Astute trading

[skeptic]

Would you sign Jones and Dmac to long deals then

What about Hannebery… should we have offered him another season.

Do u back Jones to have a full season next year? The issue with Jones isn’t that he’s had a few bad breaks like Coffield…

It’s that he can’t play 3/4 of footy without tearing something

[B.M]

Jones
1 year deal base wage or leave

DMac
Is he contracted?
If not 1 year base wage or retire

Coffield
3 year deal or second round draft pick

Gresham
Match offer we want second round Compo

Owens
Multi year deal extension

Clarke
3 year deal or second round draft pick

Stocker
Extension 2 years

Billings
Unless we get 2 round selection- keep
TBH - I’d probably do a straight swap for Dow

Windhager
Extension - 4 years

Howard
Two year deal - reduced

Phillipou
Extend to another 3

Webster 1 year deal

Wood 2 year deal

Paton
2 year deal

Keeler
2 year extension

Heath
2 year deal

Sharman
2 year extension


That’d be my list changes
Bring in Dow, Hollands, Henry, Jordan

Bring in 4 draft picks inside 50

[The Fireman]

You would definitely want an extension on Sharman
As the majority of us knew he had something
Really looking forward to seeing him progress next year

Some moron saw him delisted. I can’t remember who that was

[CQ SAINT]

Jones
1 year deal base wage or leave

DMac
Is he contracted?
If not 1 year base wage or retire

Coffield
3 year deal or second round draft pick

Gresham
Match offer we want second round Compo

Owens
Multi year deal extension

Clarke
3 year deal or second round draft pick

Stocker
Extension 2 years

Billings
Unless we get 2 round selection- keep
TBH - I’d probably do a straight swap for Dow

Windhager
Extension - 4 years

Howard
Two year deal - reduced

Phillipou
Extend to another 3

Webster 1 year deal

Wood 2 year deal

Paton
2 year deal

Keeler
2 year extension

Heath
2 year deal

Sharman
2 year extension


That’d be my list changes
Bring in Dow, Hollands, Henry, Jordan

Bring in 4 draft picks inside 50

Banga had 7 all Australians by 2000. Of the 3 or 4 currently chronically injured above, Coffield, Jones, Billings and Mackenzie, I dont think we are risking a huge loss either way.

The Harvey comparison was weird but Jones has been good when fit. Coffield started to show something, but nothing since and Billing is a GOP on a minor contract until 2025. Mackenzie looks cooked.

[B.M]

You obviously missed the point about the Harvey comparison

It’s nothing to do with ability

It’s the ability to come back from injury

Every footy player that’s ever paced up a boot gets injured, even has multiple injuries- and in most cases comes back fine.

Mason Wood was constantly injured at North - hardly missed a game at StK.

[B.M]

Oh, and disagree about Billings being a GOP

Plays the toughest position on the ground (HF) and at his best, and fit plays it as good as anyone.

[maverick]

Jones
1 year deal base wage or leave

DMac
Is he contracted?
If not 1 year base wage or retire

Coffield
3 year deal or second round draft pick

Gresham
Match offer we want second round Compo

Owens
Multi year deal extension

Clarke
3 year deal or second round draft pick

Stocker
Extension 2 years

Billings
Unless we get 2 round selection- keep
TBH - I’d probably do a straight swap for Dow

Windhager
Extension - 4 years

Howard
Two year deal - reduced

Phillipou
Extend to another 3

Webster 1 year deal

Wood 2 year deal

Paton
2 year deal

Keeler
2 year extension

Heath
2 year deal

Sharman
2 year extension


That’d be my list changes
Bring in Dow, Hollands, Henry, Jordan

Bring in 4 draft picks inside 50

Agree with all of that

[nostalgicsaint]

Oh, and disagree about Billings being a GOP

Plays the toughest position on the ground (HF) and at his best, and fit plays it as good as anyone.

Agreed.

On a bad day Billings is a B grade player. Nothing about him is GOP.

