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tony74 wrote: ↑Sun 23 Apr 2023 9:19pm
The sports and science blokes have got it all under control. Lots of less minutes in some of our prime movers.
Good point. TOG stats to back this up:
Philppou 68%
Ross 69%
Butler 70%
Paton 75%
Steele 75%
Crouch 76%
Clark 77%
All of the players I'd consider 'resting' are in this group.
They call it science, but it's just as much an artform when you consider that it isn't exact.
Assume you used data for a player 12 months ago and you use that for now. How do you know if that player had niggles 12 months ago versus today? How do you know their exact weight or their exact fitness now versus then?
Are they using sports science from several professional sports or are they specific with what they measure and just use AFL/VFL data?
At times, it means assessing data to predict the future.
How do you compare the TOG of player A versus player B and how many times in the past has it produced 100% accuracy or as close to 100% as possible?
What did the review last year say about our sports science staff?
Last edited by Scollop on Mon 24 Apr 2023 7:14pm, edited 1 time in total.
Otiman wrote: ↑Sun 23 Apr 2023 7:23pm
Upcoming friday night game off a 5 day break. How do you approach match committee?
For me, you make some changes and rest a few. I expect to see a few (managed) in the outs this week including Philippou.
I doubt they’ll be any changes…we had a clean bill of health after the Carlton game & there’s a nice balance in the team.
Webster, Caminiti and King will come in when ready.
A king, Membrey, Caminiti set up will improve our inside 50 output…currently we’re ranked 16th.
B.M wrote: ↑Mon 24 Apr 2023 6:15pm
Because Billings if a better player than players currently in the team
He played 3qtrs in the VFL
22 possessions
Tackled well
3 goals
In perspective
Membrey had 4 possessions and zero goals in his VFL game
So they don’t put a great deal of stock into that
Billings has had numerous AFL best on grounds
Some players in the team have not even got in the best players
Look I hope like hell you’re right. Potentially he’s got more ability than Higgins and butler put together. But who makes way for him? He played poorly last year and he’s been injured most of pre season. I don’t reckon 2-3 games in the VFL would hurt him. Members came in because his position structurally is critical. With Caminiti suspended who else would play tall fwd?
Not sure Billings has ever played poorly. Bloke may not have hit the heights some on here have hoped for but has always imo been one of our better players.
Disclaimer: posts are my views and shouldn't be taken as fact, even if I am in fact right.
All players experience poor form at some stage or another, except maybe a select few superstars
Jack Billings was still a relatively young player in 2018. It was Annus horribilis for the team and the whole club that year
He was dropped and the coach said he needed to be dropped to improve his footy. Turns out Cho was right. 2019 was his best year in my opinion
Not only do I think it was his best because of his disposal numbers, but it was the first year he added some weight and some muscles for the rigors of playing as a midfielder. He ended up playing all games in 2019. He played more forward in 2021...so the comparison below shows he hit the scoreboard more in that year
Sheez Scollo have you been watching the footy without sound again!
Next thing you'll be suggesting is drop Howard for Sharman.
Crouch is arguably our most important player in the midfield currently. Would be top of the voting in the TB medal and I have even heard Ross calls him Lenny by accident every now and then.
On Bytel, not sure I trust him yet at AFL level. Has always looked a cut above at Sandy, which incidently hasn't been hard to do historically, but not so much at AFL level.
Cordy ain't going anywhere until Hayes comes back to give him competition so flip of coin between Bytel and Windy for the Sub role.
You're only as good as your last game Vort. How did Crouch perform on the weekend? He had 6 kicks. Do you remember which one (I think it was only 1) actually hit a team mate?
I think he's replaceable. I'll also stick to what I said a little while ago. Jack Bytel will be a better player and more valuable to our team in the near future than Mr B Crouch
I'd like to talk more footy with you Vortex, but you've lost all credibility with your predictions in the last 3 weeks
Actually no!! I don't think you've tipped St Kilda to win even once this year.
