Howard the steal of the trade period

[prwilkinson]

Any word re his second 3km trial ? Anyone know how he went ?

He beat his PB by 28 seconds.

Good signs considering the second TT came straight after the Xmas break.

[CQ SAINT]

It appears he was being moved around and didnt like it. Before being dropped he was kicking goals and going into the ruck. It wreaks of the same thing with Carlisle at Essendon. He was told that his future at Alberton was in these roles after a great year in 2018 playing most of the season as a backman with a few cameo ruck roles. He has had some impressive forward scalps in wins that Port may not have expected. Id say his manager put him on the market earlier than divulged and we made the right offer. Perhaps Port where trying to devalue him and it flipped on them.

[damienc]

Wow.

[damienc]

Not liking how easily Carlisle gets King out of the contest. Max has a lot to learn. On the other hand great defending by Carlisle.

That is a tough call. Looked to me like neither was in the contest.

[BackFromUSA]

Not liking how easily Carlisle gets King out of the contest. Max has a lot to learn. On the other hand great defending by Carlisle.

That is a tough call. Looked to me like neither was in the contest.

Yes because Carlisle shoved King in the chest out early to get him out of the contest (taking away his launch run at the ball) and then checked (one could say "blocked") King's run back into the contest successfully keeping out of the contest.

Max has to learn to either engage his backman early to clear his own path to the ball OR wrong foot his backman by taking the long road to the contest and fly from the side like Roo used to do.

Well done to Carlisle who probably realises that he can't match Max for speed and is taking away his run early in contests.

There is a reason that Carlisle has been a good defender for many years. Don't judge him on his not even half fit end to 2019.

[DJ Higgins]

So a bigger guy with years more experience outplayed a guy yet to debut in a single play King will show glimpses this year but cut him some slack. Plus apparently it his running that gets him the ball not necessarily pack marks. Either way great grab from Howard, now if he can get some fitness he should be a starter

[Linton Lodger]

Not liking how easily Carlisle gets King out of the contest. Max has a lot to learn. On the other hand great defending by Carlisle.

That is a tough call. Looked to me like neither was in the contest.

Yes because Carlisle shoved King in the chest out early to get him out of the contest (taking away his launch run at the ball) and then checked (one could say "blocked") King's run back into the contest successfully keeping out of the contest.

Max has to learn to either engage his backman early to clear his own path to the ball OR wrong foot his backman by taking the long road to the contest and fly from the side like Roo used to do.

Well done to Carlisle who probably realises that he can't match Max for speed and is taking away his run early in contests.

There is a reason that Carlisle has been a good defender for many years. Don't judge him on his not even half fit end to 2019.

It is the only possible way to defend against Max, stop him getting to the ball drop. All opposition will try it on him and when he learns to beat that tactic, watch out.

[To the top]

Howard was played as a forward at AFL level in his final few AFL games for reasons which were not known - except he was seen as Westhoffs successor as the proverbial “swing” player

Was dropped to the SANFL, kicking 3 from a respectable number of possessions in his first game at that level but not recalled to the AFL side

The next 2 games had a handful of possessions only - and was not qualified to play SANFL finals so his season finished

My sources say he only played the 3 SANFL games and it was suspected he would not be at Alberton in 2020 - which has proven correct

So when did St Kilda make their approach - and did they know Howard was unsettled hence sought out his Manager?

St Kilda will play him in defence where his athleticism for such a big man is outstanding

Remember also that St Kilda have access to South Australian intel

[goods]

The odds are very high that not all 5 of our traded recruits will become best 22 players.

As a side note I've wondered why Howard was selected as captain for one game ahead of so many other seemingly obvious and/or appropriate choices.

why are you questioning this value ? it it what it is.

[Secret Kiel]

The odds are very high that not all 5 of our traded recruits will become best 22 players.

As a side note I've wondered why Howard was selected as captain for one game ahead of so many other seemingly obvious and/or appropriate choices.

why are you questioning this value ? it it what it is.

Not question his value, merely wondering aloud what happened between him and his old club between Captaincy and contract release.

[saintspremiers]

According to Ladey at the members do the other day, King will get the ball to the ground a lot - but may not take heaps of marks overhead

[Saintmatt]

It appears he was being moved around and didnt like it. Before being dropped he was kicking goals and going into the ruck. It wreaks of the same thing with Carlisle at Essendon. He was told that his future at Alberton was in these roles after a great year in 2018 playing most of the season as a backman with a few cameo ruck roles. He has had some impressive forward scalps in wins that Port may not have expected. Id say his manager put him on the market earlier than divulged and we made the right offer. Perhaps Port where trying to devalue him and it flipped on them.

