Grant Thomas

[Scollop]

And of course, they couldn't have possibly aimed to be contenders again in 2012/2013 because they had to drive an extra 10-15 km to get to work

Plus they were pining for their leader (Ross the Boss)

[saynta]

Anyways, can only ponder what might’ve been!!!

They were all in a trance

The messiah had spoken

If he said: 'It's the end of an era' then that is the only truth

His word shalt not be questioned or disobeyed

Unfortunately some of the players and leadership group were among the disciples

It's funny how their perception of reality was very different to what could have been, if they weren't so drunk on kool aid

So true.

[Teflon]

You’re suddenly telling us all your inside Lyons head pre 09 GF and you know what he was/wasn’t thinking ??


Do give us all next weeks Tatts numbers Nostradamus this’ll be fun

You should listen to your hero sometime. Ross has opened up about the doubts he had prior to Grand Finals at St Kilda. Have a listen ...early on in the first 2.20 minutes

https://www.dicksonfilms.com.au/the-challenge

Tossco wasn’t even confident of winning in 2010 ‘because Collingwood were so strong’!! He knew the Saints would ‘give super effort’ but ...here’s his doubts coming out ...he ‘wasn’t sure we’d get close based on form’ How’s that for inner belief and strength? It stands to reason that if he had doubts at his second GF he most probably had just as many in his first

Here's a man who has a team full of champions and stars of the game and they've gone back to back for a GF in 09 and a GF in 2010 and he's doubting whether they're good enough...or is he really saying "I doubted myself and my ability to get the job done." A great coach finds vulnerabilities in his opponent. Unfortunately supercoach Rossy usually just went with plan A

He had cause to have doubts. Remember this pearler from Ross after the GF in 09 when he'd ordered his boys to kick long to the talls on a wet track? ''Maybe we were a little bit bomby late...''

And regarding Nostradamus and the Tatts numbers...very witty Teffers...another original beauty right there

Here we go more psycho mumbo jumbo from SS own “the mentalist “ the basis of your argument is “it stands to reason...” is that it???
Seriously it gets stupider the more you type
You’re not supported by facts
You’re not supported by the playing group
But somehow you know what Ross’s fears were???
And for the record ...,Pies were the best side in 2010 ....Lyon wasn’t the only one who had doubts we could win ...most with half a brain had that as absolutely reasonable
And....”Tossco”???? and your bleating about originality ???
Up there with some of the lamest cr@p I’ve read on the site for a while...
But do tell us again how many people have reached out to get your love child “GT” a senior AFL coaching gig after he ripped off the club on the way out???? ...I’ll give you a hint
NONE.

[Teflon]

Raph Clarke. One of Rossy's "role players".

Scored by pundits as the WOG -- Worst on Ground -- in the 2009 GF.

As if anyone couldn't see it coming.

ANY defender would have been better. Gwilt. Hudghton. Even Maguire.

But you know what?

Every St kilda coach in my lifetime has made bewildering selection decisions.

Every one of them has pet players who inexplicably get a game.

Ratts has Kent, for one.

So I cut Ross some slack. And as I've said elsewhere, he's the only St Kilda coach in forty years who's been headhunted by other clubs.

Cut him some slack for being a novice - I’m ok with that but what irritated me from Lyon (* at the time) was the scapegoating of our players and trying to pretend that he as senior coach did everything right. He obviously didn’t when you look at the legacy of his time with us and the lost opportunity when we had a team that should have won in 2009

Did you look at the afltables link? What about Luke Ball only playing 46% game time?

What about Rossy thrashing the team to try and win the McLellan cup, meanwhile he’s got both ruckman cooked in the Grand Final and some of our players just couldn’t play at their best even before the finals started?

There was a lack of criticism from the so called experts and zero critical analysis in the media during his time with the Saints. This led to an unhealthy adulation from those within the club and far too many mistakes from Lyon which unfortunately proved very costly.

