This is how the Crouch deal will go down.......

[ace]

If Adelaide match St Kilda's offer they actually have to match the offer.
So if St Kilda's offer is for 4 years with a 5 year trigger Adelaide must contract Crouch for 4 years with the 5 year trigger.
They would not normally give a player of theirs that length of contract.
They also have to pay what St Kilda has offered.
That pay is probably higher than Adelaide would have paid Crouch if it were a normal contact renewal.

So if St Kilda walks away without a trade Adelaide is left with Crouch on an extended length of contract at a higher pay rate.
Crouch wins, his club loses.

[silverhalo]

So be it.....I hope we don't get tempted into trading here

[Gershwin]

Sounds promising:

"Jon Ralph

Adelaide has privately acknowledged Brad Crouch has played his last game at the Crows as it ponders whether to accept the No.23 pick in the draft as compensation for the restricted free agent.
The Crows will spend Monday considering their options, aware that they were never likely to secure a first-round compensation (the No.2 pick) for Crouch when he left for St Kilda.

Adelaide believes St Kilda’s four-year deal with a fifth-year trigger is worth around $700,000 of guaranteed money plus incentives.
It means the AFL never considered handing the club first-round compensation which needs to be at least $800,000 per season.

The Crows have until 5pm Wednesday to consider whether to match the deal or not.
But the club is aware if Crouch was to be traded they would ask for around pick 15 so the compensation pick isn't far short of his fair value if this was not a one-off free agency deal.

The AFL has not officially confirmed the second-round compensation, but the contract does not even reach end-of-first-round compensation, let alone first-round.
Adelaide has been public that if it does not receive pick two they will match a bid and ask for a trade.

The first request would be St Kilda’s pick No.15 in the draft.
But it is in the ballpark of the AFL's compensation selection and there is no guarantee the Saints would hand over their first-round call, which would set the scene for a week of haggling.

Adelaide could still accept pick 23, package it up with other picks and get on with their business which includes securing GWS midfielder Jackson Hately.
While football boss Adam Kelly has said the club would welcome back Crouch, he is determined to play for St Kilda next year."

[older saint]

interesting to see what Adelaide do as the rules state they have to match the contract exactly and in doing so could potentially hamstring themselves moving forward . If StKilda know this is the position Adelaide sit (hypothetically) it may be in a position where they actually get less than the compensation offer. Sure that is why Adelaide waiting to do the sums, as while you can always match and go - they will end up trading , there always is the position is StKilda are about to walk late on the final day that Adelaide are stuck to take what is on the table.

My gut says that the talk was a push at the AFL to get first rounder, and they will not match ( nothing but a guess0) , which would be great for us. Surely then some soft trade back the other way (wink wink)

[skeptic]

One has to imagine that if there’s deals to be had... we could still top up the offer during the trade period after they sign.

E.G give a player or pick for peanuts

[Saintmatt]

One has to imagine that if there’s deals to be had... we could still top up the offer during the trade period after they sign.

E.G give a player or pick for peanuts

I think this is on the money

[portosaint]

If the Crows don't match, I hope we give nothing for peanuts during the trade period. Unless of course it is to free up salary for a greater cause. Obviously a benefit to us.

It seems Adelaide may have conceded and accept the compensation is adequate. If so, that's our job done.

This is a ruthless business and I'd love nothing more than to see our club dig in and stand its ground. Allen, Lethlean, Gags and co seem like they're not willing to be pushed around. I like it.

[skeptic]

If the Crows don't match, I hope we give nothing for peanuts during the trade period. Unless of course it is to free up salary for a greater cause. Obviously a benefit to us.

It seems Adelaide may have conceded and accept the compensation is adequate. If so, that's our job done.

This is a ruthless business and I'd love nothing more than to see our club dig in and stand its ground. Allen, Lethlean, Gags and co seem like they're not willing to be pushed around. I like it.

