rumours

[older saint]

I love this site , 1 day after the end of the season and according to many here ( who have a good source from a friend , whose girlfriend cuts the hair of a mates girlfriend you is best friend with someone whose sister dated a player at an afl club which played against stkilda)
- Gresham gone and wants out
- Coffied, see Gresham
- Clark - see above
- Billings dying to stay but coach doesn't like him so will be traded for a can of coke
- Several young player, who are developing and untried will be thrown out as 9 months has shown they will never get any better
- No one will want to come and if they do we will only pay 50% of what they are worth


FFS, take a breath and lets acknowledge how good a year it was.
Anyone who had us finishing 7th over all either is blindly devoted or lying.

[Sainter_Dad]

Billings wants out

[saintkid]

Billings wants out

The club was so much better to Billings than what he was to the club. Managed to get paid very handsomely and way over what he was worth.
His manager couldn't find another club to pay anywhere near the big $$ former contract he was given, which was based on expectation rather than proven on-field performances, so at the current contract negotiation period, he had no choice but to sign on again for lesser, yet still flattering $$, relative to his subsequent output.
Good luck to him elsewhere this time around....he was a bust at St Kilda.

[D.B.Cooper]

Billings wants out

The club was so much better to Billings than what he was to the club. Managed to get paid very handsomely and way over what he was worth.
His manager couldn't find another club to pay anywhere near the big $$ former contract he was given, which was based on expectation rather than proven on-field performances, so at the current contract negotiation period, he had no choice but to sign on again for lesser, yet still flattering $$, relative to his subsequent output.
Good luck to him elsewhere this time around....he was a bust at St Kilda.

I disagree, not too many busts at AFL level play 150 games at 26 years of age.

Yes the last two years have been challenging with injury, but there is nothing stopping him playing another 4 seasons if he can get the body right.

He did not hit the heights his early form suggested he may, and is harshly judged due to Bont being the pick directly after him, but he’s had a decent AFL career and is no bust.

I hope he stays, gets super fit and decides he’s going to stick it up the coaches and force them to pick him.

If he goes elsewhere I hope he does a Mason Wood and finishes his career strongly.

[The Recruit]

Yeah but 155 games at 28 years of age isn’t great for top 3 pick.

Billings is one of the biggest busts of all time

[nostalgicsaint]

Hyperbole

[SaintPav]

Has obvious talent but was a product of poor standards for years so he hasn’t lived up to his potential.

I think he has 3 years left on his contract. Is there a club wanting to take him on?

I don’t think Brad Scott will take this on given all their challenges.

Interest will likely come from Norf, Dogs, Geelong, Richmond, Sydney and Gold Coast.

[Jacks Back]

Has obvious talent but was a product of poor standards for years so he hasn’t lived up to his potential.

I think he has 3 years left on his contract. Is there a club wanting to take him on?

I don’t think Brad Scott will take this on given all their challenges.

Interest will likely come from Norf, Dogs, Geelong, Richmond, Sydney and Gold Coast.

He got his mate Sincs to the club. Look how he went under those "poor standards".

[SaintPav]

Has obvious talent but was a product of poor standards for years so he hasn’t lived up to his potential.

I think he has 3 years left on his contract. Is there a club wanting to take him on?

I don’t think Brad Scott will take this on given all their challenges.

Interest will likely come from Norf, Dogs, Geelong, Richmond, Sydney and Gold Coast.

He got his mate Sincs to the club. Look how he went under those "poor standards".

I would suggest that Sincs is a different character and is very self driven. He would flourish under any environment while others might need a push or even a shove.

I get your point though.

[skeptic]

Has obvious talent but was a product of poor standards for years so he hasn’t lived up to his potential.

I think he has 3 years left on his contract. Is there a club wanting to take him on?

I don’t think Brad Scott will take this on given all their challenges.

Interest will likely come from Norf, Dogs, Geelong, Richmond, Sydney and Gold Coast.

He got his mate Sincs to the club. Look how he went under those "poor standards".

I would suggest that Sincs is a different character and is very self driven. He would flourish under any environment while others might need a push or even a shove.

I get your point though.

I tend to agree with you.

People that come with incredibly positive attitudes and are work horses aka Sincs, Owens, Windy, Pou etc

Below the surface though are these guys that never seem to be close to where they need to be…
Billings, Clark, Jones, Dunstan in years gone by. They never been featured heavily in training reports as the elite runners at the club or done impressively well at the time trials. I would say with reasonable confidence that in the Richo years and to a degree through Ratten’s era (though he may have been trying to stamp it out)… that there has been a prominent culture of ppl that will do just enough.

Whispers about terrible attitudes to training on our list have swept through for 5+ years

[older saint]

Yeah but 155 games at 28 years of age isn’t great for top 3 pick.

