Montagna on Saints

[samoht]

The team is what it recruits.

This is it in a nutshell.

It all gets back to recruiting.

[Annoyedsaint]

A decade of mediocrity and the club is still in denial.

Went in a completely different direction to become a so called Community Club and went away from throwing everything at winning and the process that actually requires.

Now maybe people will wake up when it’s another 5 years of trash on field.

Or in real terms, anyone born in 2011 will have basically finished high school and not seen St Kilda play in a final live. It’s fkn pathetic.

Real great for sustained membership growth and sponsor support. But…..we have a Wellness Centre, so it’s all good.

[Teflon]

Some anonymous bloke on BF says we lost the game because King couldn't kick a goal after his teammates worked their arses off to get him a shot within 15m directly in front, not once but 5 times. Says he's not good at maths but he calculated King only needed to convert 3 of the gifts handed to him on a platter and we win and remain in finals race.

This bloke over at BF really understands footy if you ask me.

Is he the same bloke on Saturday thought trading King was reasonable?
Starts with V?

[Teflon]

The team is what it recruits.

This is it in a nutshell.

It all gets back to recruiting.

EVERYONE knows you must recruit well
That’s not the sole ingredient- if it were GWS would have 5 flags by now
It’s what you also do with that talent
Right now at our club we have zero systems in place re game plan
Are bottom 2 AFL last 7-8 games
Not great advertisement to come here

[skeptic]

The team is what it recruits.

This is it in a nutshell.

It all gets back to recruiting.

EVERYONE knows you must recruit well
That’s not the sole ingredient- if it were GWS would have 5 flags by now
It’s what you also do with that talent
Right now at our club we have zero systems in place re game plan
Are bottom 2 AFL last 7-8 games
Not great advertisement to come here

Agreed wholeheartedly

Boggles my mind that some ppl just think that we recruit wrong pick after pick, trade after trade inexplicably getting it wrong each and every time

[Teflon]

The team is what it recruits.

This is it in a nutshell.

It all gets back to recruiting.

EVERYONE knows you must recruit well
That’s not the sole ingredient- if it were GWS would have 5 flags by now
It’s what you also do with that talent
Right now at our club we have zero systems in place re game plan
Are bottom 2 AFL last 7-8 games
Not great advertisement to come here

Agreed wholeheartedly

Boggles my mind that some ppl just think that we recruit wrong pick after pick, trade after trade inexplicably getting it wrong each and every time

Yep
There are many too “shock horror!” that suggest this list is better than losing last 7-8 and sliding to bottom 2 in key stats
Go figure
The way some people write up the list you’d think North have us covered …yet the clubs saying “windows open!”
Funny stuff if it wasn’t true

[shanegrambeau]

Do you feel that it is legit to compare Essendon to St Kilda at this juncture?

Essendon had a patchy season and a shocking loss. What do they do? Heads roll.

St Kilda had a patchy season including a shocking loss to Essendon. What do they do? Re-sign Ratts for two years.

[Yorkeys]

Do you feel that it is legit to compare Essendon to St Kilda at this juncture?

Essendon had a patchy season and a shocking loss. What do they do? Heads roll.

St Kilda had a patchy season including a shocking loss to Essendon. What do they do? Re-sign Ratts for two years.

We had some horrible lows in 22. For me the worst were the Bulldogs and Essendon capitulations. For us business as usual?

[Teflon]

Do you feel that it is legit to compare Essendon to St Kilda at this juncture?

Essendon had a patchy season and a shocking loss. What do they do? Heads roll.

St Kilda had a patchy season including a shocking loss to Essendon. What do they do? Re-sign Ratts for two years.