Once again, we all cut him slack when the team made a Grand Final the following year, but the effort and the results of getting there were not due to Rossy. They were due to the brilliance of the squad and the list that was assembled prior to Ross. The list that had players maturing in the 24-29 year old age bracket. History tells you that you assemble a squad and that should be when they hit their prime

Yeah, Rossy was very clever at deflecting the blame onto the players and looking outward rather than inward?

… ’looking outward rather than inward’

asiu; Do you like it? Does it qualify as a zen type a thing?


* Ross has admitted in interviews in recent years that he had made errors during his early years as senior coach at St Kilda

Ross thrashed the team to try to win the McLelland cup? Rubbish. Another Scollopism.

Anyway, in '71 what was did the messiah Jeans do in the last quarter to stop Keddie?

What on earth was Alves doing sending a runner out to ask Shanahan if he could handle Jarman in '97? What else could Shanahan say but "yeah". The coach should have made the move.

Supporters of all teams could raise similar issues with every single game played.

If a couple of kicks had been executed even reasonably, or with a normal bounce, Ross would have been worshipped as a premiership coach. Took a good side who had lost a few experienced players in Gehrig, Hamill, Peckett, Thompson etc, plugged some gaps with role players, developed a game plan and ethic which took the Saints all the way in one of our best periods in history. Never had that chance with GT - had the best side Saints ever assembled, developed an attacking game style which many doubted would take the team to the GF, .......and so it proved.

Ross is still very much respected as a coach, and as stated above, is the only St Kilda coach in forty years who's been headhunted by other clubs. GT ?????. Nope.

Great post

[Teflon]

…. a superb coaching effort with an ability to absolutely get the best out of a side in decline.

To suggest Lyon just “had a good list” is utter garbage

Without all the fancy adjectives and drama, let’s breakdown what you wrote

Lenny Hayes was the oldest of the core group, but he was an All Australian in 2010, so don’t think he was in decline. He won his third TB Medal in 2012. He came second in his last year which was 2014

Dal Santo was All Australian in 2011. He was one of the best mids in the game during his time with us and went on to play over 300 games. He only just turned 26 in 2010.

Goddard was 25 at the end of 2010 and also considered one of the best skilled and most versatile mids in his prime. An athlete with passion and heart and courage and ruthlessness ( we had a core group who had already played in prelims and these blokes were now seasoned finals campaigners). The leadership group could have coached themselves.

Nick Riewoldt was only 27/28. Sam Fisher same age as Roo. Milney was All Australian in 2011 and 2012.

We had half a dozen players who were All Australians, ranked highly amongst their peers, were durable and featured regularly in the top 5 players in our Best and Fairest counts. Most of our stars were at their peak in 2010…physically, but they needed someone to assist them to stay at their peak mentally

Obviously Ross couldn’t do that in 2011 and rather than motivate and inspire his troops, he dumped a truckload of bulldust on them and painted them all as washed up (and I’m not talking about his speech after the elimination final. He’d already scarred them and lost belief in them in April of 2011… the links https://www.smh.com.au/sport/st-kildas- ... 1d9j1.html
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2011-04-11/ ... ts/2621908 )

More dribble without substance

2011

Milne 31
Hayes 31
Gardiner 30
Baker 30
Blake 30
Roo 28
Kosi 28

The list hadn’t peaked yet you say??????
And all because “Ross scared them...they lost belief??”
You’re making up utter garbage and what’s scary is you believe it.....
This squad needed a re-build everyone knew they’d been up for some time and their best was behind them
Only a nimrod would be arguing otherwise ...

