he comes to the Saints.

Exact same profile:
- Kept out of the team for most of the year.
- Has speed to burn.
- Electric around goal and up the ground.
- Both were criticised for their disposal.

Liam Henry will become a star under a fast pace RTB team instead of a slow Justin Longmuir team.

[Otiman]

Brisbane didn't have the matchup for Hill and it showed.

I think any of our forwards could get up there and kick a bag, but in our case it's King.

King would have taken those marks (maybe not the speccy) and kicked those goals.

[SaintWiki]

Bobby was a standout in a game where there we few. He didn't kick that many before but full credit for seizing his moment. How anyone can think we specifically need a Bobby Hill to be successful will be waiting a long time.

[thejiggingsaint]

great mature posts here today colleagues! Most interesting to read! KUDOS! I thoroughly enjoyed yesterday's match. Two fine sides who gave it the BIFTERS!! to get the job done! I heard on Offsiders this morning one of the panelists compare the game to the '89 grand final (Which he thought was a better game) now I've watched BOTH GF games and I guess in terms of thuggery and carnage '89 has it (yesterday's game) covered. I beg to differ.
As far as the Saints having a "Bobby Hill" goes, well for what it's worth, I'd much rather see OTHER clubs asking "Our ---- ---- insert name" after a SAINTS PREMIERSHIP VICTORY!
Great discussion though Colleagues!

[whiskers3614]

Great to see Jiggster's positivity and common sense here!
More of us should take a leaf out of his book..

[Killa]

Kicking around corners?

Schnieder and Milne?

Some things never change!

[shanegrambeau]

great mature posts here today colleagues! Most interesting…. I'd much rather see OTHER clubs asking "Our ---- ---- insert name" after a SAINTS PREMIERSHIP VICTORY!
Great discussion though Colleagues!

Brisbane might have liked a Jack Sinclair yesterday and Collingwood a Wilkie, after their man went down.

It is fun to look at player ‘prototypes’ ..

I suppose there is no point wishing for a Wayne Carey, that are so generally good, but for specialists like small forwards I think so. And ruckman too. And I guess that means small forwards and rucks get traded between clubs. Some mids too.

[Banger9798]

We've got a few weapons
Max
Sincs and NWM rebounding
Michito hopefully as power mid- forward
Philipou mid -forward

We need some real elite speed - let's hope Henry fits the bill

[thejiggingsaint]

We've got a few weapons
Max
Sincs and NWM rebounding
Michito hopefully as power mid- forward
Philipou mid -forward

We need some real elite speed - let's hope Henry fits the bill

WELL SAID Colleague!!! I respect and admire the squads of yesterday's Grand Finalists. Two excellent footballing sides. Whilst I understand (and enjoy!) the posts speculating about who will be our "Bobby Hill", - its an entertaining and interesting exercise for lovers of the game,- I spend time speculating (and dreaming!) about a Saints Premiership side that will provide the supporters of 17 "other clubs" with the task of speculating who will be "THEIR ***** ***** "

DREAM THE IMPOSSIBLE DREAM!!!

[BadRossco]

Can’t compare any of Higgins, Butler or Greah to Bobby Hill they are not in the same class, our closest could be NWM if he moved forward has the skill and pace to develop into a very damaging small forward but would be sadly missed down back

[Scollop]

Which of our current players is capable of putting on a Bobby Hill style performance in a Grand Final ?

Butler is too prone to attempting his Harlem Globetrotters style flick ons, party tricks, and goals around the corner from 40m out - none of which ever come off against good teams in pressure situations

Huggins is dangerous within 15m of the goal line, but beyond that distance he plays like an undersized bush full forward who is out his depth at AFL.

Dare I say it, Gresham is the player that always looks capable of kicking 4 goals as a small forward, capable of the freak goals on the run from the boundary and never afraid to have a shot a goal .

I thought we HAD our own 'Bobby' in the making in 2017. Many Saints fans thought we did too. Lethlean and his footy department along with our list management didn't.

He was very much maligned by St Kilda fans but he could light up the field and he had all the tricks you'd want from a 'Bobby' type....and then some. We weren't exactly a high scoring team or finals worthy, so not ideal to be in a team as a forward in 2017/18/19.

I can't for the life of me figure out why we needed to recruit Jack Higgins once we had Dan and this other 'Bobby Hill' type... Don't forget we also had Lonie, Gresham and Billings.

By the way...he has an even more famous surname than Hill. We played him as a forward in 2017/18/19 but he was switched to the backline in 2020.

After we recruited Butler our 'Bobby' was moved. That's St Kilda's way of sabotaging our future.