Essendon have been crap for 20 years
They still have 16 flags
What it says to me is they’re not scared of - media or AFL to pull the trigger.
As bad as they’ve been they won’t re-sign Rutten just because they had a deal done earlier in the season
We simply don’t demand success
6th 10th 10th
No man’s land
Our no 1 goal kicking talent in 3 years (with a supposed genius biomechanics expert on board) has serious goal kicking problems ….he’s not improved
So we re-sign the head coach for 2 more years?? WTF
I’d argue as bad as Essendon are/have been there youth is deeper and better than ours and with a Clarkson at the helm to instil genuine standards they’ll overtake us
I read somewhere recently how “awful” our footy style live is to watch
I have to agree
Yes Hawks have copped belting’s this year but you can see what they are trying to do - take the game on
Us?
Short kick to pocket from D50
Long kick down the line (hope for an out of bounce)
IF by miracle we win that contest….Long bomb to King
Mostly opposition win it back from centre wing , pick through our zone i to a very open forward line to score
That and my other buh bear - 3 saints players charge the opposition player to tackle, all fall to ground, oppo has given off handball to outside runner waiting to take off…ball gone
It’s Auskick type footy
We’ve got 2 more years of it and the best they can do???
McGlynn moves on…
Lade in charge of forwards 3 years ….WTF??
Rath strategy genius??? WTF
Gotta give Bombers credit they’ll have a go

[Vortex]

Some anonymous bloke on BF says we lost the game because King couldn't kick a goal after his teammates worked their arses off to get him a shot within 15m directly in front, not once but 5 times. Says he's not good at maths but he calculated King only needed to convert 3 of the gifts handed to him on a platter and we win and remain in finals race.

This bloke over at BF really understands footy if you ask me.

Does BF ever quote Saintsational as an authoritative source?

Absolutely, Bazza quotes all of my posts over at BF to keep their board informed and educated.

[The G Train Legacy]

We cannot afford to rebuild

We’d be like Hawthorn or North Melbourne for 3 years

Then maybe 3 years climbing

And what guarantees that we would even climb

It would be our death knell

I read a post here a little while ago that said we had turned over 23 players since the end of 2019. Is that the case? If that is the number or close to it, then I would say by definition, we've been rebuilding for 3 years. Its looking like we are going to continue that pattern this year.

[Scollop]

We cannot afford to rebuild

We’d be like Hawthorn or North Melbourne for 3 years

Then maybe 3 years climbing

And what guarantees that we would even climb

It would be our death knell

I read a post here a little while ago that said we had turned over 23 players since the end of 2019. Is that the case? If that is the number or close to it, then I would say by definition, we've been rebuilding for 3 years. Its looking like we are going to continue that pattern this year.

That’s a really good point. You can do a pretend rebuild ( Saints post Richardson) and you can paper over the cracks like we have and be a middle of the road team for many years. It’s just that doing a proper rebuild has always been seen as potentially going to the bottom of the ladder and staying there for a few years

North Melbourne aren’t dying as a club because they are bottom of the ladder for a while. Clarkson is nearly over the line so you can’t say it’s been their ‘death knell’

We get all these club apologists who tells us the football department and list managers chose the right strategy with recruiting recycled players like Hannebery, Hill, Howard, Jones, Higgins and also in late 2020 with the disastrous calls on Abbott, Frawley and McKernon

For the longer term survival of our football club we’d be better off doing a fair dinkum rebuild which involves getting top ten draft picks for the next 3 years. I think we are making good inroads in these areas and I think Ratts and Batchelor and co. are the people to lead us and continue to improve our footy department and our development of players.

If the club secures a couple of good senior players and we still don’t make finals in 2023…then I think people will finally come to realise that you can’t take shortcuts to try and win a flag

[The Fireman]

I don’t know where the required improvement will come from for a successful 2023
Considering the coaching staff we have ………I just don’t have any confidence in them

I have bad vibes for next year. I wish I didn’t

[B.M]

In my view

A rebuild is when you go primarily to the draft and bring in a number of kids to shape the list and build a core from the ground

We added to the list with mature trades in 2018-2020

That is restumping imo

We didn’t get rid of any core player or hit the draft hard

Not sure we can?!