[Teflon]

And of course, they couldn't have possibly aimed to be contenders again in 2012/2013 because they had to drive an extra 10-15 km to get to work

Plus they were pining for their leader (Ross the Boss)

Maybe they all pined for your hero the grass skirt wearing “GT” the self appointed Rev Fred Nile of St Kilda
Your the psychologist ....why don’t you give us insight into what each player was thinking at the time perhaps start it off with ...”it stands to reason....”
I think you’d be better using “the vibe of the thing”

[Teflon]

1. He worked his players into the ground with a punishing game plan

2. He interfered with our recruiting, making decisions for the short term that were a long term disaster (see Ken Sheldon and Stan Alves for the same disastrous interference in recruiting)

3. He failed to play and develop youngsters who could have added some spark to a tired group

4. When he'd bled them dry and worn them out, he bailed out for huge dollars at another club, and you can't tell me that that was a snap decision at the end of the season

5. His ultra-defensive style robbed us fans of watching entertaining football from a highly talented group of players.

He got us to back to back GFs -
Took Freo to a GF
Most successful coach at our club in 40 years
A win ratio of 65%
Players loved him and to this day still talk of how good a coach he was
Still being discussed in AFL circles for senior coaching gigs
I don’t recall you whingeing in 09 when we were 19-0 that you weren’t being “entertained”
Not a player developer I’ll give you that but I think it’s well known coaches for the now (and that’s to his detriment and why I don’t think he’ll coach again)
But again let’s re-write history and ignore the facts and just reminisce over those GT prelim losses and a 10 game “The Streak” video...

[Teflon]

After the 1st attempt at a flag you’d be thinking ‘o.k he’s a twat and he made some blues but he’s a novice in only his third year as senior coach’ and he was stubborn with Luke Ball sitting on the pine, but they had some bad luck and oh well, maybe next year

After the 2nd attempt you realise there is a pattern developing where there’s an unhealthy reliance on a few stars and too little in the way of development of young talent and perhaps the defensive game plan might need some tweeking

After the 3rd attempt, only the gullible and the twats and those into myths and fairy tales still believe he’s a great coach

No only twats ignore the FACTS the guy took us to back to back GFs when the pretender before him couldn’t get us there
Twats prefer to play in losing prelims ...
I’d rather at least have a chance to win a flag myself ..
Carry on twats!
Have tried to leave out fancy adjectives in case they confuse you again

[Teflon]

Raph Clarke. One of Rossy's "role players".

Scored by pundits as the WOG -- Worst on Ground -- in the 2009 GF.

As if anyone couldn't see it coming.

ANY defender would have been better. Gwilt. Hudghton. Even Maguire.

But you know what?

Every St kilda coach in my lifetime has made bewildering selection decisions.

Every one of them has pet players who inexplicably get a game.

Ratts has Kent, for one.

So I cut Ross some slack. And as I've said elsewhere, he's the only St Kilda coach in forty years who's been headhunted by other clubs.

Yup
But the twats on here will tell you he’s no good , can’t coach ....all the players and the other AFL clubs (who still reach out to Lyon now) don’t know what they’re talking about ...
Of course SS muppets know more than all them...

[Scollop]

Teffers

Thanks for not including your usual melodramatic adjectives ….in at least some of your replies

I noticed you repeated the word twat a few times. Has always been a favourite of mine

Self thinkers and anyone with a higher level of intelligence than the average footballer would understand that popular opinion isn’t necessarily the right opinion. When all is said and done, the only prize that counts is holding up the cup and both GT and Lyon failed as coaches to bring home any silverware.

I’m not trying to change your mind, because I know it’s too difficult to to debate with someone as stubborn as a mule

The purpose of my posts is to get others to see that perhaps the perception of Lyon as a great coach, may be somewhat inaccurate even though it may have been the general consensus up until a few years before he was sacked

I’m not really concerned about Ross or GT as coaches in their own right. I’m more concerned about what the club can learn to better understand how events unfolded and why they occurred, so we don’t make the same mistakes again. Perhaps AFL footy historians will interpret the events and come to some sort of consensus in years to come.

[saynta]

Teffers

Thanks for not including your usual melodramatic adjectives ….in at least some of your replies

I noticed you repeated the word twat a few times. Has always been a favourite of mine

Self thinkers and anyone with a higher level of intelligence than the average footballer would understand that popular opinion isn’t necessarily the right opinion. When all is said and done, the only prize that counts is holding up the cup and both GT and Lyon failed as coaches to bring home any silverware.