I agree to a point

Positive relations ultimately lead to more productive processes and better outcomes

If we can walk away with Adelaide happy and no great loss to ourselves... that’s the best outcome

[ace]

If Adelaide match St Kilda's offer they actually have to match the offer.
So if St Kilda's offer is for 4 years with a 5 year trigger Adelaide must contract Crouch for 4 years with the 5 year trigger.
They would not normally give a player of theirs that length of contract.
They also have to pay what St Kilda has offered.
That pay is probably higher than Adelaide would have paid Crouch if it were a normal contact renewal.

So if St Kilda walks away without a trade Adelaide is left with Crouch on an extended length of contract at a higher pay rate.
Crouch wins, his club loses.

St Kilda's contract believed to be in the ball park but shy of $700k per year for 4 years and 5 year trigger OUCH.
If Adelaide match they have to pay that figure and duration OUCH.

The compensation is only mid second round NOT end of first round.
End of first round compensation is pick 22 forcing Adelaide' second round pick to 23
But mid second round is pick 23 leaving Adelaide's second round pick at 22.
The outcome is identical but technically shows that Adelaide is very lucky to get pick 23.
The compensation pick would have been later if Adelaide had not finished bottom.

[ace]

Message to both St Kilda and Adelaide - Crouch is not worth $700 for 5 years.
Adelaide don't match.
St Kilda if Adelaide match don't trade.
Walk away while you can.

[fugazi]

Massive risk for them if they match the offer.

5 year commitment to someone who doesn't want to be there.

On the whole I think they will accept and move on.

[Mr Magic]

If Adelaide match St Kilda's offer they actually have to match the offer.
So if St Kilda's offer is for 4 years with a 5 year trigger Adelaide must contract Crouch for 4 years with the 5 year trigger.
They would not normally give a player of theirs that length of contract.
They also have to pay what St Kilda has offered.
That pay is probably higher than Adelaide would have paid Crouch if it were a normal contact renewal.

So if St Kilda walks away without a trade Adelaide is left with Crouch on an extended length of contract at a higher pay rate.
Crouch wins, his club loses.

St Kilda's contract believed to be in the ball park but shy of $700k per year for 4 years and 5 year trigger OUCH.
If Adelaide match they have to pay that figure and duration OUCH.

The compensation is only mid second round NOT end of first round.
End of first round compensation is pick 22 forcing Adelaide' second round pick to 23
But mid second round is pick 23 leaving Adelaide's second round pick at 22.
The outcome is identical but technically shows that Adelaide is very lucky to get pick 23.
The compensation pick would have been later if Adelaide had not finished bottom.

Why is it called 'mid second round' when it occurs immediately after the Club's pick?
Shouldn't it just be called an extra 2nd round pick?

[ace]

Sounds promising:

"Jon Ralph

Adelaide has privately acknowledged Brad Crouch has played his last game at the Crows as it ponders whether to accept the No.23 pick in the draft as compensation for the restricted free agent.
The Crows will spend Monday considering their options, aware that they were never likely to secure a first-round compensation (the No.2 pick) for Crouch when he left for St Kilda.

Adelaide believes St Kilda’s four-year deal with a fifth-year trigger is worth around $700,000 of guaranteed money plus incentives.
It means the AFL never considered handing the club first-round compensation which needs to be at least $800,000 per season.

The Crows have until 5pm Wednesday to consider whether to match the deal or not.
But the club is aware if Crouch was to be traded they would ask for around pick 15 so the compensation pick isn't far short of his fair value if this was not a one-off free agency deal.

The AFL has not officially confirmed the second-round compensation, but the contract does not even reach end-of-first-round compensation, let alone first-round.
Adelaide has been public that if it does not receive pick two they will match a bid and ask for a trade.

The first request would be St Kilda’s pick No.15 in the draft.
But it is in the ballpark of the AFL's compensation selection and there is no guarantee the Saints would hand over their first-round call, which would set the scene for a week of haggling.