[Impatient Sainter]

I think we will do both, look to trade out Hill and another player eg Billings. Then bring in Free Agent/s (De Goey & Amos) and take a hand full of early picks to the draft.

It looks like Ryder will retire, so we will need another ruckman from somewhere. I mentioned Bill Frampton in another thread, he would fit the bill.

[bangaulegend]

I think we will do both, look to trade out Hill and another player eg Billings. Then bring in Free Agent/s (De Goey & Amos) and take a hand full of early picks to the draft.

It looks like Ryder will retire, so we will need another ruckman from somewhere. I mentioned Bill Frampton in another thread, he would fit the bill.

Apparently Collingwood are into Frampton as well.

[st.byron]

Do you feel that it is legit to compare Essendon to St Kilda at this juncture?

Essendon had a patchy season and a shocking loss. What do they do? Heads roll.

St Kilda had a patchy season including a shocking loss to Essendon. What do they do? Re-sign Ratts for two years.

Essendon have been crap for 20 years
They still have 16 flags
What it says to me is they’re not scared of - media or AFL to pull the trigger.
As bad as they’ve been they won’t re-sign Rutten just because they had a deal done earlier in the season
We simply don’t demand success
6th 10th 10th
No man’s land
Our no 1 goal kicking talent in 3 years (with a supposed genius biomechanics expert on board) has serious goal kicking problems ….he’s not improved
So we re-sign the head coach for 2 more years?? WTF
I’d argue as bad as Essendon are/have been there youth is deeper and better than ours and with a Clarkson at the helm to instil genuine standards they’ll overtake us
I read somewhere recently how “awful” our footy style live is to watch
I have to agree
Yes Hawks have copped belting’s this year but you can see what they are trying to do - take the game on
Us?
Short kick to pocket from D50
Long kick down the line (hope for an out of bounce)
IF by miracle we win that contest….Long bomb to King
Mostly opposition win it back from centre wing , pick through our zone i to a very open forward line to score
That and my other buh bear - 3 saints players charge the opposition player to tackle, all fall to ground, oppo has given off handball to outside runner waiting to take off…ball gone
It’s Auskick type footy
We’ve got 2 more years of it and the best they can do???
McGlynn moves on…
Lade in charge of forwards 3 years ….WTF??
Rath strategy genius??? WTF
Gotta give Bombers credit they’ll have a go

Yes indeed to all of that. Club is a mediocre burger.

[st.byron]

We cannot afford to rebuild

We’d be like Hawthorn or North Melbourne for 3 years

Then maybe 3 years climbing

And what guarantees that we would even climb

It would be our death knell

I read a post here a little while ago that said we had turned over 23 players since the end of 2019. Is that the case? If that is the number or close to it, then I would say by definition, we've been rebuilding for 3 years. Its looking like we are going to continue that pattern this year.

That’s a really good point. You can do a pretend rebuild ( Saints post Richardson) and you can paper over the cracks like we have and be a middle of the road team for many years. It’s just that doing a proper rebuild has always been seen as potentially going to the bottom of the ladder and staying there for a few years

North Melbourne aren’t dying as a club because they are bottom of the ladder for a while. Clarkson is nearly over the line so you can’t say it’s been their ‘death knell’

We get all these club apologists who tells us the football department and list managers chose the right strategy with recruiting recycled players like Hannebery, Hill, Howard, Jones, Higgins and also in late 2020 with the disastrous calls on Abbott, Frawley and McKernon

For the longer term survival of our football club we’d be better off doing a fair dinkum rebuild which involves getting top ten draft picks for the next 3 years. I think we are making good inroads in these areas and I think Ratts and Batchelor and co. are the people to lead us and continue to improve our footy department and our development of players.

If the club secures a couple of good senior players and we still don’t make finals in 2023…then I think people will finally come to realise that you can’t take shortcuts to try and win a flag

Totally baffled why anyone still thinks Ratten is the best option for head coach.

