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Scollop wrote: ↑Fri 01 Apr 2022 3:53pm
Not sure if it was 2 consecutive 6 day breaks or the Buddy Hangover, but they didn’t turn up last night…nearly pinched it in the end
I went with a Swans supporter last night. The one thing I noticed with both teams is the lack of long bombs into forward 50. Sure, there were a few but it was something they avoided, rather than what we dish up most of the time.
Yes, I saw some of the game on my AFL app.
Wow, I thought. Even though it was low scoring in terms of goals, I was really impressed by both sides and their movement. Compared to the Freo game! Light and Day. But at Freo it was windy?
I think the Swans’s success is because of The Swanettes in the 80s.
evertonfc wrote: ↑Tue 29 Mar 2022 5:20pm
They have a remarkable culture, one that is increasingly perpetual, and engrained in the fabric of the club.
They're either in contention to win flags or putting maximum development into players capable of winning flags.
They're the benchmark for consistency. They put all the framework in place to develop players and work harder than anyone else to create a team-first ethic - even when they've got one of the all-timers on their list, you can tell he can't get enough of the Swans' culture.
Speaks volumes. Amazing club.
I'm not trying to be rude but that is rubbish. Sydney have an Academy and because of that they get a top 10 pick nearly every year (regardless of whether they finish first or last), and all they have to do is put junk picks together to achieve this. If St Kilda had this little leg up then we would be just as consistent as them!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
St Kilda should never trade with Essendon and Sydney ever again!!!
evertonfc wrote: ↑Tue 29 Mar 2022 5:20pm
They have a remarkable culture, one that is increasingly perpetual, and engrained in the fabric of the club.
They're either in contention to win flags or putting maximum development into players capable of winning flags.
They're the benchmark for consistency. They put all the framework in place to develop players and work harder than anyone else to create a team-first ethic - even when they've got one of the all-timers on their list, you can tell he can't get enough of the Swans' culture.
Speaks volumes. Amazing club.
I'm not trying to be rude but that is rubbish. Sydney have an Academy and because of that they get a top 10 pick nearly every year (regardless of whether they finish first or last), and all they have to do is put junk picks together to achieve this. If St Kilda had this little leg up then we would be just as consistent as them!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Maybe in Heeney's year, when he was taken at pick 18 other clubs couldn't select him because he was a Swans Academy player.
What is the AFL draft value index and bidding system?
After Sydney snared gun academy prospect Isaac Heeney for Pick 18 in 2014, the AFL created the draft value index – a system that allocated a points value to the first 73 picks in the draft.
Pick 1 is worth 3000 points, while Pick 73 is worth nine points. Picks from 74 onwards are worth nothing.
It essentially means clubs that have existing links to draftees, either via their academy or father-son eligibility, must ‘pay’ to secure these players via multiple picks and give rival clubs the chance to bid on these players.
Last edited by Wayne42 on Fri 01 Apr 2022 8:20pm, edited 1 time in total.
The Saints are under review, will it make any difference to the underachievers ?
In case link doesn’t work - Garry Lyon and Tim Watson…ask why St Kilda and Essendon are on/off teams and Sydney are the benchmark of consistency.
Because their leaders in Parker, Kennedy, Franklin, Heeney & Rampe play consistently with passion and the kids just fall in line. We simply dont have that standard of leadership. Steele is a very good player but seldom does things that inspire the side, Jones is capable of lifting the team but is inconsistent. Membrey is a barometer up forward but taller marking opponents can shut down his influence. ATM Sinclair is probably our stand up guy that we can rely on in all situations.
Good point.
Guess I am trying to ferret out the coach or the players thing. Watson and Lyon says players.
We lack leaders.
I suppose Hill, Hannebery, Ross and Hannas were great hopes.
They are all for different reasons - some unfair or unlucky - just not leaders.
Ryder is often injured and has been absent, but as a senior citizen Ruckman, it’s hardly to be expected that he’ll be a role model for younger players.
Maybe Crouch can be the guy?
And all those players that have not come on - Bytel, Billings (didn’t realize he’s played so many games) and a few others, perhaps they are not getting gather right juice. ?
And there are some like Kent and Long, especially Long who might have that gangbusters mentality to inspire but haven’t or can’t deliver consistently.
Ah well, hopefully some leaders will emerge.
Hunter C ? What about him? He’s got the class.
Geary has obviously faded, but he wasn’t exactly Patrick Cripps in the first place…a sold citizen though.
The inconsistency of this side isn't good. The ability is there but the leadership isn't.
It's up to the coaching staff to encourage selfless acts which result in wins.
Players should never be playing for their spot in the side and equally they should never be rewarded by their kicking and handball stats.
We don't want players simply playing for stats and getting selected to play the next week.
IMO the coaching staff should be encouraging the 1%ers.
