Core Group of Players

[Jacks Back]

This has probably been written about ad-nauseum but I wrote this on another thread:
I think we need to decide on a core group of players that we can build a successful team around. That doesn't mean just young players - but players who excel in their positions. Once that is decided, then we can see if the remaining players have any trade value to get players in that we need to build around the core (and that doesn't just mean old players looking for a pension).

So here are my lists of what, in my opinion, would be our core list of players, the ones that are too early to call and the players that are tradable. Of course not all the tradable players would be traded - as other teams may not want them.

Working down the list in number order, the players I think could form the core of our next premiership (a few like Hill, Billings, Long and Higgins may be lucky to be on the list but I think they're good players):
Gresham
NWM
Hill
Steele
Clark
King
Billings
Windhager
Marshall
Howard
Long
Higgins
Owens
Battle
Membrey
Sinclair
McKenzie
Wilkie

Too early to call:
Heath
Sharman
Peris
Kyle
Hayes

Remaining players can be traded if they have any value:
Coffield
Jones
Crouch
Ross
Byrnes
Butler
Bytel
Adams
Webster
Allison
Lienert
Wood
Paton
Highmore
Connelly

What do you think?

[skeptic]

Trade Crouch and/or but Ross keep Billings…

Don’t like that

[Banger9798]

Put Sharman in the core group

[WellardSaint]

Hill, Howard, Higgins- not core for me.

Clark is injury-prone, maybe needs more awareness
Of course the club will be drawing up a similar list of 'Snog, Marry, Avoid'

I say Crouch stays.
Because of his age, nobody will come knocking.
Also he's in our top 5 possession-getters and tacklers.
Appears to have that hunger that the rest don't have all the time.
I would persist with Highmore, as he's young and still developing. Wilkie could mentor him and I expect him to be a crucial part of the backline in a year or two

[groupie1]

The 11 untouchables:
King
Wilkie
Sinclair
Steele
Skunk
Marshall
Higgins
Sharman
Connolly
Windhager
Owens

[B.M]

Connolly untouchable?

He’s a chance to be delisted!

[Beno88]

I'd have our untouchables as ;

Steele, Sinclair, King, Battle, Marshall, Wilkie, Membrey, Windhager, Owens & Wanganeen-Milera.

McKenzie & Ross not untouchable, but absolutely required players.

[Vortex]

This has probably been written about ad-nauseum but I wrote this on another thread:
I think we need to decide on a core group of players that we can build a successful team around. That doesn't mean just young players - but players who excel in their positions. Once that is decided, then we can see if the remaining players have any trade value to get players in that we need to build around the core (and that doesn't just mean old players looking for a pension).

So here are my lists of what, in my opinion, would be our core list of players, the ones that are too early to call and the players that are tradable. Of course not all the tradable players would be traded - as other teams may not want them.

Working down the list in number order, the players I think could form the core of our next premiership (a few like Hill, Billings, Long and Higgins may be lucky to be on the list but I think they're good players):
Gresham
NWM
Hill
Steele
Clark
King
Billings
Windhager
Marshall
Howard
Long
Higgins
Owens
Battle
Membrey
Sinclair
McKenzie
Wilkie

Too early to call:
Heath
Sharman
Peris
Kyle
Hayes

Remaining players can be traded if they have any value:
Coffield
Jones
Crouch
Ross
Byrnes
Butler
Bytel
Adams
Webster
Allison
Lienert
Wood
Paton
Highmore
Connelly

What do you think?

I'd have another category in there labelled "long term project players (aka way off the pace)" and move all but Hayes into the new category and keep Hayes in the "too early to call" and then add these players also to the "too early to call category"

Highmore
Owens
NWM

I think you've also got a few wrong in your "can be traded" category.

[Saints58]

This has probably been written about ad-nauseum but I wrote this on another thread:
I think we need to decide on a core group of players that we can build a successful team around. That doesn't mean just young players - but players who excel in their positions. Once that is decided, then we can see if the remaining players have any trade value to get players in that we need to build around the core (and that doesn't just mean old players looking for a pension).

So here are my lists of what, in my opinion, would be our core list of players, the ones that are too early to call and the players that are tradable. Of course not all the tradable players would be traded - as other teams may not want them.