[Vortex]

We cannot afford to rebuild

We’d be like Hawthorn or North Melbourne for 3 years

Then maybe 3 years climbing

And what guarantees that we would even climb

It would be our death knell

I read a post here a little while ago that said we had turned over 23 players since the end of 2019. Is that the case? If that is the number or close to it, then I would say by definition, we've been rebuilding for 3 years. Its looking like we are going to continue that pattern this year.

That’s a really good point. You can do a pretend rebuild ( Saints post Richardson) and you can paper over the cracks like we have and be a middle of the road team for many years. It’s just that doing a proper rebuild has always been seen as potentially going to the bottom of the ladder and staying there for a few years

North Melbourne aren’t dying as a club because they are bottom of the ladder for a while. Clarkson is nearly over the line so you can’t say it’s been their ‘death knell’

We get all these club apologists who tells us the football department and list managers chose the right strategy with recruiting recycled players like Hannebery, Hill, Howard, Jones, Higgins and also in late 2020 with the disastrous calls on Abbott, Frawley and McKernon

For the longer term survival of our football club we’d be better off doing a fair dinkum rebuild which involves getting top ten draft picks for the next 3 years. I think we are making good inroads in these areas and I think Ratts and Batchelor and co. are the people to lead us and continue to improve our footy department and our development of players.

If the club secures a couple of good senior players and we still don’t make finals in 2023…then I think people will finally come to realise that you can’t take shortcuts to try and win a flag

Totally baffled why anyone still thinks Ratten is the best option for head coach.

Funny I don't remember you being ahead of the curve when we were 8 and 3. A bit of the Harry Hindsights going on.

[Wayne42]

Do you feel that it is legit to compare Essendon to St Kilda at this juncture?

Essendon had a patchy season and a shocking loss. What do they do? Heads roll.

St Kilda had a patchy season including a shocking loss to Essendon. What do they do? Re-sign Ratts for two years.

Essendon have been crap for 20 years
They still have 16 flags
What it says to me is they’re not scared of - media or AFL to pull the trigger.
As bad as they’ve been they won’t re-sign Rutten just because they had a deal done earlier in the season
We simply don’t demand success
6th 10th 10th
No man’s land
Our no 1 goal kicking talent in 3 years (with a supposed genius biomechanics expert on board) has serious goal kicking problems ….he’s not improved
So we re-sign the head coach for 2 more years?? WTF
I’d argue as bad as Essendon are/have been there youth is deeper and better than ours and with a Clarkson at the helm to instil genuine standards they’ll overtake us
I read somewhere recently how “awful” our footy style live is to watch
I have to agree
Yes Hawks have copped belting’s this year but you can see what they are trying to do - take the game on
Us?
Short kick to pocket from D50
Long kick down the line (hope for an out of bounce)
IF by miracle we win that contest….Long bomb to King
Mostly opposition win it back from centre wing , pick through our zone i to a very open forward line to score
That and my other buh bear - 3 saints players charge the opposition player to tackle, all fall to ground, oppo has given off handball to outside runner waiting to take off…ball gone
It’s Auskick type footy
We’ve got 2 more years of it and the best they can do???
McGlynn moves on…
Lade in charge of forwards 3 years ….WTF??
Rath strategy genius??? WTF
Gotta give Bombers credit they’ll have a go

Once they get their imploding house in order Essendon will overtake us because they have a better list, although it's a list that has some deficiencies.
I hope they sack Rutten or he resigns after the weekends matches and then Clarkson tells them he is going to North.

[skeptic]

We cannot afford to rebuild

We’d be like Hawthorn or North Melbourne for 3 years

Then maybe 3 years climbing

And what guarantees that we would even climb

It would be our death knell

I read a post here a little while ago that said we had turned over 23 players since the end of 2019. Is that the case? If that is the number or close to it, then I would say by definition, we've been rebuilding for 3 years. Its looking like we are going to continue that pattern this year.