Short term it was ok, but it messed long term with his footy development. We basically said to him that Lonie and Kent and Butler are preferred as our forwards. He struggled to hold his place in the St Kilda seniors in 2021/2022 and was traded to the Gold Coast Suns at the end of last year.

Stewy Dew wanted him to play half back flank...I think you know who I'm talking about. Many will say I used to pump this player up and rated him... probably for more than he was worth

We could have had a similar player to Bobby Hill, but unfortunately for Benny he didn't turn out to be our 'Bobby'.

Ben Long wasn't as mature as Bobby Hill ( Bobby is in a stable relationship and has a child) or perhaps as professional or as consistent.

Two things. Firstly our development at St Kilda of talented players is not good. We don't trust them
enough or give them enough support. We recruit too many of the same type, to the detriment of young players.

Secondly, Ben Long was his own worst enemy. Not for his discipline on ground (although that hasn't helped) but for the lack of total dedication to his sport and his career

[shanegrambeau]

Congratulations Scollop for adding Ben Long ….how on earth??? He was playing seconds at GC by the end of the season BTw.
Well, I might as well add the Junction Oval!
Yes, if we play at the Junction we will have that winning factor!
Or play one game in Japan.

Seriously now..

Re. Bobby Hill
Jake speaks about it here , from two minutes…

[Scollop]

Congratulations Scollop for adding Ben Long ….how on earth??? He was playing seconds at GC by the end of the season BTw.

Hill wasn't perceived as being this good when he played at GWS, but none the less he's had consistency and hadn't been moved to the backline.

Isn't this thread about all the attributes of a Bobby Hill type?

Do you not see that factors outside Long's control had impacted his development? One was the fact that St Kilda were a bottom 4 team in 2018/2019 and then....they moved him from the forward line!!

Do you not agree that it was a matter of consistency with Long? I'm not saying it was solely on us. He takes responsibility for some of his misgivings, but he had the talent.

So let's go into the future...

10 or 11 years from now, St Kilda is struggling after winning the 2030 flag and then sliding to 6th then 10th in 2033/34. We have a talented small forward on the list...What have we learned?

Do we give the small forward every chance to develop or do we recruit other teams second tier players and mature types while we try and rebuild?

[SaintWiki]

Congratulations Scollop for adding Ben Long ….how on earth??? He was playing seconds at GC by the end of the season BTw.

Hill wasn't perceived as being this good when he played at GWS, but none the less he's had consistency and hadn't been moved to the backline.

Isn't this thread about all the attributes of a Bobby Hill type?

Do you not see that factors outside Long's control had impacted his development? One was the fact that St Kilda were a bottom 4 team in 2018/2019 and then....they moved him from the forward line!!

Do you not agree that it was a matter of consistency with Long? I'm not saying it was solely on us. He takes responsibility for some of his misgivings, but he had the talent.

So let's go into the future...

10 or 11 years from now, St Kilda is struggling after winning the 2030 flag and then sliding to 6th then 10th in 2033/34. We have a talented small forward on the list...What have we learned?

Do we give the small forward every chance to develop or do we recruit other teams second tier players and mature types while we try and rebuild?

GC have a pretty good line-up these days and their seconds won the GF.

Nevertheless, I have often pondered why so many ex-Saint players have done so well in other sides and put it down to possibly 3 things. Firstly most players need a fair bit of development and confidence building but also wondered whether our individual player development strategies were second or third rate in the past.

[takeaway]

Which of our current players is capable of putting on a Bobby Hill style performance in a Grand Final ?

Butler is too prone to attempting his Harlem Globetrotters style flick ons, party tricks, and goals around the corner from 40m out - none of which ever come off against good teams in pressure situations

Huggins is dangerous within 15m of the goal line, but beyond that distance he plays like an undersized bush full forward who is out his depth at AFL.

Dare I say it, Gresham is the player that always looks capable of kicking 4 goals as a small forward, capable of the freak goals on the run from the boundary and never afraid to have a shot a goal .

I thought we HAD our own 'Bobby' in the making in 2017. Many Saints fans thought we did too. Lethlean and his footy department along with our list management didn't.

He was very much maligned by St Kilda fans but he could light up the field and he had all the tricks you'd want from a 'Bobby' type....and then some. We weren't exactly a high scoring team or finals worthy, so not ideal to be in a team as a forward in 2017/18/19.

I can't for the life of me figure out why we needed to recruit Jack Higgins once we had Dan and this other 'Bobby Hill' type... Don't forget we also had Lonie, Gresham and Billings.

By the way...he has an even more famous surname than Hill. We played him as a forward in 2017/18/19 but he was switched to the backline in 2020.

After we recruited Butler our 'Bobby' was moved. That's St Kilda's way of sabotaging our future.