This is pretty much spot on. We begun speaking with Howard's Manager (whom our List Manager knows very well from their time together at Norwood) from quite early on in the 2019 season.

[saynta]

interesting.

[To the top]

Stmatt is pretty close

As I put earlier St Kilda has very good intel and connections re the SANFL

Port Adelaide’s Captain also hails from the Mighty Redlegs - as does the CEO at Alberton

And then there is Gags, where the family name is the stuff of legends at the Club

It helps to know people no matter the Industry

[Secret Kiel]

It appears he was being moved around and didnt like it. Before being dropped he was kicking goals and going into the ruck. It wreaks of the same thing with Carlisle at Essendon. He was told that his future at Alberton was in these roles after a great year in 2018 playing most of the season as a backman with a few cameo ruck roles. He has had some impressive forward scalps in wins that Port may not have expected. Id say his manager put him on the market earlier than divulged and we made the right offer. Perhaps Port where trying to devalue him and it flipped on them.

This is pretty much spot on. We begun speaking with Howard's Manager (whom our List Manager knows very well from their time together at Norwood) from quite early on in the 2019 season.

Nup, not spot on. Howard was made Captain for round 9 and it was a victory, Hinkley firmly believed he was an emerging leader and a big part of the future. They were not devaluing him midway in the season so any discussion with Port early on in the season was not about trading a future leader of the club.

[CQ SAINT]

It appears he was being moved around and didnt like it. Before being dropped he was kicking goals and going into the ruck. It wreaks of the same thing with Carlisle at Essendon. He was told that his future at Alberton was in these roles after a great year in 2018 playing most of the season as a backman with a few cameo ruck roles. He has had some impressive forward scalps in wins that Port may not have expected. Id say his manager put him on the market earlier than divulged and we made the right offer. Perhaps Port where trying to devalue him and it flipped on them.

This is pretty much spot on. We begun speaking with Howard's Manager (whom our List Manager knows very well from their time together at Norwood) from quite early on in the 2019 season.

Nup, not spot on. Howard was made Captain for round 9 and it was a victory, Hinkley firmly believed he was an emerging leader and a big part of the future. They were not devaluing him midway in the season so any discussion with Port early on in the season was not about trading a future leader of the club.

Lol. You have a strange way of looking at things. He was killing it down back, they made him Captain, his manager starts to talk contract, then they switched him, he does ok and has 2 bad games, they don't move him back, they drop him.
They were raising the bar after making him Captain. They thrrew him a bone and he wanted a steak. Lesser players take the captaincy for less money. Obviously, he wasn't keen on that.

[Joffa Burns]

I have no clue but I find it difficult to comprehend the logic around devaluation of a playing asset.

Common sense would assume a player showing form and leadership would be nurtured not marginalized whilst fulfilling the role where he is required by the team.

What ever happened it is now in the past and we have a potential 10 year tall defender if he can fulfill his early promise. Plenty have moved at his stage in the career and gone to great heights such as Mal Michael.

The kid has size and speed, whether he will be a player or not is yet to be determined, but he is not A grade overnight just because we recruited him.

There is a reason he finished the season in the SANFL but that is behind him now.

[Nick_BlueNRG]

I have no clue but I find it difficult to comprehend the logic around devaluation of a playing asset.

Common sense would assume a player showing form and leadership would be nurtured not marginalized whilst fulfilling the role where he is required by the team.

What ever happened it is now in the past and we have a potential 10 year tall defender if he can fulfill his early promise. Plenty have moved at his stage in the career and gone to great heights such as Mal Michael.

The kid has size and speed, whether he will be a player or not is yet to be determined, but he is not A grade overnight just because we recruited him.

There is a reason he finished the season in the SANFL but that is behind him now.

Austin and Howard will be our 2 "A" grade KP defenders for the next 10 years. Ironically both recruited from Port Adelaide.

[Saintmatt]

It appears he was being moved around and didnt like it. Before being dropped he was kicking goals and going into the ruck. It wreaks of the same thing with Carlisle at Essendon. He was told that his future at Alberton was in these roles after a great year in 2018 playing most of the season as a backman with a few cameo ruck roles. He has had some impressive forward scalps in wins that Port may not have expected. Id say his manager put him on the market earlier than divulged and we made the right offer. Perhaps Port where trying to devalue him and it flipped on them.

