The Elephant In The Room

[Joffa Burns]

FWIW, I was a big supporter of Paddy and agree he showed a bit until the injury woes really picked up

Up to about 2018 I was reasonably confident he’d make it If he’d get a decent run at it...
2018 though just showed that’s he’s finished. Went markedly backwards onfield and more susceptible to injury seemingly

Quite literary the only upside of redrafting him is that he would be cheap but even in that scenario he’s been risk prone without a good base of form to work off
The flip side with Dougal is that yes, he does have some perceived value right or wrong

My point with the pick70 comment was that his profile as pick 1 has garnered him a higher profile then he may have otherwise gotten... that makes for a good story but it’s not a reason to offer him a lifeline IMO

Also think it would have been interesting to see him under a different coach...
He had some bad technique issues that weren’t corrected and the approach to play him as a pack monster pbly wasn’t the correct one

It's still possible we may see Paddy get another crack under a different coach, unlikely but the flame hasn't gone out yet.

I'm curious to know what others think, Dougal Howard, is on a 5 year and $ 3 million deal, is this the real elephant in the room. I'm wrapped that we picked him up but we can't afford for him to be playing at Sandy.

Howard will not play at Sandy.

Max will debut round one.

The real elephant in the room is the contracts paid to Hannebery and Kent.

Ironically Kent is the only player of that lot you mention that has earnt any of his pay packet to this point.

What makes you so certain of Howard's future, have you seen him play?

Fair point on Kent, though I reiterate 3 years to attract a guy who is a one dimensional AFL fringe player was to me an indication of where we were as a club and what we had to do to get players to join.

I saw a little bit of PA last year and hence was very critical on us taking Ryder as he was overweight and ordinary. It does look like he has trimmed down this pre-season so I'm hopeful.

I don't think Howard is a great natural footballer or a key forward, but he is big, athletic, quick, has a big leap and is courageous. I think he is a Harris Andrews type that hits the packs hard and spoils very well and a guy you can build a defence around.

I also believe that it is rare that you recruit a guy like Howard then don't play him and give him extended opportunity. Just like Kent last year who IMO was gifted games up until his near on BOG against Melbourne.

I have heard Max has been told (barring mishap) he will debut round 1.
Very exiting for the young fella and all saints fans.

[Secret Kiel]

FWIW, I was a big supporter of Paddy and agree he showed a bit until the injury woes really picked up

Up to about 2018 I was reasonably confident he’d make it If he’d get a decent run at it...
2018 though just showed that’s he’s finished. Went markedly backwards onfield and more susceptible to injury seemingly

Quite literary the only upside of redrafting him is that he would be cheap but even in that scenario he’s been risk prone without a good base of form to work off
The flip side with Dougal is that yes, he does have some perceived value right or wrong

My point with the pick70 comment was that his profile as pick 1 has garnered him a higher profile then he may have otherwise gotten... that makes for a good story but it’s not a reason to offer him a lifeline IMO

Also think it would have been interesting to see him under a different coach...
He had some bad technique issues that weren’t corrected and the approach to play him as a pack monster pbly wasn’t the correct one

It's still possible we may see Paddy get another crack under a different coach, unlikely but the flame hasn't gone out yet.

I'm curious to know what others think, Dougal Howard, is on a 5 year and $ 3 million deal, is this the real elephant in the room. I'm wrapped that we picked him up but we can't afford for him to be playing at Sandy.

Howard will not play at Sandy.

Max will debut round one.

The real elephant in the room is the contracts paid to Hannebery and Kent.

Ironically Kent is the only player of that lot you mention that has earnt any of his pay packet to this point.

What makes you so certain of Howard's future, have you seen him play?

Fair point on Kent, though I reiterate 3 years to attract a guy who is a one dimensional AFL fringe player was to me an indication of where we were as a club and what we had to do to get players to join.

I saw a little bit of PA last year and hence was very critical on us taking Ryder as he was overweight and ordinary. It does look like he has trimmed down this pre-season so I'm hopeful.

I don't think Howard is a great natural footballer or a key forward, but he is big, athletic, quick, has a big leap and is courageous. I think he is a Harris Andrews type that hits the packs hard and spoils very well and a guy you can build a defence around.

I also believe that it is rare that you recruit a guy like Howard then don't play him and give him extended opportunity. Just like Kent last year who IMO was gifted games up until his near on BOG against Melbourne.