As for your opinions on who can play and who is irreplaceable, you wouldn't have a clue.
I think you've hung your hat on your claims about Cooper Sharman who is a kid just beginning his football journey, and the other big call you seem to be chuffed about is that you've predicted correctly that Cordy wouldn't be dropped
But...we all know that he who laughs last laughs loudest... let's see if Zaine is still in the team when Hammer and Max get back and with Michito and Rowan and Skunk all injury free
You and I first clashed heads over 4 and a half years ago when you and a few others here were backing Lethlean and Richardson and the board for their decision to recruit Dan Hannebery.
You said it was the right call and I pointed to existing data over his last two years at the Swans and told you he was cooked
As far as turning the sound down goes... Imagine how different the verdicts would be if Michael Christian made a decision purely based on vision and without all the repetitive bullshitt of people like Cameron Ling and Hamish McLachlan telling him that Robbie Fox went past the footy and it was Robbie's fault that Mitch Duncan decided to place the point of his shoulder smack bang into the centre of Robbie's temple
Last edited by Scollop on Tue 25 Apr 2023 12:00pm, edited 1 time in total.
Scollop wrote: ↑Tue 25 Apr 2023 11:46am
You're only as good as your last game Vort. How did Crouch perform on the weekend? He had 6 kicks. Do you remember which one (I think it was only 1) actually hit a team mate?
I think he's replaceable. I'll also stick to what I said a little while ago. Jack Bytel will be a better player and more valuable to our team in the near future than Mr B Crouch
I'd like to talk more footy with you Vortex, but you've lost all credibility with your predictions in the last 3 weeks
Actually no!! I don't think you've tipped St Kilda to win even once this year.
As for your opinions on who can play and who is irreplaceable, you wouldn't have a clue.
I think you've hung your hat on your claims about Cooper Sharman who is a kid just beginning his football journey, and the other big call you seem to be chuffed about is that you've predicted correctly that Cordy wouldn't be dropped
But...we all know that he who laughs last laughs loudest... let's see if Zaine is still in the team when Hammer and Max get back and with Michito and Rowan and Skunk all injury free
You and I first clashed heads over 4 and a half years ago when you and a few others here were backing Lethlean and Richardson and the board for their decision to recruit Dan Hannebery.
You said it was the right call and I pointed to existing data over his last two years at the Swans and told you he was cooked
As far as turning the sound down goes... Imagine how different the verdicts would be if Michael Christian made a decision purely based on vision and without all the repetitive bullshitt of people like Cameron Ling and Hamish McLachlan telling him that Robbie Fox went past the footy and it was Robbie's fault that Mitch Duncan decided to place the point of his shoulder smack bang into the centre of Robbie's temple
nicely done Scollop and spot on. All of the above on the money
There's gems in the young Adelaide and Hawks and Kangaroos lists that we should be looking at.
If we still have our WA scouts we should be looking at Freo's list and the Eagles lists as well.
Where is there a young player who is hungry for games in the midfield but he is starved because they've got really good depth. Who can we get perhaps from Brisbane or the Western Bulldogs.
I think the momentum of this fast start is a great opportunity for Gubby and our recruiters to go to work and bring in elite talent that can support our midfield and propel us towards a top 4 finish (or a few top 4 finishes in a row) in the next 3 years.
There are 2 players that I thought were surplus to our needs. One was Crouch and the other was Higgins. Both were picked up at the end of 2020. So far the move hasn't paid off
Where is there a young player who is hungry for games in the midfield but he is starved because they've got really good depth.
Bytel?