This is pretty much spot on. We begun speaking with Howard's Manager (whom our List Manager knows very well from their time together at Norwood) from quite early on in the 2019 season.

Nup, not spot on. Howard was made Captain for round 9 and it was a victory, Hinkley firmly believed he was an emerging leader and a big part of the future. They were not devaluing him midway in the season so any discussion with Port early on in the season was not about trading a future leader of the club.

You're strange. Really strange. I made no reference to devaluing Howard; only regarding how early we begun speaking with his manager and the connection between the two. I think you'd be well placed to get out of the sun and have a spell for a bit.

The simple fact is that lost of players and officials have played, coached and been administrators together at lots of different clubs. Trotter and Gallagher are very close from their time at Norwood and hence, had a personal relationship that later transcended to their professional lives. It's like Gubby Allan with all of the GWS kids he was responsible for at the outset of their franchise. Like in any business - people generally prefer to deal with people they enjoy working with and hence, lean on those relationships at different times to get business done.

[SaintPav]

I have no clue but I find it difficult to comprehend the logic around devaluation of a playing asset.

Common sense would assume a player showing form and leadership would be nurtured not marginalized whilst fulfilling the role where he is required by the team.

What ever happened it is now in the past and we have a potential 10 year tall defender if he can fulfill his early promise. Plenty have moved at his stage in the career and gone to great heights such as Mal Michael.

The kid has size and speed, whether he will be a player or not is yet to be determined, but he is not A grade overnight just because we recruited him.

There is a reason he finished the season in the SANFL but that is behind him now.

Austin and Howard will be our 2 "A" grade KP defenders for the next 10 years. Ironically both recruited from Port Adelaide.

Is that a problem for you, is it?

[Secret Kiel]

It appears he was being moved around and didnt like it. Before being dropped he was kicking goals and going into the ruck. It wreaks of the same thing with Carlisle at Essendon. He was told that his future at Alberton was in these roles after a great year in 2018 playing most of the season as a backman with a few cameo ruck roles. He has had some impressive forward scalps in wins that Port may not have expected. Id say his manager put him on the market earlier than divulged and we made the right offer. Perhaps Port where trying to devalue him and it flipped on them.

This is pretty much spot on. We begun speaking with Howard's Manager (whom our List Manager knows very well from their time together at Norwood) from quite early on in the 2019 season.

Nup, not spot on. Howard was made Captain for round 9 and it was a victory, Hinkley firmly believed he was an emerging leader and a big part of the future. They were not devaluing him midway in the season so any discussion with Port early on in the season was not about trading a future leader of the club.

You're strange. Really strange. I made no reference to devaluing Howard; only regarding how early we begun speaking with his manager and the connection between the two. I think you'd be well placed to get out of the sun and have a spell for a bit.

The simple fact is that lost of players and officials have played, coached and been administrators together at lots of different clubs. Trotter and Gallagher are very close from their time at Norwood and hence, had a personal relationship that later transcended to their professional lives. It's like Gubby Allan with all of the GWS kids he was responsible for at the outset of their franchise. Like in any business - people generally prefer to deal with people they enjoy working with and hence, lean on those relationships at different times to get business done.

CQ states, "perhaps Port were trying to devalue",

You reply, "spot on".

[CQ SAINT]

I have no clue but I find it difficult to comprehend the logic around devaluation of a playing asset.

Common sense would assume a player showing form and leadership would be nurtured not marginalized whilst fulfilling the role where he is required by the team.

What ever happened it is now in the past and we have a potential 10 year tall defender if he can fulfill his early promise. Plenty have moved at his stage in the career and gone to great heights such as Mal Michael.

The kid has size and speed, whether he will be a player or not is yet to be determined, but he is not A grade overnight just because we recruited him.

There is a reason he finished the season in the SANFL but that is behind him now.

I guess it is easier to.understand that when you have a potential young leader, who is also a key defender and killing it, you move him into the ruck and push him forward. Then when he has 2 bad games in that role, you drop him. That is just plain stupid.
I'm.not saying he is immediately worth 5 years and what we pay him but the lack of acknowledgement from Port and the fact they wanted him cheaper and eventually traded him, says the were trying to devalue him.
Most of the commentary around his trade described shock, shortsightedness and mistake by Port.
I.hope he lives up to the challenge and very happy to have him on board. The depth, flexibility, competition and upside for our key backs, both established and developing is exciting.