Working down the list in number order, the players I think could form the core of our next premiership (a few like Hill, Billings, Long and Higgins may be lucky to be on the list but I think they're good players):
Gresham
NWM
Hill
Steele
Clark
King
Billings
Windhager
Marshall
Howard
Long
Higgins
Owens
Battle
Membrey
Sinclair
McKenzie
Wilkie

Too early to call:
Heath
Sharman
Peris
Kyle
Hayes

Remaining players can be traded if they have any value:
Coffield
Jones
Crouch
Ross
Byrnes
Butler
Bytel
Adams
Webster
Allison
Lienert
Wood
Paton
Highmore
Connelly

What do you think?

Let me start by saying thanks for the work you have put in to the list.

Interesting I would put Coffield in the top group swap him for Billings I know he has been injured but has more of a upside with his height and marking could be a interesting prospect in the midfield.

Also move Oscar Adams in the to early to call I know he has been injured but at 198cm a big unit and still only 19.
Why Allison is still on St. Kilda list I don't know he barely gets a kick in Sandy its only that he is a AFL listed player that he plays a list clocker.

Wood and Crouch & Lienert are interesting ones all in late 20s all played some good footy this year and I would give them a 1 year contract until the young guys are ready.

Great talking point this time of year is always interesting.

[Saints58]

I'd have our untouchables as ;

Steele, Sinclair, King, Battle, Marshall, Wilkie, Membrey, Windhager, Owens & Wanganeen-Milera.

McKenzie & Ross not untouchable, but absolutely required players.

what about long, Gresham,

[Saintmike65]

It’s all in the eye of the beholder compiling a list like this.
I think you’ll find Hill is as good as gone, as is Bytel unfortunately.
Don’t underestimate the value of Jack Hayes, either forward or back, he’ll be important to our structure.
It’s imperative that we get a different centre bounce mix, Steel and Crouch alternating yes but we need a more dynamic 3rd player in there..Windhager and De Goey would be nice!!
Hoping NWM gets over himself and embraces the opportunity given to him…playing as many games as he has in his first season is a great thing for such a young player.

[Sanctorum]

Interesting calls Jack, my thoughts on your list as follows:

Working down the list in number order, the players I think could form the core of our next premiership (a few like Hill, Billings, Long and Higgins may be lucky to be on the list but I think they're good players):

Gresham - cherry ripe to trade, one of the very few on the list that would attract strong interest, lacks impact, pace, not in my my top 12
NWM
Hill
Steele
Clark
King
Billings - not in my best 22 but has 3 years left on his contract and is unlikely on any other team's wish list, might come good but doubt it!
Windhager
Marshall
Howard
Long
Higgins
Owens
Battle
Membrey
Sinclair
McKenzie
Wilkie

Too early to call:
Heath
Sharman
Peris
Kyle - has already retired
Hayes

Remaining players can be traded if they have any value:
Coffield - he reminds me of former players Russell Green and Joel Smith who St Kilda traded out and went on to great careers elsewhere, must keep, best yet
to come
Jones - had a disrupted season, one of the few impact mids when he's on fire, move to first list.
Crouch - likely to finish in top 5 for the Barker, move to first list.
Ross
Byrnes
Butler - unless they can bring in a better goal sneak, and I doubt they're looking, I'd have him on your first list.
Bytel - too early to call
Adams - ditto
Webster
Allison
Lienert - a very good depth player, plays multiple roles.
Wood - definitely deserves to stay, like Lienert, plays multiple roles very well.
Paton - elevate to first list, best yet to come
Highmore
Connelly - Connolly is also too early to call, was not given an opportunity this year, showed promise in 7 games he played in 2021.

What do you think?

[cwrcyn]

To say Gresham lacks pace and impact is incorrect. To me, he is very important an in our best dozen players

[saynta]

This has probably been written about ad-nauseum but I wrote this on another thread:
I think we need to decide on a core group of players that we can build a successful team around. That doesn't mean just young players - but players who excel in their positions. Once that is decided, then we can see if the remaining players have any trade value to get players in that we need to build around the core (and that doesn't just mean old players looking for a pension).

So here are my lists of what, in my opinion, would be our core list of players, the ones that are too early to call and the players that are tradable. Of course not all the tradable players would be traded - as other teams may not want them.

