Treloar

This unofficial St Kilda Saints fan forum is for people of all ages to chat Saints Footy and all posts must be respectful.

Moderators: Saintsational Administrators, Saintsational Moderators

Post Reply
User avatar
SaintPav
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 19161
Joined: Wed 16 Jun 2010 9:24pm
Location: Alma Road
Has thanked: 1609 times
Been thanked: 2031 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881385Post SaintPav »

Saintmatt wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 9:22am
ace wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 1:18am Jack Higgins from Richmond would be nice get but at what price.
Personally - I think he's integral to the build. If we could find a way to get Higgins and shunt Lonie - then we've seriously upgraded 2 areas of the ground that we were very innefective in against the Premier (i.e. Crouch as an inside mid where we got smashed in clearances) and small forward / pressure (where Lonie et al were unsighted).

When ppl are talking about what we pay for Higgins - remember that he was a 1st round pick for a reason and he's not got worse since he was drafted (yes, I know about the brain bit but, that's been surgically resolved). Personally - I wouldn't be unhappy if we gave a first rounder and got a 2nd back.
Sounds good but have his medical issues been fully resolved?

I thought it it was still a risk.


Holder of unacceptable views and other thought crimes.
User avatar
ace
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 10800
Joined: Sun 16 Dec 2007 3:28pm
Location: St Kilda
Has thanked: 31 times
Been thanked: 838 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881389Post ace »

Saintmatt wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 9:22am
ace wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 1:18am Jack Higgins from Richmond would be nice get but at what price.
Personally - I think he's integral to the build. If we could find a way to get Higgins and shunt Lonie - then we've seriously upgraded 2 areas of the ground that we were very innefective in against the Premier (i.e. Crouch as an inside mid where we got smashed in clearances) and small forward / pressure (where Lonie et al were unsighted).

When ppl are talking about what we pay for Higgins - remember that he was a 1st round pick for a reason and he's not got worse since he was drafted (yes, I know about the brain bit but, that's been surgically resolved). Personally - I wouldn't be unhappy if we gave a first rounder and got a 2nd back.
Fortunately you don't need a brain to play great football - just look at Dusty.


The more you know, the more you know you don't know.
When I was a young child, I knew that I knew so much about so much.
Now that I am old and know so much more, I know that I know so much about so little, and so little about so much.

If you are not engaging AI actively and aggressively, you are doing it wrong.
You are not going to lose your job to AI.
You are going lose your job to somebody who uses AI.
Your company is not going to go out of business because of AI.
Your company is going to go out of business because another company used AI.
- Jensen Huang, CEO of NVIDIA
User avatar
saintsRrising
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 30098
Joined: Mon 15 Mar 2004 11:07am
Location: Melbourne
Has thanked: 711 times
Been thanked: 1235 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881394Post saintsRrising »

ace wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 9:25am Early morning Thursday 5 November

TRELOAR TO SAINTS? COO HAS HIS SAY
ST KILDA appears unlikely to partner Brad Crouch with Adam Treloar in its improving midfield group next season, with the club distancing itself from the Collingwood midfielder on Thursday.
The Saints have done their homework on Treloar, with the gun onballer destined to leave the Pies during this year's Trade Period after a messy and complicated saga that appears no closer to a resolution.
However, St Kilda has already secured its marquee recruit of this season's Trade Period, completing the signing of Crouch on Wednesday after Adelaide rejected the opportunity to match its free agency offer.
It means that, despite holding an interest in Treloar, the Saints do not believe they would have either the cap space nor the assets to complete a trade for the contracted Magpies midfielder over the next week.
"We're very interested observers," the club's chief operating officer Simon Lethlean told SEN Breakfast.
"Treloar is a sensational player. But if you asked me right now if he'd be at the Saints, I'd say it's very unlikely. We don't have the cap space or the assets to be getting that deal done. We certainly haven't spoken to Adam or Collingwood.
"We did say if the Crouch deal fell over, we would potentially have a look at him as that midfielder that we were looking for. Given the Crouch deal has gone ahead, I think our focus and our ability to get that done is pretty minimal.
"I think it's a difficult one for us to get done with where we're at, based on having just done the deal with Crouch. You never say never, but I really think it's unlikely. It would just be too hard for us at the moment." - Riley Beveridge

https://www.afl.com.au/trade/trade-talk

The key quote there is:


"We're very interested observers,"


Which means that they still very much want him if the price is right, and quite probably if we can afford him by trading out a couple of players.