[skeptic]

It appears he was being moved around and didnt like it. Before being dropped he was kicking goals and going into the ruck. It wreaks of the same thing with Carlisle at Essendon. He was told that his future at Alberton was in these roles after a great year in 2018 playing most of the season as a backman with a few cameo ruck roles. He has had some impressive forward scalps in wins that Port may not have expected. Id say his manager put him on the market earlier than divulged and we made the right offer. Perhaps Port where trying to devalue him and it flipped on them.

This is pretty much spot on. We begun speaking with Howard's Manager (whom our List Manager knows very well from their time together at Norwood) from quite early on in the 2019 season.

Nup, not spot on. Howard was made Captain for round 9 and it was a victory, Hinkley firmly believed he was an emerging leader and a big part of the future. They were not devaluing him midway in the season so any discussion with Port early on in the season was not about trading a future leader of the club.

You're strange. Really strange. I made no reference to devaluing Howard; only regarding how early we begun speaking with his manager and the connection between the two. I think you'd be well placed to get out of the sun and have a spell for a bit.

The simple fact is that lost of players and officials have played, coached and been administrators together at lots of different clubs. Trotter and Gallagher are very close from their time at Norwood and hence, had a personal relationship that later transcended to their professional lives. It's like Gubby Allan with all of the GWS kids he was responsible for at the outset of their franchise. Like in any business - people generally prefer to deal with people they enjoy working with and hence, lean on those relationships at different times to get business done.

CQ states, "perhaps Port were trying to devalue",

You reply, "spot on".

CQ Saint wrote quite a few things and he replied ‘pretty much spot on’... the implication is that he agreed with most of it rather than the one specific point you’ve zeroed in on

[Devilhead]

It all seems pretty straightforward to me

Saints engage Howard's manager at the start of 2019 season.

Port only catch wind re: of him talking to Saints - late in the season (and are pissed)

Port drop Howard

Port trade Howard

[Saintmatt]

It appears he was being moved around and didnt like it. Before being dropped he was kicking goals and going into the ruck. It wreaks of the same thing with Carlisle at Essendon. He was told that his future at Alberton was in these roles after a great year in 2018 playing most of the season as a backman with a few cameo ruck roles. He has had some impressive forward scalps in wins that Port may not have expected. Id say his manager put him on the market earlier than divulged and we made the right offer. Perhaps Port where trying to devalue him and it flipped on them.

This is pretty much spot on. We begun speaking with Howard's Manager (whom our List Manager knows very well from their time together at Norwood) from quite early on in the 2019 season.

Nup, not spot on. Howard was made Captain for round 9 and it was a victory, Hinkley firmly believed he was an emerging leader and a big part of the future. They were not devaluing him midway in the season so any discussion with Port early on in the season was not about trading a future leader of the club.

You're strange. Really strange. I made no reference to devaluing Howard; only regarding how early we begun speaking with his manager and the connection between the two. I think you'd be well placed to get out of the sun and have a spell for a bit.

The simple fact is that lost of players and officials have played, coached and been administrators together at lots of different clubs. Trotter and Gallagher are very close from their time at Norwood and hence, had a personal relationship that later transcended to their professional lives. It's like Gubby Allan with all of the GWS kids he was responsible for at the outset of their franchise. Like in any business - people generally prefer to deal with people they enjoy working with and hence, lean on those relationships at different times to get business done.

CQ states, "perhaps Port were trying to devalue",

You reply, "spot on".

CQ Saint wrote quite a few things and he replied ‘pretty much spot on’... the implication is that he agreed with most of it rather than the one specific point you’ve zeroed in on

Dare I say it Skeptic but, ummm - spot on. I clearly have/had no idea of what Port were thinking in moving Howard to the forward line and then dropping him - trying to devalue him ior not. But I do know full well when we started speaking with David Trotter. Anyway - we move on.

The simple fact is that we've managed to land a 23 yo who was good enough to Captain a better team than ours ... in his 37th game or something stupid like that. KPP with proper leadership attributes like that do not grown on trees.

The seething reaction of Port's fans - then and still now - towards their club and in particular Hinkley and Cripps - should tell you everything about how well we've done in this particular transaction.