Lyon and his vision of our 2023 game style.

[Teflon]

WTF are you on about Teffers?!


Buckley - a poor coach

In 2018 they were a Dom Sheed kick from the boundary and premiership and Bucks was a premiership coach…. Or was he a great coach in 2018 - and a poor coach 3 years later?!

Last year they won 10 games by under 10 points - They could have easily lost 4 of those and finished below us.

End of the day - they fell short

Was that the coaches fault - or did they run into a better team?!

Chris Scott
10 years of finals all failed attempts - his fault?
Then in 2022 he won - his credit???

Who was more important
Jeremy Cameron
Or
Chris Scott

Because I’ll tell you now, no Cameron - no premiership

Once again ….for a supposed school teacher - ewe dint reed two good.

Please go back to my post and HIGHLIGHT abd BOLD where I said Buckley was a poor coach?????????

WTF indeed

Why do you persist in asking yourself your own questions…answering them yourself and insisting that was the topic????

It’s bizarre boorish look at me behaviour

Answer the previous questions I’ve asked you braniac before quoting me and posting inane nonsense that no one is actually talking about…

[Teflon]

Sorry…maybe you aren’t a dumbarse. You’re just a loon

So the club SHOULDA kept Ratten is that your position?

FFS get a view man/woman or whatever you identify as!

[Teflon]

Our general approach to selection was pedestrian, lacked flair and risk reward considerations and has amongst other things cost Ratts. Possibly influenced playing group to lose a bit of enthusiasm as well. Same ol same ol......

We never really recovered from Round 1 - Ratts seemed shell shocked because apparently he hadn't seriously rated possibility of improvement under McCrea - bit dumb.
Could not make moves to stop that first gamer for the Pies that the Dogs cut (Lipinsky). An example of how impotent Ratts was on game days, could not read what was playing out before him.

To give him some credit against Pies Rd 1 he swung Sinclair into the middle and it worked and he had impact
We hit the front after being 5 goals down but sadly wilted (as would happen throughout the year)
I think first half year we jumped a few sides for fitness but reality was we got some at good times (Tigers…they were way better later) OR had some individual brilliance help us (King against Cats etc) but reality was the draw for us got much tougher second half year …,which is why Ratten should never have been extended…and we showed our glaring holes.
The game plan players looked utterly confused and at pressers Brett had zero answers

[B.M]

By bringing up that McRae made a difference to Collingwood and was responsible for their rise up the ladder with the same list

Suggests he is a better coach than Buckley

I just pointed out that drawing such a conclusion is ridiculous


I do love the personal jibes, but please be aware - it just makes you come across as an arsehole.

Maybe I’ll run to the mids?…

[Teflon]

By bringing up that McRae made a difference to Collingwood and was responsible for their rise up the ladder with the same list

Suggests he is a better coach than Buckley

I just pointed out that drawing such a conclusion is ridiculous


I do love the personal jibes, but please be aware - it just makes you come across as an arsehole.

Maybe I’ll run to the mids?…

No…geezus this hard going
Again, SHOW ME where I said Buckley was a poor coach
Not what you THINK I meant ….that’s in your head
I could care less how I come across to some on this site who clearly try so hard to be Football intellects but end up confusing themselves..

[Vortex]

Very sensible (tad obvious but let’s ignore that)
Head coach has huge impact on recruiting talented, skilful players and in setting who trains the fitness
Thank god we got the Head coach in whose already driving change in those areas after 3 years of cuddles mess
Good call.

I am curious, you claim Ross is driving change in the area of recruitment and talent acquisition, I haven't heard him outline how he will be driving change in that area, what did I miss? Care to elaborate the details of his plan?

Yes ofcourse I never leave my friends hanging
Ross confided in me that he’s been big behind the scenes for Gags moving on and for a tilt at Cripps or possibly SOS - I be said “Ross..please not SOS..he’s a toss” but not sure he listened
Anyhoo it’s all he said.

So you made stuff up again.

Sheez you fanboy types will go to extraordinary lengths to defend your lies.

[Teflon]

Very sensible (tad obvious but let’s ignore that)
Head coach has huge impact on recruiting talented, skilful players and in setting who trains the fitness
Thank god we got the Head coach in whose already driving change in those areas after 3 years of cuddles mess
Good call.

I am curious, you claim Ross is driving change in the area of recruitment and talent acquisition, I haven't heard him outline how he will be driving change in that area, what did I miss? Care to elaborate the details of his plan?