[MC Gusto]

Just on Dow. Speaking with a mate of mine who is mad Carlton.. he reckons Dow has a lot of upside. His view is Dow was completely unprotected by the senior players and coaches, was thrown into the middle as a first year player and got absolutely smashed physically. Killed his confidence and never recovered. Whilst picks don’t mean much once you’re in the league he was top 3 of the country for his age and nobody was questioning his selection at the time.

Could be that he continues on his current trajectory then again may turn a leaf in new surrounds

If he costs nothing then def worth a crack. My mate rates him and he’s generally pretty Uber critical of blues players

[ausfatcat]

Just on Dow. Speaking with a mate of mine who is mad Carlton.. he reckons Dow has a lot of upside. His view is Dow was completely unprotected by the senior players and coaches, was thrown into the middle as a first year player

So after five years he aint gotten over being unprotected in his first year?

[Banger9798]

I can't see the point of DMac getting a contract, if we bring in Henry and already have Hill and Wood, prolonging the pay on Dmac with his injury record seems like a mistake.

Coff and Clark should stay.

Billings looks flat and would no doubt be better with a fresh start (like Wood was), still value there, but it won't happen for him now at Saints.

[desertsaint]

Oh, and disagree about Billings being a GOP

Plays the toughest position on the ground (HF) and at his best, and fit plays it as good as anyone.

just because he plays there doesn't mean he plays it well - wood, hill, owens, even higgins, all play it better, and phillipou has far more upside. there's a reason he struggles to break into the team.

[CQ SAINT]

You obviously missed the point about the Harvey comparison

It’s nothing to do with ability

It’s the ability to come back from injury

Every footy player that’s ever paced up a boot gets injured, even has multiple injuries- and in most cases comes back fine.

Mason Wood was constantly injured at North - hardly missed a game at StK.

Harvey would have to be one of most mentally tough players to play the game. He was widely recognised as outstanding in that regard.
Mason Wood has been playing injured half the year and is statistically very lucky to be playing still.
Id like to see Billings, Jones and Mackenzie find peak fitness again but I won't hold my breath.
Coffield is the only one with any value, and we can't give Billings away, so I'll let the market talk about how good they are.

[Saints58]

If we loose Dougal this year and Battle is out of contract next year as a restricted free agent and walks who do we have to play KPD, Adams was doing ok and with a 3rd year under his belt should have slot into that spot but now we could be caught out with only Cordy as a KPD any young guy we draft now will take a few years.
Willkie is not big enough to take the key forwards and Highmore is turnover king and is tried in that spot and failed miserable.
Van es is still very young and didn't do a lot this year first year so unless we trade for KPD we are in real trouble.

[B.M]

Have we got short memories wrt Billings

It’s like Dory the fish on here!

Billings has received Brownlow votes 15 times multiple BOGs
11 votes in 2017
11 votes in 2019

Has kicked 5 in a game from HF
4 goals in the last quarter vs Bulldogs to win a game
25 disposals at 100% vs WCE in his second year

To say he can’t play is absolutely absurd

Of course there was a game where he was dropped or coming back from one of his many injuries where he played VFL

They put him in the midfield- he got a lazy 54 possessions

Billings is a good player, make no mistake

A back injury and leg injuries have curtailed his last two seasons and we’ve forgotten

[CQ SAINT]

Have we got short memories wrt Billings

It’s like Dory the fish on here!

Billings has received Brownlow votes 15 times multiple BOGs
11 votes in 2017
11 votes in 2019

Has kicked 5 in a game from HF
4 goals in the last quarter vs Bulldogs to win a game
25 disposals at 100% vs WCE in his second year

To say he can’t play is absolutely absurd

Of course there was a game where he was dropped or coming back from one of his many injuries where he played VFL

They put him in the midfield- he got a lazy 54 possessions

Billings is a good player, make no mistake

A back injury and leg injuries have curtailed his last two seasons and we’ve forgotten

I think everyone bar you has just moved not, not forgotten. His manager did scream out for a saviour, surely someone who remembers might have heard, Essendon could have had him when he was on a roll, but he has done nothing since. Instead we loaded him up and have got nothing from him. Bar 52 possessions in the VFL.

He has a contract, if he is good enough and can keep up with the preseaon he is about to endure, then he will be fine. Surely he wouldn't expect any concessions?

[B.M]

What?!