I’m not trying to change your mind, because I know it’s too difficult to to debate with someone as stubborn as a mule

The purpose of my posts is to get others to see that perhaps the perception of Lyon as a great coach, may be somewhat inaccurate even though it may have been the general consensus up until a few years before he was sacked

I’m not really concerned about Ross or GT as coaches in their own right. I’m more concerned about what the club can learn to better understand how events unfolded and why they occurred, so we don’t make the same mistakes again. Perhaps AFL footy historians will interpret the events and come to some sort of consensus in years to come.

Read all your posts plus the other guy's. The one with the insults.

Now who to believe? No race AFAIC. You win the debate hands down.

Loved by all the players? What a crock of s***. Go ask Luke Ball or Max Hudgton for their opinion.

The tosser was so scared off when he saw that Ball was on the interviewing committee for the filth job, our hero scuttled off back to his hole.

Talk about hero worship.

[Freebird]

Well said Saynta. Lyon is a dog of a person and cared little about st kilda, did not draft for future, squeezed everything out of the group ensembled by others and then bolted as planned in demand.

An exodus of destruction - how any saint supporter has any affection for this lowlife is inconceivable

[Yorkeys]

Totally
Won't
Agree
Twouble Maker.

TWAT

Waskally with it, to.

[Scollop]

Totally
Won't
Agree
Twouble Maker.

TWAT

Waskally with it, to.

Yes Indeed… Isn’t it fun?

Thanks for staying the course Yorkeys. You never did answer a question I put to you earlier in the year…

Did you derive your nic from that famous beach-side suburb, north of Cairns?

[Teflon]

Totally
Won't
Agree
Twouble Maker.

TWAT

Waskally with it, to.

Great call Yorkey ..do you think he knows?

[Teflon]

Teffers

Thanks for not including your usual melodramatic adjectives ….in at least some of your replies

I noticed you repeated the word twat a few times. Has always been a favourite of mine

Self thinkers and anyone with a higher level of intelligence than the average footballer would understand that popular opinion isn’t necessarily the right opinion. When all is said and done, the only prize that counts is holding up the cup and both GT and Lyon failed as coaches to bring home any silverware.

I’m not trying to change your mind, because I know it’s too difficult to to debate with someone as stubborn as a mule

The purpose of my posts is to get others to see that perhaps the perception of Lyon as a great coach, may be somewhat inaccurate even though it may have been the general consensus up until a few years before he was sacked

I’m not really concerned about Ross or GT as coaches in their own right. I’m more concerned about what the club can learn to better understand how events unfolded and why they occurred, so we don’t make the same mistakes again. Perhaps AFL footy historians will interpret the events and come to some sort of consensus in years to come.

That’s probably your best post in 18 years.
I’m not trying to change peoples opinion either I could t care less tbh
Ross Lyon doesn’t strike me as a nice guy at all but I’m not really after nice guys ....Richo was nice....useless...but nice
What I can’t cop and don’t believe is that he couldn’t coach - agree he’s not a development coach but his record and the players who played under him still attest the guy could coach.
Anyway I’ll leave it there ....Stinger /Saynta will be doing soon with rolling eyes and no opinion of his own so we all have that to look forward to.
Go the Saints.

[Teflon]

Teffers

Thanks for not including your usual melodramatic adjectives ….in at least some of your replies

I noticed you repeated the word twat a few times. Has always been a favourite of mine

Self thinkers and anyone with a higher level of intelligence than the average footballer would understand that popular opinion isn’t necessarily the right opinion. When all is said and done, the only prize that counts is holding up the cup and both GT and Lyon failed as coaches to bring home any silverware.

I’m not trying to change your mind, because I know it’s too difficult to to debate with someone as stubborn as a mule

The purpose of my posts is to get others to see that perhaps the perception of Lyon as a great coach, may be somewhat inaccurate even though it may have been the general consensus up until a few years before he was sacked

I’m not really concerned about Ross or GT as coaches in their own right. I’m more concerned about what the club can learn to better understand how events unfolded and why they occurred, so we don’t make the same mistakes again. Perhaps AFL footy historians will interpret the events and come to some sort of consensus in years to come.