I have heard Max has been told (barring mishap) he will debut round 1.
Very exiting for the young fella and all saints fans.

Do you give a 5 year and $3 million dollar contract to a guy who needs extended opportunity to secure a best 22 spot? I agree it would be rare to then keep him in Sandy, but he has been recruited on potential alone and has yet to prove he belongs at the elite level. As always we get behind all of our players but I currently have Howard in the "unestablished" category on our list.

[Joffa Burns]

FWIW, I was a big supporter of Paddy and agree he showed a bit until the injury woes really picked up

Up to about 2018 I was reasonably confident he’d make it If he’d get a decent run at it...
2018 though just showed that’s he’s finished. Went markedly backwards onfield and more susceptible to injury seemingly

Quite literary the only upside of redrafting him is that he would be cheap but even in that scenario he’s been risk prone without a good base of form to work off
The flip side with Dougal is that yes, he does have some perceived value right or wrong

My point with the pick70 comment was that his profile as pick 1 has garnered him a higher profile then he may have otherwise gotten... that makes for a good story but it’s not a reason to offer him a lifeline IMO

Also think it would have been interesting to see him under a different coach...
He had some bad technique issues that weren’t corrected and the approach to play him as a pack monster pbly wasn’t the correct one

It's still possible we may see Paddy get another crack under a different coach, unlikely but the flame hasn't gone out yet.

I'm curious to know what others think, Dougal Howard, is on a 5 year and $ 3 million deal, is this the real elephant in the room. I'm wrapped that we picked him up but we can't afford for him to be playing at Sandy.

Howard will not play at Sandy.

Max will debut round one.

The real elephant in the room is the contracts paid to Hannebery and Kent.

Ironically Kent is the only player of that lot you mention that has earnt any of his pay packet to this point.

What makes you so certain of Howard's future, have you seen him play?

Fair point on Kent, though I reiterate 3 years to attract a guy who is a one dimensional AFL fringe player was to me an indication of where we were as a club and what we had to do to get players to join.

I saw a little bit of PA last year and hence was very critical on us taking Ryder as he was overweight and ordinary. It does look like he has trimmed down this pre-season so I'm hopeful.

I don't think Howard is a great natural footballer or a key forward, but he is big, athletic, quick, has a big leap and is courageous. I think he is a Harris Andrews type that hits the packs hard and spoils very well and a guy you can build a defence around.

I also believe that it is rare that you recruit a guy like Howard then don't play him and give him extended opportunity. Just like Kent last year who IMO was gifted games up until his near on BOG against Melbourne.

I have heard Max has been told (barring mishap) he will debut round 1.
Very exiting for the young fella and all saints fans.

Do you give a 5 year and $3 million dollar contract to a guy who needs extended opportunity to secure a best 22 spot? I agree it would be rare to then keep him in Sandy, but he has been recruited on potential alone and has yet to prove he belongs at the elite level. As always we get behind all of our players but I currently have Howard in the "unestablished" category on our list.

We reportedly offered 3 years @$500k to an Essendon ruckman with an ACL who is yet to play a senior game.

We gave 4-5 to a declining Hannebery and 3 to a fringe one dimensional small forward and 3 years to a guy with blown Hammies.

I think Howard is a very safe bet via comparison.

I also don’t think they award captaincy (albeit temporary) to non established players and by extended run I mean to fit into the team balance not secure a position.

I have Howard comfortably in our best 18 and an established AFL player, I think this is where we disagree.

[Secret Kiel]

FWIW, I was a big supporter of Paddy and agree he showed a bit until the injury woes really picked up

Up to about 2018 I was reasonably confident he’d make it If he’d get a decent run at it...
2018 though just showed that’s he’s finished. Went markedly backwards onfield and more susceptible to injury seemingly

Quite literary the only upside of redrafting him is that he would be cheap but even in that scenario he’s been risk prone without a good base of form to work off
The flip side with Dougal is that yes, he does have some perceived value right or wrong

My point with the pick70 comment was that his profile as pick 1 has garnered him a higher profile then he may have otherwise gotten... that makes for a good story but it’s not a reason to offer him a lifeline IMO

Also think it would have been interesting to see him under a different coach...
He had some bad technique issues that weren’t corrected and the approach to play him as a pack monster pbly wasn’t the correct one

It's still possible we may see Paddy get another crack under a different coach, unlikely but the flame hasn't gone out yet.