Flying the World in comfort thanks to FF Points....
Saintmike65
Club Player
Posts: 921
Joined: Sat 24 Oct 2020 10:22am
Has thanked: 217 times
Been thanked: 906 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881395Post Saintmike65 »

On the surface getting Adam Treloar seems like a good idea but in my humble opinion, it's just too messy.
Number 1, the length of his contract is a problem, 2025 is a big commitment, particularly if he continues to have hamstring problems.
Secondly, we don't have a lot of currency to trade for him.
Thirdly, would this impede the development of youngsters like Bytel and Byrnes plus where does that leave Zac Jones, a similar type of player to Treloar?


Saintmike65
Club Player
Posts: 921
Joined: Sat 24 Oct 2020 10:22am
Has thanked: 217 times
Been thanked: 906 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881396Post Saintmike65 »

SaintPav wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 9:26am
Saintmatt wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 9:22am
ace wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 1:18am Jack Higgins from Richmond would be nice get but at what price.
Personally - I think he's integral to the build. If we could find a way to get Higgins and shunt Lonie - then we've seriously upgraded 2 areas of the ground that we were very innefective in against the Premier (i.e. Crouch as an inside mid where we got smashed in clearances) and small forward / pressure (where Lonie et al were unsighted).

When ppl are talking about what we pay for Higgins - remember that he was a 1st round pick for a reason and he's not got worse since he was drafted (yes, I know about the brain bit but, that's been surgically resolved). Personally - I wouldn't be unhappy if we gave a first rounder and got a 2nd back.
Sounds good but have his medical issues been fully resolved?

I thought it it was still a risk.
Higgins trade wouldn't be a problem, Richmond is a fair & reasonable club to deal with..they can afford to be having won 3 flags!
The beauty of Higgins is, unlike Lonie, can play in the midfield, in fact, he was a gun mid in his draft year.


6621104
Club Player
Posts: 537
Joined: Wed 14 Sep 2011 8:33pm
Location: not victoria
Has thanked: 12 times
Been thanked: 79 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881400Post 6621104 »

We should thank Treloar and Collingwood- made Adelaide blink and decide not to match the Crouch offer. Clever of Lethlean to link the possibilities - if we dont get one the other is possible!


the invisible and the non existent look very much alike
damienc
Club Player
Posts: 1318
Joined: Mon 17 Oct 2011 7:19pm
Has thanked: 613 times
Been thanked: 413 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881413Post damienc »

If we get Treloar we will win a premiership. IMO.


User avatar
magnifisaint
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 8190
Joined: Sun 02 May 2004 2:52am
Has thanked: 231 times
Been thanked: 630 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881414Post magnifisaint »

No way Treloar will come to the Saints. As good as he is, I would prefer Higgins.


In Springfield, they're eating the dogs. The people that came in, they're eating the cats. They’re eating – they are eating the pets of the people that live there.
User avatar
saintsRrising
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 30098
Joined: Mon 15 Mar 2004 11:07am
Location: Melbourne
Has thanked: 711 times
Been thanked: 1235 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881417Post saintsRrising »

magnifisaint wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 12:49pm No way Treloar will come to the Saints. As good as he is, I would prefer Higgins.

I'm with the little girl in the Taco ad....

Image


Flying the World in comfort thanks to FF Points....
User avatar
Joffa Burns
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 7081
Joined: Tue 09 Mar 2004 5:48pm
Has thanked: 1871 times
Been thanked: 1570 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881428Post Joffa Burns »

Treloar:

We give Collingwood #17 and a 2nd round pick (which we secure by bundling up Dunstan, Lonie & Hind and trading those picks received into a 2nd rounder).

Collingwood give us their 2021 first rounder (they don't need badly it as they will get the Daicos boy FS next year) and Treloar and pay $200K of his wage. We then have to satisfy Richmond who are always reasonable for Higgins and away we go.

We then have 2 X first round picks & a 2nd rounder in 2021 to lead an assault on Ben King, and will still have satisfied the floating 2 X first rounders in 4 year rule.

We add Hill, Howard, Butler, Jones, Ryder, Higgins, Treloar, Couch & Ben King onto our list in 3 years.