[meher baba]

I would suggest that BM belongs to that small minority of fans who have been able to move on from the fact that Billings isn’t Bont.

He’s a pretty good player. If Lyon doesn’t want him, then fair enough. But I think he still has a contribution to make somewhere. The suggestion that Higgins is a better HF than Billings is pretty silly.

[B.M]

I was annoyed we didn’t get Josh Kelly in his draft year as I was a massive fan! But alas he was gone.

Would I have selected JB at 3

Yes - even though he was only a HF

Bont was a ‘reach’ and I wouldn’t take any risks with FRDPs

Bont has paid off for the WBs so good drafting and good luck to them


2014 was a different story - that was a cluster ****

[saintsRrising]

I would suggest that BM belongs to that small minority of fans who have been able to move on from the fact that Billings isn’t Bont.

He’s a pretty good player. If Lyon doesn’t want him, then fair enough. But I think he still has a contribution to make somewhere. The suggestion that Higgins is a better HF than Billings is pretty silly.

I too rate Billings as a pretty decent player, better than average.

Lyon earlier this season was reported as having a discussion with Billings about where he saw himself playing, and that was as a small forward.

Now injuries stuffed Billings this year, but he was fully match fit then that means Billings was competing with Higgins, Butler and Gresham for the small forward gigs.

Over his career Billings as only had NEVER had a good year for goals. His best is 23. He also kicked 36 behinds. Next best year is only 14 gaols. Plus he has overall licked 123 bends to to 106 goals. Now while try he has not just played forward over his career, but his record does not scream small forward. His field kicking is good, but he is just not a goalkicker, even if he was drafted as such.

Butler defensive pressure game is an added reason for him to be played.

So Billings is at the back of the queue to play small forward.

This was also then made worse by this year the Saints playing both Owens and the Poo as forwards in a composite role where they were there to play as smalls and talls.

That combined really meant that in 2023 that there was not a spot for Billings in the starting 22.

Come 2024 we may well be Gresham-less. But Ollie Hottons will be pushing for selection as a HF/Mid


If Billings wants to get back in the 22 he really needs to re-invent himself in terms of what position he can play in. If he wants to play as small forward, then games will most likely be few.

So one can see why Billings is being shopped about.

Personally I have no doubt that Billings could be a useful player at a number of teams.

[B.M]

See that’s where I disagree with Lyon and I think that’s his down fall as coach - he pigeonholes players and has a closed mind to what else a player can provide.

Imo
Billings is clearly a HF link player

Not a small forward crumbing player - like Butler/Gresham

Not a small forward marking player - like Higgins

He is not a stoppage player.

He is your typical High Half Forward transition players who wins most footy between the arcs

He is not a 12-15ppg 1-1.5 goal small forward
He is a 20ppg 0.5-1 goal Half Forward

Imo
He is competing with Brad Hill and Ryan Byrnes as HHF/Winger

[maverick]

I was annoyed we didn’t get Josh Kelly in his draft year as I was a massive fan! But alas he was gone.

Would I have selected JB at 3

Yes - even though he was only a HF

Bont was a ‘reach’ and I wouldn’t take any risks with FRDPs

Bont has paid off for the WBs so good drafting and good luck to them


2014 was a different story - that was a cluster ****

100% agree. - I watched billings in u18 champs and he looked very good…

[SaintPav]

Is JB capable of playing across HB?

[B.M]

1/ We have two of the best HBs in the AFL

2/ He is pigeonholed as a small forward (incorrectly)

[The G Train Legacy]

Just on Dow. Speaking with a mate of mine who is mad Carlton.. he reckons Dow has a lot of upside. His view is Dow was completely unprotected by the senior players and coaches, was thrown into the middle as a first year player and got absolutely smashed physically. Killed his confidence and never recovered. Whilst picks don’t mean much once you’re in the league he was top 3 of the country for his age and nobody was questioning his selection at the time.

Could be that he continues on his current trajectory then again may turn a leaf in new surrounds

If he costs nothing then def worth a crack. My mate rates him and he’s generally pretty Uber critical of blues players

He's also really competing with Walsh for a place in that Carlton midfield isn't he?