I'm curious to know what others think, Dougal Howard, is on a 5 year and $ 3 million deal, is this the real elephant in the room. I'm wrapped that we picked him up but we can't afford for him to be playing at Sandy.

Howard will not play at Sandy.

Max will debut round one.

The real elephant in the room is the contracts paid to Hannebery and Kent.

Ironically Kent is the only player of that lot you mention that has earnt any of his pay packet to this point.

What makes you so certain of Howard's future, have you seen him play?

Fair point on Kent, though I reiterate 3 years to attract a guy who is a one dimensional AFL fringe player was to me an indication of where we were as a club and what we had to do to get players to join.

I saw a little bit of PA last year and hence was very critical on us taking Ryder as he was overweight and ordinary. It does look like he has trimmed down this pre-season so I'm hopeful.

I don't think Howard is a great natural footballer or a key forward, but he is big, athletic, quick, has a big leap and is courageous. I think he is a Harris Andrews type that hits the packs hard and spoils very well and a guy you can build a defence around.

I also believe that it is rare that you recruit a guy like Howard then don't play him and give him extended opportunity. Just like Kent last year who IMO was gifted games up until his near on BOG against Melbourne.

I have heard Max has been told (barring mishap) he will debut round 1.
Very exiting for the young fella and all saints fans.

Do you give a 5 year and $3 million dollar contract to a guy who needs extended opportunity to secure a best 22 spot? I agree it would be rare to then keep him in Sandy, but he has been recruited on potential alone and has yet to prove he belongs at the elite level. As always we get behind all of our players but I currently have Howard in the "unestablished" category on our list.

We reportedly offered 3 years @$500k to an Essendon ruckman with an ACL who is yet to play a senior game.

We gave 4-5 to a declining Hannebery and 3 to a fringe one dimensional small forward and 3 years to a guy with blown Hammies.

I think Howard is a very safe bet via comparison.

I also don’t think they award captaincy (albeit temporary) to non established players and by extended run I mean to fit into the team balance not secure a position.

I have Howard comfortably in our best 18 and an established AFL player, I think this is where we disagree.

It's sounds like you've watched him play a fair bit. I haven't yet so like all players who I haven't seen play a decent chunk of footy, I reserve my judgment.

As a side note there are conflicting views coming out of Adelaide about Howard, the most credible being from one of his port assistant coaches who claims he didn't make the most of his opportunity. Maybe being Captain for a day was his official papers being stamped. And didn't it stump up his value...just saying.

[Joffa Burns]

FWIW, I was a big supporter of Paddy and agree he showed a bit until the injury woes really picked up

Up to about 2018 I was reasonably confident he’d make it If he’d get a decent run at it...
2018 though just showed that’s he’s finished. Went markedly backwards onfield and more susceptible to injury seemingly

Quite literary the only upside of redrafting him is that he would be cheap but even in that scenario he’s been risk prone without a good base of form to work off
The flip side with Dougal is that yes, he does have some perceived value right or wrong

My point with the pick70 comment was that his profile as pick 1 has garnered him a higher profile then he may have otherwise gotten... that makes for a good story but it’s not a reason to offer him a lifeline IMO

Also think it would have been interesting to see him under a different coach...
He had some bad technique issues that weren’t corrected and the approach to play him as a pack monster pbly wasn’t the correct one

It's still possible we may see Paddy get another crack under a different coach, unlikely but the flame hasn't gone out yet.

I'm curious to know what others think, Dougal Howard, is on a 5 year and $ 3 million deal, is this the real elephant in the room. I'm wrapped that we picked him up but we can't afford for him to be playing at Sandy.

Howard will not play at Sandy.

Max will debut round one.

The real elephant in the room is the contracts paid to Hannebery and Kent.

Ironically Kent is the only player of that lot you mention that has earnt any of his pay packet to this point.

What makes you so certain of Howard's future, have you seen him play?

Fair point on Kent, though I reiterate 3 years to attract a guy who is a one dimensional AFL fringe player was to me an indication of where we were as a club and what we had to do to get players to join.

I saw a little bit of PA last year and hence was very critical on us taking Ryder as he was overweight and ordinary. It does look like he has trimmed down this pre-season so I'm hopeful.

I don't think Howard is a great natural footballer or a key forward, but he is big, athletic, quick, has a big leap and is courageous. I think he is a Harris Andrews type that hits the packs hard and spoils very well and a guy you can build a defence around.