We'll yeah... He's in our backyard and here I am looking at other teams for a gem
If Bytel keeps getting 40 at Sandringham without a lookin with the seniors, he may want out himself
While B Crouch is playing his absolute best it's difficult to drop him. He has been integral in most games but I just have a feeling that Jack's absolute best will be better than Brad's
I think we need to work out at some stage this year whether we believe we have a team ready to challenge for a premiership in 2024. If the answer is no, then you have to play the young blokes together
Give them the experience and the game time to get used to each other and their habits and their strengths and let them grow strong bonds as they build towards something exceptional together as a young unit
Last edited by Scollop on Tue 25 Apr 2023 12:42pm, edited 2 times in total.
Scollop wrote: ↑Tue 25 Apr 2023 12:46pm
I'm not the fkn coach?
He showed signs of fatigue in the game against Collingwood. He's not a fkn machine
If I was coach and head of selection, I wouldn't have played him against Carlton
you're not the coach but you seem like you want to make coach like decisions? but I understand I think,
although dropping your best midfielder seems odd, especially when he's probably leading the TB medal vote count and probably up there in Brownlow voting too.
I'd probably be holding off dropping Crouchy for Bytel anytime soon though if we want to keep winning.
probably go as far as saying it's been odd listening to posters suggest dropping all types of players in the first 6 rounds whilst there are literally no AFL grade players left to pick from.
I'd say Caminiti will struggle to get back in on a permanent basis Members is back.
Bytel should get a bit of a run here and there over the next month depending on how well Windy goes but those two might rotate in and out of Sandy for while now as they are competing for the same spot.
I think Billings is competing for Byrnes spot and so it will be interesting to see how Billings plays under Lyon, hypothetically if Jack can find his best and hold it he should see Byrnes playing back at Sandy and come in and out from there.
Cordy should hold his spot until Hayes is ready for selection again you'd think also.
The panel here thought he should get 3rd place and a podium finish in the B&F (that's if you use The Eastern Memorial Award and use corresponding placings).
He finished 3rd as Saintsational Player of the year but 6th in the real stuff.
Seb Ross polled more votes in The Trevor Barker Medal
Steele was our best pure mid in the medal count and Jack did an AC joint and missed 5-6 games
Gresham nearly polled as many votes as Crouch even though Gresh missed a chunk of games with injury as well.
Scollop wrote: ↑Tue 25 Apr 2023 1:23pm
The panel here thought he should get 3rd place and a podium finish in the B&F (that's if you use The Eastern Memorial Award and use corresponding placings).
He finished 3rd as Saintsational Player of the year but 6th in the real stuff.
Seb Ross polled more votes in The Trevor Barker Medal
Steele was our best pure mid in the medal count and Jack did an AC joint and missed 5-6 games
Gresham nearly polled as many votes as Crouch even though Gresh missed a chunk of games with injury as well.
Scollop wrote: ↑Tue 25 Apr 2023 2:03pm
Is Sinclair a midfielder? Wood certainly is! Both should be above Crouch in my opinion
Happy
All completely different players and positions and all very important to the team in their own right and definitely not competing with each other for a spot in the team.
we should workshop stuff more often Scollo, I feel this is helping you.
Scollop wrote: ↑Tue 25 Apr 2023 12:46pm
I'm not the fkn coach?
He showed signs of fatigue in the game against Collingwood. He's not a fkn machine
If I was coach and head of selection, I wouldn't have played him against Carlton
No, the sports and science gurus at the Saints have kept a close eye on Crouchy's CE's and SME levels and they are fine, they currently have him scheduled for a break in round 12, so I don't think he will be "managed" for the Port game, or the ones after, till the break.
Now that Longy has gone, and your campaign to have him replace Brad Hill in his position failed, I can see that you are very keen for Bytel to take Crouchy's position. I agree Jack hasn't been given much of a run, injury hasn't helped, but he hasn't been selected mainly imo because he is not as good as the existing midfielders, certainly including Crouch. Not far off it, maybe he can replace someone like Crouch in the longer term, (probably after Crouch retires), but not at present with Sinclair and Crouch our best midfielders this year, noting Steele has been injured.