Yes I'm dreaming, but after going to GF in 71, 97, 2009, 2010 X 2 I think I'm allowed to dream.


Proudly assuming the title of forum Oracle and serving as the inaugural Saintsational ‘weak as piss brigade’ President.
User avatar
asiu
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 10313
Joined: Thu 08 Apr 2010 8:11pm
Has thanked: 1327 times
Been thanked: 932 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881430Post asiu »

does it technically need to be our original first round pick , that we use to keep up our ‘usage’ requirement ?

or (hopefully) i’m off tap with this bit


Image
.name the ways , thought manipulates the State of Presence away.

.tipara waranta kani nina-tu.
Saintmatt
SS Life Member
Posts: 2594
Joined: Fri 20 Jan 2012 4:57pm
Has thanked: 2043 times
Been thanked: 1167 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881433Post Saintmatt »

Saintmike65 wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 10:35am
SaintPav wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 9:26am
Saintmatt wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 9:22am
ace wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 1:18am Jack Higgins from Richmond would be nice get but at what price.
Personally - I think he's integral to the build. If we could find a way to get Higgins and shunt Lonie - then we've seriously upgraded 2 areas of the ground that we were very innefective in against the Premier (i.e. Crouch as an inside mid where we got smashed in clearances) and small forward / pressure (where Lonie et al were unsighted).

When ppl are talking about what we pay for Higgins - remember that he was a 1st round pick for a reason and he's not got worse since he was drafted (yes, I know about the brain bit but, that's been surgically resolved). Personally - I wouldn't be unhappy if we gave a first rounder and got a 2nd back.
Sounds good but have his medical issues been fully resolved?

I thought it it was still a risk.
Higgins trade wouldn't be a problem, Richmond is a fair & reasonable club to deal with..they can afford to be having won 3 flags!
The beauty of Higgins is, unlike Lonie, can play in the midfield, in fact, he was a gun mid in his draft year.
The BEST part about Higgins is that he considers himself a midfielder and wants to move not only to play senior footy - but become part of a midfield rotation. We're actually perfect for him. For ages, I've thought that if we could get a Gresham clone - one to play mid whilst other plays forward - we'd have a very dynamic centre square set-up. And here it now is staring us in the face.


Go you red, black & white warriors
SaintPelican66
Club Player
Posts: 526
Joined: Wed 16 Sep 2020 8:23pm
Has thanked: 23 times
Been thanked: 55 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881435Post SaintPelican66 »

Higgins - got him.


st.byron
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 10598
Joined: Tue 14 Jun 2005 7:04pm
Location: North
Has thanked: 1011 times
Been thanked: 1055 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881437Post st.byron »

SaintPelican66 wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 3:26pm Higgins - got him.
Source? Haven’t seen this anywhere else.


User avatar
Joffa Burns
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 7081
Joined: Tue 09 Mar 2004 5:48pm
Has thanked: 1871 times
Been thanked: 1570 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881438Post Joffa Burns »

SaintPelican66 wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 3:26pm Higgins - got him.
So we have both Treloar & Higgins according to StPelican.

Better let Lethlean & Gallagher know Pelican, as of this morning Lethlean stated we were in the dark over Higgins.

I am belatedly joining the Saintsational chorus that you are little more than trolling this site.


Proudly assuming the title of forum Oracle and serving as the inaugural Saintsational ‘weak as piss brigade’ President.
SaintPelican66
Club Player
Posts: 526
Joined: Wed 16 Sep 2020 8:23pm
Has thanked: 23 times
Been thanked: 55 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881439Post SaintPelican66 »

st.byron wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 3:36pm
SaintPelican66 wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 3:26pm Higgins - got him.
Source? Haven’t seen this anywhere else.
My mate again. He is well informed. As per my other post he told me that we had Crouch and would now concentrate on Treloar. He was right about that too.


User avatar
skeptic
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 17053
Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 7:10pm
Has thanked: 3665 times
Been thanked: 2927 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881441Post skeptic »

Joffa Burns wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 3:49pm
SaintPelican66 wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 3:26pm Higgins - got him.
So we have both Treloar & Higgins according to StPelican.

Better let Lethlean & Gallagher know Pelican, as of this morning Lethlean stated we were in the dark over Higgins.