I also believe that it is rare that you recruit a guy like Howard then don't play him and give him extended opportunity. Just like Kent last year who IMO was gifted games up until his near on BOG against Melbourne.

I have heard Max has been told (barring mishap) he will debut round 1.
Very exiting for the young fella and all saints fans.

Do you give a 5 year and $3 million dollar contract to a guy who needs extended opportunity to secure a best 22 spot? I agree it would be rare to then keep him in Sandy, but he has been recruited on potential alone and has yet to prove he belongs at the elite level. As always we get behind all of our players but I currently have Howard in the "unestablished" category on our list.

We reportedly offered 3 years @$500k to an Essendon ruckman with an ACL who is yet to play a senior game.

We gave 4-5 to a declining Hannebery and 3 to a fringe one dimensional small forward and 3 years to a guy with blown Hammies.

I think Howard is a very safe bet via comparison.

I also don’t think they award captaincy (albeit temporary) to non established players and by extended run I mean to fit into the team balance not secure a position.

I have Howard comfortably in our best 18 and an established AFL player, I think this is where we disagree.

It's sounds like you've watched him play a fair bit. I haven't yet so like all players who I haven't seen play a decent chunk of footy, I reserve my judgment.

As a side note there are conflicting views coming out of Adelaide about Howard, the most credible being from one of his port assistant coaches who claims he didn't make the most of his opportunity. Maybe being Captain for a day was his official papers being stamped. And didn't it stump up his value...just saying.

Certain players you watch because you like the way they go about it or because you picked them in Supercoach or they might be competing for a spot with someone you know etc.

I've watched Harris Andrews a fair bit and think he is a gun defender.
I've not seen anywhere near as much as Howard but what I have seen I like as he is in the same mould albeit not as good at this stage.

Big, quick, athletic, can jump and plenty of heart and I like that in a player.
Average disposal but we want him to spoil or dish it off when he wins it.
I like him.

I've never been a McCartin fan as he was an undersized KPP who couldn't jump or run at an elite level and lacked lateral mobility.

[Scollop]

.... Maybe being Captain for a day was his official papers being stamped. And didn't it stump up his value...just saying.

We didn’t pay a ‘high’ price for Howard. Most Port fans and neutral observers reckon we paid unders in terms of the draft pick we gave up

So are you saying PA were interested in securing a big contract for Howard? Or what exactly are you saying?

[Secret Kiel]

.... Maybe being Captain for a day was his official papers being stamped. And didn't it stump up his value...just saying.

We didn’t pay a ‘high’ price for Howard. Most Port fans and neutral observers reckon we paid unders in terms of the draft pick we gave up

So are you saying PA were interested in securing a big contract for Howard? Or what exactly are you saying?

5 years and $3 million. That's more than we paid for Jake Carlisle.

[Joffa Burns]

.... Maybe being Captain for a day was his official papers being stamped. And didn't it stump up his value...just saying.

We didn’t pay a ‘high’ price for Howard. Most Port fans and neutral observers reckon we paid unders in terms of the draft pick we gave up

So are you saying PA were interested in securing a big contract for Howard? Or what exactly are you saying?

5 years and $3 million. That's more than we paid for Jake Carlisle.

Let’s get things into perspective.

1/ none of us know what Howard or Jake for that matter are on
2/ Jake was what, 4 years ago? The market and TPP has increased a fair bit since then.
3/ Jake had discipline issues
4/ Jake was a better player than Howard but Howard has more upside
5/ the Jake/ Gresham deal was great for us, I’m a big fan of shuffle trading as done on both deals

Compared to what we reportedly offered the Essendon rookie, Hannebery & Kent the Howard deal as reported looks very reasonable to me.

I think you only look at the deal negatively as you don’t rate Howard. A bit like how I view the Kent deal, I don’t rate him so can’t believe he secured 3 years.

At least you have moved on from the King is needs to play half the season at Sandy and prove himself before he gets a senior game

[Secret Kiel]

.... Maybe being Captain for a day was his official papers being stamped. And didn't it stump up his value...just saying.

We didn’t pay a ‘high’ price for Howard. Most Port fans and neutral observers reckon we paid unders in terms of the draft pick we gave up

So are you saying PA were interested in securing a big contract for Howard? Or what exactly are you saying?

5 years and $3 million. That's more than we paid for Jake Carlisle.