Yes ofcourse I never leave my friends hanging
Ross confided in me that he’s been big behind the scenes for Gags moving on and for a tilt at Cripps or possibly SOS - I be said “Ross..please not SOS..he’s a toss” but not sure he listened
Anyhoo it’s all he said.

So you made stuff up again.

Sheez you fanboy types will go to extraordinary lengths to defend your lies.

I give you genuine insight and still you Troll
Should change your Nic to Nexus..

[Vortex]

Very sensible (tad obvious but let’s ignore that)
Head coach has huge impact on recruiting talented, skilful players and in setting who trains the fitness
Thank god we got the Head coach in whose already driving change in those areas after 3 years of cuddles mess
Good call.

I am curious, you claim Ross is driving change in the area of recruitment and talent acquisition, I haven't heard him outline how he will be driving change in that area, what did I miss? Care to elaborate the details of his plan?

Yes ofcourse I never leave my friends hanging
Ross confided in me that he’s been big behind the scenes for Gags moving on and for a tilt at Cripps or possibly SOS - I be said “Ross..please not SOS..he’s a toss” but not sure he listened
Anyhoo it’s all he said.

So you made stuff up again.

Sheez you fanboy types will go to extraordinary lengths to defend your lies.

I give you genuine insight and still you Troll
Should change your Nic to Nexus..

don't go changing fanboy...it's always fun doing the dance with you

[Teflon]

Very sensible (tad obvious but let’s ignore that)
Head coach has huge impact on recruiting talented, skilful players and in setting who trains the fitness
Thank god we got the Head coach in whose already driving change in those areas after 3 years of cuddles mess
Good call.

I am curious, you claim Ross is driving change in the area of recruitment and talent acquisition, I haven't heard him outline how he will be driving change in that area, what did I miss? Care to elaborate the details of his plan?

Yes ofcourse I never leave my friends hanging
Ross confided in me that he’s been big behind the scenes for Gags moving on and for a tilt at Cripps or possibly SOS - I be said “Ross..please not SOS..he’s a toss” but not sure he listened
Anyhoo it’s all he said.

So you made stuff up again.

Sheez you fanboy types will go to extraordinary lengths to defend your lies.

I give you genuine insight and still you Troll
Should change your Nic to Nexus..

don't go changing fanboy...it's always fun doing the dance with you

Like dancing with your sister they say…

[SAINT-LEE]

I predict there'll be some on here extracting their tongues out of his bumhole soon enough when reality bites

Could be some knives wanting to be inserted in his back next year rather than any extracting going on

I agree....Some people are strange....Anyone who watched our capitulations in 2022 should factor youth, injuries, etc but mostly the lack of player capacity & woeful game plan.

I assume those who just blamed the coach or the "shyte" player of the week will grind on Ross in their first game.

We ARE in a "rebuild" of sorts from staff to player to game style to culture.

Expect to win AND expect to be kicked squarely in the sweets.

[SAINT-LEE]

He could replace Lyon with Roo and Leathlean with hmmmm.

Word on the street is Roo is taking a year long "break" whilst preparing for his official role with his new Tasmanian club.

Yep...its on the streets, man.

[Yorkeys]

By bringing up that McRae made a difference to Collingwood and was responsible for their rise up the ladder with the same list

Suggests he is a better coach than Buckley

I just pointed out that drawing such a conclusion is ridiculous


I do love the personal jibes, but please be aware - it just makes you come across as an arsehole.

Maybe I’ll run to the mids?…

McCrea proved he is a better coach, seems a better bloke, seems innately smarter. Something of a trend setter.
Check out the year on year results. Not at all ridiculous to suggest McCrea is the better. Results were miles better.
Ross has some really tough coaching opposition to contend with.

[Vortex]

By bringing up that McRae made a difference to Collingwood and was responsible for their rise up the ladder with the same list

Suggests he is a better coach than Buckley

I just pointed out that drawing such a conclusion is ridiculous


I do love the personal jibes, but please be aware - it just makes you come across as an arsehole.

Maybe I’ll run to the mids?…

McCrea proved he is a better coach, seems a better bloke, seems innately smarter. Something of a trend setter.
Check out the year on year results. Not at all ridiculous to suggest McCrea is the better. Results were miles better.
Ross has some really tough coaching opposition to contend with.

And what happens if the Pies end up bottom 4 this year.

[shanegrambeau]

By bringing up that McRae made a difference to Collingwood and was responsible for their rise up the ladder with the same list

Suggests he is a better coach than Buckley

I just pointed out that drawing such a conclusion is ridiculous


I do love the personal jibes, but please be aware - it just makes you come across as an arsehole.