That’s a really good point. You can do a pretend rebuild ( Saints post Richardson) and you can paper over the cracks like we have and be a middle of the road team for many years. It’s just that doing a proper rebuild has always been seen as potentially going to the bottom of the ladder and staying there for a few years

North Melbourne aren’t dying as a club because they are bottom of the ladder for a while. Clarkson is nearly over the line so you can’t say it’s been their ‘death knell’

We get all these club apologists who tells us the football department and list managers chose the right strategy with recruiting recycled players like Hannebery, Hill, Howard, Jones, Higgins and also in late 2020 with the disastrous calls on Abbott, Frawley and McKernon

For the longer term survival of our football club we’d be better off doing a fair dinkum rebuild which involves getting top ten draft picks for the next 3 years. I think we are making good inroads in these areas and I think Ratts and Batchelor and co. are the people to lead us and continue to improve our footy department and our development of players.

If the club secures a couple of good senior players and we still don’t make finals in 2023…then I think people will finally come to realise that you can’t take shortcuts to try and win a flag

Totally baffled why anyone still thinks Ratten is the best option for head coach.

Funny I don't remember you being ahead of the curve when we were 8 and 3. A bit of the Harry Hindsights going on.

Honestly...

I think your off point here. St. B, may have been quieter then but I think he’s been pretty vocal about his concerns with Ratten almost since the outset and certainly with regularity since 2021.

[Brunswicksainter]

We cannot afford to rebuild

We’d be like Hawthorn or North Melbourne for 3 years

Then maybe 3 years climbing

And what guarantees that we would even climb

It would be our death knell

100% agree. Particularly with the tassie discussion going on. Imagine if we were in a similar position to north, there would be serious calls for us to be relocated. There is a material chance a full scale rebuild could sink the club forever.

[Brunswicksainter]

We cannot afford to rebuild

We’d be like Hawthorn or North Melbourne for 3 years

Then maybe 3 years climbing

And what guarantees that we would even climb

It would be our death knell

I read a post here a little while ago that said we had turned over 23 players since the end of 2019. Is that the case? If that is the number or close to it, then I would say by definition, we've been rebuilding for 3 years. Its looking like we are going to continue that pattern this year.

That’s a really good point. You can do a pretend rebuild ( Saints post Richardson) and you can paper over the cracks like we have and be a middle of the road team for many years. It’s just that doing a proper rebuild has always been seen as potentially going to the bottom of the ladder and staying there for a few years

North Melbourne aren’t dying as a club because they are bottom of the ladder for a while. Clarkson is nearly over the line so you can’t say it’s been their ‘death knell’

We get all these club apologists who tells us the football department and list managers chose the right strategy with recruiting recycled players like Hannebery, Hill, Howard, Jones, Higgins and also in late 2020 with the disastrous calls on Abbott, Frawley and McKernon

For the longer term survival of our football club we’d be better off doing a fair dinkum rebuild which involves getting top ten draft picks for the next 3 years. I think we are making good inroads in these areas and I think Ratts and Batchelor and co. are the people to lead us and continue to improve our footy department and our development of players.

If the club secures a couple of good senior players and we still don’t make finals in 2023…then I think people will finally come to realise that you can’t take shortcuts to try and win a flag

“ North Melbourne aren’t dying as a club because they are bottom of the ladder for a while. Clarkson is nearly over the line so you can’t say it’s been their ‘death knell“

Every indication would suggest this Clarkson move is there last chance to survive as a club. If this fails there done… relocated or folded with 100% certainty. We cannot afford to put ourselves in that position and clear house like north did at the end of 2016. That list management decision could single Handedly ruin 153 years of history for them.

[Scollop]

We cannot afford to rebuild

We’d be like Hawthorn or North Melbourne for 3 years

Then maybe 3 years climbing

And what guarantees that we would even climb

It would be our death knell

I read a post here a little while ago that said we had turned over 23 players since the end of 2019. Is that the case? If that is the number or close to it, then I would say by definition, we've been rebuilding for 3 years. Its looking like we are going to continue that pattern this year.