Read all your posts plus the other guy's. The one with the insults.

Now who to believe? No race AFAIC. You win the debate hands down.

Loved by all the players? What a crock of s***. Go ask Luke Ball or Max Hudgton for their opinion.

The tosser was so scared off when he saw that Ball was on the interviewing committee for the filth job, our hero scuttled off back to his hole.

Talk about hero worship.

Hero worship??? is that your usual baiting type posts that so often go left unchecked by mods on this site?
I can handle Scollop having a view he at least has one of his own.... not sone weird sycophantic hatred that clouds any sense logic and dumbs down a debate into emojis

Riewoldt
Hayes
Goddard
Montagna
Dal Santo
Fyfe

All beg to differ with your “crock of shite” assertion Lyon wasn’t supported by his players and Luke Ball ???? Collingwood turd of the highest who gives a flying Fock what he thinks ????
Please god can someone on this site point me to the “ignore” button quick !

[Teflon]

Well said Saynta. Lyon is a dog of a person and cared little about st kilda, did not draft for future, squeezed everything out of the group ensembled by others and then bolted as planned in demand.

An exodus of destruction - how any saint supporter has any affection for this lowlife is inconceivable

Yep ...but could coach though ...that’s the point
Let’s try stay on topic and leave the emotion aside?

[Wayne42]

And of course, they couldn't have possibly aimed to be contenders again in 2012/2013 because they had to drive an extra 10-15 km to get to work

And there were NO coffee shops close by, that had a huge effect on the playing group, well, the Prima Donnas at least.

[B.M]

No doubt star players loved playing for Ross, they still get together for dinners now.

Interesting to know what Jack Steven, Tom Lynch, David Armitage, Rhys Stanley, Ben McEvoy

Thought of Ross?!

[Teflon]

No doubt star players loved playing for Ross, they still get together for dinners now.

Interesting to know what Jack Steven, Tom Lynch, David Armitage, Rhys Stanley, Ben McEvoy

Thought of Ross?!

Not sure but
Robert Eddy Mqualter Dawson Gwilt loved Ross
All clubs have players who don’t like he coach - I suspect Carlisle doesn’t love Ratten
Big deal.
Not here to be loved here to win and under Lyon we did plenty of it and but for an unlucky bounce we wouldn’t be having this conversation
Point is he dragged the best out of what he had , sure some he didn’t rate as highly but all clubs have that
Anyway stats tell us he’s our most successful coach in 40 years
We could always go back to Richo for 6 years of mediocrity and beige....

[saynta]

No doubt star players loved playing for Ross, they still get together for dinners now.

Interesting to know what Jack Steven, Tom Lynch, David Armitage, Rhys Stanley, Ben McEvoy

Thought of Ross?!

Not sure but
Robert Eddy Mqualter Dawson Gwilt loved Ross
All clubs have players who don’t like he coach - I suspect Carlisle doesn’t love Ratten
Big deal.
Not here to be loved here to win and under Lyon we did plenty of it and but for an unlucky bounce we wouldn’t be having this conversation
Point is he dragged the best out of what he had , sure some he didn’t rate as highly but all clubs have that
Anyway stats tell us he’s our most successful coach in 40 years
We could always go back to Richo for 6 years of mediocrity and beige....

Your the one that is fond of saying that ALL the players loved the tosser, which is plainly not true, so why keep sprouting that rubbish.

[B.M]

Yes

We had a mediocre list under Richo

The famous Blueprint by Pelchen that most on here supported

[Trev from the Bush]

Just an observation. On Saintsational there is a maximum 25 posts per page. On this page alone Teflon has 12 (count 'em, an egg carton full). Congratulations non-stick one, I reckon that has to be some sort of record. Some might suggest a broken one.

[asiu]

rofl

imagine life without Tef 'n Mart


c'mon
get real