Maybe I’ll run to the mids?…

McCrea proved he is a better coach, seems a better bloke, seems innately smarter. Something of a trend setter.
Check out the year on year results. Not at all ridiculous to suggest McCrea is the better. Results were miles better.
Ross has some really tough coaching opposition to contend with.

I am interested in this too.

Maybe Buckley had lost his players?
In his last year they lost close games (Brisbane , Port Adelaide bost lost by a point) , then McCrae had all those wins in a row by a kick at the death, the boucne effect of a new coach and a nice fixture.

Look at their first four rounds next year!

R1 Geelong
R2 Port
R3 Richmond
R4 bBrissy

By the time they face the Saints in Round Five there will be a NEW WORLD ORDER!

[samoht]

I wonder how many of those close games "Macrae would have won, " if key position players Howe and Moore, as well as important small forward Jamie Elliott were similarly on the long-term injury list, as they were in Buckley's last year, and without the benefit of first year Daicos starring and averaging 27 possessions.
Those 3 important players missed half the season in 2021. A star young player was added and played all games in 2022.

Big factors that should not be ignored if we want to be fair and objective. And we're talking about a lot of close games.

Are there any other factors to consider, Teflon... is it just the coach?

No disrespect meant.

On the other hand, if Macrae's better training and recovery regime/methods has resulted in a low injury season, then I will join you in singing his praises. I am not sure how we can prove this?

[Scollop]

Proof?! This isn't a court room. Don't even mention the word respect with people you know have a reputation for being vile and constantly trying to put down any one with opposing views

People on forums aren't after the truth. Even if you raise good points...they won't often agree. That's not how they operate

They are just interested in getting one up on their combatants and proving how clever and condescending they can be

[shanegrambeau]

Ratts: hey, Bucks, can you spell?

Bucks: Yeah, I think so, what word do you want?

Ratts: 'Kiss'

Bucks: "L-O=S-E -T-O"

Ratts: 'Of'

Busks: 'P-O=R-T-B-Y"

Ratts: 'Death'

Bucks: 'O-N-E -P-O-I-N-T'

Ratts: Nice one.

Bucks: See ya down the TAB

[Teflon]

I wonder how many of those close games "Macrae would have won, " if key position players Howe and Moore, as well as important small forward Jamie Elliott were similarly on the long-term injury list, as they were in Buckley's last year, and without the benefit of first year Daicos starring and averaging 27 possessions.
Those 3 important players missed half the season in 2021. A star young player was added and played all games in 2022.

Big factors that should not be ignored if we want to be fair and objective. And we're talking about a lot of close games.

Are there any other factors to consider, Teflon... is it just the coach?

No disrespect meant.

On the other hand, if Macrae's better training and recovery regime/methods has resulted in a low injury season, then I will join you in singing his praises. I am not sure how we can prove this?

Mate what planet are you from???
Sorry but you just bang THE SAME drum
Please go back and out up a post where I state team success “is just the coach” - please put up????

FFS I’ve explained multiple times ofcourse you need players (no Shyte Sherlock) BUT the Coach plays a massive role in building that side - including the players he wants, what’s trained , whose selected, who are the assistants, how the team plays and perhaps most importantly ensuring the team cone to play week in week out
IF it’s all “just add good players” then Allistair Clarkson, Leigh Matthews, John Longmire etc etc could all just be replaced by card board cut outs (or Alan Richardson if you feel the cardboard has too much zest in it..)
Don’t think that’s the case at all.
Please stop verbalising me till you put up the post where I said success is ALL coach…

[samoht]

But, you are overlooking and downplaying all other factors, when you say ... "see what a difference Macrae has made, Buckley was not much chop, compared to Macrae" and just leave it at that. Attribute the "turnaround" to Macrae.

Where have you mentioned the significant injuries to key players in Buckley's last year, the addition of young Daicos etc.., the close games, etc.
Have you mentioned or considered Collingwood making the GF under Buckley, and their narrow 5 point loss?

In all cases we're talking about AFL coaches who were AFL players, and know what works and what doesn't from a player perspective, too. They have also learnt a thing or two as understudies to senior coaches. None of them are clueless or mugs.

By making it coach vs coach and (frankly) glossing over the bigger factors at play, you are making the coaches you don't rate sound like cardboard cut outs (they may as well be) and giving the ones you do rate special powers.

Is it just about making statements that hold no weight and are unrealistic and trying to support them (just to pass our time) ... or getting to the truth??

I'm from the planet of reality and truth, in answer to your opening question, and I will keep banging the same "drum of reality and truth" beat by beat, and make no apologies about that.