Billings is one of the biggest busts of all time

I would think the names such as Tambling, Fiora , Dow, Scache,O'Royrke, Jack Trengove, Jack Watts, would all well and truely be listed above Billings in the term"biggest Busts of all time"

Told yo a million times don't exaggerate

[Yorkeys]

Are we using "rumours", "opinion" and "speculation" interchangeably now?

Could be a long off season.

I speculate that even club recruiters/retentioners are not sure what's what and have a full hand to play out over the next few months.

I would also speculate that Anthony Camminiti will have a specialist program designed for him by the end of this week.

Rumour has it that player agents are trying to hack each others phones and going through GWS and Melbourne's VFL lists with a fine toothcomb.

[CQ SAINT]

Let just compare Billings to Kelly.

Let's say Kelly is an A grade footballer and give him 80% as an average based on stats.

Now compare Billings.

On possessions alone, Billings is C-B grade.

Now make excuses, like he is a different type of player.

No he is isn't. He can take a contested mark but he recieves just as many uncontested handballs or marks.

He is a good kick. Big deal. He doesn't kick goals with them and doesnt get enough. Making high half forward look hard, isn't an excuse.

Injuries are a part of footy, a lot of great footballers over come them, however, there was a brief time before he signed his last contract, when he played very good consistent football.

I reckon he jabbed his way through it, loaded up his value and is now cooked. I hope not, we are likely to be tied together for 2 more years.

Billings would be better in a better side. We could never afford to carry him, hence the careers of Newnes, Weller, Acres, Dunstan and Ross.

Ross is the only one worth keeping.

[saintsRrising]

Well since is rumours (and add in speculation):

The Club wants more draft pics in order to gain more kids at the draft and also Henry and Dow who have both said to be Saints bound. Strategy is to become very good over years by adding more young players around our current good group of young players, rather than trying by trade to be a contender immediately.

Dow is to give our midfield an immediate boost as the young bodies of Owens and Phillipou are not yet ready to be full time mids (plus may only ever be burst mids).


Gresham- May or may not go. The money he has been offered by other clubs has not been what he would have hoped. Blues a no. Hawks a maybe. If contract is low as a FA our compo pick may not be too flash.

Billings - According RTB Wants to play as a small forward. However this puts him behind too many other small forwards at St Kilda. Saints open to trade, BUT Billings is contracted on good coin for TWO more years. So to get a reasonable pic or player back we may have to pay part of his contract. Or if not, accept very poor value for him.

Howard - Club ok with him, BUT they want young mids more and so are will to compromise at FB in order to get a decent pick (Note that pick unlikely to be better thana late first round). ie We make do at FB for a couple of years till Van Ess or Adams comes on. Of the St Kilda players on the table Howard is the one most likely to generate the most value back.

Doggie Fans are claiming that Lobb is off to the Saints.

Saints hunting for a Salary Dump deal where we carry a players salary but get a pick or picks as well. May or may not happen though as other clubs are now also hunting such deals.

Clark will be shopped about.

Lions evidently keen on Coffield, but Saints would like to keep him.

A number of other players will also leave, but most likely for nil return.

[meher baba]

Gee the level of hatred directed towards Jack Billings on this forum is way over the top.

Poor bloke: it wasn't his fault that he got picked ahead of Bontempelli.

Trying to mark him down on the number of possessions he receives is ridiculous. He's an outside player who averages around 20 possessions per game over his career. About the same as Bradley Hill over his career or Mason Wood this season (his previous seasons weren't so productive).

It seems as if he doesn't fit into Lyon's plans and he'll most likely be moving on. But he's an AFL quality player and will potentially flourish at another club. It's ridiculous to dump on him. Like 99 per cent of AFL players past and present, he's nowhere near as good as Bontempell. So bloody what.

[CQ SAINT]

Gee the level of hatred directed towards Jack Billings on this forum is way over the top.

Poor bloke: it wasn't his fault that he got picked ahead of Bontempelli.

Trying to mark him down on the number of possessions he receives is ridiculous. He's an outside player who averages around 20 possessions per game over his career. About the same as Bradley Hill over his career or Mason Wood this season (his previous seasons weren't so productive).

It seems as if he doesn't fit into Lyon's plans and he'll most likely be moving on. But he's an AFL quality player and will potentially flourish at another club. It's ridiculous to dump on him. Like 99 per cent of AFL players past and present, he's nowhere near as good as Bontempell. So bloody what.

He is nowhere near Bontempelli and a B grade version of Kelly. There it is. Now he wants to be a small forward. He is a veteran no.3 pick, not a recruit with career options.

It is what it is. Not our biggest problem.