I am belatedly joining the Saintsational chorus that you are little more than trolling this site.
In fairness JB, his OP on Treloar said (before it was reported) that we were going after him.
That seems to have been the case... it appears that we have at least made a play.

I’d say a benefit of the doubt is in play at the moment


User avatar
Mr Magic
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 12799
Joined: Fri 04 May 2007 9:38am
Has thanked: 812 times
Been thanked: 434 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881443Post Mr Magic »

Can someone explain Collingwood's actions over Treloar to me.
I understand they've probably got a TPP problem, but the way they've handled this Treloar issue is making them look like amateur, untrustworthy, fools.
Why have they managed it this way?
As much as I despise them they've certainly been a very professionally run club for the last decade or so.
Is it merely that Gary Pert is not there steering the ship anymore?


Saintmatt
SS Life Member
Posts: 2594
Joined: Fri 20 Jan 2012 4:57pm
Has thanked: 2043 times
Been thanked: 1167 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881444Post Saintmatt »

Mr Magic wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 4:24pm Can someone explain Collingwood's actions over Treloar to me.
I understand they've probably got a TPP problem, but the way they've handled this Treloar issue is making them look like amateur, untrustworthy, fools.
Why have they managed it this way?
As much as I despise them they've certainly been a very professionally run club for the last decade or so.
Is it merely that Gary Pert is not there steering the ship anymore?
It's pretty simple.

Collingwood has a number of very very good players who, have all come out of contract at the same time. The problem for Collingwood is that they're not really staggered - i.e. Grundy, Moore and De Goey all this year. Then they have some average role players coming out at the same time (Miocek, Cox, Phillips). Collingwood knows that they need to keep all of them together to stay competitive - in hindsight, getting so close in 2018 meant they want want to keep the window open.

Treloar is a lovely young bloke who came from the housing commission flatsin Noble Park and will do anything for someone who does something for him. His dream was to play footy for a big Melbourne club and Collingwood have helped him in buying a house for his Mum and Brother and set his own life up. He feels like he owes them. So - when the Pies need to 'find room' in their cap to make available for other players they need to re-sign ... Adam has basically been their banker. and so here's where the problem arose. The culmination of this was his last contract where the Pies engaged what's known as 'smoothing' ... where a club takes money from the back of your current contract and then gives the player an extension ... and includes the money from the back of the current contract into the contract extension.

In real terms - they moved somewhere between $200K - $400K from the end of his old contract into his new extension (that goes to 2025). In effect - he's owed that money. So - the ultimate outcome is that now Treloar's contract is so bulging with old contract money that it makes it look like he's being paid overs (which he's not - it's just money he was owed from his last contract that they moved around to presumably fit in Grundy). Treloar's proper market rate is about $700K - which is what his current contract is ... but it's the money from the old contract that makes it look like he's being paid $900K.

Ordinarily - it's never been a problem until Covid hit and salary caps and playing list sizes go down. Jeremy Cameron is in exactly the same boat (but more cash involved).

It's the list management equivalent of the music stopping and the most expensive (but not necessarily the best player) being left without a seat.

Also - Gary Pert is no rocket scientist. Mark Anderson is pretty capable but Ned Guy? Wouldn't want to be him and/or Geoff Walsh ...

Diabolical list management from Collingwood in any case. Good luck getting out of it.


Go you red, black & white warriors
st.byron
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 10598
Joined: Tue 14 Jun 2005 7:04pm
Location: North
Has thanked: 1011 times
Been thanked: 1055 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881445Post st.byron »

SaintPelican66 wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 3:53pm
st.byron wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 3:36pm
SaintPelican66 wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 3:26pm Higgins - got him.
Source? Haven’t seen this anywhere else.
My mate again. He is well informed. As per my other post he told me that we had Crouch and would now concentrate on Treloar. He was right about that too.
Thanks. If true Lethlean is surely a skilled operator. Has given nada away and hosed down both Higgins and Treloar as potential targets. IF, and that’s a big IF, we land Crouch, Higgins and Treloar, and keep our first rounder, that will surely
be back to back recruiting coups.