Adelaide could still accept pick 23, package it up with other picks and get on with their business which includes securing GWS midfielder Jackson Hately.
While football boss Adam Kelly has said the club would welcome back Crouch, he is determined to play for St Kilda next year."

27 next year,
Adelaide going into rebuild
Bullied by club's administration to submit a humiliating degrading debased and embarrassing experience over days by a vile group of amateur arseholes.
Unforgiveable lack of love for players welfare.
Many of those who should have stopped it before it started are to arrogant to leave the club and disappear for ever.
Why would he want to be part of the remaining loser culture.

[SinCitySainter]

If Adelaide match St Kilda's offer they actually have to match the offer.
So if St Kilda's offer is for 4 years with a 5 year trigger Adelaide must contract Crouch for 4 years with the 5 year trigger.
They would not normally give a player of theirs that length of contract.
They also have to pay what St Kilda has offered.
That pay is probably higher than Adelaide would have paid Crouch if it were a normal contact renewal.

So if St Kilda walks away without a trade Adelaide is left with Crouch on an extended length of contract at a higher pay rate.
Crouch wins, his club loses.

St Kilda's contract believed to be in the ball park but shy of $700k per year for 4 years and 5 year trigger OUCH.
If Adelaide match they have to pay that figure and duration OUCH.

The compensation is only mid second round NOT end of first round.
End of first round compensation is pick 22 forcing Adelaide' second round pick to 23
But mid second round is pick 23 leaving Adelaide's second round pick at 22.
The outcome is identical but technically shows that Adelaide is very lucky to get pick 23.
The compensation pick would have been later if Adelaide had not finished bottom.

Why is it called 'mid second round' when it occurs immediately after the Club's pick?
Shouldn't it just be called an extra 2nd round pick?

It is mid second round because it is directly after the teams second round pick.
The fact that Adelaide got the wooden spoon creates a somewhat anomalous situation where end of first round and mid second are effectively the same thing.
Band 2 compensation would have meant that the Crows receive a pick after everyone else's first round pick directly followed by their second round pick, unless another club receives band 2 then that pick will go in between.
Band 3 gives them the first pick in the second round followed by the second pick as compensation.

[ace]

There are a lot of fools in Adelaide desperately looking for a face saving way to back down and fail to match.

They can try "we would not like a contract for 4 years with a 5 years trigger due to previous injuries and because we don't like extended contracts like this".
Or "a contract of this size for almost $700k would be out of balance with other players at the club".
Or "we can't force a trade because St Kilda is willing to walk away and has little in the way of draft value to offer.
Or "we have secured a trade in of player x at bargain basement, who we believe will lift the club performance immeasurably.

Maybe we will have to help them save face as they have opened their big mouths too wide in a team town.
But then they deserve the humiliation after what they did to their players.

[portosaint]

If the Crows don't match, I hope we give nothing for peanuts during the trade period. Unless of course it is to free up salary for a greater cause. Obviously a benefit to us.

It seems Adelaide may have conceded and accept the compensation is adequate. If so, that's our job done.

This is a ruthless business and I'd love nothing more than to see our club dig in and stand its ground. Allen, Lethlean, Gags and co seem like they're not willing to be pushed around. I like it.

I agree to a point

Positive relations ultimately lead to more productive processes and better outcomes

If we can walk away with Adelaide happy and no great loss to ourselves... that’s the best outcome

Yeah for sure skeptic... You only have to look at Dodoro to see the importance. You make a solid point.

I guess the way I'm looking at it, I think the pick Adelaide will receive is pretty much on the money. While I want Brad Crouch in the RW+B next season, he's no superstar.

Granted, he's an absolute ball pig who walks in and makes our midfield better from day one. If the hammys hold up.

I actually think he's done well to get the reported 700k. I would have thought the 600-650k would have been around the mark. But I don't work in list management

[skeptic]

If the Crows don't match, I hope we give nothing for peanuts during the trade period. Unless of course it is to free up salary for a greater cause. Obviously a benefit to us.

It seems Adelaide may have conceded and accept the compensation is adequate. If so, that's our job done.