[Vortex]

Pies game style will be picked apart this season in addition to some ageing players. Throw in some injuries and bottom 4 is possible

[Yorkeys]

Starting from the hypothesis that Craig McCrae coached/coaches the Collingwood group better than Buckley seems reasonable place to start if someone wanted to prove otherwise. Work though it to disprove the idea.

There is the ladder result, a whisker from the GF, the general team improvement and how individuals were better used and motivated, first year player starred, DeGoey stayed and became a handy weapon. Yeah but, yeah but, yeah..
and maybe you could still argue there is no difference in overall coaching ability despite clear individual personal differences or that Buckley was better but so unlucky for so long. McCrea is a one hit wonder, how do we argue that faced with pretty clear performance facts: by reference to completely unmeasurable variables pulled from make believe land. What if, what if, what if.....

Samoht, you are a writer, objectively look at the difference in communication styles between the two and seriously argue McCrae is not a better leader in that regard. How about that never say die attitude instilled by McCrea. McCrea almost made some people like Collingwood - now that's amazing. Makes me gag. Buckley is easy to dislike, yes?

[samoht]

Would Collingwood have even come close in those 7 or so close games decided by a goal or so to display the "new found never say die attitude" without the better run with injury and without the addition of young Daicos??

That injury plus Daicos factor alone would probably make them a 6 goal better team, easy.

Look no further than the injuries to key players plus the Daicos factor. It's the only real factor in my view.

And let's not forget that Buckley played under a multi premiership coach and was his understudy ... and got his side to within a goal of winning the premiership.

[Vortex]

Starting from the hypothesis that Craig McCrae coached/coaches the Collingwood group better than Buckley seems reasonable place to start if someone wanted to prove otherwise. Work though it to disprove the idea.

There is the ladder result, a whisker from the GF, the general team improvement and how individuals were better used and motivated, first year player starred, DeGoey stayed and became a handy weapon. Yeah but, yeah but, yeah..
and maybe you could still argue there is no difference in overall coaching ability despite clear individual personal differences or that Buckley was better but so unlucky for so long. McCrea is a one hit wonder, how do we argue that faced with pretty clear performance facts: by reference to completely unmeasurable variables pulled from make believe land. What if, what if, what if.....

Samoht, you are a writer, objectively look at the difference in communication styles between the two and seriously argue McCrae is not a better leader in that regard. How about that never say die attitude instilled by McCrea. McCrea almost made some people like Collingwood - now that's amazing. Makes me gag. Buckley is easy to dislike, yes?

Lyon is universally despised by most other fans, what's your point re Buckley?

[Teflon]

But, you are overlooking and downplaying all other factors, when you say ... "see what a difference Macrae has made, Buckley was not much chop, compared to Macrae" and just leave it at that. Attribute the "turnaround" to Macrae.

Where have you mentioned the significant injuries to key players in Buckley's last year, the addition of young Daicos etc.., the close games, etc.
Have you mentioned or considered Collingwood making the GF under Buckley, and their narrow 5 point loss?

In all cases we're talking about AFL coaches who were AFL players, and know what works and what doesn't from a player perspective, too. They have also learnt a thing or two as understudies to senior coaches. None of them are clueless or mugs.

By making it coach vs coach and (frankly) glossing over the bigger factors at play, you are making the coaches you don't rate sound like cardboard cut outs (they may as well be) and giving the ones you do rate special powers.

Is it just about making statements that hold no weight and are unrealistic and trying to support them (just to pass our time) ... or getting to the truth??

I'm from the planet of reality and truth, in answer to your opening question, and I will keep banging the same "drum of reality and truth" beat by beat, and make no apologies about that.

Abs you have TOTALLY ignored the massive game plan change the Pies undertook when McRae took over
I have Pies mates who were crying Hallelujah! When they stopped playing the safe n steady “Buckley hug the boundary” rubbish that was outdated abd getting them nowhere
Sorry - Buckley was cooked
McRae breathed life into the place and that’s the mark of a good coach
Now he has to back up
The rest is obvious- injuries, good recruitment etc …let’s not forget Buckley had a role in the fire sale the Dogs benefited from ….
Good coaches don’t **** that up
Buckley was a good coach imo his time to step out was perfect

[Teflon]

Pies game style will be picked apart this season in addition to some ageing players. Throw in some injuries and bottom 4 is possible

And a harder draw let’s not underestimate that
I still think McRae can coach …
He turned the game plan around AND got the entire list to buy in …
Brett managed it for half a season this year …