Let’s get things into perspective.

1/ none of us know what Howard or Jake for that matter are on
2/ Jake was what, 4 years ago? The market and TPP has increased a fair bit since then.
3/ Jake had discipline issues
4/ Jake was a better player than Howard but Howard has more upside
5/ the Jake/ Gresham deal was great for us, I’m a big fan of shuffle trading as done on both deals

Compared to what we reportedly offered the Essendon rookie, Hannebery & Kent the Howard deal as reported looks very reasonable to me.

I think you only look at the deal negatively as you don’t rate Howard. A bit like how I view the Kent deal, I don’t rate him so can’t believe he secured 3 years.

At least you have moved on from the King is needs to play half the season at Sandy and prove himself before he gets a senior game

Whoa whoa whoa JB, slam on the brakes and put her in reverse!

I'm not looking at the deal negatively...YET, I'm just reserving my judgement until he's proved himself. At this point in his career he should be made to carry Jake's bags. You've clearly gone early and purchased a membership to Howard's fan club and swallowing all of the marketing hype coming out on the newsletters.

Let's see how he's looking at the 6 week mark of the season. I might be buying Howard's premium package fan membership by then.

King will play at Sandy a bit this season. A bit at the front end and a bit towards the end...that's my guess.

[samoht]

This guy certainly rates Howard - including his kicking ..."he's got a great kick as well" ... (around 5:47 in)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xsrx4qnBCeA

Obviously Howard isn't an established player yet, and we're all reserving our judgement (including JoffaBurns, I'm pretty sure) ... but he looks okay.
Potentially, he's a good player ... with room for (and maybe even an expectation of) improvement.

[BarryGrogan]

King will play at Sandy a bit this season. A bit at the front end and a bit towards the end...that's my guess.

Why?

You don't think he'll be good enough? Or you don't think his body will hold up?

[Joffa Burns]

.... Maybe being Captain for a day was his official papers being stamped. And didn't it stump up his value...just saying.

We didn’t pay a ‘high’ price for Howard. Most Port fans and neutral observers reckon we paid unders in terms of the draft pick we gave up

So are you saying PA were interested in securing a big contract for Howard? Or what exactly are you saying?

5 years and $3 million. That's more than we paid for Jake Carlisle.

Let’s get things into perspective.

1/ none of us know what Howard or Jake for that matter are on
2/ Jake was what, 4 years ago? The market and TPP has increased a fair bit since then.
3/ Jake had discipline issues
4/ Jake was a better player than Howard but Howard has more upside
5/ the Jake/ Gresham deal was great for us, I’m a big fan of shuffle trading as done on both deals

Compared to what we reportedly offered the Essendon rookie, Hannebery & Kent the Howard deal as reported looks very reasonable to me.

I think you only look at the deal negatively as you don’t rate Howard. A bit like how I view the Kent deal, I don’t rate him so can’t believe he secured 3 years.

At least you have moved on from the King is needs to play half the season at Sandy and prove himself before he gets a senior game

Whoa whoa whoa JB, slam on the brakes and put her in reverse!

I'm not looking at the deal negatively...YET, I'm just reserving my judgement until he's proved himself. At this point in his career he should be made to carry Jake's bags. You've clearly gone early and purchased a membership to Howard's fan club and swallowing all of the marketing hype coming out on the newsletters.

Let's see how he's looking at the 6 week mark of the season. I might be buying Howard's premium package fan membership by then.

King will play at Sandy a bit this season. A bit at the front end and a bit towards the end...that's my guess.

Sorry to disappoint but I don't buy the clubs spin.

If I did I'd be rating everyone on the list as A grade or A grade potential and think Dean Kent & Hannebery were great trades and we are lucky to have them.

I was also very anti the Ryder trade amd have only mildly changed tune since seeing how much he has trimmed down this pre-season.

I've always liked Howard and think he will be a very solid AFL defensive KPP.
I also thin k he offers more than Brown, Clavarino & Battle at this point in time as a key defender.

[Secret Kiel]

.... Maybe being Captain for a day was his official papers being stamped. And didn't it stump up his value...just saying.

We didn’t pay a ‘high’ price for Howard. Most Port fans and neutral observers reckon we paid unders in terms of the draft pick we gave up

So are you saying PA were interested in securing a big contract for Howard? Or what exactly are you saying?

5 years and $3 million. That's more than we paid for Jake Carlisle.