This is a ruthless business and I'd love nothing more than to see our club dig in and stand its ground. Allen, Lethlean, Gags and co seem like they're not willing to be pushed around. I like it.

I agree to a point

Positive relations ultimately lead to more productive processes and better outcomes

If we can walk away with Adelaide happy and no great loss to ourselves... that’s the best outcome

Yeah for sure skeptic... You only have to look at Dodoro to see the importance. You make a solid point.

I guess the way I'm looking at it, I think the pick Adelaide will receive is pretty much on the money. While I want Brad Crouch in the RW+B next season, he's no superstar.

Granted, he's an absolute ball pig who walks in and makes our midfield better from day one. If the hammys hold up.

I actually think he's done well to get the reported 700k. I would have thought the 600-650k would have been around the mark. But I don't work in list management

I agree with the sentiment... if we throw in a Dunstan or Lonie aka a player we intend to lose anyway as sweetener then all the best

[SuperDuper]

Don't understand the fuss. There was nan open market for crouch. We paid the most. That salary we offered was within the range of a band 3 pick. A band 3 pick is the second round which is the range of picks 19-38, but slides after other comp to 23-42. So the open market valued Crouch at pick 23-41. Adelaide got the highest possible pick for a player of that value. If they were Richmond they would get pick 42 for the exact same player and deal. Adelaide should simply take what is the top end of market value. If they force a trade we would only give them a second rounder because that is what he is worth. But that second rounder would be worse than pick 23.

[fugazi]

Don't understand the fuss. There was nan open market for crouch. We paid the most. That salary we offered was within the range of a band 3 pick. A band 3 pick is the second round which is the range of picks 19-38, but slides after other comp to 23-42. So the open market valued Crouch at pick 23-41. Adelaide got the highest possible pick for a player of that value. If they were Richmond they would get pick 42 for the exact same player and deal. Adelaide should simply take what is the top end of market value. If they force a trade we would only give them a second rounder because that is what he is worth. But that second rounder would be worse than pick 23.

Spot on, but
Stop using logic it upsets people

[st.byron]

Sounds promising:

"Jon Ralph

Adelaide has privately acknowledged Brad Crouch has played his last game at the Crows as it ponders whether to accept the No.23 pick in the draft as compensation for the restricted free agent.
The Crows will spend Monday considering their options, aware that they were never likely to secure a first-round compensation (the No.2 pick) for Crouch when he left for St Kilda.

Adelaide believes St Kilda’s four-year deal with a fifth-year trigger is worth around $700,000 of guaranteed money plus incentives.
It means the AFL never considered handing the club first-round compensation which needs to be at least $800,000 per season.

The Crows have until 5pm Wednesday to consider whether to match the deal or not.
But the club is aware if Crouch was to be traded they would ask for around pick 15 so the compensation pick isn't far short of his fair value if this was not a one-off free agency deal.

The AFL has not officially confirmed the second-round compensation, but the contract does not even reach end-of-first-round compensation, let alone first-round.
Adelaide has been public that if it does not receive pick two they will match a bid and ask for a trade.

The first request would be St Kilda’s pick No.15 in the draft.
But it is in the ballpark of the AFL's compensation selection and there is no guarantee the Saints would hand over their first-round call, which would set the scene for a week of haggling.

Adelaide could still accept pick 23, package it up with other picks and get on with their business which includes securing GWS midfielder Jackson Hately.
While football boss Adam Kelly has said the club would welcome back Crouch, he is determined to play for St Kilda next year."

27 next year,
Adelaide going into rebuild
Bullied by club's administration to submit a humiliating degrading debased and embarrassing experience over days by a vile group of amateur arseholes.
Unforgiveable lack of love for players welfare.
Many of those who should have stopped it before it started are to arrogant to leave the club and disappear for ever.
Why would he want to be part of the remaining loser culture.