Working down the list in number order, the players I think could form the core of our next premiership (a few like Hill, Billings, Long and Higgins may be lucky to be on the list but I think they're good players):
Gresham
NWM
Hill
Steele
Clark
King
Billings
Windhager
Marshall
Howard
Long
Higgins
Owens
Battle
Membrey
Sinclair
McKenzie
Wilkie

Too early to call:
Heath
Sharman
Peris
Kyle
Hayes

Remaining players can be traded if they have any value:
Coffield
Jones
Crouch
Ross
Byrnes
Butler
Bytel
Adams
Webster
Allison
Lienert
Wood
Paton
Highmore
Connelly

What do you think?

Not much actually and you are put of date as Kyle is long gone.

[Jacks Back]

Interesting calls Jack, my thoughts on your list as follows:

Working down the list in number order, the players I think could form the core of our next premiership (a few like Hill, Billings, Long and Higgins may be lucky to be on the list but I think they're good players):

Gresham - cherry ripe to trade, one of the very few on the list that would attract strong interest, lacks impact, pace, not in my my top 12
NWM
Hill
Steele
Clark
King
Billings - not in my best 22 but has 3 years left on his contract and is unlikely on any other team's wish list, might come good but doubt it!
Windhager
Marshall
Howard
Long
Higgins
Owens
Battle
Membrey
Sinclair
McKenzie
Wilkie

Too early to call:
Heath
Sharman
Peris
Kyle - has already retired
Hayes

Remaining players can be traded if they have any value:
Coffield - he reminds me of former players Russell Green and Joel Smith who St Kilda traded out and went on to great careers elsewhere, must keep, best yet
to come
Jones - had a disrupted season, one of the few impact mids when he's on fire, move to first list.
Crouch - likely to finish in top 5 for the Barker, move to first list.
Ross
Byrnes
Butler - unless they can bring in a better goal sneak, and I doubt they're looking, I'd have him on your first list.
Bytel - too early to call
Adams - ditto
Webster
Allison
Lienert - a very good depth player, plays multiple roles.
Wood - definitely deserves to stay, like Lienert, plays multiple roles very well.
Paton - elevate to first list, best yet to come
Highmore
Connelly - Connolly is also too early to call, was not given an opportunity this year, showed promise in 7 games he played in 2021.

What do you think?

I was trying to make my list of core players as shrt as possible however some on here have made a shorter list than me - and fair enough - it's all in the eye of the beholder. Your comments are great but I think your're putting too many players on that core list.

As for Kyle retiring Santa - I've never heard of him - I was just going down the list and thought it was too early to call because I'd never heard of him.

[Beno88]

I'd have our untouchables as ;

Steele, Sinclair, King, Battle, Marshall, Wilkie, Membrey, Windhager, Owens & Wanganeen-Milera.

McKenzie & Ross not untouchable, but absolutely required players.

what about long, Gresham,

Neither are players I'd want to lose. But if the right offer came, they're far from untouchable.

Gresham has all the right attributes, but has been at the club 7 years for one top 5 finish in the B&F.

Long has the endeavour I wish all our players did, but he's played two games worthy of a Brownlow vote in 79 attempts.

[Jacks Back]

Here is the team with the core players I listed in the OP:

B: Wilkie, Howard, ???
HB: Clark, Battle, Sinclair
C: Hill, Steele, NWM
HF: Billings, ???, Windhager
F: Higgins, King, Membrey
R: Marshall, Owens, Gresham
Int: Long, McKenzie, ???, ???

I've got those players on the interchange as, IMO, you need one back, one forward and two mids (inducing ruck) interchanging on the bench at any one time. Long and McKenzie can both play forward or back.

We still need a tall back (although we are already sort of tallish back there).
We need another tall forward/ruckman (maybe Hayes but, I think too early to call)
And of course we need some good onballers - better than what we have now.

I think I've probably still got too many in the core group but if most of those players have good games then maybe we aren't that far off.

[cwrcyn]

Well. We've already lost five plawys in Geary, Ryder, Hannebery, Kent, and Joyce.

The likelihood of losing Hill looks quite high and Bytel may be off the those scumbags at Tullamarine. Why he would choose those sh#tbags is beyond me.