Let’s get things into perspective.

1/ none of us know what Howard or Jake for that matter are on
2/ Jake was what, 4 years ago? The market and TPP has increased a fair bit since then.
3/ Jake had discipline issues
4/ Jake was a better player than Howard but Howard has more upside
5/ the Jake/ Gresham deal was great for us, I’m a big fan of shuffle trading as done on both deals

Compared to what we reportedly offered the Essendon rookie, Hannebery & Kent the Howard deal as reported looks very reasonable to me.

I think you only look at the deal negatively as you don’t rate Howard. A bit like how I view the Kent deal, I don’t rate him so can’t believe he secured 3 years.

At least you have moved on from the King is needs to play half the season at Sandy and prove himself before he gets a senior game

Whoa whoa whoa JB, slam on the brakes and put her in reverse!

I'm not looking at the deal negatively...YET, I'm just reserving my judgement until he's proved himself. At this point in his career he should be made to carry Jake's bags. You've clearly gone early and purchased a membership to Howard's fan club and swallowing all of the marketing hype coming out on the newsletters.

Let's see how he's looking at the 6 week mark of the season. I might be buying Howard's premium package fan membership by then.

King will play at Sandy a bit this season. A bit at the front end and a bit towards the end...that's my guess.

Sorry to disappoint but I don't buy the clubs spin.

If I did I'd be rating everyone on the list as A grade or A grade potential and think Dean Kent & Hannebery were great trades and we are lucky to have them.

I was also very anti the Ryder trade amd have only mildly changed tune since seeing how much he has trimmed down this pre-season.

I've always liked Howard and think he will be a very solid AFL defensive KPP.
I also thin k he offers more than Brown, Clavarino & Battle at this point in time as a key defender.

Time will tell and am I the only one that wants it to be R1 already. So many fascinating sub plots to watch this season.

[Secret Kiel]

King will play at Sandy a bit this season. A bit at the front end and a bit towards the end...that's my guess.

Why?

You don't think he'll be good enough? Or you don't think his body will hold up?

A little bit from column A and a little bit from column B.

And it's not so much he's "not good enough" but rather he's a developing KPP tall and the coach will be strategic about the games he plays and that will also be influenced in the context of how he and the team is performing each week. He's not automatic 22 yet.

[BarryGrogan]

So are we sacking the no. 2 draft pick after an 11 possie half in a 36 point scoring praccy match?

[Joffa Burns]

Comment on Howard

He was recruited in 2014 at pick 57 and didn't debut until 2016.

What injuries were holding him back from taking a relatively long time to debut?

Comment on King....

And it's not so much he's "not good enough" but rather he's a developing KPP tall and the coach will be strategic about the games he plays

And he gets it, nice stuff SK, you have answered your own question albeit across two different players

[Secret Kiel]

Comment on Howard

He was recruited in 2014 at pick 57 and didn't debut until 2016.

What injuries were holding him back from taking a relatively long time to debut?

Comment on King....

And it's not so much he's "not good enough" but rather he's a developing KPP tall and the coach will be strategic about the games he plays

And he gets it, nice stuff SK, you have answered your own question albeit across two different players

Be carefull your head doesn't explode. Not sure what all the effort for that post means, I'm guessing you probably don't either.

[Joffa Burns]

Comment on Howard

He was recruited in 2014 at pick 57 and didn't debut until 2016.

What injuries were holding him back from taking a relatively long time to debut?

Comment on King....

And it's not so much he's "not good enough" but rather he's a developing KPP tall and the coach will be strategic about the games he plays

And he gets it, nice stuff SK, you have answered your own question albeit across two different players

Be carefull your head doesn't explode. Not sure what all the effort for that post means, I'm guessing you probably don't either.

Not at all sure what you are trying to communicate here. I was complimenting you suggesting you have finally linked the chain.

Also don't understand the head explode reference , what does that mean?

[Secret Kiel]

Comment on Howard

He was recruited in 2014 at pick 57 and didn't debut until 2016.

What injuries were holding him back from taking a relatively long time to debut?

Comment on King....

And it's not so much he's "not good enough" but rather he's a developing KPP tall and the coach will be strategic about the games he plays

And he gets it, nice stuff SK, you have answered your own question albeit across two different players

Be carefull your head doesn't explode. Not sure what all the effort for that post means, I'm guessing you probably don't either.