That’s a really good point. You can do a pretend rebuild ( Saints post Richardson) and you can paper over the cracks like we have and be a middle of the road team for many years. It’s just that doing a proper rebuild has always been seen as potentially going to the bottom of the ladder and staying there for a few years

North Melbourne aren’t dying as a club because they are bottom of the ladder for a while. Clarkson is nearly over the line so you can’t say it’s been their ‘death knell’

We get all these club apologists who tells us the football department and list managers chose the right strategy with recruiting recycled players like Hannebery, Hill, Howard, Jones, Higgins and also in late 2020 with the disastrous calls on Abbott, Frawley and McKernon

For the longer term survival of our football club we’d be better off doing a fair dinkum rebuild which involves getting top ten draft picks for the next 3 years. I think we are making good inroads in these areas and I think Ratts and Batchelor and co. are the people to lead us and continue to improve our footy department and our development of players.

If the club secures a couple of good senior players and we still don’t make finals in 2023…then I think people will finally come to realise that you can’t take shortcuts to try and win a flag

“ North Melbourne aren’t dying as a club because they are bottom of the ladder for a while. Clarkson is nearly over the line so you can’t say it’s been their ‘death knell“

Every indication would suggest this Clarkson move is there last chance to survive as a club. If this fails there done… relocated or folded with 100% certainty. We cannot afford to put ourselves in that position and clear house like north did at the end of 2016. That list management decision could single Handedly ruin 153 years of history for them.

So the people spending $Billions on media broadcast rights didn’t sign contracts with the AFL and North will fold if they can’t get Clarko… Yeah sure

https://www.smh.com.au/business/compani ... 5b5st.html

https://www.channelnews.com.au/afl-righ ... oadcaster/

[Vortex]

We cannot afford to rebuild

We’d be like Hawthorn or North Melbourne for 3 years

Then maybe 3 years climbing

And what guarantees that we would even climb

It would be our death knell

I read a post here a little while ago that said we had turned over 23 players since the end of 2019. Is that the case? If that is the number or close to it, then I would say by definition, we've been rebuilding for 3 years. Its looking like we are going to continue that pattern this year.

That’s a really good point. You can do a pretend rebuild ( Saints post Richardson) and you can paper over the cracks like we have and be a middle of the road team for many years. It’s just that doing a proper rebuild has always been seen as potentially going to the bottom of the ladder and staying there for a few years

North Melbourne aren’t dying as a club because they are bottom of the ladder for a while. Clarkson is nearly over the line so you can’t say it’s been their ‘death knell’

We get all these club apologists who tells us the football department and list managers chose the right strategy with recruiting recycled players like Hannebery, Hill, Howard, Jones, Higgins and also in late 2020 with the disastrous calls on Abbott, Frawley and McKernon

For the longer term survival of our football club we’d be better off doing a fair dinkum rebuild which involves getting top ten draft picks for the next 3 years. I think we are making good inroads in these areas and I think Ratts and Batchelor and co. are the people to lead us and continue to improve our footy department and our development of players.

If the club secures a couple of good senior players and we still don’t make finals in 2023…then I think people will finally come to realise that you can’t take shortcuts to try and win a flag

Totally baffled why anyone still thinks Ratten is the best option for head coach.

Funny I don't remember you being ahead of the curve when we were 8 and 3. A bit of the Harry Hindsights going on.

Honestly...

I think your off point here. St. B, may have been quieter then but I think he’s been pretty vocal about his concerns with Ratten almost since the outset and certainly with regularity since 2021.

Illustrates the point beautifully. How does that saying go about a broken clock. It would be like saying even Teffers had concerns.

I have concerns about our next coach failing, there's a big chance I'll be right.

Very easy to predict failure, any moron can do it. Predicting success is where the real skills are at.

And the idiots are easy to spot, they are the ones claiming we should of known at 8 and 3 that Ratts should have been sacked and replaced with Clarko.

So I'm curious who would your choice have been to replace Ratts and would that fix our list issues?