That's 7 players and yet I see a few people are open to moving on half a dozen more who are actually decent players, some who've had solid years

We have picks 10, 28, 46, and 64

We may get lucky and get a second rounder for Hill (north?)if he moves on. For Bytel, I can guarantee that the drug cheats would only offer a 4th rounder at best

That would give us something like 10, 20, 28, 46, 60, 64

My guess is that we won't go trading out any more senior players

[Life Long Saint]

I am not convinced on the likelihood of losing Hill for a whole host of reasons.
He still has multiple years to run on a contract. Someone, without proof, has suggested he could go to North to be with Clarko. North have picks 1, 55, 63, 73. They won't part with pick 1. And 55 won't get it done.
So they need to find more picks from somewhere else. I'm not sure how they do that without getting futures involved.
If we're looking for players, then unless it's a quality player, then I'm not sure a fringe player from a team as bad as North is worth a spot on our list.
If you're a quality player at North, you'd want to be there with the arrival of Clarko.

If we're into Nic Bryan from Essendon, then maybe a deal can be worked out for Bytel. With the addition of Windhager and Owens into the midfield, Bytel may be one we could let go.

Can't understand the mentality to trade Gresham. His first half of 2022 was more than handy. Makes no sense to trade him for an unknown quantity.

[desertsaint]

Must keep -
Howard, Wilkie, Sinclair
Marshall, Steele, Crouch
King
That's it. Plus the:
'looking likely atm' group.
NWN, Windhager, Owen, Sharman
'Keep another year' group.
Hayes, Wood, Clark, Ross, Coffield, Long, Battle, Paton, McKenzie, Membrey (leadership).
The rest - tradeable.

[Saintmike65]

Well. We've already lost five plawys in Geary, Ryder, Hannebery, Kent, and Joyce.

The likelihood of losing Hill looks quite high and Bytel may be off the those scumbags at Tullamarine. Why he would choose those sh#tbags is beyond me.

That's 7 players and yet I see a few people are open to moving on half a dozen more who are actually decent players, some who've had solid years

We have picks 10, 28, 46, and 64

We may get lucky and get a second rounder for Hill (north?)if he moves on. For Bytel, I can guarantee that the drug cheats would only offer a 4th rounder at best

That would give us something like 10, 20, 28, 46, 60, 64

My guess is that we won't go trading out any more senior players

My guess is Bytel will leave for greater opportunities but may not get that at Essendon…a player swap between he and Bryan may be fair!

[SaintPav]

I hope they hold out against the drug cheats and make them pay much more than they want.

[Banger9798]

Interesting calls Jack, my thoughts on your list as follows:

Working down the list in number order, the players I think could form the core of our next premiership (a few like Hill, Billings, Long and Higgins may be lucky to be on the list but I think they're good players):

Gresham - cherry ripe to trade, one of the very few on the list that would attract strong interest, lacks impact, pace, not in my my top 12
NWM
Hill
Steele
Clark
King
Billings - not in my best 22 but has 3 years left on his contract and is unlikely on any other team's wish list, might come good but doubt it!
Windhager
Marshall
Howard
Long
Higgins
Owens
Battle
Membrey
Sinclair
McKenzie
Wilkie

Too early to call:
Heath
Sharman
Peris
Kyle - has already retired
Hayes

Remaining players can be traded if they have any value:
Coffield - he reminds me of former players Russell Green and Joel Smith who St Kilda traded out and went on to great careers elsewhere, must keep, best yet
to come
Jones - had a disrupted season, one of the few impact mids when he's on fire, move to first list.
Crouch - likely to finish in top 5 for the Barker, move to first list.
Ross
Byrnes
Butler - unless they can bring in a better goal sneak, and I doubt they're looking, I'd have him on your first list.
Bytel - too early to call
Adams - ditto
Webster
Allison
Lienert - a very good depth player, plays multiple roles.
Wood - definitely deserves to stay, like Lienert, plays multiple roles very well.
Paton - elevate to first list, best yet to come
Highmore
Connelly - Connolly is also too early to call, was not given an opportunity this year, showed promise in 7 games he played in 2021.

What do you think?

I think I agree with the lot, your comparison of Coffield to an early Joel Smith is interesting, definitely want to keep Coff and see how he develops.

I also don't get the Trade Gresham brigade...keep him and develop him, he is a little ripper when he is up and about

[Yorkeys]

Easier to nominate non core?
Hill
Butler
Webster
Higgins
Byrnes
?

[Vortex]

Easier to nominate non core?
Hill
Butler
Webster
Higgins
Byrnes
?

Are you crazy! Question Mark is clearly in the core group.