Not at all sure what you are trying to communicate here. I was complimenting you suggesting you have finally linked the chain.

Also don't understand the head explode reference , what does that mean?

When someone thinks they've caught someone contradicting themselves thier head can explode with over excitement.

Thanks for the compliment btw, I'm glad I was able to illustrate the difference between a pick 4 and pick 57.

[Scollop]

.... Maybe being Captain for a day was his official papers being stamped. And didn't it stump up his value...just saying.

We didn’t pay a ‘high’ price for Howard. Most Port fans and neutral observers reckon we paid unders in terms of the draft pick we gave up

So are you saying PA were interested in securing a big contract for Howard? Or what exactly are you saying?

5 years and $3 million. That's more than we paid for Jake Carlisle.

What has his current contract value (whatever that may be) got to do with his former footy club trying to ‘stump up his value’?

For someone who repeatedly posts smartalec replies you are making a dumb comment regarding how Port Adelaide treated Howard

He wasn’t a free agent so they didn’t benefit and they couldn’t care less what we decide to pay him

[Secret Kiel]

.... Maybe being Captain for a day was his official papers being stamped. And didn't it stump up his value...just saying.

We didn’t pay a ‘high’ price for Howard. Most Port fans and neutral observers reckon we paid unders in terms of the draft pick we gave up

So are you saying PA were interested in securing a big contract for Howard? Or what exactly are you saying?

5 years and $3 million. That's more than we paid for Jake Carlisle.

What has his current contract value (whatever that may be) got to do with his former footy club trying to ‘stump up his value’?

For someone who repeatedly posts smartalec replies you are making a dumb comment regarding how Port Adelaide treated Howard

He wasn’t a free agent so they didn’t benefit and they couldn’t care less what we decide to pay him

I'm not sure you understand what you're so angry about. I'm certainly having trouble understanding you.

[Scollop]

.... Maybe being Captain for a day was his official papers being stamped. And didn't it stump up his value...just saying.

We didn’t pay a ‘high’ price for Howard. Most Port fans and neutral observers reckon we paid unders in terms of the draft pick we gave up

So are you saying PA were interested in securing a big contract for Howard? Or what exactly are you saying?

5 years and $3 million. That's more than we paid for Jake Carlisle.

What has his current contract value (whatever that may be) got to do with his former footy club trying to ‘stump up his value’?

For someone who repeatedly posts smartalec replies you are making a dumb comment regarding how Port Adelaide treated Howard

He wasn’t a free agent so they didn’t benefit and they couldn’t care less what we decide to pay him

I'm not sure you understand what you're so angry about. I'm certainly having trouble understanding you.

You said Port made him captain and you implied that they were looking to trade him and suggested they ‘wanted’ to increase his value

How did they benefit from his contract with St Kilda?

Why don’t you just admit that you didn’t think that one through. It’s ok. Don’t be embarrassed

[Secret Kiel]

.... Maybe being Captain for a day was his official papers being stamped. And didn't it stump up his value...just saying.

We didn’t pay a ‘high’ price for Howard. Most Port fans and neutral observers reckon we paid unders in terms of the draft pick we gave up

So are you saying PA were interested in securing a big contract for Howard? Or what exactly are you saying?

5 years and $3 million. That's more than we paid for Jake Carlisle.

What has his current contract value (whatever that may be) got to do with his former footy club trying to ‘stump up his value’?

For someone who repeatedly posts smartalec replies you are making a dumb comment regarding how Port Adelaide treated Howard

He wasn’t a free agent so they didn’t benefit and they couldn’t care less what we decide to pay him

I'm not sure you understand what you're so angry about. I'm certainly having trouble understanding you.

You said Port made him captain and you implied that they were looking to trade him and suggested they ‘wanted’ to increase his value

How did they benefit from his contract with St Kilda?

Why don’t you just admit that you didn’t think that one through. It’s ok. Don’t be embarrassed

Have you ever heard it's ok to remain silent and for people to think you have limitations rather than to communicate and remove all doubt.

Not necessarily increase value as the main objective but maybe facilitate a trade that religinshies your contractual obligations and possibly helps third parties pick up an earner on the way through thus in the process offloading a non required player without or reduced contract termination penalties.

[Scollop]

Hmmm...

Ever heard the phrase; You’re full of it

[Secret Kiel]

Hmmm...

Ever heard the phrase; You’re full of it

Good point, well argued.