I once spent a year in Adelaide, I think it was on a Sunday.
Care to list our unavailable players commencing from the Final against Richmond in 2020?
Remember also we recruited from State leagues to address on a temporary basis the demographic flaw in our List
This was to address experience depth on our List
Whilst we now have youth with some exposure we still have a depth issue - and aligned to the continuing injury list this has seen and sees inconsistency
How many players on our List have exceeded 100 games?
shanegrambeau wrote: ↑Sat 02 Apr 2022 1:38pm
I don’t believe the academy that Sydney have is a good excuse for their consistency.
We’ve seen Gold Coast and GWS with loads of help, and they can’t make a go of it like Sydney.
I think it is coaching culture too. Remember Ross Lyon was also part of that too, and I think St Kilda benefited for it.
Perhaps the leadership thing is also a factor of coaching stability?
And Sydney itself?
GWS are a model of consistency - make the finals every year - including prelims most years and did make a grand final.
Consistently competitive in the second-6th positions. If they get a lot of injuries they fall away a bit, but otherwise they are consistent.
Gold Coast Suns have been disappointing, I agree with you there. They are emulating our first decade in the old VFL.
shanegrambeau wrote: ↑Sat 02 Apr 2022 1:38pm
I don’t believe the academy that Sydney have is a good excuse for their consistency.
We’ve seen Gold Coast and GWS with loads of help, and they can’t make a go of it like Sydney.
I think it is coaching culture too. Remember Ross Lyon was also part of that too, and I think St Kilda benefited for it.
Perhaps the leadership thing is also a factor of coaching stability?
And Sydney itself?
I vehemently disagree with the above. I too would love the following.....
Access to 2 top 10 draft picks most years. The first being our own and the second one where we cobble together 3 or 4 late junk picks.
Let's say for example Sydney win the premiership this year. For this scenario I am ignoring all Father son picks to make the example easier to follow. In the draft Sydney would have pick 18. Let's assume their Academy produces a gun full forward who is a perfect replacement for Buddy. Everyone agrees that if he wasn't an academy prospect he would go around pick 10 in the draft. Pick 10 is worth 1395 points. All they would need to do is trade out a couple of good aging players to bring in a couple of late 2nd round picks, plonk them together with their own 2nd round pick and suddenly they can draft a top 10 player. And this is in a year when they win a premiership. When they don't win a premiership it would be even easier for them as they would have more points of their own to play with.
You say that Gold Coast and GWS haven't made a go of their Academy. That may be the case so far but once they get it right and it starts bearing fruit, along with Brisbane, all 4 Academy clubs will consistently outperform all other clubs. They have to when the odds are stacked in their favour.
People need to open their eyes and see what the AFL have done. I admit, they have saved our club from going under but at the same time we are like a zombie club. We don't have any marque games. We are not a big club so we are rarely able to secure good Free Agents. There are a lot of unfair advantages conspiring against us.
St Kilda should never trade with Essendon and Sydney ever again!!!
the playing field hasn't been level for over 100 yrs...back in the day if you had the money you could buy flags...then the cap came out..some clubs rorted it , mainly the clubs that historically had the advantage of the cash.
now we have academy's and preferential drafts to start up clubs whilst disadvantaging the incumbents.
Sydney has had a dream run handed to it over the years by the afl... The AFL pulled out all stops to have it succeed in NSW up against the NRL.
shanegrambeau wrote: ↑Sat 02 Apr 2022 1:38pm
I don’t believe the academy that Sydney have is a good excuse for their consistency.
We’ve seen Gold Coast and GWS with loads of help, and they can’t make a go of it like Sydney.
I think it is coaching culture too. Remember Ross Lyon was also part of that too, and I think St Kilda benefited for it.
Perhaps the leadership thing is also a factor of coaching stability?
And Sydney itself?
I vehemently disagree with the above. I too would love the following.....
Access to 2 top 10 draft picks most years. The first being our own and the second one where we cobble together 3 or 4 late junk picks.
Let's say for example Sydney win the premiership this year. For this scenario I am ignoring all Father son picks to make the example easier to follow. In the draft Sydney would have pick 18. Let's assume their Academy produces a gun full forward who is a perfect replacement for Buddy. Everyone agrees that if he wasn't an academy prospect he would go around pick 10 in the draft. Pick 10 is worth 1395 points. All they would need to do is trade out a couple of good aging players to bring in a couple of late 2nd round picks, plonk them together with their own 2nd round pick and suddenly they can draft a top 10 player. And this is in a year when they win a premiership. When they don't win a premiership it would be even easier for them as they would have more points of their own to play with.
You say that Gold Coast and GWS haven't made a go of their Academy. That may be the case so far but once they get it right and it starts bearing fruit, along with Brisbane, all 4 Academy clubs will consistently outperform all other clubs. They have to when the odds are stacked in their favour.