[saynta]

I love this site , 1 day after the end of the season and according to many here ( who have a good source from a friend , whose girlfriend cuts the hair of a mates girlfriend you is best friend with someone whose sister dated a player at an afl club which played against stkilda)
- Gresham gone and wants out
- Coffied, see Gresham
- Clark - see above
- Billings dying to stay but coach doesn't like him so will be traded for a can of coke
- Several young player, who are developing and untried will be thrown out as 9 months has shown they will never get any better
- No one will want to come and if they do we will only pay 50% of what they are worth


FFS, take a breath and lets acknowledge how good a year it was.
Anyone who had us finishing 7th over all either is blindly devoted or lying.

I had us finishing 6th and I am neither blindly devoted or lying.

To me that was obvious and I find that sentence in your post, highly offensive

[saynta]

Let just compare Billings to Kelly.

Let's say Kelly is an A grade footballer and give him 80% as an average based on stats.

Now compare Billings.

On possessions alone, Billings is C-B grade.

Now make excuses, like he is a different type of player.

No he is isn't. He can take a contested mark but he recieves just as many uncontested handballs or marks.

He is a good kick. Big deal. He doesn't kick goals with them and doesnt get enough. Making high half forward look hard, isn't an excuse.

Injuries are a part of footy, a lot of great footballers over come them, however, there was a brief time before he signed his last contract, when he played very good consistent football.

I reckon he jabbed his way through it, loaded up his value and is now cooked. I hope not, we are likely to be tied together for 2 more years.

Billings would be better in a better side. We could never afford to carry him, hence the careers of Newnes, Weller, Acres, Dunstan and Ross.

Ross is the only one worth keeping.

Acres just won a final for his blues.

[CURLY]

Billings is an elite ball user and if not for injury would have played 24 games. His spot was filled and he has next pre season to get it back.

[B.M]

Short memories re: Billings

And where the fk do the poor standards rubbish come from?

Billings is as professional as a footballer as you get

Injuries happen

And BTW
Where have I heard information from this thread before?

[Banger9798]

Most if it is from Bigfooty

Curly usually has reasonable ITK insights.

What's happening Curly?

[CURLY]

Most if it is from Bigfooty

Curly usually has reasonable ITK insights.

What's happening Curly?

Nothing ground breaking. Happy to stay happy to keep.

Obviously if an attractive offer came for both that may change.

[shanegrambeau]

Billings may have a lot of experience and more than average class, but I just don’t think he has the energy and movement and speed..

Perhaps it is something to do with back injury and hamstrings? No idea. I dread to think that Hunter Clark may also be that kind of player. Both have courage, poise, and time..

Gresham ? It is like the big bulls of GWS and Melbourne just put him in a different league. Small forward or nothing.

I think it was an average season with a fluky start.

-Our fixture was soft (it won’t be next year)
-We had the new coach bounce effect
-We we’re extremely fortunate with other results tipping others out of the 8 (we didn’t beat a single top 8 team all season, when they were in the 8 and firing, bar Essendon at the very start)

On the positive side, we arrested a rapid decline. We had already peaked with Richo/Ratts early ‘22 and were in a steep decline (Losing Paddy was a huge loss, but declining Ross, Membrey, and quite a few others added to the downturn) So in general, it wasn’t the top 8 that was remarkable, it was that we were not 16th that stands out. I think we were going down fast by late ‘22 season.

If we are even close to top 8 again next year, it would be another pass mark for Ross and the boys (and girls)

[shanegrambeau]

Billings may have a lot of experience and more than average class, but I just don’t think he has the energy and movement and speed..

Perhaps it is something to do with back injury and hamstrings? No idea. I dread to think that Hunter Clark may also be that kind of player. Both have courage, poise, and time..

Gresham ? It is like the big bulls of GWS and Melbourne just put him in a different league. Small forward or nothing.

I think it was an average season with a fluky start.

-Our fixture was soft (it won’t be next year)
-We had the new coach bounce effect
-We we’re extremely fortunate with other results tipping others out of the 8 (we didn’t beat a single top 8 team all season, when they were in the 8 and firing, bar Essendon at the very start)

On the positive side, we arrested a rapid decline. We had already peaked with Richo/Ratts early ‘22 and were in a steep decline (Losing Paddy was a huge loss, but declining Ross, Membrey, and quite a few others added to the downturn) So in general, it wasn’t the top 8 that was remarkable, it was that we were not 16th that stands out. I think we were going down fast by late ‘22 season.

If we are even close to top 8 again next year, it would be another pass mark for Ross and the boys (and girls)

[Banger9798]

Billings needs half a dozen games without injury and we would remember how good he is.
Personally I hope he stays and Ross gets the best out of him.