Short term it was ok, but it messed long term with his footy development. We basically said to him that Lonie and Kent and Butler are preferred as our forwards. He struggled to hold his place in the St Kilda seniors in 2021/2022 and was traded to the Gold Coast Suns at the end of last year.

Stewy Dew wanted him to play half back flank...I think you know who I'm talking about. Many will say I used to pump this player up and rated him... probably for more than he was worth

We could have had a similar player to Bobby Hill, but unfortunately for Benny he didn't turn out to be our 'Bobby'.

Ben Long wasn't as mature as Bobby Hill ( Bobby is in a stable relationship and has a child) or perhaps as professional or as consistent.

Two things. Firstly our development at St Kilda of talented players is not good. We don't trust them
enough or give them enough support. We recruit too many of the same type, to the detriment of young players.

Secondly, Ben Long was his own worst enemy. Not for his discipline on ground (although that hasn't helped) but for the lack of total dedication to his sport and his career

Absolute fiction.

Long is/was nothing like the Bobby Hill type of player. Totally different in the way they play. Also, nothing like the skillset, Long imo has always been a bottom six AFL player at best.

Get off Longy. Get onto your next project player, Jack Bytel ..... oh wait....

[shanegrambeau]

Hill wasn't perceived as being this good when he played at GWS,…..

have often pondered why so many ex-Saint players have done so well….

Hill at GWS…yeah, suppose so…I think it is hard to gauge their players because they have so talent that is latent we can’t see it out in the open. They have to win games. It’s like a talent lab up there and they are laboratory specimens waiting to be picked off by more established clubs that can identify their potential?

I don’t agree with the second statement.

Apart from Acres, I see our players going to other clubs and fading quickly. Weller, Mitchington, Parker, Dunstan, Newnes, perhaps Long will still shine for GC? , wouldn’t be surprised if he is chopped too. I think Acres is the exception.

Of course, I am not talking about the tragic old days, where we lose Big Boy etc., but more so the last five or so years.

I would have thought Acres is ahead of
DMac, Hunter C atm..maybe even Ross, although let’s see how he goes next year. But in general I don’t see this thing that you describe of former Saints shining at other clubs, not recently.

Edit: here is one outlier…the fast fella at Essendon…but even he was dropped this year too.

[Scollop]

Congratulations Scollop for adding Ben Long ….how on earth??? He was playing seconds at GC by the end of the season BTw.

Hill wasn't perceived as being this good when he played at GWS, but none the less he's had consistency and hadn't been moved to the backline.

Isn't this thread about all the attributes of a Bobby Hill type?

Do you not see that factors outside Long's control had impacted his development? One was the fact that St Kilda were a bottom 4 team in 2018/2019 and then....they moved him from the forward line!!

Do you not agree that it was a matter of consistency with Long? I'm not saying it was solely on us. He takes responsibility for some of his misgivings, but he had the talent.

So let's go into the future...

10 or 11 years from now, St Kilda is struggling after winning the 2030 flag and then sliding to 6th then 10th in 2033/34. We have a talented small forward on the list...What have we learned?

Do we give the small forward every chance to develop or do we recruit other teams second tier players and mature types while we try and rebuild?

GC have a pretty good line-up these days and their seconds won the GF.

Nevertheless, I have often pondered why so many ex-Saint players have done so well in other sides and put it down to possibly 3 things. Firstly most players need a fair bit of development and confidence building but also wondered whether our individual player development strategies were second or third rate in the past.

Spot on. We saw what Long and Gresham brought as far as skills are concerned. That's why we picked them

We knew what talent Clark had when he was drafted and even going back as far as Billings and Dunstan and Acres. It was up to us to develop these young draftees.

They seem to stagnate at St Kilda ..or anyway...I should say 'seemed to stagnate'. Let's hope the focus is on the right direction AND that has to be the long term

Longy is at his second club. If for some reason he doesn't mature and Hardwick doesn't want him it's not the end of the road getting delisted from Gold Coast. Oleg Markov is now a Premiership player

[B.M]

Bobby Hill just had a very good game

It happens as a small forward, you also have plenty of ordinary ones

I think Butler kicked over 30 this season
Higgins about the same

Gresham has kicked 35 in a season

All have had 5 goal games at some point

Hill just happened to have his day in the sun on GF day

JJ did the same for HBs

Petracca and Dusty for power goal kicking mids

I don’t think you build a team around a small forward

Instead you build a midfield and KPs and then add the periphery after that

[Brunswicksainter]

Bobby hill had a great game. But he had many games this season where he went missing completely. I wouldn’t say he’s a better player than Higgins.

[spert]

Some players just have a very good day, and the GF was Hill's big day. Sadly our forwards never produce the goods on the big day when it counts.