User avatar
Ghost Like
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 6562
Joined: Wed 19 Sep 2007 10:04pm
Has thanked: 5786 times
Been thanked: 1909 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881446Post Ghost Like »

Mr Magic wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 4:24pm Can someone explain Collingwood's actions over Treloar to me.
I understand they've probably got a TPP problem, but the way they've handled this Treloar issue is making them look like amateur, untrustworthy, fools.
Why have they managed it this way?
As much as I despise them they've certainly been a very professionally run club for the last decade or so.
Is it merely that Gary Pert is not there steering the ship anymore?
It smacks to me of Collingwood's version of Hird & Essendon. Through desperation they topped up on back ended salaries instead of Mexican jumping beans. Whilst not illegal, both end the same way. Over estimated and blinkered to circumvent the hard work required in development.


SaintPelican66
Club Player
Posts: 526
Joined: Wed 16 Sep 2020 8:23pm
Has thanked: 23 times
Been thanked: 55 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881447Post SaintPelican66 »

st.byron wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 4:45pm
SaintPelican66 wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 3:53pm
st.byron wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 3:36pm
SaintPelican66 wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 3:26pm Higgins - got him.
Source? Haven’t seen this anywhere else.
My mate again. He is well informed. As per my other post he told me that we had Crouch and would now concentrate on Treloar. He was right about that too.
Thanks. If true Lethlean is surely a skilled operator. Has given nada away and hosed down both Higgins and Treloar as potential targets. IF, and that’s a big IF, we land Crouch, Higgins and Treloar, and keep our first rounder, that will surely
be back to back recruiting coups.
If we get all of Crouch, Higgins and Treloar we will definitely not have a FRDP in 2020 and our FRDP in 2021 will be 18. 8-)


User avatar
ace
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 10800
Joined: Sun 16 Dec 2007 3:28pm
Location: St Kilda
Has thanked: 31 times
Been thanked: 838 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881448Post ace »

asiu wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 2:47pm does it technically need to be our original first round pick , that we use to keep up our ‘usage’ requirement ?

or (hopefully) i’m off tap with this bit
I have looked to find an answer.
I could not find anywhere any reference to it being attached to the club.
Last year we split pick 6 into 2 later firsts.
Trading out a player could bring a first
A player or a second combined with another second could create a first.

It would mean that a club could move their first toward the back of the first picks.


The more you know, the more you know you don't know.
When I was a young child, I knew that I knew so much about so much.
Now that I am old and know so much more, I know that I know so much about so little, and so little about so much.

If you are not engaging AI actively and aggressively, you are doing it wrong.
You are not going to lose your job to AI.
You are going lose your job to somebody who uses AI.
Your company is not going to go out of business because of AI.
Your company is going to go out of business because another company used AI.
- Jensen Huang, CEO of NVIDIA
fugazi
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 4243
Joined: Thu 25 Mar 2004 2:47pm
Location: incarnate
Has thanked: 286 times
Been thanked: 694 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881450Post fugazi »

Saintmike65 wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 10:29am On the surface getting Adam Treloar seems like a good idea but in my humble opinion, it's just too messy.
Number 1, the length of his contract is a problem, 2025 is a big commitment, particularly if he continues to have hamstring problems.
Secondly, we don't have a lot of currency to trade for him.
Thirdly, would this impede the development of youngsters like Bytel and Byrnes plus where does that leave Zac Jones, a similar type of player to Treloar?
I agree with this.
There is something fishy about the whole thing.
I think I'd prefer Higgins and take the FRDP to the draft.


Nee!
User avatar
Joffa Burns
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 7081
Joined: Tue 09 Mar 2004 5:48pm
Has thanked: 1871 times
Been thanked: 1570 times

Re: Treloar

Post: # 1881458Post Joffa Burns »

skeptic wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 4:18pm
Joffa Burns wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 3:49pm
SaintPelican66 wrote: Thu 05 Nov 2020 3:26pm Higgins - got him.
So we have both Treloar & Higgins according to StPelican.

Better let Lethlean & Gallagher know Pelican, as of this morning Lethlean stated we were in the dark over Higgins.

I am belatedly joining the Saintsational chorus that you are little more than trolling this site.
In fairness JB, his OP on Treloar said (before it was reported) that we were going after him.
That seems to have been the case... it appears that we have at least made a play.

I’d say a benefit of the doubt is in play at the moment
Fair enough, that part was relatively correct.
Not sure we have Higgins or Treloar as stated by the poster and he was way off the mark on the crouch deal.


Proudly assuming the title of forum Oracle and serving as the inaugural Saintsational ‘weak as piss brigade’ President.
Post Reply