Dude, regarding the Crows camp, you are just so far off the mark. Was the club out of its depth and did the club make some mistakes? No doubt. But to characterise the people employed to run it as a “vile group of amateur arseholes” and to suggest there was no concern for the players’ welfare is testament only to the power of the media to propagate rubbish and is 180 degrees at the opposite end of the spectrum from the actual truth.

[asiu]

‘they’ did some time with us yea ?

[st.byron]

‘they’ did some time with us yea ?

Collective Mind did, not the other crew who Collective Mind employed to run the Crows camp.

[asiu]

ta

[ace]

If Adelaide match St Kilda's offer they actually have to match the offer.
So if St Kilda's offer is for 4 years with a 5 year trigger Adelaide must contract Crouch for 4 years with the 5 year trigger.
They would not normally give a player of theirs that length of contract.
They also have to pay what St Kilda has offered.
That pay is probably higher than Adelaide would have paid Crouch if it were a normal contact renewal.

So if St Kilda walks away without a trade Adelaide is left with Crouch on an extended length of contract at a higher pay rate.
Crouch wins, his club loses.

St Kilda's contract believed to be in the ball park but shy of $700k per year for 4 years and 5 year trigger OUCH.
If Adelaide match they have to pay that figure and duration OUCH.

The compensation is only mid second round NOT end of first round.
End of first round compensation is pick 22 forcing Adelaide' second round pick to 23
But mid second round is pick 23 leaving Adelaide's second round pick at 22.
The outcome is identical but technically shows that Adelaide is very lucky to get pick 23.
The compensation pick would have been later if Adelaide had not finished bottom.

Why is it called 'mid second round' when it occurs immediately after the Club's pick?
Shouldn't it just be called an extra 2nd round pick?

You need to distinguish between two types of second round compensation picks.
Mid second round comes immediately after your second round pick but an End of second round comes after all club's second round picks.

[ace]

Sounds promising:

"Jon Ralph

Adelaide has privately acknowledged Brad Crouch has played his last game at the Crows as it ponders whether to accept the No.23 pick in the draft as compensation for the restricted free agent.
The Crows will spend Monday considering their options, aware that they were never likely to secure a first-round compensation (the No.2 pick) for Crouch when he left for St Kilda.

Adelaide believes St Kilda’s four-year deal with a fifth-year trigger is worth around $700,000 of guaranteed money plus incentives.
It means the AFL never considered handing the club first-round compensation which needs to be at least $800,000 per season.

The Crows have until 5pm Wednesday to consider whether to match the deal or not.
But the club is aware if Crouch was to be traded they would ask for around pick 15 so the compensation pick isn't far short of his fair value if this was not a one-off free agency deal.

The AFL has not officially confirmed the second-round compensation, but the contract does not even reach end-of-first-round compensation, let alone first-round.
Adelaide has been public that if it does not receive pick two they will match a bid and ask for a trade.

The first request would be St Kilda’s pick No.15 in the draft.
But it is in the ballpark of the AFL's compensation selection and there is no guarantee the Saints would hand over their first-round call, which would set the scene for a week of haggling.

Adelaide could still accept pick 23, package it up with other picks and get on with their business which includes securing GWS midfielder Jackson Hately.
While football boss Adam Kelly has said the club would welcome back Crouch, he is determined to play for St Kilda next year."

27 next year,
Adelaide going into rebuild
Bullied by club's administration to submit a humiliating degrading debased and embarrassing experience over days by a vile group of amateur arseholes.
Unforgiveable lack of love for players welfare.
Many of those who should have stopped it before it started are to arrogant to leave the club and disappear for ever.
Why would he want to be part of the remaining loser culture.

Dude, regarding the Crows camp, you are just so far off the mark. Was the club out of its depth and did the club make some mistakes? No doubt. But to characterise the people employed to run it as a “vile group of amateur arseholes” and to suggest there was no concern for the players’ welfare is testament only to the power of the media to propagate rubbish and is 180 degrees at the opposite end of the spectrum from the actual truth.

Sorry St Byron I didn't realise that you were one of them.