People need to open their eyes and see what the AFL have done. I admit, they have saved our club from going under but at the same time we are like a zombie club. We don't have any marque games. We are not a big club so we are rarely able to secure good Free Agents. There are a lot of unfair advantages conspiring against us.
before you get your marching orders ... I have to agree with that.
Successful teams in NSW and Queensland make the TV rights for AFL much more valuable. And that means more $$$ to keep clubs like ours afloat.
It’s certainly not ideal, but it’s always been the smart call for the AFL leadership. And I reckon that the combined effect of the draft, the salary cap, the introduction of SA and WA teams and the concessions to the teams from the rugby states has been less detrimental to us than to some of our Victorian rivals (eg, Carlton).
"It is useless to attempt to reason a man out of a thing he was never reasoned into."
- Jonathan Swift
shanegrambeau wrote: ↑Sat 02 Apr 2022 1:38pm
I don’t believe the academy that Sydney have is a good excuse for their consistency.
We’ve seen Gold Coast and GWS with loads of help, and they can’t make a go of it like Sydney.
I think it is coaching culture too. Remember Ross Lyon was also part of that too, and I think St Kilda benefited for it.
Perhaps the leadership thing is also a factor of coaching stability?
And Sydney itself?
I vehemently disagree with the above. I too would love the following.....
Access to 2 top 10 draft picks most years. The first being our own and the second one where we cobble together 3 or 4 late junk picks.
Let's say for example Sydney win the premiership this year. For this scenario I am ignoring all Father son picks to make the example easier to follow. In the draft Sydney would have pick 18. Let's assume their Academy produces a gun full forward who is a perfect replacement for Buddy. Everyone agrees that if he wasn't an academy prospect he would go around pick 10 in the draft. Pick 10 is worth 1395 points. All they would need to do is trade out a couple of good aging players to bring in a couple of late 2nd round picks, plonk them together with their own 2nd round pick and suddenly they can draft a top 10 player. And this is in a year when they win a premiership. When they don't win a premiership it would be even easier for them as they would have more points of their own to play with.
You say that Gold Coast and GWS haven't made a go of their Academy. That may be the case so far but once they get it right and it starts bearing fruit, along with Brisbane, all 4 Academy clubs will consistently outperform all other clubs. They have to when the odds are stacked in their favour.
People need to open their eyes and see what the AFL have done. I admit, they have saved our club from going under but at the same time we are like a zombie club. We don't have any marque games. We are not a big club so we are rarely able to secure good Free Agents. There are a lot of unfair advantages conspiring against us.
Did Eddie McGuire write that for you, that's straight out of his green eyed hymn book.
The Saints are under review, will it make any difference to the underachievers ?
shanegrambeau wrote: ↑Sat 02 Apr 2022 1:38pm
I don’t believe the academy that Sydney have is a good excuse for their consistency.
We’ve seen Gold Coast and GWS with loads of help, and they can’t make a go of it like Sydney.
I think it is coaching culture too. Remember Ross Lyon was also part of that too, and I think St Kilda benefited for it.
Perhaps the leadership thing is also a factor of coaching stability?
And Sydney itself?
I vehemently disagree with the above. I too would love the following.....
Access to 2 top 10 draft picks most years. The first being our own and the second one where we cobble together 3 or 4 late junk picks.
Let's say for example Sydney win the premiership this year. For this scenario I am ignoring all Father son picks to make the example easier to follow. In the draft Sydney would have pick 18. Let's assume their Academy produces a gun full forward who is a perfect replacement for Buddy. Everyone agrees that if he wasn't an academy prospect he would go around pick 10 in the draft. Pick 10 is worth 1395 points. All they would need to do is trade out a couple of good aging players to bring in a couple of late 2nd round picks, plonk them together with their own 2nd round pick and suddenly they can draft a top 10 player. And this is in a year when they win a premiership. When they don't win a premiership it would be even easier for them as they would have more points of their own to play with.
You say that Gold Coast and GWS haven't made a go of their Academy. That may be the case so far but once they get it right and it starts bearing fruit, along with Brisbane, all 4 Academy clubs will consistently outperform all other clubs. They have to when the odds are stacked in their favour.
People need to open their eyes and see what the AFL have done. I admit, they have saved our club from going under but at the same time we are like a zombie club. We don't have any marque games. We are not a big club so we are rarely able to secure good Free Agents. There are a lot of unfair advantages conspiring against us.
Did Eddie McGuire write that for you, that's straight out of his green eyed hymn book.
I don't agree with anything that McGuire says. He is only interested in Collingwood but tries to make out that he has the game's interests at heart.
St Kilda should never trade with Essendon and Sydney ever again!!!
